United still playing lowball on contract renewals?

jojojo

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Well, we already knew that - didn't we? However, I've always found it really hard to track down any actual numbers. Fortunately, Swiss Ramble has decided to take a crack at it. You need to read the full thread though.

 

Vidyoyo

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Ooo that is interesting, thanks for sharing.

Yes it looks very much like the bigger men's clubs are propping up the women's game, which itself isn't very profitable at current, sans the 3 clubs that posted a profit, including us. I hope that an increase in revenue from TV rights/cup money can help the women's game become more sustainable, though how this trickles down to lesser performing clubs is a question.

What I think might be interesting is if, say, betting companies via sponsorship became more involved in the women's game. This has undoubtedly helped finances across the board in the men's game but might not be the kind of association the women's game wants. Morally I'm against it but it's hard to ignore how much sponsorship deals help in terms of finances.

Still, it's a long-term project and hopefully more money finds its way organically over the next couple of years. Signs are encouraging.
 

jojojo

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The numbers under each heading are difficult to compare because different clubs put money under different categories. On the expenses side, some clubs allocate a portion of stadium and training ground running costs to the team for example. On the income side, clubs can decide for themselves how much of the overall club's marketing/sponsorship income the women get.

Some numbers are clearer though, at least they are if the club actually reports the numbers. Chelsea don't publish wages for example, but are assumed to have the highest wages in the WSL:


Incidentally, it's just worth noting that these are our 20/21 figures and include the wages paid to Tobin Heath and Christen Press. It was rumoured that Casey Stoney pulled money forward from the 21/22 budget to get them - partly in a gamble that we would break into top three.
 

jojojo

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Go on United - strike while the marketing iron is hot. Bung the team an extra £1m/year to get us closer to the wages paid by the top 3. I'm not even expecting us to match Arsenal, never mind Chelsea, though we'll need to if we want to attract CL hungry players - for now, just make sure that players like Groenen, Toone, Russo and Earps who want to play for us won't feel like financial mugs if they do.

Plus, it's the kind of money that a well targeted sponsor might cough up. Other teams do it, why not "super commercial department" us?

Right now we're probably not even in the top 4 salary list - it's believed Spurs have overtaken us, and Everton. West ham may have done the same.

Also right now:
 

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Go on United - strike while the marketing iron is hot. Bung the team an extra £1m/year to get us closer to the wages paid by the top 3. I'm not even expecting us to match Arsenal, never mind Chelsea, though we'll need to if we want to attract CL hungry players - for now, just make sure that players like Groenen, Toone, Russo and Earps who want to play for us won't feel like financial mugs if they do.

Plus, it's the kind of money that a well targeted sponsor might cough up. Other teams do it, why not "super commercial department" us?

Right now we're probably not even on the top 4 salary lost - it's believed Spurs have overtaken us, and Everton, West ham may have done the same.

Also right now:
I’m afraid the Glazers are going backwards into the future as they were always wont to. They closed down the previous women’s team, stalled on reestablishing even when Moyes wanted it, were talked into doing it for brand reasons, but they just don’t see that it’s the next huge market for development ready to explode, and they are reactionary as hell.
 

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I’ve always wondered why our woman’s team has not been pushed more when it comes to marketing. You have a huge global name starting a woman’s team and there was certainly buzz about it at the time but not enough. Why there wasn’t a fly on the wall doc about the team forming, that first year and winning I don’t know.

It just seems like for some reason United don’t see that the woman’s game is there to make serious bank and pull in more investment. Yes it will need a cash boost to get it started but they should have gone at this all guns blazing, To make it the best Woman’s football team in the land. Training facility, wages, housing, even a damn stadium.

Just feels like they are letting an oppertunity slip by.
 

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How good is it to see womens football getting such healthy crowds, Arsenal setting a wsl attendance record today.
 

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How good is it to see womens football getting such healthy crowds, Arsenal setting a wsl attendance record today.
It is fabulous, fantastic, amazing, all of the good words!!

I hope thar come December, for our game against Villa, we can at the very least, out do what we did last season against Everton!
 

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How good is it to see womens football getting such healthy crowds, Arsenal setting a wsl attendance record today.
Good to see so many knowledgeable fans and I have to guess new fans being excited by such good football.
 
December: still no renewal with Alessia Russo

jojojo

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Still no news on Alessia's contract negotiations other than "we're working on it".

Meanwhile the rumours on who might want Russo and who will she be negotiating with next month unless we close a deal are starting to firm up:
 

jojojo

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Last night in the UK, the BBC handed out its annual sport awards, a combination of panels for shortlisting and a popular vote. Unsurprisingly the Lionesses won the team award, Sarina Wiegman won the coach award and Beth Mead won the big individual prize - the Sports Personality of the Year award.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/sports-personality/64059276

Our women were there - of course!

Incidentally, if anyone was wondering - yes, their sponsor appeal has risen dramatically and they would be getting even more deals offered if they were playing for a London club.
 

oates

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Really pleased for Beth Mead, thoroughly deserved.
 

Dan_F

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We badly need to sort out Russo’s contract. For a very wide variety of reasons
I don’t follow the women’s team massively closely, but it seems strange from both sides that this can’t be sorted out. Can’t they just use a tiny bit of Ronaldo’s weekly wage that we’ve saved :lol:
 

Champ

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I get the impression that the likes of Russo will stay if top three (or better) is achieved this season.

Will be a tough ask but I think United will finish ahead of City meaning that Champions League place is secure.
 

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I get the impression that the likes of Russo will stay if top three (or better) is achieved this season.

Will be a tough ask but I think United will finish ahead of City meaning that Champions League place is secure.
Agreed, I don’t think it’s a purely money situation with Ona & Russo. Though that will play a part obviously, they will want to be playing at the highest level and they’ll have offers to do just that. So if we get top 3 I think Russo stays and Ona depends on if she wants to go back to Spain with Barca or not.

I think we’ve put ourselves in a great position to secure top 3 as well with a great 1st half of the season and much improved squad depth compared to previous seasons (if Skinner ever decides to use it haha). With City already trailing and Arsenal losing their top two attackers I think we should have enough about us seal the deal, especially with a couple January reinforcements.
 
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phelans shorts

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Agreed, I don’t think it’s a purely money situation with Ona & Russo. Though that will play a part obviously, they will want to be playing at the highest level and they’ll have offers to do just that. So if we get top 3 I think Russo stays and Ona depends on if she wants to go back to Spain with Barca or not.

I think we’ve put ourselves in a great position to secure top 3 as well with a great 1st half of the season and much improved squad depth compared to previous seasons (if Skinner ever decides to use it haha). With City already trailing and Arsenal losing their top two attackers I think we should have enough about us seal the deal, especially with a couple January reinforcements.
I’d be in Ona’s ears about Barcelona signing Bronze last summer too, put doubts in her head whether she’d play there, whereas we have given her captaincy a few times.

If I were to put money down now I’d definitely have us in the top 3, feel like the only thing that can stop us is, well, us. In that sense the win at the Emirates could be massive in showing we can fight through anything.
 

TMS

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I’d be in Ona’s ears about Barcelona signing Bronze last summer too, put doubts in her head whether she’d play there, whereas we have given her captaincy a few times.

If I were to put money down now I’d definitely have us in the top 3, feel like the only thing that can stop us is, well, us. In that sense the win at the Emirates could be massive in showing we can fight through anything.
Yeah, if we don’t get top 3 this season you wonder if it’ll ever come if it means losing key players because of it. If we’d have beat City in the derby I’d already be spending the champions league cash!
 
Feb 23 - Batlle contract offer coming up short

jojojo

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I would be ok with the idea that Batlle wants CL football or even a return to Spain, but if the Athletic are right we aren't even offering a good pay deal.

She started as (and remains) one of our lowest paid players - she's now being courted by other clubs. Our best offer so far is apparently half of what's been offered elsewhere.

"Negotiations — led by United’s head of women’s football Polly Bancroft — started with Batlle in September and are still ongoing. Sources close to Batlle, however, have been surprised to see talks drag on and are still waiting on an enticing offer from United."
https://theathletic.com/4227416/202...ashford-contract-liverpool-sporting-director/

I'm torn. I want it to be true that she's happy in Manchester and wants to stay. On the other hand, I don't really want to believe that we're willing to lose her because we won't pay her market value. Hopefully those negotiations really are ongoing and we haven't just hit a financial brick wall with the team.
 

TMS

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I would be ok with the idea that Batlle wants CL football or even a return to Spain, but if the Athletic are right we aren't even offering a good pay deal.

She started as (and remains) one of our lowest paid players - she's now being courted by other clubs. Our best offer so far is apparently half of what's been offered elsewhere.

"Negotiations — led by United’s head of women’s football Polly Bancroft — started with Batlle in September and are still ongoing. Sources close to Batlle, however, have been surprised to see talks drag on and are still waiting on an enticing offer from United."
https://theathletic.com/4227416/202...ashford-contract-liverpool-sporting-director/

I'm torn. I want it to be true that she's happy in Manchester and wants to stay. On the other hand, I don't really want to believe that we're willing to lose her because we won't pay her market value. Hopefully those negotiations really are ongoing and we haven't just hit a financial brick wall with the team.
Saw this today as well and was going to create a thread but I can't. It's crazy that other teams are offering double and better terms in the sense of years on the deal. The idea she hasn't just signed with someone else already based on those details must mean she has some desire to stay if we qualify for Champions league and met her half way on the contract.

The striking part of the article for me was she wants to be part of an ambitious project. That's the key question here, are Manchester United Women an ambitious project? If you give them the benefit of the doubt you could say they are waiting on Champions League qualification to revise the budget and offer a market value deal, but I just don't think they're serious about being contenders. Hopefully the new owners come in and change that.
 

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Saw this today as well and was going to create a thread but I can't. It's crazy that other teams are offering double and better terms in the sense of years on the deal. The idea she hasn't just signed with someone else already based on those details must mean she has some desire to stay if we qualify for Champions league and met her half way on the contract.

The striking part of the article for me was she wants to be part of an ambitious project. That's the key question here, are Manchester United Women an ambitious project? If you give them the benefit of the doubt you could say they are waiting on Champions League qualification to revise the budget and offer a market value deal, but I just don't think they're serious about being contenders. Hopefully the new owners come in and change that.
It feels like by the time the takeover happens it may be too late to convince her and Russo that the project will be ambitious (clearly it isn't at the moment) to stay. It's mad though that they're seemingly so far off other offers given how small the costs are relatively in the women's game and given that Batlle is 23 and already probably our best player.
 
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Rood

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Find it difficult to believe that we would offer half of what a rival would be prepared to pay her - always have to take these kind of stories with a pinch of salt since agents feed stories to the press in their own interests

I would assume the bigger issue is convincing the likes of Batlle and Russo that this is the place to be for winning trophies in the future
 

TMS

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It feels like by the time the takeover happens it may be too late to convince her and Russo that the project will be ambitious (clearly it isn't a the moment) to stay. It's mad though that they're seemingly so far off other offers given how small the costs are relatively in the women's game and given that Batlle is 23 and already probably our best player.
Money talks and if the new owners come in by Easter as is targeted and have a plan to invest in the womens team on the scale of other top contenders that should speak volumes to the players. I'm choosing to cling to the fact neither of them have signed pre-contract deals elsewhere and leaks like this suggest they still see United as an option if the ambition is there.
 

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Money talks and if the new owners come in by Easter as is targeted and have a plan to invest in the womens team on the scale of other top contenders that should speak volumes to the players. I'm choosing to cling to the fact neither of them have signed pre-contract deals elsewhere and leaks like this suggest they still see United as an option if the ambition is there.
Absolutely. Players are not stupid, and they will wait to see what happens if we get new owners, and what their plans are for the club, and particularly the women's team, training facilities etc.
They're keeping their options open.
 

madi5h

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totally agree that its probably more about the sale of the club, from both sides. The staff want to look strong for any new owner but from the players side, if it is Qatar for instance, pocket change for them and suddenly man utd is the most serious club about women's football. such an easy PR win considering women's rights is big part of there criticisms, so the players WOULD be stupid to sign ANY new contract now imo.
 

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It's strange that Qatar is probably the better owner for the women's team despite the criticisms.
Why is it strange? They are using their endless money to whitewash their sins! It means nothing when they have unlimited funds.
 

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Harsh but true.

Backing the women's team is cheap easy PR for whoever takes over, but especially for a state sponsored bid that has a story to sell.
The problem for me is that if a state sponsored bid takes over I am going to be rooting for a the same evil I have condemned at every chance (Chelsea, City, Newcastle) With the minor difference that United actually was a top club before such takeover. Chelsea and City would never have been world class clubs without their free money. United were and is. So that is different! But I would still hate it more than anything, and to other fans they wont take this into consideration just lumping us in with the others.

Even if United Women become world beaters instantly, I am still against it!
 

Rampant Red Rodriguez

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I remember when people were outraged about smartphones and the exploitation of workers for huge profits by Apple and yet they are one of the biggest brands in the world :lol:.

The metal used to make smartphones is ridiculously laborious and has taken over an African country turning it into a hotspot for child labour, yet people still have their phones.

And has anyone ever mentioned the relief sent by Qatar to Turkey and Syria?. Reportedly more than what the entire EU has promised but no one talking about that :confused:.

This hatred towards Qatari ownership is misguided by "paid for pens", they will be a fine custodian of our club.
 

madi5h

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The problem for me is that if a state sponsored bid takes over I am going to be rooting for a the same evil I have condemned at every chance (Chelsea, City, Newcastle) With the minor difference that United actually was a top club before such takeover. Chelsea and City would never have been world class clubs without their free money. United were and is. So that is different! But I would still hate it more than anything, and to other fans they wont take this into consideration just lumping us in with the others.

Even if United Women become world beaters instantly, I am still against it!
the way i see it is, the whole idea of sportswashing is kinda silly, the people who will forgive them for there evils because of owning there football team where never people who were gonna do anything about it anyway, whereas owning utd puts them in a bigger spotlight so more pressure to improve there ways, which the world cup also DID DO at least somewhat

so putting that up against having a man utd, who can at very least, use ALL the money it generates on ITSELF and if not us, it will be another rival, i am ok with it, but also to be fair i will say the utd fans who are suddenly defending them all over the internet as a lovely bunch of lads, it is a little sickening
 
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jojojo

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the way i see it is, the whole idea of sportswashing is kinda silly, the people who will forgive them for there evils because of owning there football team where never people who were gonna do anything about it anyway, whereas owning utd puts them in a bigger spotlight so more pressure to improve there ways, which the world cup also DID DO at least somewhat

so putting that up against having a man utd, who can at very least, use ALL the money it generates on ITSELF and if not us, it will be another rival, i am ok with it, but also to be fair i will say the utd fans who are suddenly defending them all over the internet as a lovely bunch of lads, it is a little sickening
I don't want to rehash the whole Qatar issue here - we've got plenty of threads for that. I will say that from my perspective, I'd see money for the women's team as a PR initiative that's far cheaper and a lot easier for them than acting on the issues around equality and diversity in their own country

It's the easiest kind of sports washing there is. It's cheap and it can be fronted by players whose sex and sexuality would stop them living full lives in Qatar.

For United as a whole, including the women's team, I'd always see any success obtained as tainted by financial doping. Sure, it would be nice to be debt free - but I'm not convinced that we would be anything more than a rich man's/men's toy that could be traded or discarded at will when finance or fashion changes, and who knows what kind of debt we'd be in by then.
 

TMS

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I don't want to rehash the whole Qatar issue here - we've got plenty of threads for that. I will say that from my perspective, I'd see money for the women's team as a PR initiative that's far cheaper and a lot easier for them than acting on the issues around equality and diversity in their own country

It's the easiest kind of sports washing there is. It's cheap and it can be fronted by players whose sex and sexuality would stop them living full lives in Qatar.

For United as a whole, including the women's team, I'd always see any success obtained as tainted by financial doping. Sure, it would be nice to be debt free - but I'm not convinced that we would be anything more than a rich man's/men's toy that could be traded or discarded at will when finance or fashion changes, and who knows what kind of debt we'd be in by then.
I get the point about financial doping and wins being tainted. However my mind goes to Lance Armstrong and his 'tainted' Tour de France wins where everyone else was likely doping as well, at least those at the top of the sport. If we treat Chelsea and City as being financially doped then 7 of the last 9 Premier League and 6 of the last 7 WSL titles have been tainted. I view it as a sort of re-levelling of the playing field, where being a well run organisation still matters greatly. It's also not a guarantee of success, as remind me how many Champions League titles PSG and City have between them.

I think anything that puts extra resources into the womens team should be supported, and I believe the Qatar bid would do this more than others on the table. Very likely for the reasons you've said above, but as long as the club is allowed to function to it's own morals/ideals like it appears City, Chelsea, PSG etc. are allowed to then that satisfies my needs on the matter. Plus from the debates that have been set alight by this very topic it seems to suggest to me that sports washing is rather overrated and acquisitions of such public entities like sports teams bring more foreign scrutiny if anything.
 

madi5h

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I don't want to rehash the whole Qatar issue here - we've got plenty of threads for that. I will say that from my perspective, I'd see money for the women's team as a PR initiative that's far cheaper and a lot easier for them than acting on the issues around equality and diversity in their own country

It's the easiest kind of sports washing there is. It's cheap and it can be fronted by players whose sex and sexuality would stop them living full lives in Qatar.

For United as a whole, including the women's team, I'd always see any success obtained as tainted by financial doping. Sure, it would be nice to be debt free - but I'm not convinced that we would be anything more than a rich man's/men's toy that could be traded or discarded at will when finance or fashion changes, and who knows what kind of debt we'd be in by then.
yes understandable but also more interesting to talk about here as more measured responses can be expected whereas its a bit off a tough read elsewhere on here.
il try to keep specific to the women side though

I am curious, is there ANY sort of financial regulations to the women's side of things? or is it all based off the parent club so basically non-existent as far as the women are concerned?
because its the only truely right answer to all of this, it shouldn't be on fans and clubs or buyers to decide whats right, it should be properly regulated so it doesn't actually matter who buys a club.

another point is its very hard to argue with the fact that the massive amount of money that gets pumped into premier league teams in recent years HAS resulted in a lot of growth of the league as a whole, and its head and shoulders the best league in the world now, so hard not to get a little excited at the same result in the WSL, at the end of the day its an entertainment industry and people will always be on the side of more entertainment, which in turns causes more growth to the sport as a whole, something the women's game needs and deserves imo
 

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I hope we've been able to convince Mannion & Ramsey to stay. I know Ramsey is a big United fan but she might be waiting to see what happens with Earps' situation. That's apart from the obvious ones, but I'm kind of tired of discussing those. :( Hopefully we've also already entered talks with Zelem, Blundell & Ladd. I know that Earps is waiting for the CL spot at least. Although the money we're offering might still not be enough even if we make it to the CL.

Expire end of 2022/23:
Earps - option for a further year
Baggaley - option for a further year
Ramsey
Batlle
Blundell - option for a further year
Thorisdottir - option for a further year
Mannion
Cascarino - loan from PSG
Moore
Bøe Risa - option for a further year
Ladd - option for a further year
Jones - option for a further year
Russo
Thomas - option for a further year

Expire end of 2023/24:
Tounkara
Zelem
Galton - option for a further year
Hanson - option for a further year
Perreira Fuso
Leon
Williams
García
Parris

Expire end of 2024/25:
Riviere
Turner
Le Tissier
Clinton

Expire end of 2025/26:
Naalsund
Toone
 

StretfordEnd78

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I hope Russo signs another contract. Fair play to the club for refusing Arsenal’s offer.
If she goes, Daly would be top of my list. Villa will do well to keep her.