Copa Libertadores

Charlie Foley

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Anyone on here watching/interested in this this year? Boca playing Santos tonight in the second group game. Boca won their first game 1-0 against The Strongest (from Bolivia) and Santos lost 2-0 at home to Barcelona SC of Ecuador. Boca and Santos met in last season’s semi final, after a 0-0 draw in the first leg Santos won 3-0 at home, Tevez got mad, and Santos went on to lose in the final to Palmeiras.
 

Charlie Foley

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Some players to watch in this Boca team. Tevez, of course, who starts tonight, as do Sebastian Villa and Cristian Pavón who has played for LA Galaxy, and went to the World Cup with Argentina in 2018. Eduardo Salvio, who played for Benfica,Marcos Rojo, and Mauro Zárate, who I’m sure people will remember from his time in Europe including at West Ham, miss out.
 

Charlie Foley

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Santos are a bit of a mess at the moment. They are in poor form and their manager just quit
 

Charlie Foley

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If anyone is interested check out Fanatiz. It’s about $80 a year, or $8 on a monthly plan, and you get football from all over the world
 

Charlie Foley

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Boca 1-0 up, Tevez scoring after a flick on from a corner.

elsewhere Flamengo won 4-1 earlier, Gabigol with two more goals
 

Charlie Foley

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2-0. Tevez assist, Villa finish. Lovely goal
 

NYAS

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I don’t understand how Arrasca is still not in Europe. Unbelievable player.
 

Lay

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What team is considered the favourite this year?
 

Charlie Foley

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What team is considered the favourite this year?
I am not sure about the odds. I think Flamengo will be tough to beat personally. They are just so dangerous going forward, Gabigol and Pedro can get goals against anyone, Bruno is so dangerous on counter attacks, and Arrascaeta is a fantastic player. They won in 2019, and won the last 2 Brazilian leagues.
 

Charlie Foley

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Internacional lost their first group match 2-0 and have since won 4-0 and 6-1. They seem mad
 

Charlie Foley

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Group C is a really tight Group. Santos lost their first 2 games and then battered The Strongest. Currently 1-0 up at home to Boca (Tevez missed a sitter after 6 minutes), who beat Strongest and Santos but then lost to Barcelona SC. Barcelona themselves won each of their first 3 but currently 1-0 down to The Strongest. It would leave Barcelona on 9, Santos on 6, Boca on 6, Strongest on 3.
 

Charlie Foley

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The referee booked the wrong Santos player. If the right player had been booked it would have been his second yellow card. No VAR of course. Both managers just got booked (Boca manager trying to point out who should have been booked) and then 3 minutes later sent off. Santos manager has not left though :lol: :lol:
 

NYAS

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Santos manager is finally up in one of the executive boxes
 

Charlie Foley

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Strongest now 2-0 up :nervous::annoyed: meanwhile Internacional, who beat Deportivo Tachira 4-0 a few weeks ago despite playing for 30 minutes with 10 men are losing 2-1 to them.
 

Charlie Foley

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Santos win. Bad tempered match. Ultimately this loss is on Boca with Tevez missing an absolute sitter and laughable defending for the Santos goal, but they weren’t helped by a generally shit referee who should have sent off that Santos player. But the autopsy needs to start closer to home.
Boca’s last 2 games are at home and it’s still really in their hands.
 

Charlie Foley

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Flamengo 1-0 down! They have a strong team but not their first choice keeper, but Batista has been consistently exposed and has been forced to make some good stops, ULC finally managing a deserved goal. Flamengo have already qualified but that’s a huge goal for la calera (who are missing a lot of starters)
 

Charlie Foley

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Big game going on right now between the Strongest and Santos. The Strongest are leading 1-0 in what is really a must win game for them. If it stays like this, Barcelona would be on 9 points, Santos, Boca, and Strongest all on 6, with Barcelona to play Boca tomorrow.
 

Charlie Foley

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2-0 now! But The Strongest had a centre back sent off, they’ll play over an hour with 10 men. Potentially a huge goal for Santos to concede as their goal difference is now 0 compared to Boca’s of +1 (Santos have scored more goals mainly due to them smashing The Strongest in their third game)
 

antohan

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I don’t understand how Arrasca is still not in Europe. Unbelievable player.
You mean Giorgian? I was a massive fan and could never figure why he didn't get more gametime with the NT. Turns out he is a cold chest player, as we say.
 

NYAS

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You mean Giorgian? I was a massive fan and could never figure why he didn't get more gametime with the NT. Turns out he is a cold chest player, as we say.
What is a cold chest player? Is Nicolas de la Cruz also one?
 

André Dominguez

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I don’t understand how Arrasca is still not in Europe. Unbelievable player.
Flamengo has a very welathy budget, probably the south american team with highest wage ceiling. He's probably on a good contract and will not leave unless an european club offers him a good offer.
 

antohan

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What is a cold chest player? Is Nicolas de la Cruz also one?
Doesn't impose himself or dominate games except when in his comfort zone. The playing version of a fairweather fan, will not have any ambition to "move up the ladder". Shame, because the ability is there.

Can't say I paid too much attention to de la Cruz to give an informed opinion. Don't read much into the fact I haven't, except that I don't see any natural successors for Suarez-Cavani. Fingers crossed we get one more qualification and WC gut-wrenching hope out of those two.
 

NYAS

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Flamengo has a very welathy budget, probably the south american team with highest wage ceiling. He's probably on a good contract and will not leave unless an european club offers him a good offer.
Yes of course, Flamengo is my second team. I just meant at some point when his contracts were expiring I would have expected something to happen. Marseille have just made a €25m bid for Gerson. Gerson is brilliant, one of our top 3 best players, but Arrascaeta is better. Of course many different factors go into it, but my general point was that it’s hard to believe no European team has made an effort for him. To be honest it seems to me as if he isn’t desperate to leave South America.

Doesn't impose himself or dominate games except when in his comfort zone. The playing version of a fairweather fan. Shame, because the ability is there.

Can't say I paid too much attention to de la Cruz to give an informed opinion. Don't read much into the fact I haven't, except that I don't see any natural successors for Suarez-Cavani. Fingers crossed we get one more qualification and WC gut-wrenching hope out of those two.
He has been quite crucial actually in a lot of tough games over the past few years. Most recently for example when he got the comeback winner from outside the box 10 minutes from time at Velez a couple of weeks ago. I do see how his demeanor during games could give that impression, but he does contribute a lot during difficult moments.

The reason I mention DLC is because he is a similar type of player and has also not really “done it” for the national team yet. Disclaimer: you are Uruguayan and will always know better than me; but if I were to give a view I’d say creative players such as Arrascaeta and DLC will never be able to truly solidify their influence on the NT until Tabarez is gone. I don’t see that his tactics align with players like that, so naturally it will be difficult for those players. I don’t mean that he “should” go by the way, he is rightfully a legend for what he has done. It’s just horses for courses. Their styles don’t align.

As for Suarez-Cavani successors: Forget Maxi and Darwin. Augustin Alvarez is the guy.
 

antohan

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Yes of course, Flamengo is my second team. I just meant at some point when his contracts were expiring I would have expected something to happen. Marseille have just made a €25m bid for Gerson. Gerson is brilliant, one of our top 3 best players, but Arrascaeta is better. Of course many different factors go into it, but my general point was that it’s hard to believe no European team has made an effort for him. To be honest it seems to me as if he isn’t desperate to leave South America.

He has been quite crucial actually in a lot of tough games over the past few years. Most recently for example when he got the comeback winner from outside the box 10 minutes from time at Velez a couple of weeks ago. I do see how his demeanor during games could give that impression, but he does contribute a lot during difficult moments.
That's precisely the point, he lacks the ambition and drive that is required, he would much rather be in a side which plays to his strengths. Comfort zone player, it need not mean he won't get you a result in a tight game. Reminds me a bit of Riquelme in that sense. It's not exactly big fish in a small pond as I would never call Boca/Flamengo small ponds, but look at him in Spain, he failed at Barcelona and found his comfort zone at Villarreal.

The reason I mention DLC is because he is a similar type of player and has also not really “done it” for the national team yet. Disclaimer: you are Uruguayan and will always know better than me; but if I were to give a view I’d say creative players such as Arrascaeta and DLC will never be able to truly solidify their influence on the NT until Tabarez is gone. I don’t see that his tactics align with players like that, so naturally it will be difficult for those players. I don’t mean that he “should” go by the way, he is rightfully a legend for what he has done. It’s just horses for courses. Their styles don’t align.
Agree somewhat. I spent a long time berating Tabárez for not playing him more and insisting with Lodeiro (I'm talking pre-WC2018 and even before he moved to Cruzeiro, let alone now at Flamengo). He did get chances though and completely stank up the place. Part is Tabárez and his style, part is him and his comfort zone. Look at Cavani, he played right midfielder for us at WC2010 and the 2011 Copa America win, either you have that fire and drive and adapt or you flounder. Giorgian flounders.

As for Suarez-Cavani successors: Forget Maxi and Darwin. Augustin Alvarez is the guy.
Aye, I'm very impressed :drool: A tad soon though, fingers crossed.
 

FootballHQ

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Flamengo has a very welathy budget, probably the south american team with highest wage ceiling. He's probably on a good contract and will not leave unless an european club offers him a good offer.
We were sort of linked to him this week, talk of 25m offer but suspect it's just agent talk.

One of those names I've seen regularly in Uruguay squad but never paid much attention to so no idea if he's been a regular given it tends to be more defensive minded midfields.
 

Lay

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Gerson always looks impressive whenever I see him play. Shame it never worked for him at Roma, because I think he could play at a higher level now.
 

Bertie Wooster

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That's mad. But, then, so is so much about South American football. :lol:

River have always been my favourite South American team. I love their kit (superficial reason, I admit), and a great youth system. I especially got into them in the late 90's / early 2000's when they were producing the likes of Marcelo Gallardo, Hernan Crespo, Pablo Aimar, Javier Saviola, Radamel Falcao Garcia...
 

Bertie Wooster

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Wow they have no subs availlable aswell :lol:
It's absolutely crazy that they're being forced to play it. And not even being allowed to register a young academy keeper for the game. :houllier:

I saw some of the later stages of last year's competition (played earlier this year) and, although I only have a passing interest in them from afar, I was really invested in it by the end of their semi final v Palmeiras.

They had a man sent off in each leg, lost the first one 3-0 at home, and then absolutely hammered Palmeiras away and deserved to score loads, even with 10 men, but only won 2-0 and so went out on aggregate.

They were even awarded a penalty in about the 10th minute of injury time that could have levelled the game but VAR overturned it (I think they'd also had something like another penalty overturned and a goal ruled out). I started off watching it with just a small interest in River getting it back but not emotionally invested, and then by the end I was really desperate for them to get the goal they deserved. So frustrating. But it was a really great match.
 

NYAS

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That's precisely the point, he lacks the ambition and drive that is required, he would much rather be in a side which plays to his strengths. Comfort zone player, it need not mean he won't get you a result in a tight game. Reminds me a bit of Riquelme in that sense. It's not exactly big fish in a small pond as I would never call Boca/Flamengo small ponds, but look at him in Spain, he failed at Barcelona and found his comfort zone at Villarreal.



Agree somewhat. I spent a long time berating Tabárez for not playing him more and insisting with Lodeiro (I'm talking pre-WC2018 and even before he moved to Cruzeiro, let alone now at Flamengo). He did get chances though and completely stank up the place. Part is Tabárez and his style, part is him and his comfort zone. Look at Cavani, he played right midfielder for us at WC2010 and the 2011 Copa America win, either you have that fire and drive and adapt or you flounder. Giorgian flounders.


Aye, I'm very impressed :drool: A tad soon though, fingers crossed.
Ok, we actually agree. In a sense I misunderstood your point and thought you meant more that if a specific game wasn’t going great, he wouldn’t step up and be a game-changer. You mean it at a more macro level though, career-wise, etc. I’d be inclined to agree because there’s no way he hasn’t received genuine offers by now. Just probably doesn’t fancy moving unless it’s a top end club in Spain or Italy. And I’m not complaining at all :drool: he’s a joy to watch.

I do think however post-Tabarez it may be worthwhile to play a system that allows both him and Nicolas to flourish. I just think both are really quality playmakers, and it will probably be one of the strongest areas of your NT when the old guard strikers are done after Qatar.