Chelsea appoint Thomas Tuchel

stefan92

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It will be interesting to see if Lukaku returning upsets the system a bit. With him in the side the average xG for Chelsea in the PL was 1.5, in the games he's missed the average xG has been 2.5. The big caveat is the level of opposition was much better in the games he played but it does feel as though he's not really a neat fit.
Lukaku and Werner both returned from injuries and were on the bench. Werner got some minutes, Lukaku didn't. I wonder if that is just coincidence or if it is a hint who is preferred by Tuchel.
 

Cloud7

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Lukaku and Werner both returned from injuries and were on the bench. Werner got some minutes, Lukaku didn't. I wonder if that is just coincidence or if it is a hint who is preferred by Tuchel.
Tuchel probably realizing at this point just what he got in Lukaku

The commentators on the match yesterday were saying Allegri essentially said Chelsea are better without Lukaku
 

Hammondo

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Maybe if you've only watched Bruno last couple of weeks.


Yeah, imagine using the squad in a tight schedule. Madness.
Ive watched nearly every game he's played, fans on here have been saying for a long time he's never in midfield. Closer to a 2nd striker.
 

Adisa

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Bastards.
 

Dave Smith

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It will be interesting to see if Lukaku returning upsets the system a bit. With him in the side the average xG for Chelsea in the PL was 1.5, in the games he's missed the average xG has been 2.5. The big caveat is the level of opposition was much better in the games he played but it does feel as though he's not really a neat fit.
Does not surprise me at all. People get too carried away with looking at pure G&A stats and do not look at the player himself enough when playing. Lukaku is known to slow things down and have limited technical ability which causes issues for the rest of the attack.

One of Utd's biggest hopes for Sunday is that he plays.
 

adexkola

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I agree, our squad is superior to that Liverpool squad in every way but whether anyone agrees or not, Klopp insisted on his style even when it wasn’t a perfect fit at the time. This caused their results to be inconsistent right up until signing VVD and Salah really. That’s when it started to click.

Tuchel came in, accessed the squad and worked with each player to create on of the most interesting and fluid attacking systems that I’ve seen in a long time. You wouldn’t just be calling him a defensive genius if we finished all the guilt edged chances we’ve missed in the last year. It’s been A LOT.
I'm not sure what would have been a perfect fit for that Liverpool at the time, but even agreeing with that, even up until the addition of VVD and Fabinho, there was a genuine progression in results (solidification of 4th place, Europa League final, CL final, title race participants down to the last minute, CL winners, title winners) that justified Klopp sticking to his methods, even if there was some short term inconsistencies we have not seen with Tuchel.

Agree with Tuchel's impact, but I think more than anything, this shows what a bad job Lampard had done (post player acquisition), even though I kind of wanted him to do well. I think the stark contrast between Tuchel and Lampard, and the short turnaround in results and form, amplifies what is already excellent coaching by Tuchel.
 

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I'm not sure what would have been a perfect fit for that Liverpool at the time, but even agreeing with that, even up until the addition of VVD and Fabinho, there was a genuine progression in results (solidification of 4th place, Europa League final, CL final, title race participants down to the last minute, CL winners, title winners) that justified Klopp sticking to his methods, even if there was some short term inconsistencies we have not seen with Tuchel.

Agree with Tuchel's impact, but I think more than anything, this shows what a bad job Lampard had done (post player acquisition), even though I kind of wanted him to do well. I think the stark contrast between Tuchel and Lampard, and the short turnaround in results and form, amplifies what is already excellent coaching by Tuchel.
I think it does not prove Lampard to have been very poor, quite the contrary actually. Yes he failed to make the team work successfully, but Tuchel's immediate success was only possible because he inherited a squad full of fit and quality players. He just needed to find the right formation and philosophy to make it work ( and it is Lampard's fault he wasn't able to do that), but Tuchel did not have to worry about so called deadwood or massive toxicity in the club.

That is kind of the best possible state you can find a troubled club in when you take over. So some credit has to go to Lampard for creating this squad, some has to go for the board for making the call at the right time (before the struggles really impacted the squad quality), and of course a lot to Tuchel for doing the right things when he came in.
 

Orc

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By Tuchel‘s admission himself Werner has been back fit for a bit longer than Lukaku and could’ve started against Leicester a few days ago if necessary. Whereas Lukaku is still not fully fit. So that’s why Timo got some minutes yesterday and Rom didn’t.

I think everyone (including a large number of our own supporters) has written Lukaku off already after one rough patch and called our signing him a mistake. I think it’s way too early for that. I’m hoping that when he comes back into the team he’ll benefit greatly from pretty much all our wide players (both attackers and wingbacks) being in red hot form.

I expect he’ll play against United at the weekend. Probably still not from the start, though. Tuchel will want pace and fluidity against your injured/suspended back line.
 

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Lukaku is a valuable weapon to have for certain games...maybe in a final or against a top CL side he might not be first choice, but he can win many different games against lower opposition.

Not every player needs to be Berbatov on the ball. Chelsea have a striker for every scenario...which is bad news for United on Sunday, but at the minute its all bad news so nothing to worry about (nervous laugh0
 

Mb194dc

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Lukaku and Werner both returned from injuries and were on the bench. Werner got some minutes, Lukaku didn't. I wonder if that is just coincidence or if it is a hint who is preferred by Tuchel.
Lukaku suits certain kinds of opposition and is a different tactical option to our other attackers. Don't think he should have started all games to begin with, now Tuchel has seen what CHO et al can do, I doubt Lukaku will walk back in to start every match.

Can see it's hard for Tuchel to keep the squad happy, that's why Azpi came on at LWB yesterday, he'd promised him minutes by the sound of it and put him on even though he was out of position. Looks like Alonso will be getting more minutes if Chilwell is out and probably RLC too if Kante out. Not sure when Kova is back too.

Attack we have the most players for fewest positions, very hard for Tuchel to give all minutes. Ziyech was excellent yesterday, his vision is different to other players even if he lacks in physicality and some other areas. Can open teams up with one pass or one two.

Squad is really stacked at the moment, can see why rumours circulate some might go in January.
 

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Lukaku is a valuable weapon to have for certain games...maybe in a final or against a top CL side he might not be first choice, but he can win many different games against lower opposition.

Not every player needs to be Berbatov on the ball. Chelsea have a striker for every scenario...which is bad news for United on Sunday, but at the minute its all bad news so nothing to worry about (nervous laugh0
I agree but also find it madness that Chelsea brought him for £90m+ to do that. If you essentially admit he cannot perform against the big teams then you're essentially saying that he is a player to use against the likes of Burnley, Soton, Villa etc. Not sure why they didn't just stick with someone like Giroud to carrying out that job as it essentially means he is only really needed for about 20% of the time.
 

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Chelsea have really stuck gold here. We are most likely going through a list of 805 managers to go on and appoint Sam Allardyce level of manager.
 

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Does not surprise me at all. People get too carried away with looking at pure G&A stats and do not look at the player himself enough when playing. Lukaku is known to slow things down and have limited technical ability which causes issues for the rest of the attack.

One of Utd's biggest hopes for Sunday is that he plays.
Yes you are right we were not at our best when he started especially in big games but whole team not functioned well either.

But team came together lot since he injured especially our midfield players and wing backs occupying positions not only exercised before by us when he played but also urgency in transition and vertical ball movement was outstanding.

So I am looking forward to his next start hopefully against man utd.Yesterday pulisic was anonymous for most part and rarely get into the ball yet we played fantastic.So just not worried about Lukaku presence and if I am right if he starts he will score.
 

Lee565

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Tuchel is probably the closest thing to prime fergie and wenger in the premier league.

The way he effortlessly integrates squad players into the first 11 without a drop in performances is the kind of thing we use to see from fergie and prime wenger, for me tuchel has set the bar of what I want to see from the next united manager by not being afraid to use youth academy players and rotating squad players into the first 11 when needed without a massive dip in performance on the pitch.
 

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Tuchel is probably the closest thing to prime fergie and wenger in the premier league.

The way he effortlessly integrates squad players into the first 11 without a drop in performances is the kind of thing we use to see from fergie and prime wenger, for me tuchel has set the bar of what I want to see from the next united manager by not being afraid to use youth academy players and rotating squad players into the first 11 when needed without a massive dip in performance on the pitch.
Fergie absolutely but was Wenger that great at it?

I seem to recall in the invincible season especially they ran out of steam against United and Chelsea in the FA Cup and UCL especially because Wenger ran the same 12/13 players into the ground. Similar problem the year before when they blew the title.
 

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As ever at Chelsea, it will depend on how long that bad patch lasts for. More than six weeks and he'll be under pressure. That is just the way Chelsea roll.
Yep, that's what I was thinking. The best in form manager in the world over the last 12 months could quite easily be the one fired in the next 12-18 months the way Abramovich operates.
 

Rajiztar

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I'm not sure what would have been a perfect fit for that Liverpool at the time, but even agreeing with that, even up until the addition of VVD and Fabinho, there was a genuine progression in results (solidification of 4th place, Europa League final, CL final, title race participants down to the last minute, CL winners, title winners) that justified Klopp sticking to his methods, even if there was some short term inconsistencies we have not seen with Tuchel.

Agree with Tuchel's impact, but I think more than anything, this shows what a bad job Lampard had done (post player acquisition), even though I kind of wanted him to do well. I think the stark contrast between Tuchel and Lampard, and the short turnaround in results and form, amplifies what is already excellent coaching by Tuchel.
At chelsea he is trying to integrate youngsters was anything other than miracle mate. Yes we have good squad and easily can get top 4 with any decent manager. But that squad had no business in cl winning or leading 3 points in league despite losing to second ranked pep team.

I will not take even pep or Klopp if I have a chance to swap now. I am not arguing here he is better than pep or Klopp.He will need to win the league even to start an argument of that kind.

I just think with this new environment of we are not richest any more,we just luckily got this man. Hope he will stay as our manager as long as he will want.
 

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I will not take even pep or Klopp if I have a chance to swap now. I am not arguing here he is better than pep or Klopp.He will need to win the league even to start an argument of that kind.
I also prefer our style to theirs. The movement of our forward play this last year is just unreal. Much more enjoy to watch than Peps possession based football.
 

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Has a manager ever made such a significant impact in only 12 months in a job? Literally turned them into one of the top sides in England and Europe from a shambles under Lampard. Even klopp and pep needed a bit of time to get going.
Klopp and Pep still needed time to improve their squads. Tuchel was signed because Lampard failed to make the squad work, not because the squad was problematic. So a better way to start for him for sure.
I think it's a factor that Tuchel seems to be more pragmatic in his approach than Klopp/Pep. He seems much more willing to adapt his formation and tactical approach to suit his current squad rather than sticking to an idealised way of playing and bringing in players to fit that vision.
Exactly. the narrative is that a new manager needs his own team and own players so needs 3-4 years. That is only if you have a stubborn one way to play and are high maintenance. Zidane just came in and won with Madrid. he could be our Tuchel
 

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I wonder - Given how successful Tuchel has been at Chelsea so far, what went wrong (if anything did!) for him at Dortmund and PSG? He did very well at Dortmund overall but only lasted 2 seasons. Has he developed his managerial/coaching skills in the meantime? Was the PSG squad not to his liking?
 

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I wonder - Given how successful Tuchel has been at Chelsea so far, what went wrong (if anything did!) for him at Dortmund and PSG? He did very well at Dortmund overall but only lasted 2 seasons. Has he developed his managerial/coaching skills in the meantime? Was the PSG squad not to his liking?
He clashed with his superiors at both clubs. So far he's had nothing to complain about at Chelsea. He's been given a superb young team to coach and backed in the transfer market and results have gone swimmingly so far. He's spoken about learning from his previous jobs and perhaps picking his battles better, so we'll see if this 'difficult to work with' reputation he arrived with rings true eventually, but at the moment, all parties concerned will be chuffed to bits with the way things are going.
 

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I wonder - Given how successful Tuchel has been at Chelsea so far, what went wrong (if anything did!) for him at Dortmund and PSG? He did very well at Dortmund overall but only lasted 2 seasons. Has he developed his managerial/coaching skills in the meantime? Was the PSG squad not to his liking?
At Dortmund especially he was unhappy with the outgoing transfers in the end. He rightfully thought he was ready to challenge Bayern again, having finished above 80 points for the first time since Klopp (second best season Dortmund ever had in the Bundesliga), but than core players were sold. The atmosphere between him and the board was already troublesome after the bomb attack, so in the end they clashed too much and let him go.
 

Wilt

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I wonder - Given how successful Tuchel has been at Chelsea so far, what went wrong (if anything did!) for him at Dortmund and PSG? He did very well at Dortmund overall but only lasted 2 seasons. Has he developed his managerial/coaching skills in the meantime? Was the PSG squad not to his liking?
Failed to win the CL with PSG and fell out with the wrong people?
 

Rajiztar

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I also prefer our style to theirs. The movement of our forward play this last year is just unreal. Much more enjoy to watch than Peps possession based football.
I hope roman finally got his man as a manager. Even roman can't have any complaints about tuchel if he continuously performs and also integrate the youngsters into main squad.

He has full confidence in his coaching methods so why he is able to put kids and squad players in games previously even Jose with all his power struggled to do so.

I said we would be peaked around festive period and we are getting there in my opinion.With injured Lukaku and Werner coming back we will clearly see the full potential of this chelsea team.
 

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I think it's a factor that Tuchel seems to be more pragmatic in his approach than Klopp/Pep. He seems much more willing to adapt his formation and tactical approach to suit his current squad rather than sticking to an idealised way of playing and bringing in players to fit that vision.
Yea. Having followed him at Mainz and Dortmund, while only in the UCL for PSG, I've never him play this way with three at the back and flying full backs.

He usually always played the standard 4-2-3-1 with inside forwards, overlapping wing backs. His Mainz team was more counter attacking with a young front four but that was usual given Mainz were an underdog. When he went to Dortmund he changed it a bit to be more possession based while still being quick to press.

The way he's playing now is far from usual, which is what makes it more impressive that he has managed to make it work.
 

Orc

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I agree but also find it madness that Chelsea brought him for £90m+ to do that. If you essentially admit he cannot perform against the big teams then you're essentially saying that he is a player to use against the likes of Burnley, Soton, Villa etc. Not sure why they didn't just stick with someone like Giroud to carrying out that job as it essentially means he is only really needed for about 20% of the time.
I think he just suits certain opponents much more than others. Against teams that sit deep and crowd their box with loads of defenders Lukaku struggles. Unfortunately, that’s most of the clubs we play against these days. Lukaku is at his most dangerous when he has open space to run into so against sides that actually try to attack and play football he should prove very useful.

Also, I think his rough spell recently had as much to do with our other players being subpar behind him as it did with him just being bad.
 

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Lukaku and Werner both returned from injuries and were on the bench. Werner got some minutes, Lukaku didn't. I wonder if that is just coincidence or if it is a hint who is preferred by Tuchel.
Tuchel said in his presser that Lukaku is back to full training and would be assessed in their last training before Juve but he expected him to get some minutes. I don’t know that he is fully fit yet?
 

monosierra

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He clashed with his superiors at both clubs. So far he's had nothing to complain about at Chelsea. He's been given a superb young team to coach and backed in the transfer market and results have gone swimmingly so far. He's spoken about learning from his previous jobs and perhaps picking his battles better, so we'll see if this 'difficult to work with' reputation he arrived with rings true eventually, but at the moment, all parties concerned will be chuffed to bits with the way things are going.
Ah, sounds like he had the right idea at Dortmund about challenging Bayern but went about arguing with the board in the open. PSG ... well, that's a tough spot for any manager who doesn't bring home Big Ears. I agree that Chelsea now is the perfect squad for him. Wonder if his public spats before sullied his reputation when assessed by conservative boards like our's.
 

Zaphod2319

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Ah, sounds like he had the right idea at Dortmund about challenging Bayern but went about arguing with the board in the open. PSG ... well, that's a tough spot for any manager who doesn't bring home Big Ears. I agree that Chelsea now is the perfect squad for him. Wonder if his public spats before sullied his reputation when assessed by conservative boards like our's.
Going back to when he was brought in he was definitely a gamble and his spats with previous administrations was no doubt the reason for an 18 month initial contract.

On a different note about tactics the announcers being used for the US audiences kept bringing up that for most of the game once we had position in Juve’s territory he was really playing a 3-1-6. He is always tweeking things from game to game and often in game.
 

monosierra

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Going back to when he was brought in he was definitely a gamble and his spats with previous administrations was no doubt the reason for an 18 month initial contract.

On a different note about tactics the announcers being used for the US audiences kept bringing up that for most of the game once we had position in Juve’s territory he was really playing a 3-1-6. He is always tweeking things from game to game and often in game.
He has a reputation for tactical flexibility, doesn't he? Not as ideologically driven as some of the other top managers perhaps but still very effective, if not more so. I wonder how he or his coaching staff drill this Chelsea team. They seem to be playing with great discipline and individual flair.