City and Financial Doping | Charged by PL with 130 FFP breaches | Hearing concluded | Awaiting outcome

Bubz27 said:
Imagine the psychological damage if they get a 20 point deduction and finish higher than us. That'd do some damage to me for sure.
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20 points would be pretty much pointless. Has to be one that has a serious chance of being relegated and so out of CL for three season at least (unless they win it) so that will knock them back like it did Juventus.

Verdict will drop at a random point during the World Cup so no serious people on socials are saying it now.
 
FootballHQ said:
20 points would be pretty much pointless. Has to be one that has a serious chance of being relegated and so out of CL for three season at least (unless they win it) so that will knock them back like it did Juventus.

Verdict will drop at a random point during the World Cup so no serious people on socials are saying it now.
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I dont have hopes for any serious punishment though.
 
I'm fully expecting them to get a slap on the wrist and no serious punishment of any kind. They will get away with this and can't imagine that the media will hold them to account.

They have committed crimes over many years, so the punishment should also be dished out over many years. They should be deducted points and that shouldn't just apply to one season, but it should really apply to several seasons. They shouldn't be able to 'take the hit' in one go when they have benefitted from breaking the rules over many, many years. They're still benefitting now.
 
It will look bad on Pep if it’s a big punishment. He might claim that he thought they would be found innocent (they still might be) but it looks like he abandoned ship.
 
Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought it was just the verdict that would be announced shortly, and the punishment would be decided later?
 
Irwin99 said:
It will look bad on Pep if it’s a big punishment. He might claim that he thought they would be found innocent (they still might be) but it looks like he abandoned ship.
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Guess it could be pointed out he's still on the ship. A Global Ambassador who could still sell tickets for White Star Line, even after disaster.

I agree that I think his shift is partially to avoid tarnishing his reputation, and by extension, the memory of whatever happens. City as a brand are already muddy as can be, Pep as a brand may well just be passed over for scrutiny.
 
Pughnichi said:
Have you missed their last few windows? It’s already happeing

Jan 26
Guehi
Semenyo

Summer 25
Ait Nouri
Cherki
Reijnders
Donnarumma
Trafford
Nypan

Jan 25
Marmoush
Nico Gonzalez
Khusanov
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A lot of bang average signings. Maresca won't be able to get the same level out of them as Pep could either.
 
DarkLord1984 said:
Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought it was just the verdict that would be announced shortly, and the punishment would be decided later?
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If you believe the rumour on here then yes, the verdict is imminent.

The punishment will be decided after the inevitable appeal.
It's at least two years away.
 
If City end up relegated, and Middlesbrough take their place, Boro will have to go down as luckiest club in history of football.
 
Bartondale said:
If you believe the rumour on here then yes, the verdict is imminent.

The punishment will be decided after the inevitable appeal.
It's at least two years away.
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That's not correct. The panel will work on the verdict and punishment and announcened to the club and PL 24 hours before made public. An appeal of course will be made if guilty, so the punishment affectively will be frozen. I looked all this up myself, it's all available on Google.
 
Garnacho Libre said:
That's not correct. The panel will work on the verdict and punishment and announcened to the club and PL 24 hours before made public. An appeal of course will be made if guilty, so the punishment affectively will be frozen. I looked all this up myself, it's all available on Google.
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Of course they will appeal. But at least if the verdict comes out as guilty the damage will be done to both City and Guardiola's reputation.
 
bringbackbebe said:
If City end up relegated, and Middlesbrough take their place, Boro will have to go down as luckiest club in history of football.
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The EFL and PL are different bodies so I can't see a scenario where the EFL disrupt there structure to allow City into the EFL if they've been booted out of the PL. Then you'd be looking at them starting from scratch in the non-league. Easier option is a huge points deduction by the PL that effectively relegates them come end of the season. No disruption to promotion/relegation system. Apart from one team in the PL practically guaranteed to go down due to their points punishment.

That's a worse punishment than immediate relegation to the Championship. Straight relegation means they could bounce back up in a season. A points deduction that effectively relegates them means a pointless season in the PL just waiting to be confirmed as relegated. A torturous season. Then having to play in the championship the season after.
 
Bert_ said:
The EFL and PL are different bodies so I can't see a scenario where the EFL disrupt there structure to allow City into the EFL if they've been booted out of the PL. Then you'd be looking at them starting from scratch in the non-league. Easier option is a huge points deduction by the PL that effectively relegates them come end of the season. No disruption to promotion/relegation system. Apart from one team in the PL practically guaranteed to go down due to their points punishment.

That's a worse punishment than immediate relegation to the Championship. Straight relegation means they could bounce back up in a season. A points deduction that effectively relegates them means a pointless season in the PL just waiting to be confirmed as relegated. A torturous season. Then having to play in the championship the season after.
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I just want them to suffer in the worst possible way. I deeply respected Guardiola as a manager (not intending to argue), and given he's gone, I hope they rot in hell for multiple seasons with Maresca, stripped off from titles and made to suffer the indignity of starting off -100points.
 
This is so political, I doubt much will happen. And even if they do, this will be dragged on with next instances over years
 
If the options are a straight relegation to championship or like a 100 point reduction the latter is better as it messed up this year, next year and no CL the year after either.

It's still a slap on the wrist for the longevity, none compliance and the taking the piss sueing the league several times.

I wonder if they'll push for something extreme like expulsion altogether, force change of board/ownership etc to make a point.

Otherwise can't teams just inject billions ignore rules fight and mock the league then get a couple year punishment and then the club is set for life no problem.
 
Garnacho Libre said:
That's not correct. The panel will work on the verdict and punishment and announcened to the club and PL 24 hours before made public. An appeal of course will be made if guilty, so the punishment affectively will be frozen. I looked all this up myself, it's all available on Google.
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Hi,
Numerous articles have appeared in the press stating there are three distinct phases being the verdict, the appeal and finally the punishment.

@Crick posted a video on 31 July 2025 in this thread featuring an interview with Stefan Borson in which at 3mins and 10secs Borson clearly states the punishment will not be considered until after the appeal is finalised. Borson is widely regarded as the authority on the 115 Charges.

This makes sense to me. I cannot imagine a punishment will be determined until the extent of Citys guilt, or innocence, has been determined. It's how the law works in other cases when, after a guilty verdict has been decided in complex cases, the judge will take several weeks or months to decide upon an appropriate punishment.

Any chance you can post the link that contradicts this?
 
DarkLord1984 said:
Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought it was just the verdict that would be announced shortly, and the punishment would be decided later?
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So City get found guilty of most of the charges, then appeal, and we need to wait the outcome of the appeal until we know what punishment they will get, the severity of which can also probably be appealed?

This wasn't how i thought it would work at all, I just assumed a guilty verdit would come with the punishment attached, and then City would appeal the whole the thing.
 
C'est Moi Cantona said:
So City get found guilty of most of the charges, then appeal, and we need to wait the outcome of the appeal until we know what punishment they will get, the severity of which can also probably be appealed?

This wasn't how i thought it would work at all, I just assumed a guilty verdit would come with the punishment attached, and then City would appeal the whole the thing.
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If found guilty, City can appeal against the verdict but not the penalty.
 
Bert_ said:
The EFL and PL are different bodies so I can't see a scenario where the EFL disrupt there structure to allow City into the EFL if they've been booted out of the PL. Then you'd be looking at them starting from scratch in the non-league. Easier option is a huge points deduction by the PL that effectively relegates them come end of the season. No disruption to promotion/relegation system. Apart from one team in the PL practically guaranteed to go down due to their points punishment.

That's a worse punishment than immediate relegation to the Championship. Straight relegation means they could bounce back up in a season. A points deduction that effectively relegates them means a pointless season in the PL just waiting to be confirmed as relegated. A torturous season. Then having to play in the championship the season after.
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Yep. A 130 point deduction, transfer ban and strip them of the pl titles won in that period
 
steeeb said:
If the options are a straight relegation to championship or like a 100 point reduction the latter is better as it messed up this year, next year and no CL the year after either.

It's still a slap on the wrist for the longevity, none compliance and the taking the piss sueing the league several times.

I wonder if they'll push for something extreme like expulsion altogether, force change of board/ownership etc to make a point.

Otherwise can't teams just inject billions ignore rules fight and mock the league then get a couple year punishment and then the club is set for life no problem.
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I don’t think that (relegation to the Championship) was an option… if thrown out of the PL, it’s up to the Football League where to place them?
 
Pughnichi said:
Have you missed their last few windows? It’s already happeing

Jan 26
Guehi
Semenyo

Summer 25
Ait Nouri
Cherki
Reijnders
Donnarumma
Trafford
Nypan

Jan 25
Marmoush
Nico Gonzalez
Khusanov
Click to expand...
Mostly cheap crap players.
 
I’m convinced they’ll get a ”record fine”, ”record points deduction” & a 2 year transfer ban, and they’ll then try telling the World it was the most extreme punishment ever handed out in English football.

Which in reality will be something pathetic like a 40 point deduction and an amount of money their owners won’t even know is missing. It’ll be one season written off and then back to normal in 2027-2028.
 
steeeb said:
Otherwise can't teams just inject billions ignore rules fight and mock the league then get a couple year punishment and then the club is set for years without a problem
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Yeah, unless it was us. Can you imagine if we had broken these rules that they would be still looking about it? Straight down to the Ishmael Premier
 
They'll be an appeal and a separate hearing for the penalty if guilty after that. So it'll still a long time regardless.

It's all a really bad look for English football, along with the league debacle this season. They should settle.
 
C'est Moi Cantona said:
So if they get found guilty over the summer, we then have to wait until the appeal is finished before we find out their punishment?
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Correct. There are three phases, verdict, appeal, punishment.

If City appeal against the verdict then the existing three person panel must resign and be replaced by three new people. The new panel must then start from scratch to arrive at a second verdict. There can be no appeal against the second verdict or the eventual punishment.
 
Bartondale said:
Correct. There are three phases, verdict, appeal, punishment.

If City appeal against the verdict then the existing three person panel must resign and be replaced by three new people. The new panel must then start from scratch to arrive at a second verdict. There can be no appeal against the second verdict or the eventual punishment.
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So unless it's a lenient punishment, and alot of the charges are dismissed, then City will of course appeal.

So we are in a position by the sounds of things that for City to get anything meaningful, we could be looking at 2028-2029 until anything actually happens to them.

Makes you wonder how the media will handle it if they are found guilty of the most serious charges, and they are just allowed to carry on pending the appeal.
 
I still think they'll be punished. Maybe I'm being incredibly naïve on this but I do think it was interesting when Chelsea got a slap on the wrists a month or so back the prem referenced they'd be exceptional in co-operating with authorities given it was a self-referral when the takeover happened. Was mentioned points deductions was looked at but that was one of the main reasons why it didn't happen.

Man. City been polar opposites by all accounts in this restricting the premier league investigating so I can't see how the prem can fudge this if the serious charges are proven.
 
C'est Moi Cantona said:
So unless it's a lenient punishment, and alot of the charges are dismissed, then City will of course appeal.

So we are in a position by the sounds of things that for City to get anything meaningful, we could be looking at 2028-2029 until anything actually happens to them.

Makes you wonder how the media will handle it if they are found guilty of the most serious charges, and they are just allowed to carry on pending the appeal.
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Surely they should be finding three new people who actually have little to do and could listen to the appeal and then get to verdict in double quick time compared to the snail pace this first one is taking.

Richard Masters admitted six months back the three they appointed for this hearing have simply too much else going on so that's why it took over a year to go through every single charge, write up the report and all other stuff regarding eventual verdict.
 
If they do appeal, but the appeals panel knocks them back, saying it's a frivolous appeal they should then add extra penalties on top of what ever has been given.....
 
FootballHQ said:
Surely they should be finding three new people who actually have little to do and could listen to the appeal and then get to verdict in double quick time compared to the snail pace this first one is taking.

Richard Masters admitted six months back the three they appointed for this hearing have simply too much else going on so that's why it took over a year to go through every single charge, write up the report and all other stuff regarding eventual verdict.
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It's the calibre of professions needed to consider the charges that is the issue here. When City were charged for breaching CL rules the panel who considered the matter were an ex Prime Minister of Belgium, a solicitor who worked for the ECHR and an English barrister and QC.
It's not a job for Hawksbee, Jacobs and Alan Brazil.

City submitted over 500,000 items of evidence in their defence of the 115 charges. That's over 166,667 per panel member. I assume much of this evidence is frivolous and would include volumes of case law containing a thousand or more cases. However, the panel members have to wade through each case and explain it's irrelevance.

If you assume an hours work to consider each item of evidence then one person working a 10 hour day, 5 days a week for 52 weeks per year(ignore holidays) would spend 2,600 hours per year on the case. For 166,667 hours, divided by 2,600 hours pa, it would only take 64 years to complete the task.
A 10 man team would reduce that to 6.4 years, a 20 man team a mere 3.2.

Maybe the panel could sub-contract some of the work to smaller legal practices in order to save time but the time-scale will still be enormous. It will be years before this matter is concluded.
 
But is it actually true that the verdict is going to come out now, or is that just what you think
 
Bartondale said:
Hi,
Numerous articles have appeared in the press stating there are three distinct phases being the verdict, the appeal and finally the punishment.

@Crick posted a video on 31 July 2025 in this thread featuring an interview with Stefan Borson in which at 3mins and 10secs Borson clearly states the punishment will not be considered until after the appeal is finalised. Borson is widely regarded as the authority on the 115 Charges.

This makes sense to me. I cannot imagine a punishment will be determined until the extent of Citys guilt, or innocence, has been determined. It's how the law works in other cases when, after a guilty verdict has been decided in complex cases, the judge will take several weeks or months to decide upon an appropriate punishment.

Any chance you can post the link that contradicts this?
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Well Everton's announcement and punishment was the same time https://www.premierleague.com/en/news/3788486
 
Bartondale said:
Hi,
Numerous articles have appeared in the press stating there are three distinct phases being the verdict, the appeal and finally the punishment.

@Crick posted a video on 31 July 2025 in this thread featuring an interview with Stefan Borson in which at 3mins and 10secs Borson clearly states the punishment will not be considered until after the appeal is finalised. Borson is widely regarded as the authority on the 115 Charges.

This makes sense to me. I cannot imagine a punishment will be determined until the extent of Citys guilt, or innocence, has been determined. It's how the law works in other cases when, after a guilty verdict has been decided in complex cases, the judge will take several weeks or months to decide upon an appropriate punishment.

Any chance you can post the link that contradicts this?
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I don’t know either way but I wouldn’t believe anything Borson says about City, ever
 
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