Can Bruno break the PL assists record? | 4 more to go in 6 games | officially overtakes Nani and Becks

Seen people start to pick up the open play versus set pieces debate with his numbers.

Not sure why it matters for assists. Different kettle of fish for pens in a way
 
Sandikan said:
Seen people start to pick up the open play versus set pieces debate with his numbers.

Not sure why it matters for assists. Different kettle of fish for pens in a way
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Just another way of playing down his contribution imo
 
Assists from set pieces are legit. Most set pieces have a low probability of resulting in a goal.

Penalties on the other hand should be discarded when discussing goalscoring (or g+a stats). It's a free goal more than half the time even for a terrible penalty taker.
 
Sandikan said:
Seen people start to pick up the open play versus set pieces debate with his numbers.
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Yeah, it's predictable at this stage...

If it was that easy to get assists from set pieces, then how come only one player have broken the 9 assist mark (Gerrard with 11 in 2013–14)? Even Beckham and TAA never managed more than 7 assists from set pieces.
 
Skills said:
Assists from set pieces are legit. Most set pieces have a low probability of resulting in a goal.

Penalties on the other hand should be discarded when discussing goalscoring (or g+a stats). It's a free goal more than half the time even for a terrible penalty taker.
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To some extent maybe, but what about open play goals where the ball sits up for an empty net tap in 2 yards out? Those aren't any more valid than pens.
 
Scandi Red said:
Yeah, it's predictable at this stage...

If it was that easy to get assists from set pieces, then how come only one player have broken the 9 assist mark (Gerrard with 11 in 2013–14)? Even Beckham and TAA never managed more than 7 assists from set pieces.
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It's always a bit weird when crowds go really excited for corners, as they're such a low percentage play.
 
Sandikan said:
It's always a bit weird when crowds go really excited for corners, as they're such a low percentage play.
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Yup.

And then there are freekicks. It's not easy to assist from those! And half of Bruno's set piece assists have come from freekicks.
 
Sandikan said:
To some extent maybe, but what about open play goals where the ball sits up for an empty net tap in 2 yards out? Those aren't any more valid than pens.
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This is always a very silly argument, because every single outfield attacking player on the pitch could end up in that position to score that easy tap in.

Penalty takers are chosen/allocated - so the biggest factor in you managing to get a penalty goal is, whether you get a chance to take one or not. So it's not the same thing.
 
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Skills said:
This is always a very silly argument, because literally every single outfield attacking player on the pitch could end up in that position to score that easy tap in.

Penalty takers are chosen/allocated - so the biggest factor in you managing to get a penalty goal is, whether you get a chance to take one or not. So it's not the same thing.
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Technically true but clearly players that play in more advanced positions (eg centre forwards) are exponentially more likely to be the beneficiaries of tap ins.
 
Pickle85 said:
Technically true but clearly players that play in more advanced positions (eg centre forwards) are exponentially more likely to be the beneficiaries of tap ins.
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Exponential if you're comparing the likelihood of an attacker scoring a tap-in to say a defender. Not an exponential difference between other attackers though (though naturally positional some differences).

A penalty is much more deterministic, because only 1 player can take it.
 
Skills said:
This is always a very silly argument, because every single outfield attacking player on the pitch could end up in that position to score that easy tap in.

Penalty takers are chosen/allocated - so the biggest factor in you managing to get a penalty goal is, whether you get a chance to take one or not. So it's not the same thing.
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It's only "silly" for people who have an issue with pens counting in stats. To most, a goal is a goal.
Otherwise you can just start applying the chance of scoring goals depending on how good your team is and so on.
 
Pickle85 said:
Technically true but clearly players that play in more advanced positions (eg centre forwards) are exponentially more likely to be the beneficiaries of tap ins.
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Yep, it's a very weird thing to say, when in reality a full back might get 1 tap in a season and some strikers make a living off scraps.
 
I'm pretty sure that if you examined some of the greatest CFs of all time who also took penalties, then you quickly discover that they have as many tap-ins as they have penalty goals. If not more.

But a midfielder or a defender who takes penalties wouldn't be able to add many of those tap-ins to their tally.
 
Can you get an assist on an own goal?
 
17 assists this season...has reached 100 goals and 100 assists which is incredibly impressive.

31 games, 8 goals, 18 assists...and also reached 100 goals and 100 assists for United in 318 games which is quicker than Ronaldo (341) and Messi (338) apparently.

So I thought I'd look into the stats of other United players as a comparison.

Total Numbers

Bobby Charlton - 251 goals and 204 assists (455 G/A) in 761 games
Ryan Giggs - 168 goals and 268* assists (436 G/A) in 963 games.
Wayne Rooney - 253 goals and 146 assists (399 G/A) in 559 games
Denis Law - 238 goals and 101 assists (339 G/A) in 405 games
George Best - 180 goals and 143 assists (323 G/A) in 470 games

I think Jack Rowley, Dennis Viollet and Stan Pearson my also be in the 100/100 club but yet to crunch their numbers.

I also dug a little deeper into the records of Best, Law and Charlton and whilst these numbers are 99% accurate, there may be the odd assist not recorded, so these are 'minimum' numbers.

Most Assists In A Season

22 - Bobby Charlton in 1963/64
21 - George Best in 1964/65
18 - Denis Law in 1971/72

Most Goals/Assists In A Season

62 - Denis Law in 1963/64
48 - George Best in 1967/68
41 - Bobby Charlton in 1958/59

Games To Reach 100 Assists

304 - George Best (still only 19)
354 - Bobby Charlton
391 - Denis Law

Games To Reach 100 Goals/Assists

90 - Denis Law
116 - Bobby Charlton
149 - George Best

Number Of Seasons With Double Figure Assists

12 - Bobby Charlton (17 seasons)
8 - George Best (11 seasons)
5 - Denis Law (11 seasons)


Pretty impressive really, especially when you consider they were playing on crap pitches with defenders kicking the shit out of them every week.

No surprise we got relegated when they all left at the same time.
 
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Skills said:
Assists from set pieces are legit. Most set pieces have a low probability of resulting in a goal.

Penalties on the other hand should be discarded when discussing goalscoring (or g+a stats). It's a free goal more than half the time even for a terrible penalty taker.
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To large degree, yes. I think fans sometimes just look at the headline number of goals when talking about potential signings. If a chunk of them were pens and he's not going to be your penalty taker then that needs factoring in. Clubs obviously do their homework and look at players as a whole.

Just on numbers alone for example, Mbeumo will have to go some to ever reach 20 league goals for United like he did last season unless he takes over on pens eventually. Brentford might have found another one in Thiago wo might never hit his numbers of this season should he move to a bigger club and not be on pens. Still good players though, doesn't mean you don't sign them of course.

Older post of yours, sorry for a late bump. Just thought it was interesting to reply to.

Anyway, back to Bruno. He's great!
 
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