BLM in the Prem

Posh Red

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Yeah I think it's inevitable we'll see backlash as society tries to change for the better. Hopefully it will be a dying ember rather than massive flames.
Yeah I agree. I just think back to those United fans gathering outside Ed’s house. We all know how stupid football fans can be.
 

Ravelation

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Yeah I think it's inevitable we'll see backlash as society tries to change for the better. Hopefully it will be a dying ember rather than massive flames.
They already have, the Hooligans that went as counter protestors and sparked violence against the police and some BLM protestors in london.
It's a really shi**y time for a lot of black people; who feel like they have to engage in constant debates about BLM and human rights, etc, and deal with the backlash from genuinely racist people revolting against the movement, while have to be calm and patient with everybody who engages in countering their views.\

It's absolutely insane to me that we are even discussing if encouragement of a positive message via the PL is the 'right' thing the pL should be doing.
 

Posh Red

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They already have, the Hooligans that went as counter protestors and sparked violence against the police and some BLM protestors in london.
It's a really shi**y time for a lot of black people; who feel like they have to engage in constant debates about BLM and human rights, etc, and deal with the backlash from genuinely racist people revolting against the movement, while have to be calm and patient with everybody who engages in countering their views.\

It's absolutely insane to me that we are even discussing if encouragement of a positive message via the PL is the 'right' thing the pL should be doing.
Just to be clear I’m completely on board with everything the PL is doing and back Sterling all the way with the messages he sends out. Just can’t help but worry about what’s round the corner.
 

jus2nang

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There are 32 teams in the NFL

Dak Prescott
Pat Mahomes
Jameis Winston
Lamar Jackson
Russell Wilson

Are 5 "non-white" QBs who had a starting role last year that I can name without going through rosters

Marcus Mariotta
Deshaun Watson

I don't see all of those players be branded or defined by one skillset or bein typecast and they're definitely not underrepresented at that position.
Yeah I wasn't suggesting that there weren't any - and I'm by no means an authority on NFL so kept it very short.

However, I'm pretty sure that not so long ago this was a topic of conversation, not only that there weren't that many but the few that were around weren't considered "thinking quarterbacks".

I'm not massive on NFL, are the above QBs considered intelligent?
 

Rish Sawhney

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Yeah I wasn't suggesting that there weren't any - and I'm by no means an authority on NFL so kept it very short.

However, I'm pretty sure that not so long ago this was a topic of conversation, not only that there weren't that many but the few that were around weren't considered "thinking quarterbacks".

I'm not massive on NFL, are the above QBs considered intelligent?
I think this was definitely a problem historically but recently its been more a meme about players "looking like a franchise quarterback" (usually coinciding with them looking like a blonde haired blue eyed farm boy). I don't think anyone in charge of recruiting really looks down upon black QBs as less intelligent or something like that. However there is still an issue with what people call passing QBs vs running QBs. There is a bit of a racial connotation there, for example Colin Kaepernick was what you'd call a running QB and therefore was thought to have a shorter shelf life. But thats also not really seriously held opinion on racial lines as Russ and Pat are two of the best pure passers as well.

Regarding your question, Russel Wilson, Pat Mahomes and Lamar Jackson along with Deshaun Watson are considered probably in the top 5-7 QBs currently playing and certainly considered intelligent. Mahomes in particular is said to have a photographic memory for plays. Dak is more of a workmanlike average QB while Jameis is a very talented but very risky passer. He famously threw 30 TDs (a very good production) and 30 interceptions (an insane number) last season. So lots of variety there.
 

2 man midfield

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So the Burnley fan responsible for the banner has been sacked apparently.
 

DoomSlayer

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So the Burnley fan responsible for the banner has been sacked apparently.
Is it true that he gave an excuse for some racist remarks on social media by saying he sometimes gets "coked up" and starts talking dumb shit? :lol: Can you fit a stereotype more than that, ffs?
 

2 man midfield

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So he spends money, gets dog's abuse for his efforts, loses his job. Did he get banned by Burnley yet?
He did. He'll probably just buy his tickets under a new name once the dust has settled though. By the time fans are allowed back in, who's going to remember his face?

Is it true that he gave an excuse for some racist remarks on social media by saying he sometimes gets "coked up" and starts talking dumb shit? :lol: Can you fit a stereotype more than that, ffs?
Yeah I read that too. Probably not the best thing he could've said.
 

starman

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Its stuff like this as to why the PL should never have got involved with BLM and instead done its own anti racism stance/campaign
 

Mogget

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Its stuff like this as to why the PL should never have got involved with BLM and instead done its own anti racism stance/campaign
All the racists being triggered in the replies. Love it.
 

Zlatan 7

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All the racists being triggered in the replies. Love it.
Quick question, about a week or so ago a poster mentioned that they didn’t support BLM as one of its aims was to bring down capitalism. This was countered by saying that wasn’t actually UKBLM but BLMUK )not sure which way around). This Twitter BLM has the same bring down capitalism pinned tweet. M

so my question, is there two different BLM in the uk and if so why
 

Mogget

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Quick question, about a week or so ago a poster mentioned that they didn’t support BLM as one of its aims was to bring down capitalism. This was countered by saying that wasn’t actually UKBLM but BLMUK )not sure which way around). This Twitter BLM has the same bring down capitalism pinned tweet. M

so my question, is there two different BLM in the uk and if so why
I've genuinely got no idea
 

SilentWitness

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You can be for the meaning and phrase behind “black lives matter” without being for the group BLM.
 

Zlatan 7

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You can be for the meaning and phrase behind “black lives matter” without being for the group BLM.
How does that work? One says they support BLM but not the group BLM whenever it’s mentioned. I can see why this gets confusing and met with opposition by people if that’s the case
 

Mogget

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Ok fair enough, I’m interested to know what’s what though. I’ll try to find the exchange
I remember the exchange too, and remember there being two separate websites for donation which were linked. I don't see what the issue is though
 

Zlatan 7

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I remember the exchange too, and remember there being two separate websites for donation which were linked. I don't see what the issue is though
I don’t think I said there was an issue. I’m still interested to know why there’s two different groups and why and who supports what. Don’t you think that’s interesting? Why are they not one BLM group?
 

SweetRightFoot

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All the racists being triggered in the replies. Love it.
Looks like a lot of jewish/israeli nationals throwing their toys out the pram.

BLM: End police brutality in America!
Israelis: Yeah!
BLM: and in Palestine!
Israelis: No.
 

horsechoker

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You can be for the meaning and phrase behind “black lives matter” without being for the group BLM.
Yeah it's the meaning and not the organisation. You can change the words as long as they convey the same message "black lives are important, black people matter" etc.
 

Mogget

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I don’t think I said there was an issue. I’m still interested to know why there’s two different groups and why and who supports what. Don’t you think that’s interesting? Why are they not one BLM group?
There's always the risk of opportunists jumping on bandwagons, especially if there's donations involved. I don't think that should detract from the original message.
Looks like a lot of jewish/israeli nationals throwing their toys out the pram.

BLM: End police brutality in America!
Israelis: Yeah!
BLM: and in Palestine!
Israelis: No.
Yep. As well as the "all lives matter" crowd using this to justify their decision to continue being racist because its proof BLM are "far left antisemitic marxists" :lol:
 

SilentWitness

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How does that work? One says they support BLM but not the group BLM whenever it’s mentioned. I can see why this gets confusing and met with opposition by people if that’s the case
Because the organisation BLM can have other motives or beliefs aside from the sole message and meaning of the phrase “black lives matter”. As @horsechoker said, the phrase can be worded differently but the meaning stays the same.
 

Zlatan 7

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Because the organisation BLM can have other motives or beliefs aside from the sole message and meaning of the phrase “black lives matter”. As @horsechoker said, the phrase can be worded differently but the meaning stays the same.
Yeah I get all that, and don’t confuse me questioning this with not supporting the phrase BLM. I’d say for most people supporting that phrase is obvious and a given.
It does interest me thought that it possibly needs to be separated from the organisation BLM and it’s not something I’d put much thought into before now to be honest. So when companies and say the premier league have that on their shirts, accounts, tweets etc are they supporting just the phrase or the whole organisation.

I know it’s something of nothing before I get jumped on.
 

Zlatan 7

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Yeah it's the meaning and not the organisation. You can change the words as long as they convey the same message "black lives are important, black people matter" etc.
That’s obvious to me though. Out of curiosity do support the phrase black lives matter aswell as support BLM organisation? Or are you indifferent and not really care? did you always know there was this distinction between supporting the phrase or organisation?
 

starman

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All the racists being triggered in the replies. Love it.
What replies? I am curious about what you think makes them racist? Is it because everyone is not replying with agreement, is that what racism is nowadays? Is it someone with a blacklivesmatter statement tagged to their opinion makes them immune from criticism and if you do that make you racist?

BLM is exposing itself as a political organisation, exactly the reason the PL should never have got involved with it

As for them being supposedly separate, its irrelevant, the PL should have been smart enough to do their own research to avoid confusion. However that's not even the case, the founders of the US movement have endorsed BLMUK, so they do have a genuine connection besides sharing a slogan.
 

Zlatan 7

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We shouldn’t need an organisation for Black Lives to Matter in the first place.
Very true, obviously.

But now that we have, isn’t it ok to ask questions about it and if people follow the organisation as a whole or just the phrase?

Or am I to blindly follow any organisation that is currently popular for fear of being called out and ostracised?

Yes I’ll get the usually response of educate myself and do reading, I will of course, but I’m sure questions can also be asked on a forum? even though some here like to jump on and mock, I know there’s also others that take the time to answer and reply in an uncondescsnding manner.
 

horsechoker

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That’s obvious to me though. Out of curiosity do support the phrase black lives matter aswell as support BLM organisation? Or are you indifferent and not really care? did you always know there was this distinction between supporting the phrase or organisation?
I knew of the organisation but as far as I know most people are quoting the message not the organisation
 

Javi

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Political issues and expressing a anti racism message are not the same thing.
BLM is a political "issue" too. Besides, they'd probably argue that «free palestine» is an anti-racist message, insofar as Palestinians are denied equal rights. But I get where you're coming from, it can feel like they are expanding their mission top down.
 

Zlatan 7

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I knew of the organisation but as far as I know most people are quoting the message not the organisation
Fair enough. Upto now I honestly thought the phrase and organisation was as one and that’s what’s being supported by the prem league etc.
 

Cheimoon

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I knew of the organisation but as far as I know most people are quoting the message not the organisation
I think so too. Personally, I don't know anything about the organization, in terms of its goals, structure, whether national groups are (semi-?) separate, etc. But I do know I support the BLM message. In that sense, I guess it's a pity the organization didn't adopt a different name, so the slogan could stand on its own. But it is what it is.
 

SilentWitness

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Yeah I get all that, and don’t confuse me questioning this with not supporting the phrase BLM. I’d say for most people supporting that phrase is obvious and a given.
It does interest me thought that it possibly needs to be separated from the organisation BLM and it’s not something I’d put much thought into before now to be honest. So when companies and say the premier league have that on their shirts, accounts, tweets etc are they supporting just the phrase or the whole organisation.

I know it’s something of nothing before I get jumped on.
I think there will be some people who support the organisation and phrase and some who just support the phrase. Thing is, everyone who supports the organisation will support the phrase. That's not the case the other way.

I think it's a bit sad and disappointing too that people wouldn't be able to disassociate the message from the organisation.
 

Zlatan 7

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I think there will be some people who support the organisation and phrase and some who just support the phrase. Thing is, everyone who supports the organisation will support the phrase. That's not the case the other way.

I think it's a bit sad and disappointing too that people wouldn't be able to disassociate the message from the organisation.
Thanks for the reply. As I said re the bold, I didn’t even know there was a difference until today
 

Wiltord02

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I think this is why the Premier League should have used the KickItOut campaign instead.

Pretty much every single person can get behind that message, without it becoming bogged down in politics.
 

horsechoker

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I think this is why the Premier League should have used the KickItOut campaign instead.

Pretty much every single person can get behind that message, without it becoming bogged down in politics.
The kick it out campaign relates to football from what I can tell whereas this is a protest against police brutality and other things that harm black people.

The opposition will always find ways to pick holes in your message. Even if the Premier league chose a different phrase, there would be people complaining.
 

AFC NimbleThumb

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Very true, obviously.

But now that we have, isn’t it ok to ask questions about it and if people follow the organisation as a whole or just the phrase?

Or am I to blindly follow any organisation that is currently popular for fear of being called out and ostracised?

Yes I’ll get the usually response of educate myself and do reading, I will of course, but I’m sure questions can also be asked on a forum? even though some here like to jump on and mock, I know there’s also others that take the time to answer and reply in an uncondescsnding manner.
My intention wasn’t to be condescending, this has been discussed to a point of nauseam in the CE Forum.

Supporting the statement & supporting the organisation are 2 different things & personally I think anyone trying to position BLMUK or whatever they’re going by as a ‘political party’ are being wilfully ignorant.

It’s fine to ask questions, obviously, but you’ve already said in the thread you can acknowledge the statement & the movement as separate things so I’m unsure what you’re asking [sorry if I’ve missed it].