Cristiano Ronaldo | Signs for United! Fcuk City

[Fortitude]

Football is in real danger of imploding.

Bale is on 600k a week and not making the match day sqaud some games.

Ronaldo is apparently on even more than that and have seen it said he's on as much as 800k a week. No wonder they want him gone if that's what he's earning. Crazy if true.

And Messi is apparently on even more still and that's bringing up everyone else's wages up so much at Barca that it's killing them financially.

I don't care how good someone is. Nobody is worth anything like 600k a week nevermind nearly 1m. Football wages have always been mental but right now I think they are beyond that.

Bale is the only outlier there.

Ronaldo and Messi have been worth every penny of their wage for their entire careers and there is no parity with them because nobody else got near them in terms of consistency and assuredness of delivering the output of two, if not three, world class players across season after season. On top of that, they are commercial forces who make money for their clubs off the pitch just by association.

Even the last contract Ronaldo got, how much do you think Juventus were going to have to pay for a recent 4-time CL winner and highest scorer in the competition's history? They paid the premium for the competitions most prominent figurehead. Their failing was then dumping him in a sub par team with negative tactics and far less support than a goal machine of his standing should have got - he delivered in the CL as always for them even as they got knocked out, but there's only so much that can be done if others aren't pulling their weight.

Two players who are amongst the greatest who ever played the game are not the problem with football wages, particularly so in a time when run-of-the-mill substitutes at top clubs are earning north of £50k a week sitting on benches across top divisions.

 

[Nou_Camp99]

Bale is the only outlier there.

Ronaldo and Messi have been worth every penny of their wage for their entire careers and there is no parity with them because nobody else got near them in terms of consistency and assuredness of delivering the output of two, if not three, world class players across season after season. On top of that, they are commercial forces who make money for their clubs off the pitch just by association.

Even the last contract Ronaldo got, how much do you think Juventus were going to have to pay for a recent 4-time CL winner and highest scorer in the competition's history? They paid the premium for the competitions most prominent figurehead. Their failing was then dumping him in a sub par team with negative tactics and far less support than a goal machine of his standing should have got - he delivered in the CL as always for them even as they got knocked out, but there's only so much that can be done if others aren't pulling their weight.

Two players who are amongst the greatest who ever played the game are not the problem with football wages, particularly so in a time when run-of-the-mill substitutes at top clubs are earning north of £50k a week sitting on benches across top divisions.

He's been very good for Juve and they apparently want rid so maybe it's not made the most economic sense at all.

Barca are also in a financial hole because as Messi's wage keeps going up everyone else wants a raise too. They have the highest wage bill in Europe.

 

[Fortitude]

He's been very good for Juve and they apparently want rid so maybe it's not made the most economic sense at all.

Barca are also in a financial hole because as Messi's wage keeps going up everyone else wants a raise too. They have the highest wage bill in Europe.

Juve messed up by not having a plan in place - getting themselves a superstar who wanted to move and then not supplementing him at CL level - despite it being the reason they bought him - which led to an inevitable conclusion, where, even then, he was the only one who looked like he could turn the game (plus scoring two goals in it); the outlay for him is massive and you need a return for it unless you're getting him in to elevate the status of your club as a whole, which comes as standard. Even now, if Juventus do shift him, the next club taking on his wage etc. need to have their shit in order otherwise it's quite pointless to be taking him on despite him still being comfortably one of the most prolific players on the planet.

Messi is the least of Barcelona's problems - his productivity would require two, and still possibly three, players of elite standing to replicate: an elite playmaker; an elite goalscorer and an elite wide winger as he's all of these things still, even in decline. Barca's wage bill is out of control because of how many dire signings the board have made that have utterly tanked over the last few years. No player on the planet is using Messi as a measuring stick for what they themselves should be earning - nobody at Barcelona has the brass balls to be demanding such and such because of what Messi earns. Their problems stem from terrible conflicts at board level.

If a club was guaranteed the level of productivity these two have put forth over their careers they'd pony up the cash in advance and work around the problem trimming some of those ridiculous high earners who barely even play, or at least are not worth the wage they pick up every week. Ronaldo has been about as close to a sure thing as you can get in football on and off the pitch in terms of delivering what he's in teams to do - Messi hasn't moved so he's a different story here. Ronaldo goes from club to club maintaining a standard that rightly comes at the highest premium. After him, I think the next highest profile star who has done the same is Ibrahimovic, obviously on a lesser scale, but still being worth what you pay for his services.

 

[VivaObertan]

I'd be very reluctant to be honest. He was always a hog but watching Juve this season he just seems to the worlds best goalhanger. Basically if there's a goal in it for him, he's on it. If not, he seems to amble around letting others get on with the game. He was never particularly defensive, even in his United days, but he was very involved in general play and would work hard in all the attacking phases. Now he really looks like his own goal tally is about all that matters to him.

If I was to highlight two areas Id like to see us improve on this season, it would be our coordinated pressing and being better in attacking possession. I think we'd go backwards on both with Ronaldo in the team. I dont doubt he'd score plenty of goals, but I think he'd arrest our progress in important areas and we'd go backwards overall.

I'm torn to the idea of CR7 back at United but I don't think i agree with your first paragraph. I've probably watched Juve 5-6 times this season and Ronaldo seems to be more involved in the build-up and creation of goals than he was at Madrid, which I guess highlights how poor that Juve team are.

At united you're right that it detracts from what we're trying to do but as a pure #9 I'd back him to score 40 goals in his first season.

 

[Nou_Camp99]

Juve messed up by not having a plan in place - getting themselves a superstar who wanted to move and then not supplementing him at CL level - despite it being the reason they bought him - which led to an inevitable conclusion, where, even then, he was the only one who looked like he could turn the game (plus scoring two goals in it); the outlay for him is massive and you need a return for it unless you're getting him in to elevate the status of your club as a whole, which comes as standard. Even now, if Juventus do shift him, the next club taking on his wage etc. need to have their shit in order otherwise it's quite pointless to be taking him on despite him still being comfortably one of the most prolific players on the planet.

Messi is the least of Barcelona's problems - his productivity would require two, and still possibly three, players of elite standing to replicate: an elite playmaker; an elite goalscorer and an elite wide winger as he's all of these things still, even in decline. Barca's wage bill is out of control because of how many dire signings the board have made that have utterly tanked over the last few years. No player on the planet is using Messi as a measuring stick for what they themselves should be earning - nobody at Barcelona has the brass balls to be demanding such and such because of what Messi earns. Their problems stem from terrible conflicts at board level.

If a club was guaranteed the level of productivity these two have put forth over their careers they'd pony up the cash in advance and work around the problem trimming some of those ridiculous high earners who barely even play, or at least are not worth the wage they pick up every week. Ronaldo has been about as close to a sure thing as you can get in football on and off the pitch in terms of delivering what he's in teams to do - Messi hasn't moved so he's a different story here. Ronaldo goes from club to club maintaining a standard that rightly comes at the highest premium. After him, I think the next highest profile star who has done the same is Ibrahimovic, obviously on a lesser scale, but still being worth what you pay for his services.

Not quite true that though is it? Never mentioned they would asking for parity with Messi as that would be insane I agree. But when he's earning 3 times what other first 11 players are earning there starts to be cracks in the squad. Messi is incredible. A genius. But paying somebody that amount, however good he is, comes with a price. All your other players want their pay raised and that's what it looks like has happened. Their wage bill is obscene.

 

[Flanders Devil]

Don’t think it would happen. But would absolutely LOVE for it to happen!!

 

[Hernandez - BFA]

Football is in real danger of imploding.

Bale is on 600k a week and not making the match day sqaud some games.

Ronaldo is apparently on even more than that and have seen it said he's on as much as 800k a week. No wonder they want him gone if that's what he's earning. Crazy if true.

And Messi is apparently on even more still and that's bringing up everyone else's wages up so much at Barca that it's killing them financially.

I don't care how good someone is. Nobody is worth anything like 600k a week nevermind nearly 1m. Football wages have always been mental but right now I think they are beyond that.

American Footballer Patrick Mahomes is on ~800,000 a week and he only plays 20 games a year or so.

Ronaldo and Messi “deserve” to be in the higher bracket because they are the greatest.

Saying that, Juve should have made some calculations when signing him to be sure that they’d be happy to pay this amount on a season by season basis.

 

[Paxi]

Juve messed up by not having a plan in place - getting themselves a superstar who wanted to move and then not supplementing him at CL level - despite it being the reason they bought him - which led to an inevitable conclusion, where, even then, he was the only one who looked like he could turn the game (plus scoring two goals in it); the outlay for him is massive and you need a return for it unless you're getting him in to elevate the status of your club as a whole, which comes as standard. Even now, if Juventus do shift him, the next club taking on his wage etc. need to have their shit in order otherwise it's quite pointless to be taking him on despite him still being comfortably one of the most prolific players on the planet.

Messi is the least of Barcelona's problems - his productivity would require two, and still possibly three, players of elite standing to replicate: an elite playmaker; an elite goalscorer and an elite wide winger as he's all of these things still, even in decline. Barca's wage bill is out of control because of how many dire signings the board have made that have utterly tanked over the last few years. No player on the planet is using Messi as a measuring stick for what they themselves should be earning - nobody at Barcelona has the brass balls to be demanding such and such because of what Messi earns. Their problems stem from terrible conflicts at board level.

If a club was guaranteed the level of productivity these two have put forth over their careers they'd pony up the cash in advance and work around the problem trimming some of those ridiculous high earners who barely even play, or at least are not worth the wage they pick up every week. Ronaldo has been about as close to a sure thing as you can get in football on and off the pitch in terms of delivering what he's in teams to do - Messi hasn't moved so he's a different story here. Ronaldo goes from club to club maintaining a standard that rightly comes at the highest premium. After him, I think the next highest profile star who has done the same is Ibrahimovic, obviously on a lesser scale, but still being worth what you pay for his services.

Good post this.

 

[Fortitude]

Not quite true that though is it? Never mentioned they would asking for parity with Messi as that would be insane I agree. But when he's earning 3 times what other first 11 players are earning there starts to be cracks in the squad. Messi is incredible. A genius. But paying somebody that amount, however good he is, comes with a price. All your other players want their pay raised and that's what it looks like has happened. Their wage bill is obscene.

You have to be realistic about this: nobody uses Messi as a yardstick for their own wages! What do you think their agent opens with that doesn't sound risible from the off? Messi is considered top 3 of literal all-time as a minimum. His performances for the club justify what they pay him.

Other players in the squad will use the remainder of the squad as their own barometer of what is and is not just. Players like Griezmann, De Jong, Dembelele and so forth came on high wages based on what their performance level and/or potential was assessed at with absolutely no attachment to Messi or his earnings. I mean, why do you think there'd even be a link? In one corner, a player ranked with Pelé and Maradona; in the other, two relative upstarts who have achieved nothing and a World Cup winner who was the superstar of the team he was bought from. The latter comes with a premium that should be pretty obvious, whilst the former are simply products of a changing market that pays a fortune for potential world beaters - Juventus literally did the same with De Ligt.

Barcelona's woes have arisen because their brand of prospecting has been disastrous not because of some link to one of the few players on the planet who delivers in line with the contract he's on.

Don't mean to sidetrack the thread so I'll not make another lengthy post on this, but I do think it's important to recognise these two are right on the money that they are paid for both on and off-feld contribution, both of which have been massive and without fail.

 

[harms]

Even if we were to go for him, we'd need to rebuild the whole side around him. Juve had made this mistake – they signed him without building a good side around him (something that Ancelotti and Zidane did masterfully). Alongside Ronaldo we'd need a new left back and probably a new midfielder as well, who is going to cover the left wing... and then I'm not sure how that fits with Pogba & Bruno, as they need a different kind of a partner. This version of Cristiano still guarantees you goals, but he doesn't drag you to titles anymore – hence why we haven't seen any real progression in Juve's league standings (if anything, they have been less impressive with him), and they failed to do anything of note in CL, even though Ronaldo had scored a lot of goals in play-offs. I think he had scored all of Juve's goals in play-offs in the past 2 seasons, actually, which is absurd.

And while Sancho can be moved around and even benched in some games, Ronaldo will require to be a starter always in a certain position, so we'll have the other 3 always competing for 2 other spots. With Sancho coming in, you'd have 4 attackers for 3 spots (and even an option of playing Sancho in Bruno's place).

 

[Raoul]

Would take Martial or Rashford spot, so No.

They'd probably benefit by playing alongside one of the all time greats - both in terms of technique, but also in training. He also tends to make all those around him better so there's really no downside.

 

[Paxi]

Even if we were to go for him, we'd need to rebuild the whole side around him. Juve had made this mistake – they signed him without building a good side around him (something that Ancelotti and Zidane did masterfully). Alongside Ronaldo we'd need a new left back and probably a new midfielder as well, who is going to cover the left wing... and then I'm not sure how that fits with Pogba & Bruno, as they need a different kind of a partner. This version of Cristiano still guarantees you goals, but he doesn't drag you to titles anymore – hence why we haven't seen any real progression in Juve's league standings (if anything, they have been less impressive with him), and they failed to do anything of note in CL, even though Ronaldo had scored a lot of goals in play-offs. I think he had scored all of Juve's goals in play-offs in the past 2 seasons, actually, which is absurd.

And while Sancho can be moved around and even benched in some games, Ronaldo will require to be a starter always in a certain position, so we'll have the other 3 always competing for 2 other spots. With Sancho coming in, you'd have 4 attackers for 3 spots (and even an option of playing Sancho in Bruno's place).

I think that can be put down to Sarri, no? We’d definitely need to accommodate him properly though in order for him to hang in goals at the rate that he’s banging them in.

 

[harms]

I think that can be put down to Sarri, no? We’d definitely need to accommodate him properly though in order for him to hang in goals at the rate that he’s banging them in.

It's both. Sarri is a system manager, and a very rigid at that, so a superstar player who doesn't fit into his way of playing is a big issue. You have your Ancelotti's and Zidane's who change their way of playing based on the personnel that is available to them; you have great system managers like Klopp who have their vision but can adapt it depending on their squad. Sarri is neither. But then you can turn it around on Cristiano – he isn't able to adjust to manager's ideas, to work off the ball and move the way Sarri wants him to etc.

So in the end you have a situation when Sarri and Cristiano just don't work together (at least as well as they should), because both of them don't feel the need to, or simple aren't able to change to make this partnership work better. Who is to blame here? Sarri is a more likely option, since their standing in the game is incomparable, one is an all-time great and another is a decent manager with almost no trophies to his name (I think before Juve he had only won Europa League with Chelsea?). But the issue lies with both of them.

Actually, the biggest culprit here is Juve's management, who had not seen this (quite obvious) potential clash and decided to proceed forward without doing anything about Sarri, Cristiano or their ageing and regressing squad.

 

[Nou_Camp99]

Yeah this Ronaldo dream needs to die. He's never coming back. He's done what he wanted to with us. He won the lot and there's no way we are paying him those silly wages.

 

[Paxi]

It's both. Sarri is a system manager, and a very rigid at that, so a superstar player who doesn't fit into his way of playing is a big issue. You have your Ancelotti's and Zidane's who change their way of playing based on the personnel that is available to them; you have great system managers like Klopp who have their vision but can adapt it depending on their squad. Sarri is neither. But then you can turn it around on Cristiano – he isn't able to adjust to manager's ideas, to work off the ball and move the way Sarri wants him to etc.

So in the end you have a situation when Sarri and Cristiano just don't work together (at least as well as they should), because both of them don't feel the need to, or simple aren't able to change to make this partnership work better. Who is to blame here? Sarri is a more likely option, since their standing in the game is incomparable, one is an all-time great and another is a decent manager with almost no trophies to his name (I think before Juve he had only won Europa League with Chelsea?). But the issue lies with both of them.

Actually, the biggest culprit here is Juve's management, who had not seen this (quite obvious) potential clash and decided to proceed forward without doing anything about Sarri, Cristiano or their ageing and regressing squad.

Yeah that makes sense to be honest. And it’s very true about Juve’s board not seeing that it was always destined to fail, that relationship.

How long do you think he can keep going for? Say at 25+ goals a season. I reckon he can play in the top leagues until he’s 40. Of course he’s slowing down physically but to me he still looks very fit. I don’t know any 35 year olds that have the ability to score headers like he scored against Sampdoria last season.

 

[harms]

He also tends to make all those around him better so there's really no downside.

Does he? Who would be a recent example? Genuine question, I'm open to suggestions. Higuain doesn't look good, but that's mostly down to his attitude and weight issues. Dybala had massively struggled when Cristiano came in and almost got sold – he has been really good this season, but I wouldn't say that it was due to Ronaldo (more like in spite of him). Bale didn't get any better and actually regressed. Benzema had the best season of his career just now when Cristiano had left. I won't count Kaka as he was destroyed by injuries. Rooney also took another step in his development after Ronaldo left us.

Cristiano is a huge boost for any creative players though, I'll give you that. Bruno's and Pogba's numbers would receive a huge boost with Cristiano making his trademark off-the-ball runs. And I'm sure that his attitude in training is something that would impress young/young-ish players.

 

[Siorac]

He’d score more and be more of a threat than Ighalo.
Age didn’t stop ibra from scoring.
Not saying he’d play every single game either
Could you imagine choosing a different front 3 from Rashford-Martial-greenwood-Ronaldo
Not to even mention the learnings they’d get from training with him

And his goals didn't get us any higher than 6th in the league. We actually achieved better results before and after him.

 

[Zehner]

It's both. Sarri is a system manager, and a very rigid at that, so a superstar player who doesn't fit into his way of playing is a big issue. You have your Ancelotti's and Zidane's who change their way of playing based on the personnel that is available to them; you have great system managers like Klopp who have their vision but can adapt it depending on their squad. Sarri is neither. But then you can turn it around on Cristiano – he isn't able to adjust to manager's ideas, to work off the ball and move the way Sarri wants him to etc.

So in the end you have a situation when Sarri and Cristiano just don't work together (at least as well as they should), because both of them don't feel the need to, or simple aren't able to change to make this partnership work better. Who is to blame here? Sarri is a more likely option, since their standing in the game is incomparable, one is an all-time great and another is a decent manager with almost no trophies to his name (I think before Juve he had only won Europa League with Chelsea?). But the issue lies with both of them.

Actually, the biggest culprit here is Juve's management, who had not seen this (quite obvious) potential clash and decided to proceed forward without doing anything about Sarri, Cristiano or their ageing and regressing squad.

To be fair, the image of Cristiano being the target player in a working Sarriball system is really exciting and I can fully understand why they gave it a try. Napoli played some amazing football and given that was done with players like Higuain who is worse than CR7 in every aspect of football, it wasn't all that improbable they may work out. Unfortunately it didn't and now they both wasted one of Cristiano's remaining years and burned through a manager that could've given them a new identity and lifted them to the next level.

 

[harms]

How long do you think he can keep going for? Say at 25+ goals a season. I reckon he can play in the top leagues until he’s 40. Of course he’s slowing down physically but to me he still looks very fit. I don’t know any 35 year olds that have the ability to score headers like he scored against Sampdoria last season.

It wouldn't surprise me if he'd continue to play at the highest level until he's 40. If 38 years old Zlatan can score roughly 1 in 2 in Serie A (even better, actually, 10 in 18), I see no reason for Cristiano not to – he's even more dedicated and talented than the Swede. It all depends on his will – if he would want to continue, he will, and he'll probably keep up producing 20-25 goals per season, especially with VAR significantly boosting penalty numbers in today's football.

I think this can be the last big challenge of his career – to last longer at the top level than Messi does, despite the age difference. It's usually fans and not players who care about this sort of stuff, but this is not the case with Cristiano.

 

[Raoul]

Does he? Who would be a recent example? Genuine question, I'm open to suggestions. Higuain doesn't look good, but that's mostly down to his attitude and weight issues. Dybala had massively struggled when Cristiano came in and almost got sold – he has been really good this season, but I wouldn't say that it was due to Ronaldo (more like in spite of him). Bale didn't get any better and actually regressed. Benzema had the best season of his career just now when Cristiano had left. I won't count Kaka as he was destroyed by injuries. Rooney also took another step in his development after Ronaldo left us.

Cristiano is a huge boost for any creative players though, I'll give you that. Bruno's and Pogba's numbers would receive a huge boost with Cristiano making his trademark off-the-ball runs. And I'm sure that his attitude in training is something that would impress young/young-ish players.

I'd say his entire career from 2006 onwards has been an example of this. He doesn't make every player on the squad better (its still down to individual players to work at doing so), but with the possible exception of one or two years, his presence has consistently made squads he has been apart of punch well above their collective weights. I can't imagine Pogba, Bruno, Rashford, Martial, Greenwood et al...not benefiting tremendously in this regard.

 

[Fortitude]

Yeah that makes sense to be honest. And it’s very true about Juve’s board not seeing that it was always destined to fail, that relationship.

How long do you think he can keep going for? Say at 25+ goals a season. I reckon he can play in the top leagues until he’s 40. Of course he’s slowing down physically but to me he still looks very fit. I don’t know any 35 year olds that have the ability to score headers like he scored against Sampdoria last season.

An interesting thing when people assess Ronaldo is only focusing on physical decline when, even if he were to be in line with others, his movement and anticipation in the box is truly all-time great standard.

As a goalscorer he'll last as long as his appetite remains, but what he'll need as he declines is better and better service and there's less likely to be ridiculous goals out of nothing.

Injuries permitting, he's got some way to go before he's no longer in the conversation as a league top scorer, but paying a 38+ yr old poacher the kind of money he'll be on, can't see many doing that. Think he's got one top league contract in him before he becomes a player who clubs won't justify wages for in big 4 leagues. Still think he'll put up top percentile numbers, though.

Can't see him doing the nomadic Ibrahimovic 1 and 2 yr contract thing at 38+ even if he's in demand. Wonder if he'll even lower himself to going off to China or the US or just call it a day.

 

[Fortitude]

They'd probably benefit by playing alongside one of the all time greats - both in terms of technique, but also in training. He also tends to make all those around him better so there's really no downside.

He'd be an absolute disaster for both, I reckon.

Martial loses the position he most covets and Rashford, if he's even a starter, utterly curtailed because all those things he loves to do, particularly blasting shots from distance, Ronaldo is far better than him at and every wasted shot would be a reason to chastise for not passing the ball to Ronaldo.

Think they'd gain loads in training, but in terms of development in actual games in the positions they've carved out, Ronaldo is about the worst signing we could make.

 

[Raoul]

But would the team player better, score more goals, increase chances of winning big trophies and in the process gain infectious confidence that would seep into all squad members, fans et al ? I'd say yes.

 

[It's B Rubble]

What if Ronaldo and Messi both went to PSG? They’re a bottomless pit of money, FFP is just a theory and they’d surely lose in extra time to Sevilla in the quarterfinals of the UCL. In all seriousness, I’m all for Ronaldo coming back and teaching our forwards the way of the gods.

 

[Siorac]

I'd say his entire career from 2006 onwards has been an example of this. He doesn't make every player on the squad better (its still down to individual players to work at doing so), but with the possible exception of one or two years, his presence has consistently made squads he has been apart of punch well above their collective weights. I can't imagine Pogba, Bruno, Rashford, Martial, Greenwood et al...not benefiting tremendously in this regard.

From 2006 onwards he's only been part of excellent squads. The collective weight of the Real Madrid squads he played for was pretty fecking high - it's not like he dragged a bunch of average players to CL titles. He was the best player in absolutely star-studded squads, where most of his teammates were clearly brilliant players with or without him.

 

[Siorac]

But would the team player better, score more goals, increase chances of winning big trophies and in the process gain infectious confidence that would seep into all squad members, fans et al ? I'd say yes.

Didn't happen at Juve. No guarantee it would happen here.

 

[harms]

I'd say his entire career from 2006 onwards has been an example of this. He doesn't make every player on the squad better (its still down to individual players to work at doing so), but with the possible exception of one or two years, his presence has consistently made squads he has been apart of punch well above their collective weights. I can't imagine Pogba, Bruno, Rashford, Martial, Greenwood et al...not benefiting tremendously in this regard.

Interesting.

I wouldn't attribute it to him personally – I doubt that he had contributed much to our defensive improvement, with Vidić and Evra finding their feet next to Rio and van der Sar; Scholes' resurgence had more to do with his eyesight. I'd give you Rooney, I guess, but only to some extent – his progression was, of course, influenced by having Ronaldo next to him, but it was a natural progression of a world-class talent and it continued even when Cristiano had left us for Madrid.

In Madrid, Perez was on a mission – and signing Cristiano was one of the first steps of his plan, but it was not a catalyst for it. They had consistently spent top money to sign the best available talent, which had allowed them to progress and compete for all of the major trophies. When you sign the likes of Kroos, Modrić, Di Maria, Benzema, Varane etc. (and tons of expensive talent that didn't exactly work out), you're bound to reach your goal at some point – especially since those signings were made with a careful consideration of Cristiano's in-game preferences.

When you talk about a player who elevates everyone around him, I think of Cantona. Cristiano, for me, didn't have that impact on neither United nor Madrid (nor Juve for that matter). He was the main player in all of their winning campaigns and an unquestionably the best player in his team for years, but I wouldn't say that he had elevated players around him on a level they weren't able to reach before him. Aside from, maybe, the creative players who directly benefitted from his ridiculous goalscoring instincts.

That said, I'm sure that his presence and individual example will inspire all the young guys to be more wary of their diet, training etc. and young forwards will learn a lot just by watching him train. But to say that he was always a player who elevated his teams (by influencing his teammates and not by his individual performances)? I wouldn't say that – at least not by an all-time great standard.

 

[Raoul]

From 2006 onwards he's only been part of excellent squads. The collective weight of the Real Madrid squads he played for was pretty fecking high - it's not like he dragged a bunch of average players to CL titles. He was the best player in absolutely star-studded squads, where most of his teammates were clearly brilliant players with or without him.

Yes and players like Pogba, Bruno, Rashford, Martial et al aren't exactly scrubs either. Ronaldo's impact at Madrid was pretty evident given that they were in a barren spell when he arrived and wound up with 4 CLs by the time he left - a vast majority of which were won off of Ronnie's work.

 

[Fortitude]

But would the team player better, score more goals, increase chances of winning big trophies and in the process gain infectious confidence that would seep into all squad members, fans et al ? I'd say yes.

@Joga Bonito made the RVN comparison earlier and I think it's the same thing in some ways with Ronaldo. Any creative player, who is primarily an assisster should see their numbers go through the roof; anyone who expects to take shots in lieu of Ronaldo or not supply him as a first thought, is going to suffer.

Benzema basically spent a decade sacrificing his own game for the benefit of the team/Ronaldo. Don't know what he thinks about that or if he even minds, but since Ronaldo left, Benzema has been allowed to fully express himself and is coming out of his shell to be the player he was known as as a youngster. I think forwards make massive compromises to accommodate Ronaldo and some just don't want to be used in that way.

Honestly don't know what the net result would be. Ronaldo is a scoring phenomenon, so could do a Van Persie and elevate us to league winners by 'himself' it's not out of the question, imo. But the short term reward comes at the expense of two forwards we rate highly and I think most believe will be starters for us for at least another half decade - perhaps less for Martial if Greenwood truly surpasses him - so it's not something to take on without considering the consequences, at least.

 

[Siorac]

Yes and players like Pogba, Bruno, Rashford, Martial et al aren't exactly scrubs either. Ronaldo's impact at Madrid was pretty evident given that they were in a barren spell when he arrived and wound up with 4 CLs by the time he left - a vast majority of which were won off of Ronnie's work.

I'm not denying his impact at Madrid. I'm saying that Real Madrid didn't punch above their weight at all.

And at Juventus, he couldn't elevate the side at all. There's no guarantee he would at United.

 

[Raoul]

I'm not denying his impact at Madrid. I'm saying that Real Madrid didn't punch above their weight at all.

And at Juventus, he couldn't elevate the side at all. There's no guarantee he would at United.

There are no guarantees of anything - but given his track record of doing it for a vast majority of his career, I wouldn't use this as valid point to bet against him.

 

[golden_blunder]

And his goals didn't get us any higher than 6th in the league. We actually achieved better results before and after him.

But that takes into account lots of other factors

All I’m saying is that top drawer players like Ronaldo will still score goals, his age is not a hindrance for probably another 2 years

 

[Siorac]

But that takes into account lots of other factors

All I’m saying is that top drawer players like Ronaldo will still score goals, his age is not a hindrance for probably another 2 years

You also said we'd win the league with him which is far from certain. He scored as many goals from open play as Martial last season so there's a chance we wouldn't improve much or at all as a team with him. Juventus certainly haven't become a better team since signing him.

 

[Denis' cuff]

Does he? Who would be a recent example? Genuine question, I'm open to suggestions. Higuain doesn't look good, but that's mostly down to his attitude and weight issues. Dybala had massively struggled when Cristiano came in and almost got sold – he has been really good this season, but I wouldn't say that it was due to Ronaldo (more like in spite of him). Bale didn't get any better and actually regressed. Benzema had the best season of his career just now when Cristiano had left. I won't count Kaka as he was destroyed by injuries. Rooney also took another step in his development after Ronaldo left us.

Cristiano is a huge boost for any creative players though, I'll give you that. Bruno's and Pogba's numbers would receive a huge boost with Cristiano making his trademark off-the-ball runs. And I'm sure that his attitude in training is something that would impress young/young-ish players.

Basically, other players sacrifice their game for Ronaldo. No clearer example than Rooney.

Toppest strikers don’t guarantee titles. Ruud was as good, if not better than almost anyone in Uniteds history, yet we had our leanest spell under Fergie whilst he was here - pre-Glazers, of course.

 

[golden_blunder]

You also said we'd win the league with him which is far from certain. He scored as many goals from open play as Martial last season so there's a chance we wouldn't improve much or at all as a team with him. Juventus certainly haven't become a better team since signing him.

I’m coming from that he’s a better option than ighalo. Being able to choose a front 3 out of ronaldo, Rashford, martial, greenwood.
He’s one of the best goal scorers of all time. No disrespect to ighalo.
The others would learn from him, including dedication to keeping themselves fit

 

[TrustInOle]

Get it done WoodJudge!

 

[Ishdalar]

But that takes into account lots of other factors

All I’m saying is that top drawer players like Ronaldo will still score goals, his age is not a hindrance for probably another 2 years

His age is a hindrance, for starters you have a player that won't track back or pressure in the pitch if you want to use it close to his full potential, then, even if he's absurdly fast, he's not that fast nor explosive compared to athletic players on their 20's, and then there's the problem of limiting his minutes, if you have a squad that has shown capable of reaching 100 points like Real Madrid or Juve had, then you can afford to make him coast for periods of the season and to miss 3 or 4 away games with the title clinched, but United are not close to being able to win a league while rotating and with 4 games to spare against City and Liverpool.

There's a lot of absurd hyping with players like Ronaldo and Messi lately, like they've barely noticed aging or that they even became better at the game and that's absurd, none of those two are even close to the level they had 8 years ago, and the gap will only get wider until someday people will point out the obvious, they won't be worth their colossal wages, it can happen tomorrow, in one year or in three, but that's impending doom looming over your team.

 

[Paxi]

His age is a hindrance, for starters you have a player that won't track back or pressure in the pitch if you want to use it close to his full potential, then, even if he's absurdly fast, he's not that fast nor explosive compared to athletic players on their 20's, and then there's the problem of limiting his minutes, if you have a squad that has shown capable of reaching 100 points like Real Madrid or Juve had, then you can afford to make him coast for periods of the season and to miss 3 or 4 away games with the title clinched, but United are not close to being able to win a league while rotating and with 4 games to spare against City and Liverpool.

There's a lot of absurd hyping with players like Ronaldo and Messi lately, like they've barely noticed aging or that they even became better at the game and that's absurd, none of those two are even close to the level they had 8 years ago, and the gap will only get wider until someday people will point out the obvious, they won't be worth their colossal wages, it can happen tomorrow, in one year or in three, but that's impending doom looming over your team.

That’s absurd. Name some players who have Ronaldo’s physical attributes at his height and weight in any age bracket in any sport. Also Ronnie never tracked back.

 

[Ish]

Juve messed up by not having a plan in place - getting themselves a superstar who wanted to move and then not supplementing him at CL level - despite it being the reason they bought him - which led to an inevitable conclusion, where, even then, he was the only one who looked like he could turn the game (plus scoring two goals in it); the outlay for him is massive and you need a return for it unless you're getting him in to elevate the status of your club as a whole, which comes as standard. Even now, if Juventus do shift him, the next club taking on his wage etc. need to have their shit in order otherwise it's quite pointless to be taking him on despite him still being comfortably one of the most prolific players on the planet.

Messi is the least of Barcelona's problems - his productivity would require two, and still possibly three, players of elite standing to replicate: an elite playmaker; an elite goalscorer and an elite wide winger as he's all of these things still, even in decline. Barca's wage bill is out of control because of how many dire signings the board have made that have utterly tanked over the last few years. No player on the planet is using Messi as a measuring stick for what they themselves should be earning - nobody at Barcelona has the brass balls to be demanding such and such because of what Messi earns. Their problems stem from terrible conflicts at board level.

If a club was guaranteed the level of productivity these two have put forth over their careers they'd pony up the cash in advance and work around the problem trimming some of those ridiculous high earners who barely even play, or at least are not worth the wage they pick up every week. Ronaldo has been about as close to a sure thing as you can get in football on and off the pitch in terms of delivering what he's in teams to do - Messi hasn't moved so he's a different story here. Ronaldo goes from club to club maintaining a standard that rightly comes at the highest premium. After him, I think the next highest profile star who has done the same is Ibrahimovic, obviously on a lesser scale, but still being worth what you pay for his services.

Couple of great posts on the topic bud.

 

[Fortitude]

Couple of great posts on the topic bud.

Cheers.