Casemiro - Kroos - Modric

izec

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Casemiro was great defensively in the second half.

Kroos and Modric were invisible in the first half. Improved second, but dont think they were special on the ball. Put in a shift and occupied great positions, but dont think they were special. Casemiro was better.

it was enough for them to win, as Liverpool played around more than actually going for it.
 

P-Nut

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I don’t see it. He will be a good player but technically and in his actual quality he’s levels below the three. Best they will do with him is turn him into an energetic midfield runner which can play an important role but just don’t see him ever being the kind of player that goes right to the top. Camavingha on the other hand…
He's got the technical ability to play as part of a front three, (obviously in a very limited capacity) so I don't think he'll have any issue when he drops back in to become part of the midfield 3. With Camavinga and possibly Tchouameni alongside I think the three of them will hit crazy heights. The only worry would be the lack of a dedicated DM.

I think Valverde will be their Kante type player though, constantly covering the other 2 it's just if he is positional disciplined enough to anchor them.
 

KeanoMagicHat

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Casemiro was great defensively in the second half.

Kroos and Modric were invisible in the first half. Improved second, but dont think they were special on the ball. Put in a shift and occupied great positions, but dont think they were special. Casemiro was better.

it was enough for them to win, as Liverpool played around more than actually going for it.
Yeah Casemiro was the pick of the bunch, definitely.
 

Dumbstar

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Only have to walk when you have Thiago ballooning every pass and Henderson not worth a feck and Fabinho wingeing and gurning at every foul.
100% agree. They might have had a tougher test against City and Chelsea but our midfield was depressingly shit. Hendo and Fabinho's crab passing all night made it so easy for them. We really deserved nothing. And like you say the numerous over hit passes from Thiago were sickening (he was carrying his injury).
 

Calidad

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You could see their individual class yesterday, but at the same time also why Madrid need to phase them out.

I’m not a fan of Valverde as a RW either. I’m part, I guess it’s to add legs to the MF, but it means you end up with only two forwards in the pitch.
 

Zen

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No chance. Not even at just club level.

2004-2022 : 3 Titles, 4 UCL's, No Copa's
2008-2015: 5 Titles, 3 UCL's, 3 Copa's.....

They were also far more dominant UCL wins than Real's too, with better competition in the League. The only thing Modric, Kroos and Casemiro have going for them is the additional UCL, and ageing better I guess. I mean, unless you are taking away 2015 from Xavi due to becoming a bit more redundant - but still played a fair chunk, in comparison to Casemiro in 13-14 that I ignored(because he legit barely played).

I'd say it's close, but I don't think it is. They've been absolutely immense though. But I doubt we will see something as special as that Spanish trio for a while.
 

Blood Mage

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Modric is one of the most press resistant footballers I've seen. He, Carvajal and Casemiro put on a masterclass in how to beat the press last night.
 

marktan

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No chance. Not even at just club level.

2004-2022 : 3 Titles, 4 UCL's, No Copa's
2008-2015: 5 Titles, 3 UCL's, 3 Copa's.....

They were also far more dominant UCL wins than Real's too, with better competition in the League. The only thing Modric, Kroos and Casemiro have going for them is the additional UCL, and ageing better I guess. I mean, unless you are taking away 2015 from Xavi due to becoming a bit more redundant - but still played a fair chunk, in comparison to Casemiro in 13-14 that I ignored(because he legit barely played).

I'd say it's close, but I don't think it is. They've been absolutely immense though. But I doubt we will see something as special as that Spanish trio for a while.
Far more dominant against a weaker calibre of teams.

2009: Scraped through after the injustice at Stamford Bridge, then played a United team that was missing Tevez, Hargreaves, Scholes and Brown from the previous year's final.

2011: Only really faced Real who were still 2-3 years from having players like Kroos, Modric, Casemiro, Carvajal, Bale etc and their lineup in the semi had some weak players. United in the final were terrible by that point and only got through because Schalke somehow made it to the semis. The calibre of teams were weaker then - only Chelsea, Inter and Bayern had any success in the CL and they were weaker than City and Liverpool are now. Hell Real's run in 2018 included PSG, Juve, Bayern and then Liverpool in the final. Barca never came up against that calibre of team - it's easier to look dominant when you're playing a United team that's playing Anderson, Giggs, Chicharito etc. The quality of opposition is rarely taken into account but it does matter - a lot.

Put that Barca team into the modern era and they would get hit on the counter time after time by the likes of Liverpool, Real and Bayern.
 

youmeletsfly

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100% agree. They might have had a tougher test against City and Chelsea but our midfield was depressingly shit. Hendo and Fabinho's crab passing all night made it so easy for them. We really deserved nothing. And like you say the numerous over hit passes from Thiago were sickening (he was carrying his injury).
Replay the game, look at them coming out of the tunnel looking scared to death. Salah was looking half asleep when coming out.
The occasion got the better of them, for sure. Henderson at least was trying to keep the ball, speculate a pass here and there. Thiago and Fabinho got rid of it immediately after receiving it.

I don't think it's a matter of quality, it's just the experience of dealing with the event. Mane's and Salah's finishing was utter crap last night and the same happened with the midfield's passing.

On the other side of things, you can't line up with Hendo - Fabinho - Thiago and expect to walk a UCL final vs Casemiro - Kroos - Modric. I mean your midfield surely has the energy but boy that Madrid midfield can get out of any sticky situation with the ball at their feet. Don't think that they're upright better than Barca's legendary midfield, but they're surely the best at beating a press in a way that drags more players from the other team towards them and then they stem a counter attack out of 3 passes.

Anway, your manager needs to bring 1-2 CM's this summer, otherwise next season will look pretty grim. Especially considering Keita is a complete waste of 60 mil.
 

Zen

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Far more dominant against a weaker calibre of teams.

2009: Scraped through after the injustice at Stamford Bridge, then played a United team that was missing Tevez, Hargreaves, Scholes and Brown from the previous year's final.

2011: Only really faced Real who were still 2-3 years from having players like Kroos, Modric, Casemiro, Carvajal, Bale etc and their lineup in the semi had some weak players. United in the final were terrible by that point and only got through because Schalke somehow made it to the semis. The calibre of teams were weaker then - only Chelsea, Inter and Bayern had any success in the CL and they were weaker than City and Liverpool are now. Hell Real's run in 2018 included PSG, Juve, Bayern and then Liverpool in the final. Barca never came up against that calibre of team - it's easier to look dominant when you're playing a United team that's playing Anderson, Giggs, Chicharito etc. The quality of opposition is rarely taken into account but it does matter - a lot.

Put that Barca team into the modern era and they would get hit on the counter time after time by the likes of Liverpool, Real and Bayern.
Almost every single one of Real's 5 wins have had serious outcries of luck or questionable shenanigans happening. It's mad, like really mad, but there's a semblance of truth to a lot of them, outplayed in something like 4 of the finals. It's a winning mentality for sure, but that's kind of what I meant by dominance... and I'd say the same about United's 2 wins too, for the most part. Outside of the Chelsea game, no one really questioned the 3 Barca wins - and they genuinely outplayed City, PSG, Bayern and Juventus, all League champs - in 14/15. Though as I already, Xavi kind of bit part of this point.

Man Utd also weren't missing 3 of those players, their manager choose not to start them, 2 of them were fully fit too. Wes Brown, we'll let off.

I also don't disagree about your final point... but tactics, especially heavily offensive ones, evolve and in theory, make any older team obsolete to new methods, until they come full circle with tweaks again. So it's a pretty pointless point. I mean, the classic, parking the bus, will never die, but even that gets modified, Chelsea have been doing it since 2004 with tweaks in any big European game.
 

CarbonStoolBites

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Put that Barca team into the modern era and they would get hit on the counter time after time by the likes of Liverpool, Real and Bayern.
I don’t know about that. Mourinho’s Madrid and 2009 United were exceptional counter attacking teams.

Busquets, Xavi, Iniesta made every team they’ve faced look like Sunday league sides, Chelsea was probably the only team that knew how to play them, for some odd reason.
Even if they didn’t win as many CL’s as Madrid’s trio they were brutal, they would just smother teams. People have short memories on how special they were, I’ve been watching football for 30 years and they were far and away the most superior side I’ve ever seen.

I would put Casemiro,Kroos,Modric as the second best club midfield trio I’ve seen.

Deschamps, Davids, Zidane were fantastic as well for Juventus who were the most dominant team in Europe at the time.

Gattuso, Pirlo, Seedorf was an excellent trio as well, particularly in Europe.
 
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tomaldinho1

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Their my top now - the 3 CLs in a row is just ridiculous and they showed a different side to their game which I never saw from Xavi-busquets-Iniesta with the latest CL win which was essentially being heavy underdogs in the QF, SF and Final and overcoming 'stronger' teams. That Barca team were incredible but their CL wins both had highly fortunate/controversial games.

I genuinely think Modric is the best all round CM I've seen as well
 

Maluco

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I actually prefer them to the xavi-iniesta-busquets combo. I am not saying they are better players, but I love the range of passing Modric-Kroos have and how calm they are under pressure.

I am also a sucker for a proper defensive specialist like Casemiro with his excellent positioning.

I just think this trio works for any manager in any system because of the balance and the variety of skills they bring to the table. Absolute legends the three of them.
 

MVBDX

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No chance. Not even at just club level.

2004-2022 : 3 Titles, 4 UCL's, No Copa's
2008-2015: 5 Titles, 3 UCL's, 3 Copa's.....

They were also far more dominant UCL wins than Real's too, with better competition in the League. The only thing Modric, Kroos and Casemiro have going for them is the additional UCL, and ageing better I guess. I mean, unless you are taking away 2015 from Xavi due to becoming a bit more redundant - but still played a fair chunk, in comparison to Casemiro in 13-14 that I ignored(because he legit barely played).

I'd say it's close, but I don't think it is. They've been absolutely immense though. But I doubt we will see something as special as that Spanish trio for a while.
Xavi was a squadie in 2015 (having been replaced by Rakitic), their "trio" got 2 CLs.

Similarly, Madrid's "trio" got 4 CLs as starting XI players, though they have 5 each (Modric with Khedira/Alonso, Kroos with Bayern, and Casemiro being a squadie like Xavi in 2015 or even 2006 with him barely playing in any key games)
 

DevilRed

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modric is truely the definition of "class is permanent"

I wish we could have signed him (and Kroos). It was a real possibility.

Instead we have plodders like fred and matic who have managed to stay 5+ years.
 

Iker Quesadillas

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Almost every single one of Real's 5 wins have had serious outcries of luck or questionable shenanigans happening. It's mad, like really mad, but there's a semblance of truth to a lot of them, outplayed in something like 4 of the finals.
I'm not really sure what you are talking about here. Real Madrid were not outplayed in 4 out of 5 finals.
 

Scroto Baggins

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Modric is one of those players who just looks like he has more time than everyone else. Silky technician, amazing passing range, when he hangs up his boots will be interesting where he sits in the hierarchy of greatest midfielders ever. Especially considering his longevity.
 

Red the Bear

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I'm not really sure what you are talking about here. Real Madrid were not outplayed in 4 out of 5 finals.
Yeah none of your final wins was luck based aside from the Atletico ones in my opinion ( Liverpool seemed dominant but I never felt you were in any danger, controlled the game relatively well i think.)
 

ZIDANE

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Modric has always reminded me of Scholes. The Barca midfield was legendary but they also bored us to death and went down at the slightest touch so I would rather watch Madrid. This CL run was epic and they’ve beat Liverpool in two finals - is there a heart emoji.
 

kthanksbye

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Far more dominant against a weaker calibre of teams.

2009: Scraped through after the injustice at Stamford Bridge, then played a United team that was missing Tevez, Hargreaves, Scholes and Brown from the previous year's final.

2011: Only really faced Real who were still 2-3 years from having players like Kroos, Modric, Casemiro, Carvajal, Bale etc and their lineup in the semi had some weak players. United in the final were terrible by that point and only got through because Schalke somehow made it to the semis. The calibre of teams were weaker then - only Chelsea, Inter and Bayern had any success in the CL and they were weaker than City and Liverpool are now. Hell Real's run in 2018 included PSG, Juve, Bayern and then Liverpool in the final. Barca never came up against that calibre of team - it's easier to look dominant when you're playing a United team that's playing Anderson, Giggs, Chicharito etc. The quality of opposition is rarely taken into account but it does matter - a lot.

Put that Barca team into the modern era and they would get hit on the counter time after time by the likes of Liverpool, Real and Bayern.
Good points. Also, just because they kept the ball more, does not mean they "dominated" it's how they play, a lot of that possession was just ball retention, and the opposition played counter attacking football against them, so they let Barca midfield have the ball in.
 

kthanksbye

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Modric is one of the most press resistant footballers I've seen. He, Carvajal and Casemiro put on a masterclass in how to beat the press last night.
The way he turned and made that pass which eventually lead to the goal was elite, almost as if he was offended that Robertson pressing him so high, he had easier options, but didn't take those, he realized Robertson has left space behind him, made a penetrating pass and Robertson was never able to get back in the game for that move. Moments like these literally win you games.
 

Eddy_JukeZ

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Far more dominant against a weaker calibre of teams.

2009: Scraped through after the injustice at Stamford Bridge, then played a United team that was missing Tevez, Hargreaves, Scholes and Brown from the previous year's final.

2011: Only really faced Real who were still 2-3 years from having players like Kroos, Modric, Casemiro, Carvajal, Bale etc and their lineup in the semi had some weak players. United in the final were terrible by that point and only got through because Schalke somehow made it to the semis. The calibre of teams were weaker then - only Chelsea, Inter and Bayern had any success in the CL and they were weaker than City and Liverpool are now. Hell Real's run in 2018 included PSG, Juve, Bayern and then Liverpool in the final. Barca never came up against that calibre of team - it's easier to look dominant when you're playing a United team that's playing Anderson, Giggs, Chicharito etc. The quality of opposition is rarely taken into account but it does matter - a lot.

Put that Barca team into the modern era and they would get hit on the counter time after time by the likes of Liverpool, Real and Bayern.
Jose's Madrid are better than any of those teams listed and Barcelona trounced them.
 

Adisa

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Remember when some said he wasn't worth £30m cause "he didn't score enough goals". We have had some weird opinions in this country.
 

Eddy_JukeZ

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They were not and they needed a contentious red card to Pepe to win
They were dominating the game beforehand and they already trounced you in the La Liga Clasico.

And I'd definitely take Jose's Real over 2018 Liverpool, 2018 PSG(it's PSG), 2018 Bayern and 2018 Juventus. Mourinho was still pretty good then and you had Ronaldo in his physical prime.

2019/2022 Liverpool or 2020 Bayern, well that's a different story.
 

sukhy

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They were not and they needed a contentious red card to Pepe to win
That red card was not contentious, Pepe is high, doesn't get near the ball and is studs up on Alves' shin.
Plus, using a triple pivot at the Bernabeu? Deserve to get eliminated for that alone
 

giorno

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They were dominating the game beforehand and they already trounced you in the La Liga Clasico.
They were never coming even close to scoring before the red card and the h2h record for the season at that point was 1W 1D 1L

And I'd definitely take Jose's Real over 2018 Liverpool, 2018 PSG(it's PSG), 2018 Bayern and 2018 Juventus. Mourinho was still pretty good then and you had Ronaldo in his physical prime.

2019/2022 Liverpool or 2020 Bayern, well that's a different story.
2018 Bayern would have broken Mou's Madrid over its knee. A lesser Bayern side outplayed and beat a better Madrid in 2012...
 

Eddy_JukeZ

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They were never coming even close to scoring before the red card and the h2h record for the season at that point was 1W 1D 1L


2018 Bayern would have broken Mou's Madrid over its knee. A lesser Bayern side outplayed and beat a better Madrid in 2012...
A loss in extra time versus a 5-0 trouncing and the draw was played when the league was over.

Real Madrid were defending with 11 men even prior to the red card and it's not true they didn't come close to scoring. Villa had a shot that almost went in after 3 minutes and Messi slipped Xavi in once and he scoffed the shot.

I don't think 2012 Bayern are a lesser Bayern side at all than their 2018 version. They're 1 year away from their treble version and they had a younger Robben/Ribery.
 

MVBDX

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Jose's Madrid are better than any of those teams listed and Barcelona trounced them.
They played 4 games within 14 days, 1 win each and 2 draws. With Barca's sole win being due to a nonexistent red card with Dani Alves playacting, and being called out for it by Rio and so many others.

This was Jose's first year, in the second year Barca were 2nd in the league, with a loss at Camp Nou, and got out of CL too, which played a part in Pep leaving Barca for good, knowing he couldn't do it anymore.
 

Iker Quesadillas

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In Mourinho's second year RM beat Barcelona a grand total of one time out of six. Wow they really had Pep's number.
 

Zehner

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I love Madrid's midfield, especially Kroos and Modric, but there's no way their Madrid teams are anywhere near Pep's Barca, even if they won more CLs. You've got to admire their mentality but let's be real, especially their last two CL wins involved lots and lots of luck. Barca looked like the far better team in almost every game they played at that time.
 

Eddy_JukeZ

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They played 4 games within 14 days, 1 win each and 2 draws. With Barca's sole win being due to a nonexistent red card with Dani Alves playacting, and being called out for it by Rio and so many others.

This was Jose's first year, in the second year Barca were 2nd in the league, with a loss at Camp Nou, and got out of CL too, which played a part in Pep leaving Barca for good, knowing he couldn't do it anymore.
You know I was referring to the 5-0 game.

And in Jose's 2nd season, they still beat you more times.
 

Iker Quesadillas

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Barca looked like the far better team in almost every game they played at that time.
In three of the four CL campaigns under Guardiola they only won 3 games in the knockout rounds: 08/09, 09/10, 11/12. Their away record was generally poor: a draw and a defeat against Arsenal, draws against Stuttgart, Milan, and Lyon, defeats against Chelsea and Inter. The record gets even worse if you include the two post-Guardiola seasons when Xavi was still a starter.

By comparison, Real Madrid won 5 games in 15/16, 6 in 16/17, 5 in 17/18, and 4 in 21/22, with less discernible difference between their home and away form. That's probably why they were able to rack up so many titles.
 
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DannyCAFC

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With the seemingly credible links to Tchouameni, and the fact Camavinga and Valverde are both at the point you feel they would want to be starters now, I was kind of under the impression Real might sell one of Kroos or Casemiro but maybe not.
 

hasanejaz88

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With the seemingly credible links to Tchouameni, and the fact Camavinga and Valverde are both at the point you feel they would want to be starters now, I was kind of under the impression Real might sell one of Kroos or Casemiro but maybe not.
Before the final I thought both Kroos and Casemiro should be out of the team and were finished, but both played an amazing game in the final to show they can still do it.

I actually think it's the perfect situation for a younger player to join that midfield. They won't have the immense pressure you get with being a consistent starter since Kroos-Casemiro-Modric will still largely be trusted for the bigger games, proven with finals performance, but you'll also get plenty of minutes in other games as those players will need to be rested throughout the season. You'll have freedom to acclimatize yourself to the team and be ready to take over next year of soon after.
 

Morty_

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With the seemingly credible links to Tchouameni, and the fact Camavinga and Valverde are both at the point you feel they would want to be starters now, I was kind of under the impression Real might sell one of Kroos or Casemiro but maybe not.
Kroos only has a year left on the contract, and i think he was talking about retiring once the contract ends.