Barcelona on the brink

simonhch

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They should have sold him last season. As ridiculous a player as he is, they very clearly need the money. City would have paid up, they would have got his wages off the books and they could have hopefully fixed the mess they're in due to their absolute dog shite management.

That being said, I wouldn't trust that board to fix this mess, with or without Messi anyway. Look at the signings they've made and the fecking ridiculous wages they're all on. They've essentially got a squad composed of mostly rubbish who no-one wants, veterans who are very clearly past their prime or good players on wages so ridiculous it makes them almost impossible to move on.

Ridiculous how they've got to this point.
Yes, a combination of incompetence and hubris. It all started going south when Neymar got taken from them. They went on a big dick swinging contest spree, signing players for ridiculous fees on even more absurd wages, almost as if to prove a point.

Their insistence on keeping Messi at any cost now just stinks of cowardice. No one wants to be the president or board that let Messi leave, even if it cripples the club. The attempt to save face by saying he got a 50% pay cut is laughable. They still have to pay him 60m for letting his contract expire and an undisclosed signing on fee - which conveniently doesn’t count towards the salary cap - and then they gave him a 5 year contract, despite being 34, which conveniently adds up to what we would’ve made previously in two. Shambolic and irresponsible.

The idea that’s also our forwards that they are saving the club by getting wages deferred, just ignores the fact that they are going to still have to catch those wages up next season, likely against the backdrop of an aging and depleted squad.

I had to laugh at the cheek of them refusing to pay out the difference on Griezmann’s contract in a potential move to Atlético, while demanding cash plus Saul. They need to accept they can’t afford to keep him or other players if they want I register Messi and their new signings, and let some players go for bargain basement prices or on a free. Such as Coutinho and Griezmann himself. That’s the only way you’re shifting them on on their wages. Or moving them out on loan and getting as much covered as possible.
 

tenpoless

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This has just been leaked

- Every player has to surrender 5% of their weekly wage to Messi. This will fund 0.8% of Messi's salary.

- If Messi assists you to score a goal, 75% of your goal bonus goes to Messi. If you don't have a goal bonus clause, an individual bonus will be rewarded to you, of which 100% proceeds to Messi.

- Barca will set up a charity focusing on mental health, which purpose is to bring about happiness in Catalonia by ensuring Messi's long-term stay.

-As very credible reports explain, Messi is crucial to Barca's match day revenue, merchandising and sponsorships, Messi will earn 75% from profits of all shirts and tickets sold, as well as sponsorships entered into. Those with keen economic sensibilities speculate that this will increase Barca's revenues by 40% in the next fiscal quarter.

-Javier Tebas has privately confirmed that La Liga will place a 15% Messi tax on every transfer between now and end of June 2023 to help fund Messi's salary, as La Liga's most important asset. It is still not clear whether this only applies to transfers between Spanish clubs or whether this can be applied to transfer dealings between Spanish clubs and non-Spanish clubs. Reports suggest that UEFA have given La Liga positive signals that it will throw its weight behind the proposal, given the importance of the matter.

Messi is thought to be seriously considering joining PSG.
I would rather play Phil Jones as winger than to have someone like him in the squad.
 

giorno

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I've been hearing that Busquets has been finished for some time. Is he really one of their key players?
Mmm. Yeah, he kind of is. And in the right context he's still a great player. Problem is barcelona have increasingly failed to provide said context for him. Been happening since 17/18, he's awesome if the game is played at the tempo he wants, but he becomes a liability at faster pace. Pick every big barcelona loss of the last 4 years and one thing they all have in common is Busquets looking like he was drowning/getting subbed off early
 

Iker Quesadillas

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It insanity. Let Messi go and start a financially sustainable rebuild is the only sensible option. He is 34 FFS.
I feel like the people who defend Messi's insane wages tend to ignore this part the most.

Even if we grant all this stuff about how he makes up 97% of Barcelona's revenue so you can't lose him, he's going to retire. Soon. So you will lose him. What is the argument, then? Let's delay our inevitable end for two years? Let's hope that in the next two years, a team built around Messi at the expense of top players like Griezmann somehow becomes less financially dependent on Messi?
 

Andeva

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This has just been leaked

- Every player has to surrender 5% of their weekly wage to Messi. This will fund 0.8% of Messi's salary.

- If Messi assists you to score a goal, 75% of your goal bonus goes to Messi. If you don't have a goal bonus clause, an individual bonus will be rewarded to you, of which 100% proceeds to Messi.

- Barca will set up a charity focusing on mental health, which purpose is to bring about happiness in Catalonia by ensuring Messi's long-term stay.

-As very credible reports explain, Messi is crucial to Barca's match day revenue, merchandising and sponsorships, Messi will earn 75% from profits of all shirts and tickets sold, as well as sponsorships entered into. Those with keen economic sensibilities speculate that this will increase Barca's revenues by 40% in the next fiscal quarter.

-Javier Tebas has privately confirmed that La Liga will place a 15% Messi tax on every transfer between now and end of June 2023 to help fund Messi's salary, as La Liga's most important asset. It is still not clear whether this only applies to transfers between Spanish clubs or whether this can be applied to transfer dealings between Spanish clubs and non-Spanish clubs. Reports suggest that UEFA have given La Liga positive signals that it will throw its weight behind the proposal, given the importance of the matter.

Messi is thought to be seriously considering joining PSG.
Surely, this cannot be true?
 

The Boy

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Surely, this cannot be true?
I think you'll find it is a joke!

This bit made me laugh out loud:

-Javier Tebas has privately confirmed that La Liga will place a 15% Messi tax on every transfer between now and end of June 2023 to help fund Messi's salary, as La Liga's most important asset.

Messi is thought to be seriously considering joining PSG.
 

Andeva

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I think you'll find it is a joke!

This bit made me laugh out loud:
I find so much of the supposed truth to be ridiculous, it's hard to tell the difference. Now I don't know whether to laugh or cry.
 

Adisa

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It's madness. He is 34, how long has he got left? Bite the bullet early and move on.
Barca fans blame their board for the mismanagement but they don't understand the fact that they are fan-owned has played a role in this mess. They are completely governed by sentiment. They are insisting the board continue with the kind of decisions that got them into this mess.
The other thing I have heard them say is Messi deserves these wages but the other players do not. Even of Griezmann, Coutinho, De Jong etc were playing out of their skin, Barcelona would still be in the same financial mess.
Their wage bill is just too large, it doesn't matter how well or how bad the players are playing.
 
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AFC NimbleThumb

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It's madness. He is 34, how long as he got left? Bite the bullet early and move on.
Barca fans blame their board for the mismanagement but they don't understand the fact that they are fan-owned has played a role in this mess. They are completely governed by sentiment. They are insisting the board continue with the kind of decisions that got them into this mess.
The other thing I have heard them say is Messi deserves these wages but the other players do not. Even of Griezmann, Coutinho, De Jong etc were playing out of their skin, Barcelona would still be in the same financial mess.
Their wage bill is just too large, it doesn't matter how well or how bad the players are playing.
This./

Lock the thread.
 

Devil81

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So are they allowed to register the free transferred players yet?

If not then what the hell are they supposed to do, sit and wait for this fiasco to play out or are they free to negotiate with other clubs?
 

Womp

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The craziest part about all this is the guy probably doesn't even want to really be there anymore. They are crippling themselves to convince a player who only a year ago publicly announced his intention to leave. I really doubt if they turned around and told him they can't afford to keep him he would have too many issues. They were willing to go to court to keep him around. City were willing to sign him, even pay a ridiculous transfer fee. Surely Barca's board could have assessed the circumstances a year ahead of time? It's not like Covid wasn't an issue then.

Whenever Messi does finally leave they are finished as a top club for a while imo. Their squad is extremely average to poor, they are broke as feck and they can't move any players on as its like all of them are on like 500k a week ffs.

That being said though - I can see it from a commercial perspective. Messi Is probably the only remaining elite global star in that league, milk the cow until it's dry.
 
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Morty_

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It's madness. He is 34, how long has he got left? Bite the bullet early and move on.
Barca fans blame their board for the mismanagement but they don't understand the fact that they are fan-owned has played a role in this mess. They are completely governed by sentiment. They are insisting the board continue with the kind of decisions that got them into this mess.
The other thing I have heard them say is Messi deserves these wages but the other players do not. Even of Griezmann, Coutinho, De Jong etc were playing out of their skin, Barcelona would still be in the same financial mess.
Their wage bill is just too large, it doesn't matter how well or how bad the players are playing.
Dont know who, but someone mentioned that one has to view the relationship between Messi and the club more as a religious one, and less related to actual business.
 

Adisa

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Dont know who, but someone mentioned that one has to view the relationship between Messi and the club more as a religious one, and less related to actual business.
That can only happen at a club owned by fans. One of thenperils of Barcelona's ownership model.
 

CG1010

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Dont know who, but someone mentioned that one has to view the relationship between Messi and the club more as a religious one, and less related to actual business.
For Messi it is business for sure, with the wages he is getting. Else he can easily reduce his demands and all would be sorted.
 

MUFC OK

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Their wage bill is just too large, it doesn't matter how well or how bad the players are playing.
It is large, however it's the La Liga salary cap that is causing this issue. Barca and Madrid have been in huge debt for years and the reality is that the league is not lucrative enough for their wage structures of the last few years to be sustainable - make no mistake, Barca and Real needed the Super League.

From our perspective, this is the summer to get well ahead of the spanish clubs, I'd test the waters for Busquets personally - he's a phenomenal player.
 

MUFC OK

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So are they allowed to register the free transferred players yet?

If not then what the hell are they supposed to do, sit and wait for this fiasco to play out or are they free to negotiate with other clubs?
Not until theyve got rid of 2 or 3 of their highest earners - a mess.
 

Adisa

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It is large, however it's the La Liga salary cap that is causing this issue. Barca and Madrid have been in huge debt for years and the reality is that the league is not lucrative enough for their wage structures of the last few years to be sustainable - make no mistake, Barca and Real needed the Super League.

From our perspective, this is the summer to get well ahead of the spanish clubs, I'd test the waters for Busquets personally - he's a phenomenal player.
Barca would sell Busquets in the blink of an eye if he agreed to leave and I don't think he would be a good signing.. Bid for De Jong and see how desperate they are.
They needed the Super League badly. They still haven't pulled out officially. I was reading Angelli's interview the other day. The reason for the Super League was never the Champions League. It is the EPL.
 

ThreeCorners

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For those who subscribe to the Athletic, there's an interesting graphic of the wage budgets of the Super League clubs over the last 10 years.

https://theathletic.com/2717019/202...par-with-ac-milan-and-tottenham/?source=ukdfb

For those who can't access this, Barca since 2018 had a wage budget above the £400m mark. That was about £100m more that Madrid who were the second highest.

In a nutshell, Barca should really have seen this coming a long way back.
It's just crazy how their wage limit is now expected to be £138m.

Other interesting things to note were that City were second last year at around £350, Liverpool 4th at around £325m.
We're 5th at just under £300m, but this year might be interesting if we add Sancho, Varane, and another without selling anyone.
 
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NicolaSacco

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For those who subscribe to the Athletic, there's an interesting graphic of the wage budgets of the Super League clubs over the last 10 years.

https://theathletic.com/2717019/202...par-with-ac-milan-and-tottenham/?source=ukdfb

For those who can't access this, Barca since 2018 had a wage budget above the £400m mark. That was about £100m more that Madrid who were the second highest.

In a nutshell, Barca should really have seen this coming a long way back.
It's just crazy how their wage limit is now expected to be £138m.

Other interesting things to note were that City were second last year at around £350, Liverpool 4th at around £325m.
We're 5th at just under £300m, but this year might be interesting if we add Sancho, Varane, and another without selling anyone.
I’m surprised at Liverpool there, I wonder when the last time was they had a bigger wage bill than Utd.
 

Gehrman

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Its pretty incredible how they had perhaps one of the greatest golden generations ever if not the greatest and managed to end up like this. Only we managed to feck it up nearly as much. I know we are not as finamcially fecked as they are, but at least they managed to win the league and go fairly far in the cl under Valverde while we havnt had a title challenge post fergie.
 

Zehner

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Pretty amazing how everybody could see this coming without any insider knowledge and they still continued as if there were no warning signs. I mean, they were pretty much broke and still signed Griezmann on loaned money before Corona hit them. You should probably never underestimate the incompetence of people.
 

Lay

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I always wondered if they were secretly happy that the Neymar deal happened. That large sum of money which was paid in full would have been great for their debts. But no, they decided to spunk it on Coutinho who doesn’t fit their system and Dembele. They panicked and they’re still paying for it now
 

ThreeCorners

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I’m surprised at Liverpool there, I wonder when the last time was they had a bigger wage bill than Utd.
2020 was the first time in that chart which goes back to 2011, I'd imagine we'd have to look back to before our first premier league win.
I imagine getting rid of Alexis was big part of it. :smirk:
 
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iKnowNothing

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So are they allowed to register the free transferred players yet?

If not then what the hell are they supposed to do, sit and wait for this fiasco to play out or are they free to negotiate with other clubs?
The players should be able to train together without registration affecting it. They are surely under contract with the club. The only thing the club can’t do is register them, to be able to play in actual games.
 

King7Eric

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The players should be able to train together without registration affecting it. They are surely under contract with the club. The only thing the club can’t do is register them, to be able to play in actual games.
That's the funniest part for me. They are already sagging under their wage bill, they have added the likes of Depay and Aguero to it, whom they are now legally obligated to pay. But they can't actually play them. :lol:
 

anant

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Considering they need to raise 200m by reducing wages or selling players, I don't think one can solely blame Messi. Yeah, his high wages meant that other marquee signings would be asking for money relative to that. However, the issue has been their transfer business at large and who has benefitted from those insane wages.

For example, Coutinho as per some data analytics firms wasn't the most influential Pool player, and they had said that it wouldn't be a wise signing. Yet they paid 140m for him. They paid 105m for Dembele. 120m for Griezmann. Then there's the Pjanic-Arthur swap. All in all, they've wasted 450m on players who have turned out to be very high profile flops and were getting paid insane wages.

Move Messi out, and next season they'd lose another 40m for not getting into CL as well.
 

iKnowNothing

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That's the funniest part for me. They are already sagging under their wage bill, they have added the likes of Depay and Aguero to it, whom they are now legally obligated to pay. But they can't actually play them. :lol:
They are definitely under pressure to sell. I guess getting rid of Griezman will solve half their problems and if rumors are to be believed, they are talking to PL clubs about a transfer. Who else they sell besides Griezman remains to be seen.
 

Sarni

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For those who subscribe to the Athletic, there's an interesting graphic of the wage budgets of the Super League clubs over the last 10 years.

https://theathletic.com/2717019/202...par-with-ac-milan-and-tottenham/?source=ukdfb

For those who can't access this, Barca since 2018 had a wage budget above the £400m mark. That was about £100m more that Madrid who were the second highest.

In a nutshell, Barca should really have seen this coming a long way back.
It's just crazy how their wage limit is now expected to be £138m.

Other interesting things to note were that City were second last year at around £350, Liverpool 4th at around £325m.
We're 5th at just under £300m, but this year might be interesting if we add Sancho, Varane, and another without selling anyone.
Don't see how a top club can get to £138m to be honest but their limit being this low has a lot to do with how poor their books looked last year.
 

TrustInOle

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Considering they need to raise 200m by reducing wages or selling players, I don't think one can solely blame Messi. Yeah, his high wages meant that other marquee signings would be asking for money relative to that. However, the issue has been their transfer business at large and who has benefitted from those insane wages.

For example, Coutinho as per some data analytics firms wasn't the most influential Pool player, and they had said that it wouldn't be a wise signing. Yet they paid 140m for him. They paid 105m for Dembele. 120m for Griezmann. Then there's the Pjanic-Arthur swap. All in all, they've wasted 450m on players who have turned out to be very high profile flops and were getting paid insane wages.

Move Messi out, and next season they'd lose another 40m for not getting into CL as well.
When it is put like this, what the hell were they thinking! :lol:
 

kingwaynerooney

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Barca would sell Busquets in the blink of an eye if he agreed to leave and I don't think he would be a good signing.. Bid for De Jong and see how desperate they are.
They needed the Super League badly. They still haven't pulled out officially. I was reading Angelli's interview the other day. The reason for the Super League was never the Champions League. It is the EPL.
If they really were desperate to get rid of griezmans wages they should have accepted the swap with saul. They get a good player in return and save wages instead they insisted on 15m-20m. They probably have some back up plan for salary cap mess.
 

TheRedHearted

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Mmm. Yeah, he kind of is. And in the right context he's still a great player. Problem is barcelona have increasingly failed to provide said context for him. Been happening since 17/18, he's awesome if the game is played at the tempo he wants, but he becomes a liability at faster pace. Pick every big barcelona loss of the last 4 years and one thing they all have in common is Busquets looking like he was drowning/getting subbed off early
Interesting because others are saying he’s finished. Sounds like you’ve watched a decent amount of him. Anyway he would work in a midfield three here?(if pogba leaves and we sign a box to box next to Bruno
 

DiMaria

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This can be a lesson that all clubs should learn from. Barcelona should have sold Messi for a few hundred million 2/3 years ago and they would be around 500/600m better off right now. I appreciate he’s a club legend and easily the second best player of his generation but what has that money won them? One league title and one cup.

I just hope United don’t make the same mistake with Sancho in 10 years. Take the £800m and reinvest it in the squad.
Second to Paul Scholes or who?
 

Devil81

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The players should be able to train together without registration affecting it. They are surely under contract with the club. The only thing the club can’t do is register them, to be able to play in actual games.
If that were the case then surely they could just decide to not register some of their current players as they are under contract as well.
 

MUFC OK

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Barca would sell Busquets in the blink of an eye if he agreed to leave and I don't think he would be a good signing.. Bid for De Jong and see how desperate they are.
They needed the Super League badly. They still haven't pulled out officially. I was reading Angelli's interview the other day. The reason for the Super League was never the Champions League. It is the EPL.
Any particular reason for this? maybe the pace of the league but he was clearly world class against Italy at the Euros and still at the top of his game. Don't forget Carrick, Scholes played for us until they were like 36-38.
 

Dave Smith

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Don't see how a top club can get to £138m to be honest but their limit being this low has a lot to do with how poor their books looked last year.
Isn't £138m essentially Messi's prior contract? So, even at half rate he is taking up half their wage bill. 5 a side anyone?
 

giorno

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Interesting because others are saying he’s finished. Sounds like you’ve watched a decent amount of him. Anyway he would work in a midfield three here?(if pogba leaves and we sign a box to box next to Bruno
No. He'd get run off the park against any top PL side. Even at City he might struggle. I think he's finished at the top, top level(meaning he's just not a great player at that level anymore). He's just still a fantastic player at the level below that yet