No, you are not, you are even worse than those.
Do you see the plan yet?
- Thread starter DVG7
- Start date
The injuries excuse. I can't wait for Pogba to come back. Hopefully there will be an improvement in our form against lesser teams.
You missed a key word in what Neville said, he said "counter" attack was our best defence, hence why we sat back and broke when we had the opportunity. Its also not unusual for teams to "be on the ropes" away at City so blaming Ole for the tactics is a little harsh imo.
LVG didn't play the same way as Ole but he certainly got results against the top 6. Jose was average though, only got 8 wins in 26 games and lost 10 of them. We won't talk about Moyes...
Nope. I think it was unlikely he was going to be sacked anyway and given these last two results he'll stay until the Summer and will be backed in January.So, and it's the third time this season I'm saying this, the next few games will definitelybe decisive in determining whether Ole has a future here.
Is it your opinion that what players the team has available doesn't matter?
Yep. He's beat probably the two biggest name managers in the world in the space of 4 days. Brilliant. I have a feeling we'll figure out how to beat lesser teams with more time and a few signings and I do think we can go on a run over the Xmas period which will hopefully see us up into 4th. Absolutely buzzing.
The one thing this team definitely can't do is play well in different ways. It's clear that we are a very good team and very hard to beat when we can sit back and counter, but other than that we're nowhere near close enough to where we need to be. I get that you're buzzing after the last two games, we all are, but you can't look at two games in isolation and just forget about all the others. If you take a step back and look at the past year it's quite obvious that we need more than just two players to get back to the top, and a lot more to be able to dominate every game.
No i think he's a key player but we should be able to cope with injuries to one or two big players. Chelsea have been without Kante for most of the season
Our squad haven’t been together long enough to make any certain determination about where they will end up. Even the players who have been at the club for a few years, they haven’t played together all that often. Martial and Rashford together is only really a recent development, as is McTominay and Fred. The rest of the squad are also getting used to one another too. There’s enough there for me to say we have to give this project time, irrespective of the bumps.
Realistically there hasn't been enough time at all. He needs more investment and better players.
His most creative player has missed almost all the season (Pogba) and he's relying heavily on counter attacking football. We need that bit of class to unlock stubborn defences and only more time, money and better players will bring that.
The chances of us signing a quality attacking player in Jan are slim, so were looking at the summer and next season realistically.
Yeah probably, but I meant beyond the summer.
You have to understand that they got someone to cover him while we got 3 midfields injured at the same time Matic, Pogba & McTominay. Imagine if two of Kante & Kovacic are injured, they would be left with Jorginho alone playing with whoever they got left probably make the same impact as Pereira.
And that’s Chelsea. What about Leicester city. Their form also has been good not only because quality they got but also their starting XI barely getting injured.
Well you kind of did make that determination when you said we were two players away from dominating every game, I just don't agree with that based on the fact that we have struggled so much for so long against every other team in the bottom half of the PL.
I hope you're right though and that the core of this team will be the one that takes us back to the top, I just need to see more from them (and Ole) over a longer period of time before I'm convinced. This week has been a massive step in the right direction though!
Jose's record vs top 6 was generally quite poor. LVG's was quite close to perfection. Ole is following a similar vain to LVG.
It's sad to see though that folks can't just enjoy a win anymore that they've to still be miserable b*astards and be condescending towards a brilliant win.
If he loses he's not good enough and if he wins its "not revolutionary".
The first real test
Not trying to be a buzzkill, but counterattacking against teams which actually want to come at you (hard) is the "easy" part. Imho the real task of the modern coach (at least for league play) is to create a system that reliably creates chances against organized defenses without giving up too much in return. And it's not like this just magically appears with time.
I think usually you see pretty early how a (good) coach is trying to accomplish that, his philosophy, even if the results aren't there from the start. Solskjaer has been in the job for about a year know and I couldn't really tell what his philosophy is.
I think usually you see pretty early how a (good) coach is trying to accomplish that, his philosophy, even if the results aren't there from the start. Solskjaer has been in the job for about a year know and I couldn't really tell what his philosophy is.
The plan has been obvious for months. It was obvious when he binned off the likes of Sanchez and Lukaku during the summer. Neville was right when he said it earlier that there were players at the club that didn’t want to be in the city. The ‘cultural reboot’ narrative might seem a little cheesy, but there’s certainly merit to it. At the very least, the players are following instructions. You don’t defend like we did today unless there is a tactical plan in place.
I’ve said it several times, but we need to ride this out and see where it takes us. If we can bring in some quality midfielders and a top notch winger then we will look markedly different.
I’ve said it several times, but we need to ride this out and see where it takes us. If we can bring in some quality midfielders and a top notch winger then we will look markedly different.
T
To be fair, Pep has been one dimensional his entire career...
If that's the easy part why don't we see more teams get 14/18 points from top 6 regularly? I'm sorry but anyone saying that is insane.
One could say it will be the first real test for Ole.
We’re still sloppy as hell and countering can only win against so many teams. Good news is that this squad still has fight in it. It needs to be complemented with more quality.
A key development here will be Martial and Rashford learning to move well when crosses come in to tap the ball home.
There’s no respect in what you are saying here. None whatsoever. I am sure many fans who don’t agree with your opinion love MUFC just as much as you do. There’s no need for this, specially after a day like today when we have just beaten City.
One of the greatest strengths our 1999 and 2008 teams had was counter attack - we just need a bit more solidity and guile through the middle and we'll be in good shape. McTomminay could be one of them but we need at least one more. Greenwood (and hopefully Gomes) are gems. Rashford is becoming real quality and I can see some CR7 in him in terms of professionalism, hunger, courage and talent - I really think he can become world class. I don't see how Pogba fits in this team though, he doesn't have the engine to be our false nine, someone like Firminho would actually be great. I personally want to see us go all out for Mbappe. We have the money and hopefully ambition and Real Madrid aren't in great shape right now so perhaps there's a chance. Him on the right with Rashford on the left and Martial in the centre would be absolutely devastating and we wouldn't have to worry about the lower teams then, we'd steam roller them. I also think Lingard at 10 is okay, as he makes good space for the others.
Cant we stop with this sh1te please. Youd swear we cant score a single goal against lower opposition. Have read this so many times on here today. We have scored 3 v Brighton and also Sheffield united and 2 against villa in last few matches, didn't win 2 of them due to injury to mctominay(yes we would have). Games earlier in season dont count so much as a new team needs time to gel. Also we were missing our striker for weeks. provided we can keep today's starting 11 fit we will be fine, but the problem is that our squad outside first 11 or 12 is very thin on quality.
I put it into quotations for a reason, I think it's a lot easier compared to actually creating a reliable positive approach, that doesn't mean it's so easy anyone can do it though. Especially since very few coaches have a squad of United's quality at their disposal.
So all we need to do is get worse?
I can just imagine that attack...Rasford, Martial, Mbappe, and (drumroll)...Lingard behind them.
Very good. Have to be careful though, after PSG we became shit. Hope the same thing doesn't happen again.
I’m not getting carried away. This has vibes of that mini run we had under Van Gaal, then it went to pot again.
The last two performances have been very good. I think it’s fair to lay off the manager for the moment.
The last two performances have been very good. I think it’s fair to lay off the manager for the moment.
My major concern is once again the manager won’t get backed the minute we need to make the next step.
I think we need a better ten than Lingarrd/Perrera/Mata. Perhaps try Pogba in there when he returns.
Or else buy Grealish or Maddison, although the latter will cost a fortune.
I understand, but this team has more than enough quality and been together under him for long enough to deal with it. It hasn't just been the top teams that have had a go at United to offer those counter-attacking chances, most of the smaller teams have as well, they're not really parking the bus against United. So the problem doesn't just lie with Pogba's absence or a lack of reinforcements; at least not to the degree it may seem. He has been here long enough to develop a style of play that should be able to deal with the lower-half of the table, and there's no excuse for how United have looked in most of those games.
Again, sometimes you need some kind of catalyst game to bring a new spark to the team, and I like Ole so I'd love to see it happen and have it be turned around but I can't blame anybody for reserving their judgement in spite of those latest results.
The abuse thrown at OGS has been disgraceful and based on nothing but ridiculous expectations from spoilt customers who lose their shit when not instrantly gratified.
Not really the behaviour you’d expect from a supporter.
That’s the difference between customers and supporters
No. This is not a big 6 mini league. Our play is too basic and simply not sophiscated enough to disorganize and pull apart a defence that leave no space in behind them and their keeper. That's why we're sitting behind the top 4 and far away from the title race. If we wants to compete seriously we need a manager that will provide us with a framework and structure beyond the basic counter attack that any manager can implement with fast players. Some of us even predicted before the match City are wide open and there to be attacked. Even Nuno beat them in the same way and I don't think anyone thinks he is now already suited to manage a top club that have completely different expectations with the same tactics, it doesn't work like that. Over 38 games you will get found out. You are just as likely to win a big match , same as you are likely to lose vs any small team and this instability is not OK for a top club.
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The abuse on Ole and the players has been shit. All the posts back and forth to defend him and the process has been shit.
That said, let’s be bigger than Bluemoon and RAWK. Everyone here want United to be successful. Everyone reacts different from each other.
Let us enjoy the moment, because I am pretty sure the ride will continue to be bumpy.
I don't think anyone who saw his Molde-side regularly would say that he set them up only to counterattack. We've clearly been playing this way because we're in the middle of a rebuild and short of quality in midfield, as well as we've had major injuries all over the pitch. Couple more decent transfer windows and we'll get somewhere.
And now they're without Abraham. Look what that has done to their results.
Ole’s first real test