Do we need a modern goalkeeper?

[Pogue Mahone]

I thought Henderson played well last night. But it’s becoming more and more obvious to me he has similar limitations to De Gea with the ball at his feet. The overhit pass in the final seconds was the most blatant red flag but there was an incident earlier in the second half which also caught my eye. VdB had made himself available in midfield with no opposition players near him. Henderson needed to zip a 30 yard pass along the ground, bisecting two West Ham players, (about 10 yards apart) en route. Not the easiest pass in the world but would have immediately put us on the front foot. Henderson didn’t fancy it and smashed the ball deep into their half instead. Which immediately ceded possession.

Ramsdale (who I don’t particularly rate, as it happens) pulled off a similar between the lines pass recently and Arsenal went up the other end on a dangerous counter-attack.

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I’m loving big Dave’s renaissance but he will never be the most comfortable in possession. Even on a good day when he’s pinging lofted passes out to the fullbacks you don’t see him zip passes into feet between the lines. It’s just not part of his game.

As an Ireland fan I’ve seen how comfortable Bazunu and Kelleher are on the ball and it pains me that Liverpool and City have proper, next generation, footballing goalkeepers on their books.

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Because that’s the next obvious step for football. Goalkeepers who have the same passing range and confidence on the ball as outfield players. I reckon it’s easier to teach a talented footballer to stop shots than it is to teach a talented shot-stopper to play football.

Should Manchester United be prioritising the identification and signing of a top class footballing goalkeeper?

 

[dinostar77]

We have two very good keepers. Keepers priority should be keeping the ball out of their net. Who cares about their involvement in buildup that's what the outfield players are for.

#oldskool

 

[EtH]

Short answer is yes. But we still rely on a few outfield players who aren’t exactly pinnacles of the modern footballer.

So until technique and possession-based football becomes the focus, the long answer is no. It’s not a priority anyway.

 

[gajender]

Yes that should be the next priority once we have sorted out our Midfield , it's just not the passing it's also the reluctance of De Gea to push high up the pitch and become additional passing option which sometimes breaks our momentum as well.

 

[Revan]

If De Gea is really back to his best, then no. Yes, he is nowhere as good as Alisson or Ederson with the ball at his feet, and yes, that is quite important. But as an overall package, a fully firing De Gea is better than either of them. At some stage, people were calling him the best in the world, despite that Neuer and Ter Stegen are very good with the ball, and arguably better than Alisson at other things. Oblak has often being called the best in the world, and he is as limited as De Gea in passing.

Saying that, if we decide to replace De Gea, I agree that we should look at a keeper who is very comfortable with the ball at his feet.

 

[Lynty]

No.

Its a trend and will pass.

 

[Massive Spanner]

We don't play or even attempt to play a modern style of football so what would be the point?

 

[crossy1686]

Anything that uses Ramsdale as an example is never going to catch on

 

[Lentwood]

Probably but this is what people mean when they talk about a "rebuild" isn't it.

Unlike City, we can't just have two massive windows and fix every problem at once.

So, do we need a GK who is more comfortable on the ball? Probably. But we also need a top CF who isn't older than me (32), two CMs and arguably an attacking RB.

On the list of priorities of things to fix, id say its not that high yet

 

[Siezard]

United already has 3 top keepers.

 

[Davie Moyes]

Yes, definitely. I'm also enjoying Dave's return to decent form however the next goalkeeper needs to be the keeper sweeper type. It just adds so much more to the control and possession teams can build up e.g. City and Liverpool. It's the way modern football is going and we need to keep up.

The exception would be unless the next keeper is a prime Oblak or Dave i.e. capable of monster saves - actually based on what I saw at the Euros I would take Donnarumma for his height and penalty saves.

 

[Red00012]

Using Ramsdale is a no no

 

[nistleloy]

We shouldn't have been in a position to require the 2nd choice keeper to hit a diagonal pass from the halfway line to start restart the attack in the 94th minute.

He did his job with 2 good saves minutes before.

 

[Nickelodeon]

Can't really ignore the coaching element there. What are the requirements of the manager from the keeper? In certain cases, our keeper can ask the team to push forward and accordingly pick the right pass. But we have the tendency to play a lot of unnecessary two yard passes which add little value and slows the game down.

Of late, De Gea's passing has improved. But we don't see any adventure in his playing style. Whether it is down to the coaching or the keepers is definitely debatable.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Probably but this is what people mean when they talk about a "rebuild" isn't it.

Unlike City, we can't just have two massive windows and fix every problem at once.

So, do we need a GK who is more comfortable on the ball? Probably. But we also need a top CF who isn't older than me (32), two CMs and arguably an attacking RB.

On the list of priorities of things to fix, id say its not that high yet

Despite our infuriating alleged preference for dealing with transfers sequentially we should be able to address a number of issues in parallel.

I’ve been a bit lax in watching our kids over the last couple of years. Do we have any young keepers who are top class in possession? If not, should signing one be a priority?

 

[groovyalbert]

No.

Its a trend and will pass.

Literally

 

[WI_Red]

No.

Its a trend and will pass.

Who is Trend (sounds French) and how much do you think he will cost?

 

[Lentwood]

Despite our infuriating alleged preference for dealing with transfers sequentially we should be able to address a number of issues in parallel.

I’ve been a bit lax in watching our kids over the last couple of years. Do we have any young keepers who are top class in possession? If not, should signing one be a priority?

I'm sure we can address a number of positions in parallel, but still, I think most posters agreed we needed almost 10 signings post-Jose to transform the squad. We have made good inroads but still work to be done.

Kovar has just been called up by the Czech Republic for the first time, can't say I ever watch more than the highlights of the u23 games though, so wouldn't know if he is any good.

On that note, we would be able to speed up the acquisition of new players if we were a bit more aggressive at selling players. If we decide Henderson isn't for us, let's take the £50m we could get. Likewise, if Kovar is showing potential but has no pathway to the first team, sell for £10-£15m and insert a reasonable buyback. United have been slow to use our Academy as a means to fund our transfer business, it's why we bring relatively few players in but our net spend is always horrendous

 

[arnie_ni]

If we don't sign midfielders to play those sorts or passes we definitely don't care if our keeper can't

 

[Bastian]

I think we should be looking at this. Really enjoying seeing Dave back to his old self, but my view is that Henderson is not good enough and we should sell him and get in another young keeper who can actually play.

In a similar discussion in the summer, someone on here mentioned a young English keeper based in the Netherlands. Can't remember the name, and the poster wasn't sure about their technical ability. Anyone know more about the kid? (father was a pro golfer is all I remember).

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Absolutely. Ideally it should be DDG plus a young ball playing GK who we groom to eventually take over.

 

[HTG]

Yes you do.

 

[Ace]

Speaking of limitations with the ball at our feet, do we need a "modern" midfielder? Doesn't make a lot of sense to complain about our goalkeepers' limited passing ability as we continue to trot Fred out on the pitch.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

In a similar discussion in the summer, someone on here mentioned a young English keeper based in the Netherlands. Can't remember the name, and the poster wasn't sure about their technical ability. Anyone know more about the kid? (father was a pro golfer is all I remember).

Charlie Setford. He's 17 and Dutch/English but seems to have pleged his future to England. Youngest keeper to appear for Jong Ajax and has been on the bench for the senior team. I've only seen him play once and he wasn't involved in the game much so I'm not sure what his skill set is, although you'd expect him to be a modern keeper if he's come through the system at Ajax.

 

[ThatsGreat]

Guessing thats the reason Arsenal bought Ramsdale, White. I'm old fashioned and like to see goalies, defenders that are good at what they do, but this new trend started by Pep seems to be copied by everyone. Will need another hipster manager to come and change things in a different direction.

 

[Bastian]

Charlie Setford. He's 17 and Dutch/English but seems to have pleged his future to England. Youngest keeper to appear for Jong Ajax and has been on the bench for the senior team. I've only seen him play once and he wasn't involved in the game much so I'm not sure what his skill set is, although you'd expect him to be a modern keeper if he's come through the system at Ajax.

That's the one, cheers. Can't find any footage of him unfortunately, but here's an interview that I'm rather enjoying


Edit: Ah...mentions Chelsea and Liverpool as dream clubs. Naughty!

 

[Brwned]

No.

Its a trend and will pass.

What similar footy trends can you think of that passed?

 

[Bebestation]

Is onana a modern one?

 

[Bastian]

Is onana a modern one?

Most definitely.

 

[shaky]

No we don't. I'd take a peak Schmeichel or De Gea ahead of any "modern" goalkeeper playing right now. Quality of the actual goalkeeping is far more important than any other factor.

 

[Flytan]

Henderson is bad at it but I think you guys are really underestimating De Gea, like he's not good at it, but he's also not abysmal at it either and is certainly something that seems to have improved in recent years.

Ideally the next GK has it, but I'd rather us improve on Midfield, RB, and manager first.

 

[Boavista]

Guessing thats the reason Arsenal bought Ramsdale, White. I'm old fashioned and like to see goalies, defenders that are good at what they do, but this new trend started by Pep seems to be copied by everyone. Will need another hipster manager to come and change things in a different direction.

There's no downside to goalkeepers having better passing ability than previously expected of them, so why would that change?

 

[caid]

Yeah, it'd help all right. Happy enough to settle for an in form De Gea in the mean time
It should definitely be one of the main considerations when we go into the transfer market, which should be on the list of positions that needs looking at just after midfield and right back. Struggling to play out from the back is a pretty common theme and every little helps. No one really worries much about what de gea is going to do with the ball, they dont even try to press him.

 

[Tiber]

We hope to win the title while playing the likes of Fred and Matic in central midfield and people find the time to worry about our goalkeepers passing skills?

 

[Big Ben Foster]

What happened to De Gea's passing ability anyway? When he was at Atletico he got the nickname "Van der Gea" because of how comfortable he was in possession.

 

[Idxomer]

For the next manager, definitely.

 

[Revan]

What happened to De Gea's passing ability anyway? When he was at Atletico he got the nickname "Van der Gea" because of how comfortable he was in possession.

He actually was quite good in his first couple of seasons, and also under LVG. I guess replacing his goalkeeper coach every season, and playing under three managers who are happy to concede possession did not help. Also, he does not look to be the type of player who always strive to improve his weak spots.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

What happened to De Gea's passing ability anyway? When he was at Atletico he got the nickname "Van der Gea" because of how comfortable he was in possession.

I think that was more about him being cool and calm in general rather than any great passing ability. I do remember when he started there were a lot of keepers still playing who were absolutely terrible with the ball at their feet, so he might have looked decent compared to them. The game’s moved on though.

 

[Hansi Fick]

If De Gea is really back to his best, then no. Yes, he is nowhere as good as Alisson or Ederson with the ball at his feet, and yes, that is quite important. But as an overall package, a fully firing De Gea is better than either of them. At some stage, people were calling him the best in the world, despite that Neuer and Ter Stegen are very good with the ball, and arguably better than Alisson at other things. Oblak has often being called the best in the world, and he is as limited as De Gea in passing.

Saying that, if we decide to replace De Gea, I agree that we should look at a keeper who is very comfortable with the ball at his feet.

'People' in this case meaning Manchester United fans and RedCafé posters. In reality De Gea, while being a world class shot stopper no doubt, was never the best goalkeeper in the world.

 

[Revan]

'People' in this case meaning Manchester United fans and RedCafé posters. In reality De Gea, while being a world class shot stopper no doubt, was never the best goalkeeper in the world.

He also was in FifPro XI which is historically biased towards the Spanish League. Nevertheless, he was absolutely the best keeper in the world in 17-18 (his best year, and Neuer being injured), and was easily top 3 (with Neuer and Oblak) the few years before that.