Now go and read again, because i clearly wrote that these lot makes me miss him, because of how they inept they are and are constantly lowering expectations. He at least fired managers who were not up to the mark. Lastly, for the record it was clear from the original post that i think Woodward was terrible at his job, just that they are worse.
Club ownership | Senior management team talk
- Thread starter golden_blunder
- Start date
Given we will most likely sit 14-16th after defeats to Palace and handing wolves their first victory this season, I’m not sure even this managerial disaster squad would keep him on.
We have to go all in for Ireola - best PL manager out there who’s getable and plays formations that would suit our players.
This can’t go on. Our lucky spell has finished and we haven’t improved one metric since last season.
We have to go all in for Ireola - best PL manager out there who’s getable and plays formations that would suit our players.
This can’t go on. Our lucky spell has finished and we haven’t improved one metric since last season.
Why would he join us?
No more panicing in the middle of the season. If the board decides to change the manager, they should take their time and find the best fit. Not just someone who won 14 games in a row in Portugal, or someone who won a Champions League trophy 15 years ago, or someone who once scored an important goal for the club.
Find someone who fits the United profile. And most important of all... Make sure this happens at a time when you have the funds to back him properly. Obviously there is no patience for a guy like Ruben. Hired mid season, got an unproven Danish left back as the only player in his first season. Next season - new strikeforce, but several injuries to those players already. Basically leaving him with the same players as last season. Also, the AFCON is coming up, and we're losing arguably our two best players for a month.
Right now would be a terrible time to change the manager. We should find solace in the fact that most teams above us are inconsistent as hell also.
We're three points of a CL spot right now. No need to panic. I don't believe the players we've got right now is going to get us there. No matter who the manager is.
I want the management to be realistic about our situation, have a plan in place and don't panic.
They are stubborn, and want to show trust in their own decision. They should just admit Amorim is never going to be a success here.
How on earth would Ireola be a panic appointment? He’s PL proven, his team plays good football, he’s turned some unknowns into gems, and always punching above their weight on a shoestring. And I’m pretty sure he’s out of contract at the end of the season. He would jump at the chance to manage a team like United I reckon - why wouldn’t he?
If you have watched us much this season, you will know that 3 points off CL places is an absolute dream but the 7 points away from relegation is a more realistic finish line for Amorim.
It tends to be because they don't back themselves for short term success, so plead as if they have some master plan that guarantees long term success.
This way they alleviate pressure to succeed or show any quality early on and can keep kicking the can down the road " we knew this would be a long tough road" etc.
We were doing a cultural reset, which fans claimed was working, 5 years ago yet today we hear the same excuses and how everyone who doesn't lap up the loser mentality is impatient. Tomorrow never comes at this club.
Sorry but i find that comment disgusting. How can anything be worse than the death of multiple players?
Not sure if this is the right thread but kind of sad
That point is irrelevant because with Amorim in charge, we won't be making it to the CL places. Get someone competent in and we might have a chance.
It sure says something about the state of things. Very sad, if you ask me.
100%.
There are literally dozens of coaches who could do more with the squad we have than Amorim.
There are literally dozens of managers who seeing Everton go down to 10 men might've switched to 4 at the back, put Bruno as a #10 (where he should be playing anyway) and really tried to squeeze the game.
The longer we stick with Amorim the worse its going to get. INEOS is condemning us to the wilderness because they're not willing to accept they made a mistake with Amorim.
This whole era is about gearing up for the new stadium, thats the promised land
Its a shame we're so shambolic on the pitch because off it we seem to be doing things right. I do think eventually these sort of appointments will pay dividends.
They make me miss Ed too. He would have booted Amorim months ago.
For gods sake. Stop being nostalgic for that man.
I am not nostalgic and I do not want him near the club, but even him has higher standard than this board.
Did he he though?
He sacrificed potentially long term success to gain some limited wins in the short term and we're still arguably paying the price (literally in some cases) for his appalling record in the transfer market now.
Ratcliffe and the "new regime" have got a lot wrong but they inherited an absolute shit show.
I'm largely on the fence when it comes to Amorim but the board making a change now when there isn't really any decent managers available would be what we'd have done 5 years ago. Woodward might have sacked the manager after Brentford but we'd be in no better position.
Unless things get really bad in the next month or so, the board need to stay strong. They have invested a lot into this and binning that off would be daft.
Sunk cost fallacy
I just realized today that there is no hope in the near future for us.
The fact that Amorim is not already sacked tells you that INEOS and club management don't know what they are doing either.
They maybe doing some things right ( transfers seem better then before) and other club personnel being employed but the actual team related stuff is being destroyed by their inaction
So how is this going to get fixed, and by who?
The fact that Amorim is not already sacked tells you that INEOS and club management don't know what they are doing either.
They maybe doing some things right ( transfers seem better then before) and other club personnel being employed but the actual team related stuff is being destroyed by their inaction
So how is this going to get fixed, and by who?
News like this annoys me because no matter what happens with recruitment, it's being fed into a jester who keeps 5 defenders on the field against a 10 man Everton at home
Yes, and I am not a fan of him, but even he understood that there are standards that should not be going under at any cost. United's worst position under him is 7th and that was his first season.
2014: 7th.. sacked DM
2015: 4th
2016: 5th +FA cup.. sacked LVG
2017: 7th +EUL + league cup
2018: 2nd
2019: 6th OGS.. (JM sacked at 6th)
2020: 3rd
2021: 2nd
2022: 6th RR ( OGS sacked at 7th)
2023: 3rd + league cup
INEOS
2024: 8th + FA cup, TH.. not sacked
2025: 15th.. not sacked
2025/26: until now 10th..
Jim compares united to Arsenal under Arteta, but we are nowhere near them. We are not playing like Arteta's first years, Arsenal did not finish below 8th with Arteta. They did not inherit a shit show, they bought a club with it's worse league position 7th in a decade and took the team and took the team to 15th for the first time in it's history. It's really embarrassing and at any big club this management should be booted. They took united with financial difficulties, maybe, but so did many other clubs, why did not Barcelona fall this low despite us much better financial position?
They claimed they do not want to buy a Yamal, but want to buy the next Yamal, but then goes on and spend 70m on Dorgu and Zirkzee. They have failed miserably.
The Glazers and INEOS have killed the club.
He was great at sacking managers. Not so great at actually doing anything positive for the long term.
Look, I'm no fan of Ratcliffe. I'm not really a fan of Amorim but there's clearly wider issues going back years that have not really been resolved. Pretty much every aspect of the club was a shit show and it's gonna take some time to resolve that.
Bringing another up and coming manager (Glasner is often the name given on here) without a proper structure wouldn't work and we'd be back in the same situation in 12 months or sooner (look at Spurs with Frank). Bringing in another experienced manager for some short term success (Van Gaal and Mourinho esque) means we're back in square one in 2/3 years after they've spent hundreds or millions on 30+ year olds who maybe give us a good 18 months before looking knackered.
Now, with all that I'd add in the caveat that Amorim and probably Wilcox need some short term success. And if we're 10th/11th or lower by the end of January and miles off the European places then we need to look elsewhere.
The window to make a positive change for this season was probably in the week after Brentford. Now it would be a case of casting the net out far and wide to see if we can bring in a "vibes man" that can somehow teach these bozos to take a throw in correctly or pass the ball 10 yards. Sunk cost fallacy it might be but that's where we're at unless INEOS can invent time travel and stop the 2005 takeover from happening.
Nuance everyone. Remember that?
This makes me hate Jim and INEOS even more.
That's the beauty of supporting United, isn't it. No matter what happens on the pitch, no matter what happens with the club, we'll always have had worse days. Or one worse day anyway, back in 1958.
I'm sorry but this is a load of nonsense. The Glazers have killed the club but that comment is bizarre.
I love Scholes but Jesper Blomqvist was at Forest the other week. United have a number of ex player organisations. I'm sure if Scholes wanted a ticket, he could have contacted one of those. I was talking to an ex academy player a few months ago who always gets sorted when he asks. I find it hard to believe that multi millionaire Paul Scholes doesn't know how to sort himself out.
And on a wider point, why is it automatically a bad thing that most people at the club from 2012/2013 aren't there anymore?
I just don't get this attitude, we know the club is a mess and still dysfunctional. I personally doubt we ever win PL with the Glazers as owners, I also really dont see a new stadium with them either as we have so much debt. But you're really telling me the awful crap that Amorim serves up is the best we can do? He has not improved a single player. Maybe we need to stop appointing managers from the weakest leagues in Europe. Even under ETH we played more attacking football amongst the chaos. He is the least able manager we have in the last 20 years. What on earth is the point of more time? He is not changing and his system is crap and dull, the fans also seem to have forgotten what it means to be Manchester United.
I am 100% sure that if Scholes or Butt really wanted tickets theyd have it offered to them.
It's not a bad thing. Scholes comes across as a bit of a prat here with his 4 season tickets (at least he's got them!!). I don't believe for a second he couldn't get a hold of someone and if that's the case then it's probably on him.
As for Butt, sounds like standard practice when you're missing games. The club should be on the front foot with this with ST horders. If you're not going to the game then it's an empty seat someone else should be able to use. Maybe 3 games is a bit harsh but there has to be a line somewhere.
Sounds like just petulance and entitled whingy behaviour to me.
Yeah, it's just more shitting on the club by our lovely ex-players.
I'm not saying it wouldn't work. Maybe it could.
But.. Signing him in the middle of the season is probably going to be expensive. Getting rid of Ruben and staff is expensive. As I wrote earlier, i'd like the club to be able to support the manager properly to begin with.
Larnaca, Mirandés, Rayo and Bournemouth are his experiences as a manager. He's very much THE interesting option right now, but he doesn't have big club experience.
We're setting ourselves up for failure again if we change the manager now. If he's interested in joining United, wait until the summer and back him in the transfer market. This whole adopting a weak squad hasn't really worked out for any of the post Fergie managers.
Ireola also was winless for a dozen games for Bournemouth initially? Could be wrong but I remember him needing some time before he got going.
I wouldnt be against him nor Glasner, mind.
I have no problem in building a team slowly, but their must be standards. You can not simply give a 40 years old free ticket to control a giant organisation like united. Amorim inexperience is showing and he is crumbling like a little kid in every press conference. If I was a CEO of a club and watch my coach in a press conference say "I am afraid of going back to the old united of last season" live on camera, I would call him to my office and tell him to pack his things and leave. The board have a job to instill tranquillity and stability into the team by appointing the right people and they are failing miserably in doing that.
Nobody is suggesting it wasn't awful, but my original assertion regarded events happening to United as a whole.
United recovered from Munich. Yes, it was absolutely terrible but the club recovered.
Within ten years of it, we were champions of Europe playing football the Busby Way. We'd won both the league and cup and produced the likes of George Best.
The tragedy also provided for the club an identity: what we do, we do for our fallen. We never die and when we fell, we got back onto the perch our way, with swashbuckling attack-minded football bred in our academy.
One decade on from Ferguson retiring we practically exist to manage the Glazer debt, which has been exacerbated by their plant Woodward's chronic mismanagement of the club.
Our fans, who fought the Glazers, Cubic and Rupert Murdoch, are giving serious consideration to endorsing state ownership whilst the playing staff continually take the piss on wages we can ill afford.
Let's be flatly frank, the club's reputation, identity and capabilities have been utterly destroyed, on the pitch and off, and only another lurid cook-off can 'save' us from the mess they caused.
I appreciate your concern with my comment, it is a legitimate response, but what is truly disgusting is what we are now.
Quite.
We cant keep experimenting with upcoming coaches again and again when the last 3 werent up to it. Look, this is United, its really different from other club that the pressure and the magnitude of the club itself can eat the young coaches alive especially with competition in PL is fierce.
If we want long term success, then we have to have short term success and medium term success to reach that point. Go for the best we can get that has the experience and pedigree to withstand the pressure, scrutiny, flexible/practicle enough to get the success. I was asking for Tuchel before we got Amorim because he is probably the best after the obvious ones like Pep, Klopp, the Don. The pressure is just really different for the young coaches to come in and get the results as well as palying good football occassionally. We as a club just wasnt having enough with managment side of things to support them enough for them to succeed.
If we want long term success, then we have to have short term success and medium term success to reach that point. Go for the best we can get that has the experience and pedigree to withstand the pressure, scrutiny, flexible/practicle enough to get the success. I was asking for Tuchel before we got Amorim because he is probably the best after the obvious ones like Pep, Klopp, the Don. The pressure is just really different for the young coaches to come in and get the results as well as palying good football occassionally. We as a club just wasnt having enough with managment side of things to support them enough for them to succeed.
Since this thread's vibes changed again after the last bad result on field, it's not a bad time to remember that:
A) The Glazers are the ones who caused this mess in the first place, and the buck ultimately still stops at them;
B) INEOS, while being mostly clueless and ineffective in anything other than creating pompous senior director jobs to anyone spending 5 minutes in City or Chelsea while penny-pinching with United legends and sacking the lunch lady, aren't really able to fix United's biggest issues. Not from a minority position at least (and considering precedent at Lausanne and Nice, I don't think they would be from a majority position anyway).
C) United's biggest issue is still being owned by parasitic, non investing, incompetent majority investors that have brought (and refused to pay) crippling debt (associated to the privilege of having them at the helm) into the club, and refusing to leave unless being paid a ridiculous amount of money way over market value.
On the squad and manager issue: to the "no manager value in the market right now" crew, you don't really have to sign the next big thing the very next day. Caretaker managers exist and have been used effectively before. The squad desperately needs to use its AM as an AM, its box to box as a box to box, its wingers as wingers, its wingbacks as wingbacks. Right now the managers inflexibility is being exploited by the rivals in the PL. And that could be the difference between Europe (which the club needs both because of money and as a way to attract better players in the future) and no Europe.
Any manager could eventually become fantastic if you give them 5 years time and a lot of money to rebuild every year. Pretty much like every footballer can look like Cruyff if you give him an acre of space and 10 seconds on the ball. The problem is those conditions aren't being met, and on the meantime the competition will get stronger.
A) The Glazers are the ones who caused this mess in the first place, and the buck ultimately still stops at them;
B) INEOS, while being mostly clueless and ineffective in anything other than creating pompous senior director jobs to anyone spending 5 minutes in City or Chelsea while penny-pinching with United legends and sacking the lunch lady, aren't really able to fix United's biggest issues. Not from a minority position at least (and considering precedent at Lausanne and Nice, I don't think they would be from a majority position anyway).
C) United's biggest issue is still being owned by parasitic, non investing, incompetent majority investors that have brought (and refused to pay) crippling debt (associated to the privilege of having them at the helm) into the club, and refusing to leave unless being paid a ridiculous amount of money way over market value.
On the squad and manager issue: to the "no manager value in the market right now" crew, you don't really have to sign the next big thing the very next day. Caretaker managers exist and have been used effectively before. The squad desperately needs to use its AM as an AM, its box to box as a box to box, its wingers as wingers, its wingbacks as wingbacks. Right now the managers inflexibility is being exploited by the rivals in the PL. And that could be the difference between Europe (which the club needs both because of money and as a way to attract better players in the future) and no Europe.
Any manager could eventually become fantastic if you give them 5 years time and a lot of money to rebuild every year. Pretty much like every footballer can look like Cruyff if you give him an acre of space and 10 seconds on the ball. The problem is those conditions aren't being met, and on the meantime the competition will get stronger.
Glazers being shit doesn't rule that Ineos can't be shit too.
Our results inPL since that LC cup final are getting worse and worse. I wish that I have time to calcite our PPG since that final.
Our results inPL since that LC cup final are getting worse and worse. I wish that I have time to calcite our PPG since that final.