"Big changes need to be made in the summer"

roonaldo78

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Davo said:
Get a new left back in on the cheap, or just make a choice between Neville, Silvestre and Fortune and stick with it for a bit...
why do you say left back ? We have heinze who has already taken up that position
 

MrMarcello

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Reds_always said:
Goalkeeper - Toldo
DM - Baraja, not really a DM, but could work with Keane
AM - Ballack
Winger - who can cross - dunno who, Wilhelmsson? Malouda?
Central defender - Kovac on a Bosman, or move Heinze to CD, sign a LB
Possible solutions?
 

Number7

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MrMarcello said:
If he's good enough, he'll eventually push the incumbent out. It has happened with other United youth (Scholes, Butt, Beckham, Gazza, etc.).

My point is, although that has always been 'the fergie way' , we are seeing less and less of it.
For example Liam Miller, Who was on the bench vs West Brom last week has continually been outclassed by his team mate - David Jones, in the reserves this season. Yet we've seen nothing of him at all, except for once in the FA cup.
 

Davo

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roonaldo78 said:
why do you say left back ? We have heinze who has already taken up that position
Because he's clearly a CB and should be played there...

I see Marcello's quickly down to naming loads of players you can't afford.....
 

roonaldo78

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Dubai_Devil said:
OK people im talking about major changes, not buy a new keeper or a new midfielder.
What do you mean by major changes ?

Sack fergie, sell the entire team and bring in a new set of players ?

That is hardly what we need at the moment. We have an excellent bunch of players and only the midfield needs a bit of sorting.
 

Irwin

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Heinze probably would be good at CB, but it wouldn't solve that much. We've got the second best defence in the league. Our problems are further up the pitch.
 

Dubai_Devil

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roonaldo78 said:
What do you mean by major changes ?

Sack fergie, sell the entire team and bring in a new set of players ?

That is hardly what we need at the moment. We have an excellent bunch of players and only the midfield needs a bit of sorting.
Well thats what plenty of people have said on here. 'This cant be allowed to happen, something major needs to be done over the summer.'
 

pbrown

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Dubai_Devil said:
What changes do think can actually be made?
I think we all should have access to the Newbie forum for new ideas to start with and that Charotte Church tread that got taken off the General Chat Forum should be reinstated immediately.. I get back to you on the team later... :houllier:
 

MrMarcello

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Number7 said:
My point is, although that has always been 'the fergie way' , we are seeing less and less of it.
For example Liam Miller, Who was on the bench vs West Brom last week has continually been outclassed by his team mate - David Jones, in the reserves this season. Yet we've seen nothing of him at all, except for once in the FA cup.
So you think he's going to start playing Spector at all? Spector had some class matches in August. But how many first team matches has he played since? I know he's suffered a couple minor injuries, but even when healthy, he's rarely even on the bench. Yet he's a much better LB than Fortune. But SAF trusts his veterans, maybe too much. The young players will go all out...they crave the first team match...they want to be a first team player. I hope SAF will give some of the youngsters a match against So'ton.

But the first bad match or two Spector suffers as the starting LB, the forum will attack him and moan about signing a veteran LB. It's a big decision for a manager to go with youth over experience...especially with so much money riding on CL qualification. I think Spector can handle it and is probably the LB of the future for United, but is he ready to be the unquestioned starting LB at age 19, considering he's only played in defense for roughly 3 years?
 

Irwin

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Well if we could find a top class LB who can cross well and cost only a few million, then fair enough. But it would make more difference if the money was spent on a CM IMO.
 

noodlehair

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I still think my ideas rule. In fairness, they probably do. Don't listen to Davo, he has a beard
 

MrMarcello

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Davo said:
Because he's clearly a CB and should be played there...

I see Marcello's quickly down to naming loads of players you can't afford.....
And you're quickly talking about Manchester United again...it's obvious you are a closet fan.
 

FLASHWOK

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leviathan said:
who is going to fetch that much???




i thought we had most of that already..




hope u're not serious.. i doubt the board will let the club go into debt and further doubt that we have a war chest of anything above 10-15mil pounds tops.

i still think we have enough quality in our side. the deadwood does need to be let out, but instead of binge buying, i'd like to see a lot more youngsters being given a chance..
I am completely serious Lev...there is what needs to be done, and what should be done, not necessarily what will be done...people want to know what NEEDS to be done? Perfectly stated in my post...we are going down for the proverbial "third time" the question is, do we try and get a life raft or do we look around for a piece of driftwood?

there isn't a single youngster in oursystem at the moment who will turn the tide.

It would not be binge buying...4 high quality players is not a binge...Chelsea and Arsenal in all likelihood will both move for 3-4 High quality reinforcements.

30 million pounds of debt is next to nothing paid over time...it's nothing more than a 1 pound per kit sale per year increas.

we can easily cull enough deadwood in sales and salary by getting rid of youngsters who will never cut it and crap fringe players.

and we only recently got the full balance of payment for the Stam transfer.

with some bravery we can win again...with a paralyzing timidity, we are finished and will fall further behind.
 

Davo

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MrMarcello said:
And you're quickly talking about Manchester United again...it's obvious you are a closet fan.
Stupid comment from someone whose just suggested signing Baraja and Ballack...

Says it all
 

MrMarcello

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Dubai_Devil said:
We couldnt be able to afford Ballack alone.
Has 1 year remaining on his contract, turns 29 this summer, and Bayern have been rumored to let him go if a good offer came in. I think Ballack has even stated he'd love to come to England.

I figure 5-6m would be a good offer and Bayern would probably take...considering he'll leave for nothing in 2006.
 

Dubai_Devil

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Flash, we are not going to borrow money to buy players, it just wont be allowed to happen and shouldnt for that matter. We have already recieved half of the Stam fee. Which quality players are a) available and b) can we afford?
 

Dubai_Devil

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MrMarcello said:
Has 1 year remaining on his contract, turns 29 this summer, and Bayern have been rumored to let him go if a good offer came in. I think Ballack has even stated he'd love to come to England.

I figure 5-6m would be a good offer and Bayern would probably take...considering he'll leave for nothing in 2006.
It would cost at least £15m to buy him, Bayern wont let him get to the end of his contract and we wont be the only one in for him.
 

Beedle

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MrMarcello said:
Possible solutions?
A whole new team with players aged between 28-30+ isn't what we need, and isn't the united way. Rebuilding our midfield with high class up and comming youngsters in the Essien, Fabregas, Xabi Alonso, Xavi mould is what we have to do, mixed with one or two experienced players in the 28-30 bracket (like those you mentioned)

It won't be easy and we'll get less trophies in the next couple of years. Mikel is hopefully a small start to SAF & Carlos' midfield revolution. Maybe Fletch will be a part of that too, but I have my doubts.
 

Dans

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Defence can be left as it is, though if anyone wanted Silvestre they can have him as far as I am concerned. Keeper and midfield are where we need changes. I wouldn't be surprised if having a very good keeper wouldn't help most. Confidence in your last line of defence is essential. Schmeichel and Cech prove that. Not sure who is available though. Keane and Scholes, whilst still both quality players, are living on borrowed time. We turn it on in the big games too infrequently. Only the 4-2 at the Arse sticks in my mind over the past 2 or 3 years. I would also not be too upset to cash in on Ronaldo - I am fed up with his diving. Granted he has talent, but he can't help himself and his sitting on the floor looking hard done by 20 times a game doesn't help when we need to get back and regain the ball.
 

MrMarcello

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Beedle said:
A whole new team with players aged between 28-30+ isn't what we need, and isn't the united way. Rebuilding our midfield with high class up and comming youngsters in the Essien, Fabregas, Xabi Alonso, Xavi mould is what we have to do, mixed with one or two experienced players in the 28-30 bracket (like those you mentioned)

It won't be easy and we'll get less trophies in the next couple of years. Mikel is hopefully a small start to SAF & Carlos' midfield revolution. Maybe Fletch will be a part of that too, but I have my doubts.
Those veteran players will give United 2-4 solid seasons, while the next batch of youngens mature into class players (hopefully). Jones, N'galula, Martin, etc., are still 1-2 years away from first team regulars.
 

Dubai_Devil

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MrMarcello said:
Marcello. We paid about £5m for that Obi bloke. We payed over £10m for Saha when we were the only one in for him. Are you so naive to think that if we made a bid of £5m for Ballack they would sell him straight away without bring other clubs in to the equation and starting a bidding war?
 

Dans

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Actually I have a feeling Ballack would be a very good signing for us. I just don't think he'll leave the Bundesliga before the World Cup.
 

Mozza

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Big change, drop scholes and never ever ever play him in midfield again, buy someone that can tackle and play a bit to partner Keane, get a couple of wingers in to cover for Ronnie and Giggs, 442 and off we go, 38 games later well be champions.
 

MrMarcello

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Dubai_Devil said:
Marcello. We paid about £5m for that Obi bloke. We payed over £10m for Saha when we were the only one in for him. Are you so naive to think that if we made a bid of £5m for Ballack they would sell him straight away without bring other clubs in to the equation and starting a bidding war?
The fee for Mikel has not been confirmed. It's rumored to be 2m base plus additional fees that could take it upwards of 6m (I've even heard as much as 8m).

And surely other clubs would love to sign Ballack...it still does not mean he would go for 15m when he has 1 year on his contract. No club would be foolish to pay that for him. Bayern might list 15m to scare clubs away. But come January, he'll just sign on a Bosman and leave in June.

And the possibility that Ballack might demand a move could leave Bayern having to accept a smaller fee than they want. It's happened before with other players.
 

MThomas

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Figo: In Spain we called Benitez 'píldora para dor
first of all,out with the trash, no more useless benchwarmers.
-o`shea
-kleberson
-phil neville

first 3 to go, none of them has had any true performances to back up either their paycheck or position at manchester united.
this could bring in as much as £5mill, add that to our kitty and we might be able to bring in a good cm, atleast get one on loan, like edgar davids, who would be a major asset for us.

then we have to stop tinkering with every god damn lineup, we simply have to realise that we are one of the teams that everyone wants to beat, and when we actually give them true belief that they can,then we are just asking for it...no more underestimating other teams.
lets find the best 11 and try to stick with it, then bet our money on squad players who we bought in for quality, not quantity,that can get the job done when we need them.

placing heinze as a cb would be a mistake, he`s been nuttmegged a "couple" of times recently,and his arms keeps making freekicks on our left side.i love him for his attitude, but his defence needs some work, therefore i dont want to place him there just yet. his toughness could be exactly what we need, but as a player he`s just not ready for it yet.

we cant always rely on rooney and ronaldo to create everything, as it is now, both of them has way to much pressure on their legs.
scholesy has been rather dreadfull this season, same goes for giggsy.
i have said this several times before, when both of them hit that wonderfull spell, they are almost impossible to stop.
giggsy is running down the wing,scholesy is setting up goals and banging them in as well..unfortunately, its been a while since their last spell now.
the worst part is, we dont have anyone to replace them with that can actually get the job done. if we dont play with ronaldo then our right side is basicly paralyzed, if we dont play with giggsy then our left side is paralyzed.
using rooney on the left is as far away from the answer as we can get, its just not him. we just dont have any proper cover.

saha is turning out to be a major issue.
we bought him because of what he had done at fulham troughout half a season, emergency buy due to our issues upfront, we managed to get ripped off, payed way to much for him.
the question is, should we try to cash in on him now ? how much would we be able to get for him ?
i think we should sell him, it would raise some cash for our transfer kitty, and ole is coming back as well (yes, i would rather risk everything on ole than on saha) .

i think that this is the most important summer in recent history, where we have to bring in replacements for several positions, though little money in the transfer kitty to do so. chelsea will only get better, same goes for arsenal.
liverpool (this has probably been said every summer for the last decade,therefore i wont say it). we cant afford to fall behind.
 

FLASHWOK

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MrMarcello said:
Those veteran players will give United 2-4 solid seasons, while the next batch of youngens mature into class players (hopefully). Jones, N'galula, Martin, etc., are still 1-2 years away from first team regulars.
1-2 years away from being first team!!!!!!!!!! :houllier:

considering none of them have even featured in the first team in a league game I would say that is extraordinarily insane and overly optimistic!!!! we would get crushed.

MAYBE 3-4 years...if any of them turn out to be good enough, which there is no guarantee....None of them have even been on the bench for a league fixture and they are going to be first team in 1-2 years...I think not.
 

Dans

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Ahhhh, the much vaunted youth system that has produced.........feck all since Giggs and Scholes.
 

Plechazunga

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It's all been said a billion times...but feck it

New keeper
Heinze to centre half
Can't afford a top centre midfielder, will have to make do, I'd play Smith there and see how he did
Buy some cover on the right wing if we've got any cash
Have some patience for a season or 2
 

luko

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we should play with two solid, quality DM or at least two who can tackle well. it would allow us to play 442, Arsenal do it well when they play with silva and vieira, and i think its better than playing five in midfield. we dont seem to be able to do that very well and 442 would still allow us to play attacking football.play rooney and ruud up front and sign a winger to compete with ronaldo and giggs. a new GK obviously