Bruno, Fred, McT

[UNITED ACADEMY]

There is a reason why Santos doesn’t play Neves with Bruno together. It was often William & Danilo. We just need to replace Matic with Zakaria so we can give these two some rest when needed, sick of having lazy, ball watching & can’t sense danger defensive midfielder like Matic.

 

[Walters_19_MuFc]

The worrying thing is that we have no one in the squad similar to them and they obviously wont be able to play every game.

The only other defensive midfielder is Matic and hes losing his legs.

Pivotal we get a energetic midfielder next season or even January if we can.

 

[TheGame]

They will probably play in tougher games but we should look to play VDB in other games with maybe Pogba wide right or left.

 

[Thiagoal]

McT is massively underrated on here! He does the crucial dirty work really well! Some great expansive passing today too! Fred played his usual all action game and kept thinks ticking nicely

 

[Borys]

They were better offensively than defensively. I think they are growing, by far our best midfield and I have no issues playing them in any game.

 

[el3mel]

It's obvious from today this is the midfield Ole trusts the most when he needs a result so I think he'll stop changing things and will stick with them for now. Those 3 seem to never fail him.

 

[Walters_19_MuFc]

They will probably play in tougher games but we should look to play VDB in other games with maybe Pogba wide right or left.

As long as we keep that base with McT and Fred, then as you said, we can chop and change our front four.

 

[Bobski]

They play with a consistent energy no matter the situation, makes the game so much easier for the CB's, instead of having to defend one v one constantly as they did with Matic/Pogba they can go for the ball against a pressured opponent. Saw that a lot with Maguire today, winning balls that the pressure from our midfield made winnable.

 

[bond19821982]

It's our best balanced midfield not necessarily the talented one though. Mata has a role in that as well . He just keeps us ticking with that solid base. Take Mata out and bring James on you will see the quality difference.

A player like Saul would make a hell of a difference. Partey would have been perfect for 50m.

 

[AltiUn]

It should be Fred or McTominay, not both. It’s no shock we started creating more chances when we introduced our more creative players. Fred and McTominay is an 8th place midfield.

I said this earlier in the thread. I still don't think it's a great midfield but going off Pogba's and Matic's form then it probably is our best midfield. There's never any surprises which is why Solskjaer is probably right to trust it.

 

[charlenefan]

What's the actual win % when these 3 play?

 

[JakeC]

There is a reason why Santos doesn’t play Neves with Bruno together. It was often William & Danilo. We just need to replace Matic with Zakaria so we can give these two some rest when needed, sick of having lazy, ball watching & can’t sense danger defensive midfielder like Matic.

Jesus, you can call him a lot of things, but lazy just isn't a word anyone with 2 eyes should be calling Matic.

 

[KW2006]

Not perfect(too rely on Bruno for creativity), but the best combination we have.

 

[Pablo18th]

What's the actual win % when these 3 play?

I'm looking for this stat too because I don't think we have lost with them and Ole knows this.They will fight for the team.

 

[UNITED ACADEMY]

Jesus, you can call him a lot of things, but lazy just isn't a word anyone with 2 eyes should be calling Matic.

I disagree.

 

[MadDogg]

We beat Newcastle 4-1 with them.

It was only 1-1 until Pogba came on and replaced Fred.

 

[MadDogg]

Jesus, you can call him a lot of things, but lazy just isn't a word anyone with 2 eyes should be calling Matic.

He's very lazy at following runners who get passed him. Time after time we see opposition midfielders running around him and straight at our defenders while he just slowly jogs back watching.

 

[K Stand Knut]

Our best midfield duo.

Easily. Absolutely no question about it.

They should start every game moving forward with Fernandes, Martial, Rashford and one other (I’d prefer Cavani) up top.

 

[red woppit]

McT is massively underrated on here! He does the crucial dirty work really well! Some great expansive passing today too! Fred played his usual all action game and kept thinks ticking nicely

McTominay had a good game, just once I remember him switching off, when Digne hit the post, McTominay didn't track back with him, but apart from that the lad played well. If Rashford and Martial had been on their game up front, we could have had five.
I don't think it's an exaggeration to say that Maguire and Lindelof looked pretty good today, overall, thanks to the wall in front of them stopping quite a few attacks from getting through.

 

[MadDogg]

What's the actual win % when these 3 play?

With these three in a trio (so not counting games where we've played four with Matic or Pogba in there as well) it's actually not good in the league.

19/20 Spurs: we were losing until Pogba replaced Fred and won us the penalty and we ended up with a draw.
20/21 Newcastle: drawing 1-1 until Pogba once again replaced Fred and we ended up winning 4-1.
20/21 Chelsea: 0-0 draw.
20/21 Everton: 3-1 win.

1 win, 2 draws and a loss based purely on the period that we had all three on the field. Small sample size obviously though.

We've done better in the cups, with wins against Derby, Norwich (although we were drawing that game at the time Matic and Pogba replaced Scott and Fred), Club Brugge, LASK and PSG. Obviously fairly low level opposition other than PSG though.

 

[Leftback99]

I think eventually we'll be looking for more quality on the ball than McTominay but the side is a lot more balanced with him and Fred aggressively closing space in midfield rather than the passiveness of Pogba and Matic. Clear first choice right now.

 

[Walters_19_MuFc]

It was only 1-1 until Pogba came on and replaced Fred.

But we dominated the game and created chances with them on the field.

We had Matic VdB and Bruno on the pitch the other day against Istanbul and created feck all.

 

[charlenefan]

With these three in a trio (so not counting games where we've played four with Matic or Pogba in there as well) it's actually not good in the league.

19/20 Spurs: we were losing until Pogba replaced Fred and won us the penalty and we ended up with a draw.
20/21 Newcastle: drawing 1-1 until Pogba once again replaced Fred and we ended up winning 4-1.
20/21 Chelsea: 0-0 draw.
20/21 Everton: 3-1 win.

1 win, 2 draws and a loss based purely on the period that we had all three on the field. Small sample size obviously though.

We've done better in the cups, with wins against Derby, Norwich (although we were drawing that game at the time Matic and Pogba replaced Scott and Fred), Club Brugge, LASK and PSG. Obviously fairly low level opposition other than PSG though.

what about Matic, Fred and Bruno?

 

[Roboc7]

The Fred/Mctominay combination is only going to take you so far, it’s fine as a quick fix and maybe for someone as limited as Ole keeping it simple for rest of season is his best bet.

All Ole is trying to do is play very basic and quite cautious football, he’s not building anything so simpler the better and it might keep him plodding along enough to save his job.

 

[MadDogg]

what about Matic, Fred and Bruno?

Won three out of three in the league (Chelsea, Watford and Man City last season) but lost against Chelsea in the FA Cup semi. I want to see it more often because it's my preferred combination in theory, so I want to see if it works as well in real life as it does in my head.

I made this thread a couple of weeks ago that goes into the league records of different combinations, although obviously it doesn't include the last few games.

 

[acnumber9]

With these three in a trio (so not counting games where we've played four with Matic or Pogba in there as well) it's actually not good in the league.

19/20 Spurs: we were losing until Pogba replaced Fred and won us the penalty and we ended up with a draw.
20/21 Newcastle: drawing 1-1 until Pogba once again replaced Fred and we ended up winning 4-1.
20/21 Chelsea: 0-0 draw.
20/21 Everton: 3-1 win.

1 win, 2 draws and a loss based purely on the period that we had all three on the field. Small sample size obviously though.

We've done better in the cups, with wins against Derby, Norwich (although we were drawing that game at the time Matic and Pogba replaced Scott and Fred), Club Brugge, LASK and PSG. Obviously fairly low level opposition other than PSG though.

We were drawing against PSG as well before Pogba came on. At this stage we probably need to cut our losses on Pogba and get a midfielder who can pass and make the occasional tackle.

 

[MadDogg]

We were drawing against PSG as well before Pogba came on.

Ah yes, of course. Pogba actually got the assist for Rashford's winner. So you could actually say that today was the first win out of five games against decent opposition (although we turned two draws into wins and one loss into a draw once we bought Pogba on).

 

[MattofManchester]

Am I the only one that finds it incredibly frustrating that we require both McTom and Fred to protect the flaws of our XI while placing so much emphasis on Bruno as the playmaker. Hence, when he's not on, we suffer immensely. Even then, we still have a frequency to lose the ball in dangerous positions, but this weirdly goes unnoticed.

I suppose it's necessary for now, but this is not a duo that wins you the league.

 

[kiristao]

I like these 3 in midfield against better teams but our regular line up should be
Rashford - Martial
Bruno
Pogba - Fred - VDB

 

[Njord]

Think this is a sign of the times. If your midfield can't cover enough ground, you can't send your FBs forward, as your CBs gets exposed.

I think we would benefit if we changed Matic and Pogba with two more energetic CDMs, like Ndidi and Zakaria.

 

[Trex]

I would like to see Vdb in place of Mctominay against deep sitting teams and this trio against teams that would come at us,Pogba should be used somewhere else (as Bruno and Rashford sub),Matic shouldn't be here next season,we should get a more mobile replacement

 

[Poborsky's hair]

Fred is as important as Bruno for us the key is to find another player to upgrade McT who is a decent squad option and a good lad but his passing is very erratic and generally not good enough, neither his touch and overall vision.

Would like to see maybe VdB there, provides the legs and can win the ball too, not as dominant as McT but he's a clever player, actually find him out Herrera replacement. Has good movement, plays one touch football, never stops running, decent vision and short & midrange passing, a great modern no8 option imho. Like with Ander he waswas deployed as a no10 there but coming to a club like United the bar is higher so hehad to adjust his defensive game and start playing a bit deeper. I think DvdB wouldn't have a problem to be developped as a no8 for us.

Also if we finally ditch Lindelof for someone powerful and fast like Axel / Upamecano, we will have more cover and Fred for me would be enough to mop around with the obvious defensive help of VdB and Bruno as well

 

[Abhinav]

As I said earlier, Ole should play this midfield in tough away matches and replace McT/Fred with Vdb in home games where we are expected to drive the play. Keep Pogba & Matic to the bench or play them in the league cup/ FA cup.

 

[Red20]

That formation was the reason we finished third last season.and the reason we did so well in 2 champion league games. And thet have to play the majority of games.pogba will have to get used to being an impact sub until he offers more to the team or leaves

 

[Borys]

Midfield (starting XI)	Scored	Conceded	Games	Av. Scored	Av. Conceded	Av. G/D
Matic & Fred	8​	0​	2​	4,0​	0,0​	4,0​
Fred + 1	20​	4​	8​	2,5​	0,5​	2,0​
McTominay & Fred	12​	4​	6​	2,0​	0,7​	1,3​
Matic + 1	12​	8​	4​	3,0​	2,0​	1,0​
McTominay + 1	13​	7​	6​	2,2​	1,2​	1,0​
Pogba + 1	5​	11​	3​	1,7​	3,7​	-2,0​
Matic & Pogba	4​	8​	2​	2,0​	4,0​	-2,0​
McTominay & Pogba	1​	3​	1​	1,0​	3,0​	-2,0​

Midfield performance updated. Starting with McTominay-Fred we've conceded 4 goals (Shaw own goal, Martial own goal, penalty after Pogba foul, and only one from open play against Everton). We've scored a total of 12 goals in 6 games (bolded). We got two bad results against Chelsea and Arsenal, you could argue if the midfield was at fault but I wouldn't say so. So one draw loss (Arsenal), one draw (Chelsea), and 4 wins with average of 3 goals scored per game. Good enough for me.

This table shows who should be first choice CM and last choice CM. Time will tell if Pogba can climb up the ladder, or if van de Beek will overtake.

To be honest after watching City - Liverpool game, I don't see what Gundogan - Rodri and Wijnaldum - Henderson have over Fred - McTominay. They seem to be doing pretty much the same simple stuff. It's the attackers that make the difference - Liverpool have 3 performing forwards, City have two, and we have 0,5 (depending on which day you catch Rashford).

 

[bugmat]

It was only 1-1 until Pogba came on and replaced Fred.

This is called a "lack of context" - if Pogba or Matic had started instead of Fred or McT it probably would've been 1-3 to Newcastle when the subs were made.

 

[dal]

It’s striking that balance in the right game.

Honestly I’m happy with any two of matic, Fred, Mctominay starting games. VDB and Pogba can play if we are chasing games.

When pogba is on form he can play that role fine but it’s inconsistent.

Regardless, we will need him there at some point form or no form.

 

[Hammondo]

Midfield (starting XI)	Scored	Conceded	Games	Av. Scored	Av. Conceded	Av. G/D
Matic & Fred	8​	0​	2​	4,0​	0,0​	4,0​
Fred + 1	20​	4​	8​	2,5​	0,5​	2,0​
McTominay & Fred	12​	4​	6​	2,0​	0,7​	1,3​
Matic + 1	12​	8​	4​	3,0​	2,0​	1,0​
McTominay + 1	13​	7​	6​	2,2​	1,2​	1,0​
Pogba + 1	5​	11​	3​	1,7​	3,7​	-2,0​
Matic & Pogba	4​	8​	2​	2,0​	4,0​	-2,0​
McTominay & Pogba	1​	3​	1​	1,0​	3,0​	-2,0​

Midfield performance updated. Starting with McTominay-Fred we've conceded 4 goals (Shaw own goal, Martial own goal, penalty after Pogba foul, and only one from open play against Everton). We've scored a total of 12 goals in 6 games (bolded). We got two bad results against Chelsea and Arsenal, you could argue if the midfield was at fault but I wouldn't say so. So one draw loss (Arsenal), one draw (Chelsea), and 4 wins with average of 3 goals scored per game. Good enough for me.

This table shows who should be first choice CM and last choice CM. Time will tell if Pogba can climb up the ladder, or if van de Beek will overtake.

To be honest after watching City - Liverpool game, I don't see what Gundogan - Rodri and Wijnaldum - Henderson have over Fred - McTominay. They seem to be doing pretty much the same simple stuff. It's the attackers that make the difference - Liverpool have 3 performing forwards, City have two, and we have 0,5 (depending on which day you catch Rashford).

I agree, I think our midfield is our strongest part.

Yes it could be improved on but Fred, mctominay, Bruno is good.

 

[Foxbatt]

I would prefer to get a quality DM so that we do not have to use McTominay at all.

 

[Leftback99]

Midfield (starting XI)	Scored	Conceded	Games	Av. Scored	Av. Conceded	Av. G/D
Matic & Fred	8​	0​	2​	4,0​	0,0​	4,0​
Fred + 1	20​	4​	8​	2,5​	0,5​	2,0​
McTominay & Fred	12​	4​	6​	2,0​	0,7​	1,3​
Matic + 1	12​	8​	4​	3,0​	2,0​	1,0​
McTominay + 1	13​	7​	6​	2,2​	1,2​	1,0​
Pogba + 1	5​	11​	3​	1,7​	3,7​	-2,0​
Matic & Pogba	4​	8​	2​	2,0​	4,0​	-2,0​
McTominay & Pogba	1​	3​	1​	1,0​	3,0​	-2,0​

Midfield performance updated. Starting with McTominay-Fred we've conceded 4 goals (Shaw own goal, Martial own goal, penalty after Pogba foul, and only one from open play against Everton). We've scored a total of 12 goals in 6 games (bolded). We got two bad results against Chelsea and Arsenal, you could argue if the midfield was at fault but I wouldn't say so. So one draw loss (Arsenal), one draw (Chelsea), and 4 wins with average of 3 goals scored per game. Good enough for me.

This table shows who should be first choice CM and last choice CM. Time will tell if Pogba can climb up the ladder, or if van de Beek will overtake.

To be honest after watching City - Liverpool game, I don't see what Gundogan - Rodri and Wijnaldum - Henderson have over Fred - McTominay. They seem to be doing pretty much the same simple stuff. It's the attackers that make the difference - Liverpool have 3 performing forwards, City have two, and we have 0,5 (depending on which day you catch Rashford).

Pogba is far from deserving his place back but i was surprised we didn't start the season the Fred + Pogba midfield which had us playing good stuff in the the Europa league (we were the better team against Sevilla).