Daniel Hale sentenced to 45 months in prison for drone leak
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
Hero
Sickening stuff that. Much respect to Hale for standing up and exposing it at the cost of his freedom.
That’s real bravery.
Definitely agree with you all - feel bad for him. Jailed for having a conscience and raising his voice about innocents being killed.
I guess that's 'Murica for you.
I guess that's 'Murica for you.
That written letter is worth a read. Sanity is bravery in an insane world.
https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/21015583-daniel-hale-letter-to-judge-liam-ogrady
^ the letter if anyone wants to read.
Absolute hero. Sacrificing his own freedom to bring to light injustice.
A 4 year sentence, my word America is a backwards country. What a man.
He was sentenced for leaking documents related to military workings, not the bit about exposing the human cost. Considering similar incidents he's lucky 45 months is all he got.
Oh okay that's fine then
They wanted him to go to jail for 9 years which would have been the longest sentence for a case like this. Which incidents are you referring too?
That letter is so gut wrenching. Hopefully even his colleagues acknowledge his personal sacrifice doing what he believes is right.
Expose war crimes, become an enemy of the state and jailed for unauthorized disclosure of national defense and intelligence information.
It truly is piss funny to see how absurd the world is.
It truly is piss funny to see how absurd the world is.
Guy is a hero for exposing the truth.
Snowden would've met the same fate times 10
What a stand up guy.
Two more quotes from the same article:
In delivering his judgement, O’Grady said that Hale was “not being prosecuted for speaking out about the drone program killing innocent people” and that he “could have been a whistleblower … without taking any of these documents.”
unauthorized disclosure of national defense and intelligence information and the theft of government property. In addition to documents related to how the government chooses its drone strike targets Hale was also linked to the release of a secret, though unclassified, rulebook detailing how the U.S. government places individuals in its sprawling system of watchlists.
Anybody who does those things can expect to see jail time, in any country.
Leaking classified documents very often ends up with a lengthy stay in a Supermax prison.
Land of the free.
Any examples? The article I read from Washington Post said the Justice Department wanted a 9 year sentence which would have been the longest sentence ever. Which seems to me a sentence that wouldn't have fit the crime given that they later conceded that no harm was actually done despite the Justice Department complaining that it put American lives at risk (which is ironic given that Drone Strikes have killed US Citizens). Seems to me reading between the lines they're pissed that war crimes comitted using Drones which they have hidden are now unhidden.
I don't think you really can be a whistleblower these days without having the evidence to support your claims. It seems pretty incredible to me that Trump gave the militiary and CIA access to conduct drone strikes outside of battlefield countries. Madness.
My initial gut reaction was to say "Well done sir".
But then I thought about it some more. About how he leaked classified documents. About how he may have put America's drone program at risk. About how America might have to completely rebuild how we use drones. About how this might hamper the US war effort.
After all this I need to change that initial reaction.
"Well done you fecking hero, well done"
But then I thought about it some more. About how he leaked classified documents. About how he may have put America's drone program at risk. About how America might have to completely rebuild how we use drones. About how this might hamper the US war effort.
After all this I need to change that initial reaction.
"Well done you fecking hero, well done"
whoever told you that is your enemy!
Freedom? Yeah right.
Good old rage against the machine, they were well ahead of their time.
Oh yeah, I'm sure he would have been a very successful whistleblower without having any documents to prove it. That always works great.
What does "secret but unclassified" mean? Isn't that an oxymoron?
I read that as meaning "not classified but also not publicly available"
Planning to whistleblow some big terrible military stuff tomorrow but I'll be a lawful citizen and won't leak documents - instead you just have to believe me guys.
The two most high profile examples of leaking classified information are Chelsea Manning (35 years) and Ed Snowden (current charges against him carry a 30 year sentence). Daniel Elsberg was facing 115 years for a very similar leak in relation to Vietnam but the prosecution fecked it up on technicalities. 3 and a bit years is pretty light in comparison.
It's definitely possible to leak information about targeting civilians without leaking the entire drone targeting and terrorism watchlist processes, which can legitimately cause problems for military operations.
I think they've got that wrong. Top Secret, Secret and Confidential are all considered classified in the US.
Think about the thousands of US military members who witnessed civilians getting slaughtered and didn't say a word.
How many of them are in prison?
How many of them are in prison?
Tough one. The whistle blowing is good but particpating in the drone strikes is bad.
and the doctors and nurses running the psyc ops, torturing detainees at places like Guantanemo and god knows where else....
suppose there has been enough written about how well functioning educated adults in a free society can be actively involved in grotesque behavior in the name of the state and protecting freedoms.
just read the letter, wow. and he's the one that ends up doing time.
irony is, theres nothing new there though, we all know about the vagueness of 'enemy combatants' and the aftermath of the first gulf war exposed how ridiculous the notion of precision 'surgical' strikes is. but everyone carries on, merciless killing continues, and the same people shed their crocodile tears at remembrance events and talk of the battle of good vs evil and our values....
irony is, theres nothing new there though, we all know about the vagueness of 'enemy combatants' and the aftermath of the first gulf war exposed how ridiculous the notion of precision 'surgical' strikes is. but everyone carries on, merciless killing continues, and the same people shed their crocodile tears at remembrance events and talk of the battle of good vs evil and our values....
Not even ahead of their time really, just as relevant as ever because some things never change.
Is it even a secret anymore? Those hellfire are going to kill their surroundings. It's not like they only bomb secret lairs.
Collateral damage has been an unfortunate, yet common outcome of many wars. That isn't new. It's stone cold murder and takes a different person(s) to carry out those 'orders'. The technicians and drone operators are "simply" following orders and it is highly traumatic when it's broken down into its simplest form.
However, I do have to agree with @11101 the fact that he stole the drone program playbook so to speak and disclosed it, compromised all individuals (and strategy) who touched the program.
However, I do have to agree with @11101 the fact that he stole the drone program playbook so to speak and disclosed it, compromised all individuals (and strategy) who touched the program.
Legend. They should name an award after him.
I think the blatant lying about it is pretty new. We have been told time and again that the drone strikes only target enemy combatants. No mention of children being guilty enough to be targeted.
Yeah the Germans tried that excuse, too. Everyone involved in the drone wars knows what they are doing and have drank the kool-aid. They are all guilty.
Sure he stole some documents and should pay the price but he hasn't compromised anyone's safety. The point is that the strategy is wrong and needed to be outed so it can be revised to reduce non-combatant deaths. In case you missed it, the US doesn't care about those lives and that is a big part of what's wrong here. Killing little girls with reaper drones and hellfire missiles doesn't make anyone safer, indeed it increases the risk of retalitory action against the US and its allies. The only people who benefit from that are those with ties to the military industrial complex who get richer from it.
Definitely worth a read... Fair play to him.
The end result of too much collateral damage is bad and the inefficiency of these strikes is shocking...but it's completely justified in the military industrial complex POV. That's a harsh and totally fecked up reality for normal folks like us to comprehend, but to those who make those decisions, the juice is worth the squeeze.
He stole highly classified and sensitive documents, which also provided clarity in the (lack of) efficiency of it which resulted in innocent murders, one too many. With all that public, he just increased the risk of retaliation against the United States, allies, eyes on the ground, etc even further. Military warfare, especially with the U.S., has always been tone-deaf, cold blooded, when it comes to collateral damage. That's the mindset of the military at the highest of ranks when it comes to killing people for the sake of security or whatever reasons.
Most of the world already knew that the strikes weren't as accurate as the US liked to portray them. We've had plenty of evidence over the years and logical people know what it leads to. It's the killings that lead to security risks not the release of these documents, always have and will continue to do so until the military industrial complex has its wings clipped and stops killing innocent people in the name of protecting America from terrorists all while ensuring there is a steady stream of people willing to attack them for killing innocent people.
The War on Terror is a genius invention as it allows the MIC to continue its R&D and money making activities without putting the US at serious risk of having to find new countries to declare war on.