DOOM and GLOOM thread ( Ole in crowd stay out)

[Isotope]

I'll take a couple more years of failure if it guarantees we shed a few more of these whiny, joyless cnuts.

It's like you have any other choice .

Anyway. This is how I felt when Mou's Chelsea was dominating in mid 2000s. I didn't see how United could beat that kind of team, and expecting Mou to dominate PL for another 10 years.

But then things happened. Mou got bored and fecked off from PL, SAF hired Queiroz, and signed Ronaldo. Next thing you know, we're dominating the League and Europe.

 

[el3mel]

I was quoting the OP, not what I think we'll sign.

I see. No problem.

 

[meamth]

In conclusion, our version of RAWK goes to meltdown thread in Redcafe. Neat.

I'll enjoy this.

 

[Hound Dog]

I just want to point out that "it will be a process" thing should not be acceptable for one of the richest clubs in the world.

Historically, Real find themselves struggling, they go and buy Ronaldo, Kaka and Benzema.
Bayern find themselves struggling, they buy Robben, Ribery and Tony.
United find themselves struggling and make one big transfer each two years, repeatedly saying how it will be a process.

So, how are United supposed to compete with these clubs, again?

I wonder if there are any Caf members still hoping that Anderson will come good. Or Morrison. Or Jones.

 

[RooneyLegend]

I am curious why you lot who have faith in the manager and think things are on track get so worked up by people who think otherwise. You could post positive things in plenty of other threads but it seems you desire some sort of conflict/self righteousness. To each their own i guess.

Apparently if we keep any man in charge, give him all his transfers , he's a sure bet to be successful.

 

[RooneyLegend]

I just want to point out that "it will be a process" thing should not be acceptable for one of the richest clubs in the world.

Historically, Real find themselves struggling, they go and buy Ronaldo, Kaka and Benzema.
Bayern find themselves struggling, they buy Robben, Ribery and Tony.
United find themselves struggling and make one big transfer each two years, repeatedly saying how it will be a process.

So, how are United supposed to compete with these clubs, again?

I wonder if there are any Caf members still hoping that Anderson will come good. Or Morrison. Or Jones.

So we simply aren't spending enough dosh?

 

[tenpoless]

I am concerned but I have aways been when it comes into United so I'm desensitized and I can now ignore bad results and go about my day. Just want to watch the next game doesnt matter how shite it is, if it's shite just forget about it. Acceptance phase perhaps.

 

[ghagua]

Except we've been crap for 7 years now and none of those supporters you've described have left. It's because, as daft as it sounds, they actually do support the club regardless of how good we are. Sharing their concerns on a forum doesn't change that.

7 years will quickly turn into 14 years and we will be saying that same thing. I was hoping we would get closer this year, but it's the same old thing. Ole just said we need 4-5 games to get going, then what does he do, he plays the reserves against Luton town. This was a perfect game to get the team some fitness and then rest them in a few games time once everyone was up to par.

 

[Yagami]

7 years will quickly turn into 14 years and we will be saying that same thing. I was hoping we would get closer this year, but it's the same old thing. Ole just said we need 4-5 games to get going, then what does he do, he plays the reserves against Luton town. This was a perfect game to get the team some fitness and then rest them in a few games time once everyone was up to par.

We've gone full Liverpool. Well, without that European cup during said drought so far. I hope most of us are alive in 2043 to see our next title win, and maybe some entertaining football, too!

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Is this thread about Ole or the owners/Woodward?

On Ole, he finished 3rd last season but has it all to prove as manager of Manchester United. I've always been skeptical, sometimes been completely done with him, and other times held some hope. All in all, I don't rate him very highly and believe we need a top class manager rather than a merely okay/decent one.

It has to be said, if this thread is also about that, that the running of the club is becoming an absolute parody of itself too. This has to be one of the most underwhelming windows I can remember as compared to the expectations.

So yeah, things are pretty gloomy. Hopefully we see an improvement soon from everyone involved.

 

[Siorac]

It's like you have any other choice .

Anyway. This is how I felt when Mou's Chelsea was dominating in mid 2000s. I didn't see how United could beat that kind of team, and expecting Mou to dominate PL for another 10 years.

But then things happened. Mou got bored and fecked off from PL, SAF hired Queiroz, and signed Ronaldo. Next thing you know, we're dominating the League and Europe.

Your timeline here is a little out of whack, as both Queiroz and Ronaldo had arrived before Mourinho took the Chelsea job, and of course we won our first title before he fecked off from the Premier League, competing with his Chelsea all season long.

And that's sort of the point: things that would take us back to the top were in place already even while Chelsea were destroying everyone in sight, and even at our worst we "only" finished 18 points behind the title winners (in 2005), not 33! We don't have a Rooney and a Ronaldo now, we don't have a proven world class manager, and the competition is stronger than it ever was. It'd be a surprise if we won a league title in the next decade. Look at Arsenal since 2004 - that's what we can look forward to.

 

[Isotope]

Your timeline here is a little out of whack, as both Queiroz and Ronaldo had arrived before Mourinho took the Chelsea job, and of course we won our first title before he fecked off from the Premier League, competing with his Chelsea all season long.

And that's sort of the point: things that would take us back to the top were in place already even while Chelsea were destroying everyone in sight, and even at our worst we "only" finished 18 points behind the title winners (in 2005), not 33! We don't have a Rooney and a Ronaldo now, we don't have a proven world class manager, and the competition is stronger than it ever was. It'd be a surprise if we won a league title in the next decade. Look at Arsenal since 2004 - that's what we can look forward to.

Sorry. You're right. I'm just hoping miracles at this point. I also can't see us going back to the top in another 2-3 years. Not with this kind of planning from the Club.

Although Liverpool turned it around massively, just by getting the right manager. So who knows, man. No use to be doom and gloom, as it won't change anything anyway.

 

[MattofManchester]

Honestly, I don't think this thread was needed.
I'd argue it was better to specify in the title: Angry knobheads who belittle and force opinions down your throat and up your rear not welcome.
I mean that for both sides of this argument.
There are logical arguments on both sides, but it gets lost among the various majority of twits that exist on the Internet. More specifically, on the caf.

 

[Andycoleno9]

Results are irrelevant. That feeling when you see your club legend on the bench is everything.

 

[Deery]

Same posters said this bullshit last year about getting relegated and we came third. I swear some people need to get a cut of themselves, this shite is getting tiresome.

 

[Mainoldo]

It's like you have any other choice .

Anyway. This is how I felt when Mou's Chelsea was dominating in mid 2000s. I didn't see how United could beat that kind of team, and expecting Mou to dominate PL for another 10 years.

But then things happened. Mou got bored and fecked off from PL, SAF hired Queiroz, and signed Ronaldo. Next thing you know, we're dominating the League and Europe.

Ronaldo signed in 03-04 after we regained our title. Im totally convinced by this because he was David Beckham’s replacement.

Sorry but your time line really bothered me.

 

[Mainoldo]

Same posters said this bullshit last year about getting relegated and we came third. I swear some people need to get a cut of themselves, this shite is getting tiresome.

So is he’s building and he might not be the right man but the next man will be in a better position than he was.

 

[Bobcat]

I am curious why you lot who have faith in the manager and think things are on track get so worked up by people who think otherwise. You could post positive things in plenty of other threads but it seems you desire some sort of conflict/self righteousness. To each their own i guess.

1. Simply because we are seemingly moving in the right direction, one bad game does not undo that. From February until now we have had 9W, 5D 1L in the league
2. There seems to be a long term plan in order in the squad makeup, both in terms of ability but more importantly in terms of mentality.
3. As you said yourself, there is no quick fix. Our two former managers had very impressive CV's, that in itself is no guarantee of anything really. Another problem is who? Poch gets mentioned a lot, but his achievements is massively overrated here imo. He took Spurs that were regular top 4 contenders and made them a regular top 4 team, which coincided with us dropping of a fecking cliff after Fergie and they having a generational talent in Kane breaking through.
4. Right now its evident that the problem is not the manager or coaches, but rather the higher ups who are slowing down the rebuild with their ineptitude.
5. Most of the criticism leveled at Ole is vague nonsense about coaching and tactics. Ole and Carrick have played at the highest level for years, under the best manager and some of the best coaches of all time. Then you have armchair fans on here whos only experience is amateur football and FM who claim to know better. Thats peak hubris right there because in honesty we know the square root of feck all about actual top level coaching and tactics

And isnt the whole point of a forum like this to discuss things like these? Why would you want an echo chamber were everyone agrees? People disagreeing with you is not getting "worked up", they are simply responding and giving their opinion.

 

[K Stand Knut]

Wow. Just wow!

New lowest level reached.

Congratulations! Wasn’t sure it was possible on here but you managed it

This will take some beating to ever bring the standard any lower so at least there is some positive points

 

[Leftback99]

Same posters said this bullshit last year about getting relegated and we came third. I swear some people need to get a cut of themselves, this shite is getting tiresome.

Being massively wrong last season really got to them.

 

[OleBoiii]

I'll take a couple more years of failure if it guarantees we shed a few more of these whiny, joyless cnuts.

I want to have sex with this comment.

 

[Flexdegea]

Can't decide who I dislike more. Glazers, Woodward or some of our quite frankly ridiculously spoilt and unrealistic fans.

Ole just finished top 3. 1st and 2nd were never on. Those 2 teams were and still are too good for us which is not Ole's fault. He's not been here long enough to change that. So he basically finished as best of the rest in his first full season. And let's not even start with the BS he's got to put up with above him at the club.

People calling for his head after 1 game are everything wrong with modern football fans. Who next then? Poch? A man Spurs didn't even trust to win them a league cup?

I pine for the days we return to the top again but then some times question whether a lot of our fans even deserve it. The type of fans who if born 20 years later wouldn't even be United fans.

Been thinking like this a lot lately.


Some of the stuff I hear in real life, and online is frankly bizarre and delusional to say the least.




So knee jerk after every game ya win or lose.

Can only put it down to lack of control of Emotions, in one word, Fannies.

 

[Mickson]

We usually play crap football and people think that is okay. We are obsessed with blaming it all on Glazers. People actually think we can't dominate Crystal Palace without two new billion signings. Low standards are the new norm at this club. Everything is okay. As I said in my first line, we usually play crap football, for most of the time. Ole has periods where we are good, like after Covid19. Or like when he first got the job. But usually, for the most part, it's underwhelming. He has no idea what he is doing and we saw the same against Palace and now against Luton.

 

[Crashoutcassius]

its beyond belief that the glazers have fooled so many fans again to think sacking the manager and appotining some new random manager is the right thing to do. beyond belief how easily lead people are. I understand the first time, the second and third time too, but a 4th time in the space of a few years. that is my view, ill leave you to wallow.

 

[Siorac]

its beyond belief that the glazers have fooled so many fans again to think sacking the manager and appotining some new random manager is the right thing to do. beyond belief how easily lead people are. I understand the first time, the second and third time too, but a 4th time in the space of a few years. that is my view, ill leave you to wallow.

Yeah, we need better owners and leadership so that they can, among other things, finally make the right managerial appointments, something the Glazer regime seems unable to do. It's one of their many failings, the way they handle the manager's position at United.

 

[FootyGirl88]

Results are irrelevant. That feeling when you see your club legend on the bench is everything.

 

[Desert Eagle]

1. Simply because we are seemingly moving in the right direction, one bad game does not undo that. From February until now we have had 9W, 5D 1L in the league
2. There seems to be a long term plan in order in the squad makeup, both in terms of ability but more importantly in terms of mentality.
3. As you said yourself, there is no quick fix. Our two former managers had very impressive CV's, that in itself is no guarantee of anything really. Another problem is who? Poch gets mentioned a lot, but his achievements is massively overrated here imo. He took Spurs that were regular top 4 contenders and made them a regular top 4 team, which coincided with us dropping of a fecking cliff after Fergie and they having a generational talent in Kane breaking through.
4. Right now its evident that the problem is not the manager or coaches, but rather the higher ups who are slowing down the rebuild with their ineptitude.
5. Most of the criticism leveled at Ole is vague nonsense about coaching and tactics. Ole and Carrick have played at the highest level for years, under the best manager and some of the best coaches of all time. Then you have armchair fans on here whos only experience is amateur football and FM who claim to know better. Thats peak hubris right there because in honesty we know the square root of feck all about actual top level coaching and tactics

And isnt the whole point of a forum like this to discuss things like these? Why would you want an echo chamber were everyone agrees? People disagreeing with you is not getting "worked up", they are simply responding and giving their opinion.

1) Moving in the right direction from the end of the mourinho reign sure i agree with, but we have to give the full context. We are not better than we were in mourinhos second year. Did Ole take over in february? His win percentage is about one percent better than moyes. Is our rate of improvement satisfactory? Not for me.
2) I see posters questioning the mentality of pogba and martial constantly. What kind of long term plan involves giving new contracts to Jones and Mata at way above market rate?
3) Do you think we can do better than Ole? If you say yes, don't you think we should? Who the next manager will be, none of us know but I think it's fair to say Ole is not a tactical innovator. When it comes to things like our pressing, you can clearly see how disjointed it is. I find that unacceptable for a club of our stature that basic things like pressing and set pieces are still so bad after almost 2 years in charge. ther are better managers out there and we should be looking around for one of the best.
4) It's not an either or. Both things can be problems at the same time. Ole has been given 200 million pounds to spend. Thats a decent chunk of change wouldn't you agree.
5)Argument from authority is a logical fallacy. We have not established that a top playing career translates to a successful manager, as the countless failed footballers turned managers can attest to.

I have no problem with discussing things in a reasonable manner. Just because people agree on one thing doesn't mean we agree on everything. Some might want Ole sacked now, midseason or at the end of the season. Some might want Poch or nagelsman or whoever. There are plenty of differing opinions in this thread. I created it because it felt like some posters were being bullied in the ole out thread and i wanted a safe space for those who are worried to vent. Obviously the Ole in crowd has decided to come in the thread anyways and many unlike yourself are just here to point score or troll or whatever.

 

[Machine Elements]

I can live in hope. Believing they'll stick around forever is too much doom and gloom even for this thread.

Like Liverpool fans did for 30 years then. There is one thing though; delusion is a different than hope. There's always a "next year" I suppose.

 

[Crashoutcassius]

Yeah, we need better owners and leadership so that they can, among other things, finally make the right managerial appointments, something the Glazer regime seems unable to do. It's one of their many failings, the way they handle the manager's position at United.

Sonia the argument to sack the manager now, appoint a manager that needs to get rid of our last 5 signings, then think about some solution to meaningful improve the club