In the second half to the left hand side of our box, when he went after a loose ball, he moved like a sloth. Genuinely think I’m quicker than him, and I’m a lot bloody older.
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
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It doesn’t.
Then he’s an idiot. Because if he watched Bruno and Pogba he’d realise the manager wants players in this positions to take chances and try to create something.
The same old tale, don't get played enough. When you get played, you are too scared too feck up. Back to the bench. Until he gets a run of games then I believe we won't see the best of him.
That's how I read him too, way too scared to put in a proper performance, making him look completely out of place.
Agree. This is not Jose. OGS likes risk takers.
Maybe van de Beek would have been a player under van Gaal's methodical style of football in a deeper role.
At the moment it is incredibly difficult to envisage how we might turn around his form in this particular team. Not a glimmer to be found. We are not a possession orientated team, we do not play well when we're playing very deliberately which is exactly what VDB tries to do every time he gets the ball.
At the moment it's a case of he slows us down when he does something "good" and that is the best we can hope for, the alternative is he gets pushed off the ball or completely disappears.
I don't even know what to suggest with him as there is nothing to cling onto that might suggest we can find a position or role he'll excel in. We are pretty much at the stage of praying he shows something else next season and has some kind of mental shift, with no real expectation that it is likely. That or take a massive hit on the guy.
At the moment it is incredibly difficult to envisage how we might turn around his form in this particular team. Not a glimmer to be found. We are not a possession orientated team, we do not play well when we're playing very deliberately which is exactly what VDB tries to do every time he gets the ball.
At the moment it's a case of he slows us down when he does something "good" and that is the best we can hope for, the alternative is he gets pushed off the ball or completely disappears.
I don't even know what to suggest with him as there is nothing to cling onto that might suggest we can find a position or role he'll excel in. We are pretty much at the stage of praying he shows something else next season and has some kind of mental shift, with no real expectation that it is likely. That or take a massive hit on the guy.
I am not saying he is right. I am saying that is what he probably feels which I can honestly understand. We need a right winger, we need a holding midfielder and a centre forward. Why did we spend 40 million on an attacking midfielder when we already have one of the best in Europe?
That might be partially his fault for not seeing this and signing somewhere else but it is probably more our fault. I just have sympathy for him to be honest.
I still don't understand why he's not tried in a deeper midfield role. He'll find forward passes a lot easier from this position and his safe ball retention would make a lot more sense in this role. He'd also see more of the ball and the more involvement he has will grow his confidence. His best game against Instanbul came in the double pivot also but hasn't had a look in since.
Pogba's been playing well in his attacking role, instead of keeping him there and playing VDB alongside Fred, we decided to move Pogba back to the double pivot and play VDB out of position and they were both shit. It really is bizarre.
Pogba's been playing well in his attacking role, instead of keeping him there and playing VDB alongside Fred, we decided to move Pogba back to the double pivot and play VDB out of position and they were both shit. It really is bizarre.
2 of the best in Europe.
He needed to be given a chance in a deeper midfield role, if he can't shine there either then it's pointless keeping him. But at least give it a try before we flog him.
But as somebody that played at a higher level than Jose, he must understand the psychological battle for some players? @shabz is right in what he's said above. It's a genuine issue with some players, they will only get their confidence through regular game time (not meaning play every game) and when they start to feel like they've settled in. Not playing regularly will only compound their mental issues, whether they admit it or not, because the pressure and doubt in their head will grow.
It was just a disaster of a signing in all honesty. Fergie was thorough in his research into a player's mentality for his reason.
Tonight would have made a lot of sense to attempt this, as it seems to be the one idea that people fancy to see some improvement in VDB. It was very illogical to have Pogba strutting around in deep positions when we could have used his athleticism on the break from the left where we have been using him regularly, only to have a very slow VDB out wide where he doesn't have the attributes.
I do think it's clutching at straws, though. He seems well off the pace, which is probably why Ole does not like the idea. He is pretty cautious in expecting defensive cover in those roles and even with this lead he decided against it. I just don't think he sees him in this role, it is hard to find another explanation.
I reckon if Bruno got injured for 10 games or so (touch wood please let this never happen) and VDB had to play in his position for 10 games without fear of being dropped that most people would be saying he is great by the tenth game.
If there is something there he is sure making it hard to see it. Every chance he is given he just doesn't show up.
It is not about game time but it is about his lacking in mentality, skill sets and physicality to be successful in this team and PL. His build is not ideal for CMs or DMs. Fred is tenacious and pretty strong for his size. VDB is nothing like that to combat against EPL CMs/AMs. We do not need someone to pass the ball backwards standing in CMs. Would be a waste.
I still stand corrected that he is a useful player to break down against packed sides which we dominated for last 20 mins or so by playing 2nd striker or something. Seems like he will be only useful for that so far.
I still stand corrected that he is a useful player to break down against packed sides which we dominated for last 20 mins or so by playing 2nd striker or something. Seems like he will be only useful for that so far.
There is absolutely nothing suggesting this as it currently stands
Here’s what I think, the club wanted a backup for Bruno and Pogba they hoped VDB could be both but reality is he’s neither.
Bruno barely missing a game and a few dodgy games early on in the centre of midfield I think marked his card and all the noise from around him probably didn’t help.
United needed a midfielder in the summer and I think they took a chance on VDB as he was supposed to be going to Madrid. Maybe gambled a bit that he could adapt to the role and sadly he hasn’t.
Bruno barely missing a game and a few dodgy games early on in the centre of midfield I think marked his card and all the noise from around him probably didn’t help.
United needed a midfielder in the summer and I think they took a chance on VDB as he was supposed to be going to Madrid. Maybe gambled a bit that he could adapt to the role and sadly he hasn’t.
Ironically despite of the bad comment I thought today was the most progressive things he ever done this season, so that’s the positive means there is bit of improvement.
However, still not good enough. That backpass to Pogba (when Pogba lost it) was just so pointless and sums up he’s not fit for us. His passing is not smart and progressive enough. He needs to develop his mentality.
However, still not good enough. That backpass to Pogba (when Pogba lost it) was just so pointless and sums up he’s not fit for us. His passing is not smart and progressive enough. He needs to develop his mentality.
My dog leaves things on the grass that would have more impact than this bloke.
He reminds me so much of Cleverley in his early United days. If anything Cleverley had a few decent games. Still waiting for Donny to show anything of note. United's playing style and intensity just doesn't seem to suit his game. Could possibly do well in a possession-based team.
He is so bad, i was actually laughing.
Deer in the headlights. It'c comical how quickly he got rid of the ball every time it touched him. Amad or even Shola looked so much more comfortable on the ball even though they got less minutes.
Fred had the same problem in his 1st season.
This is the thing though- at best he’s another Cleverly and Cleverly was never good enough for us.Cleverly
I would argue Cleverly was a more useful player because he could shoot and cross the ball. Donny can not play a long pass and has an awful shooting technique.
Please get rid while he still has believers
I know you all enjoy bashing our players but if you believe he's not better than Cleverly (also from what he's done at Ajax), then you're just a fool
He doesnt have the tempo for United.
He looks out of depth
He looks out of depth
Ziyech has been shit as well, saw one of the Chelsea lot here say there's rumours of him leaving already
If Ole isn't confident of getting the best out of him we should move him on. Back to Ajax or something. At the moment being linked to Real Madrid seems to be his biggest claim to fame.
I got quite excited when I saw the pre-match line up and it appeared as though he was playing as a 6 next to Fred. His position in the match was anything but that and once again he looked a little out of place and unsure of what he was supposed to be doing. He constantly drifts up into attacking positions and would often be our furthest forward player.
He's a conundrum. Its all well and good saying that he can't perform in the style that United use (and I'm increasingly amused at the media's portrayal of United as this band of individualistic misfits with no concept of team shape) as a defence of him, but quite often his first touch and body shape isn't at the level that it needs to be and I have fleeting thoughts that perhaps he just isn't a good enough player.
No idea what the future holds for him. If we were to get our money back this summer I'm sure we'd take it, but its not unheard of for a player to take a season to adapt to English football. I'm not confident that he will, but I'd like to see him succeed here.
He's a conundrum. Its all well and good saying that he can't perform in the style that United use (and I'm increasingly amused at the media's portrayal of United as this band of individualistic misfits with no concept of team shape) as a defence of him, but quite often his first touch and body shape isn't at the level that it needs to be and I have fleeting thoughts that perhaps he just isn't a good enough player.
No idea what the future holds for him. If we were to get our money back this summer I'm sure we'd take it, but its not unheard of for a player to take a season to adapt to English football. I'm not confident that he will, but I'd like to see him succeed here.
I think he doesn't really understand the game. So many times on the counter he just turns around and waits to pass it to the nearest player. Should realise that he's not at Ajax anymore and that he needs to show some courage on the ball.
I like the way he always takes the ball on the half turn and did get involved in some nice passages of play. His signing is so confusing though. He’s completely unsuited to the positions Ole keeps asking him to play. And that was obvious before he kicked a ball for United. How does that happen?!
Playing him on the wing is a disservice to himself, the team, and Amad and any other actual wingers we have trying to earn minutes.
It's not good for anyone. He doesn't have the attributes to play out wide.
It's literally playing him for the sake of it. He needs to earn it in the centre of the pitch.
It's not good for anyone. He doesn't have the attributes to play out wide.
It's literally playing him for the sake of it. He needs to earn it in the centre of the pitch.
Doesn't have the passing ability for it tbh.
He's not an impact player. He's a guy who works well in a quick passing team all inter syncing positions.
Coming in and out for the occasional game he merely looks like an egg and spoon pass it back to the guy he got it off merchant, so I feel a bit sorry for him.
Sometimes teams and players just don't fit each other. But many a foreign player takes until the second time to get into the flow of the premier league.
It's laughable that people are excusing his performance based on the fact that he's scared to make a mistake
1. Jose isn't our manager anymore
2. if that's his mentality he doesn't belong at Manchester United
He was starting in a game where we were already 6-2 up, and was surrounded by what was largely our first team (so he doesn't have the excuse of playing amongst the second string) he should be looking to take some risks and impress.
The only thing he has going for him now is that it's still his first season and we've got plenty of examples of players who were awful at first and stepped up in their second, so he deserves that at least.
1. Jose isn't our manager anymore
2. if that's his mentality he doesn't belong at Manchester United
He was starting in a game where we were already 6-2 up, and was surrounded by what was largely our first team (so he doesn't have the excuse of playing amongst the second string) he should be looking to take some risks and impress.
The only thing he has going for him now is that it's still his first season and we've got plenty of examples of players who were awful at first and stepped up in their second, so he deserves that at least.
Sad. Had a good game and a decent cameo in one of the games few weeks ago; can’t even remember if he’s played since then.
Gets his chance today and it was awful. With a packed schedule coming up, we need him to play and he needs to do better than that
Gets his chance today and it was awful. With a packed schedule coming up, we need him to play and he needs to do better than that
The system and the way we play does not suit him at all. We play a more direct game. He spent his youth and his first senior years at Ajax where they try combine and pass the ball in the goal. He is probably to afraid to try some risky stuff.
He needs to learn to adapt or the situation will not change for him. I think technically he is not a bad player and his awareness is generally quite good. Maybe even better than most of the players in his team but he does not seem to sync to the way we play.
He needs to learn to adapt or the situation will not change for him. I think technically he is not a bad player and his awareness is generally quite good. Maybe even better than most of the players in his team but he does not seem to sync to the way we play.
Waste of £40m should have just kept Lingard..
Unfortunately for him the person in the position he needs to be playing in is our best player. Looking less likely to make it here in my opinion.
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