Draper: Ten Hag has his work cut out to fix the problems at Man Utd

Green_Red

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Why do we need some journalist to tell us what we already know. feckin leeches making a living off negativity. Seagulls following trawlers and all that.
 

TheReligion

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I’m calling it as I see it. If that means it’s negative then so be it. I’m struggling to find a single positive outside of Ten Hag appearing to be somewhat motivated to be here. We’ll sharp drain that from him.
If you can’t see any positives beside that then I’d suggest you take off the blinkers
 

Skills

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Tyrion

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Nothing new.
Nothing that can't be solved by getting rid of the lot of them.
They can sour up other dressing rooms
Agreed. We should have asked ten Hag to wait a year while Rangnick runs an inquisition complete with stretching racks and forced confessions.
 

AneRu

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Agreed. We should have asked ten Hag to wait a year while Rangnick runs an inquisition complete with stretching racks and forced confessions.
My thoughts exactly, Rangnick should have been allowed to stay beyond this season regardless of the results. There is a clean up job that needs to be done before we even start thinking about progression and its not a job that can easily be addressed by one or two signings.

Our lot will ruin this manager like they did the previous ones and our descent into the abyss won't be complete until we are rid of this toxic ownership that doesn't understand anything about football. Our worst ever season and how do we react? Keeping the poisonous players and spending our standard budget that we have always spent. That's not how a big team reacts to a season like this.
 

AneRu

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It's in my locker. Still got the fall out from Ten Hag's inevitable drop of form. The CAF's knives will come out and so will my rants ;)
The thing is people will lose faith if he starts touting the Glazer bollocks about not needing a major rebuild and goes into next season with the same players that sank Ole and Rangnick playing key roles. Players like Bruno, Shaw, Rashford and Maguire are miles better than what we have seen from them at any point of the season which suggests that some have lost confidence and others have downed tools on the manager which is a cardinal sin in team sports.

I wanted Ten Hag over any other realistic manager but if places his faith in this lot then there is literally no point because he is done before he has even set foot at Carrington. This team needs a clear out above anything else, I am sure the rotten apples are known and no matter who they have to be chucked out.
 

Kag

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If you haven’t noticed all the change all the club then you haven’t been paying attention pal
Be specific. We’ve signed a highly promising coach who appears to be motivated to succeed. What else?

The first team is hideous and we need several players all across the team. The club doesn’t have the stomach, funds or ability to do what needs to be done to give the bloke a chance.
 

noelyman

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I hope we're paying Ten Hag an absolute fortune. Because if he can get this shower playing decent football again he'll have earned every penny.
 

TheReligion

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Be specific. We’ve signed a highly promising coach who appears to be motivated to succeed. What else?

The first team is hideous and we need several players all across the team. The club doesn’t have the stomach, funds or ability to do what needs to be done to give the bloke a chance.
Have you been living under a rock?

Ten Hag plus Van der Gaag and McClaren.

Woodward, Judge, Lawlor, Bout.. essentially everyone who has been running recruitment sacked/moved on (and that’s not mentioning the other staff departures).

Pogba, Lingard, Matic, Mata, Cavani all gone.

Essentially the squad is being gutted.

You can’t see any changes?
 

golden_blunder

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He needs NATO countries lending us players at this stage
 

Swedish_Plumber

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Have you been living under a rock?

Ten Hag plus Van der Gaag and McClaren.

Woodward, Judge, Lawlor, Bout.. essentially everyone who has been running recruitment sacked/moved on (and that’s not mentioning the other staff departures).

Pogba, Lingard, Matic, Mata, Cavani all gone.

Essentially the squad is being gutted.

You can’t see any changes?
New coaches is promising as is the hierarchy changing.

However these players are all at the end of their contracts and are leaving. Through choice. We’ve yet to see if we can bring in quality to replace them. Time will tell in seeing if we do and give ten hag an opportunity to be successful.
 

Kag

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Have you been living under a rock?

Ten Hag plus Van der Gaag and McClaren.

Woodward, Judge, Lawlor, Bout.. essentially everyone who has been running recruitment sacked/moved on (and that’s not mentioning the other staff departures).

Pogba, Lingard, Matic, Mata, Cavani all gone.

Essentially the squad is being gutted.

You can’t see any changes?
I can see changes. There is no evidence to suggest that any of it is going to be positive.

Ten Hag is likely to do better than Rangnick on the basis that he’s actually permanent and appears to be keen.

You or I have no real clue as to the merits of Lawlor and Bout, for better or worse. Judge left on his own terms as per reports. Andy Mitten would have you believe that some of the other staff who are leaving are not necessarily under performing.

Our squad is worse than it was this time last season and there is no evidence at all to suggest the club has the structure in place to complete the overhaul that needs to be done. You’re living in hope and using it to suggest that others are negative. Today we lost 1-0 at Palace and started the likes of McTominay, Elanga, Dalot and Telles. Tell me who is being more realistic as it stands.
 
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TheReligion

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New coaches is promising as is the hierarchy changing.

However these players are all at the end of their contracts and are leaving. Through choice. We’ve yet to see if we can bring in quality to replace them. Time will tell in seeing if we do and give ten hag an opportunity to be successful.
If fans can’t get optimistic about all that then really what’s the point in supporting the club?
 

TheReligion

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I can see changes. There is no evidence to suggest that any of it is going to be positive.

Ten Hag is likely to do better than Rangnick on the basis that he’s actually permanent and appears to be keen.

You or I have no real clue as to the merits of Lawlor and Bout, for better or worse. Judge left on his own terms as per reports. Andy Mitten would have you believe that some of the other staff who are leaving are not necessary under performing.

Our squad is worse than it was this time last season and there is no evidence at all to suggest the club has the structure in place to complete the overhaul that needs to be done. You’re living in hope and using it to suggest that others are negative. Today we lost 1-0 at Palace and started the likes of McTominay, Elanga, Dalot and Telles. Tell me who is being more realistic as it stands.
What on earth you on about?

Ten Hag is ‘likely’ to do better but only on the basis that he’s permanent and keen? :lol:

You must be wumming with an analysis on that level.

And yes our recruitment has been awful and scattergun over the past years. Finally the scouts are going as are the two men who managed negotiations and contracts. Unless you think our recruitment has been spot on of course. That’s why I’m able to tell they’ve not been doing a good job.

The whole structure at the club is changing, including personnel, and we are getting a top head coach and two top quality assistants. We have had literally no one bar Rangnick for 6 months and he’s a director of football. He couldn’t get enough coaches in hence Fletcher masquerading as a coach on the bench. His other coaches were recruited on the go as there was literally no one else available.

There definitely won’t be any change or improvements though and whatever happens we shall not be positive.
 

Swedish_Plumber

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If fans can’t get optimistic about all that then really what’s the point in supporting the club?
There’s cautious optimism. I can understand why some are wanting to ‘see it before they believe it’.

I don’t think being wary of how our club operates this summer equates to not being excited with ten hag, it’s just the result of 10+ years of mismanagement.
 

Kag

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What on earth you on about?

Ten Hag is ‘likely’ to do better but only on the basis that he’s permanent and keen? :lol:

You must be wumming with an analysis on that level.

And yes our recruitment has been awful and scattergun over the past years. Finally the scouts are going as are the two men who managed negotiations and contracts. Unless you think our recruitment has been spot on of course. That’s why I’m able to tell they’ve not been doing a good job.

The whole structure at the club is changing, including personnel, and we are getting a top head coach and two top quality assistants. We have had literally no one bar Rangnick for 6 months and he’s a director of football. He couldn’t get enough coaches in hence Fletcher masquerading as a coach on the bench. His other coaches were recruited on the go as there was literally no one else available.

There definitely won’t be any change or improvements though and whatever happens we shall not be positive.
I feel like you have, probably deliberately, missed my inference that part of this season’s shambles has been down to the decision to bring somebody in for the interim, but you do you. Ten Hag is permanent, motivated and clearly has some pedigree, but he isn’t the first. I’ll help you out a little: we will get better because it’s probably impossible not to. What better is, I have no idea, but the structure still doesn’t appear to be in place in order to give him a proper crack at the whip.

You appear to be upset that other people don’t appear to share your enthusiasm. I find that odd. It’s clear to me that the current squad is a million miles away from the quality required and there is no evidence at all to suggest the club has the capability of bringing in the six or seven players clearly needed to improve the first team.

You’re citing change as positive. I’m saying there’s no evidence to suggest it’ll make much of a difference. Say what you will, but I’m not living in hope…
 

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I think a lot of it is just bad leadership and weak managers. Ole was clearly a weak manager by personality. Ralf because he was interim. ETH is the first strong manager we've had since SAF in the specific sense that he has carte blanche to clean out the stable and not under time pressure to do it.

Under Woodward the players were simply financial assets that had to be kept regardless of their playing ability - which made player power too great for any manager to challenge. Hopefully that's all gone.
 

bosnian_red

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Say what you will, but I’m not living in hope…
Then go sit in a corner and pout I guess? We wanted change. We are seeing a massive amount of changes. If you can't be hopeful after wholesale changes after this shit show, what the feck is the point in supporting a football club? There are clear reasons to be hopeful. Of course it's been shit. But there are widespread changes going on. It'll take time. But I'm confident we're on the right track.
 

TheReligion

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I feel like you have, probably deliberately, missed my inference that part of this season’s shambles has been down to the decision to bring somebody in for the interim, but you do you. Ten Hag is permanent, motivated and clearly has some pedigree, but he isn’t the first. I’ll help you out a little: we will get better because it’s probably impossible not to. What better is, I have no idea, but the structure still doesn’t appear to be in place in order to give him a proper crack at the whip.

You appear to be upset that other people don’t appear to share your enthusiasm. I find that odd. It’s clear to me that the current squad is a million miles away from the quality required and there is no evidence at all to suggest the club has the capability of bringing in the six or seven players clearly needed to improve the first team.

You’re citing change as positive. I’m saying there’s no evidence to suggest it’ll make much of a difference. Say what you will, but I’m not living in hope…
Far from it. I’m just fed up of this constant spew of negative, boring, so called ‘fans’ who seemingly log on the caf to try and bring the place down. You’re not the worst but one of a few who are starting to stand out as irritating at the moment. You seem to have an issue with people being positive. I find that strange.

If you don’t think change is positive, considering the season we’ve just had, then there’s no point in this discussion really. Totally baffling to have that opinion. Do you think Liverpool shot up by carrying on with the same manager, structure and staff or do you think they made changes.
 

Kag

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Then go sit in a corner and pout I guess? We wanted change. We are seeing a massive amount of changes. If you can't be hopeful after wholesale changes after this shit show, what the feck is the point in supporting a football club? There are clear reasons to be hopeful. Of course it's been shit. But there are widespread changes going on. It'll take time. But I'm confident we're on the right track.
This is just more vacuous word vomit about supporting the club. It’s fluff.

If the club go out and bring in six or seven proper players over the next two months, and it is clear that we haven’t got gaping holes all across the first team, then I’ll be hopeful. Until then, I live firmly in the belief that the club hasn’t got gumption to get that done. This belief is actually based on tangible evidence, not some superfluous reasoning or blind faith.
 

redcucumber

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I feel like you have, probably deliberately, missed my inference that part of this season’s shambles has been down to the decision to bring somebody in for the interim, but you do you. Ten Hag is permanent, motivated and clearly has some pedigree, but he isn’t the first. I’ll help you out a little: we will get better because it’s probably impossible not to. What better is, I have no idea, but the structure still doesn’t appear to be in place in order to give him a proper crack at the whip.

You appear to be upset that other people don’t appear to share your enthusiasm. I find that odd. It’s clear to me that the current squad is a million miles away from the quality required and there is no evidence at all to suggest the club has the capability of bringing in the six or seven players clearly needed to improve the first team.

You’re citing change as positive. I’m saying there’s no evidence to suggest it’ll make much of a difference. Say what you will, but I’m not living in hope…
There quite clearly is a new structure in place, though, so I find this comment incredibly odd? There's no guarantees it works obviously, but there is a new and completely revitalised structure which starts with the removal of the egomaniac and despot finance banker Woodward. That's pretty massive, given he has been the shot caller since 2013 and directly overseen over a billion pounds spent and wasted. He's been replaced by John Murtough, a man with a pedigree in football and data analytics who has been given the power to rework how recruitment and the like is done at the club.

Changes have been happening and have been well documented.
 

Kag

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Far from it. I’m just fed up of this constant spew of negative, boring, so called ‘fans’ who seemingly log on the caf to try and bring the place down. You’re not the worst but one of a few who are starting to stand out as irritating at the moment. You seem to have an issue with people being positive. I find that strange.

If you don’t think change is positive, considering the season we’ve just had, then there’s no point in this discussion really. Totally baffling to have that opinion. Do you think Liverpool shot up by carrying on with the same manager, structure and staff or do you think they made changes.
I have no issue with people being positive. Other than saying that some folk are pie in the sky I’ve posted little on here in the way of taking a poke at people. Honestly, all power to those who believe next season will be a good one. I need to see a lot more than a new manager to get excited as it stands. As I said above, if we can facilitate the turnover of players I’ve mentioned above, and I’m talking at least six in, then I may be able to get on board. But I honestly and genuinely don’t believe that the club can pull that off.
 

TheReligion

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I have no issue with people being positive. Other than saying that some folk are pie in the sky I’ve posted little on here in the way of taking a poke at people. Honestly, all power to those who believe next season will be a good one. I need to see a lot more than a new manager to get excited as it stands. As I said above, if we can facilitate the turnover of players I’ve mentioned above, and I’m talking at least six in, then I may be able to get on board. But I honestly and genuinely don’t believe that the club can pull that off.
It’s not just a new manager though is it as I’ve pointed out? I’m not sure what you’re struggling with here. If it was just a new manager then I’d agree but there’s clearly much more than that going on whether you accept that or not.
 

Kag

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It’s not just a new manager though is it as I’ve pointed out? I’m not sure what you’re struggling with here. If it was just a new manager then I’d agree but there’s clearly much more than that going on whether you accept that or not.
As it stands, it is just a new manager. Murtough seems to have more control, too, but nobody is any position to really assess whether this is a good thing or a bad thing. Other than that we appear to be losing other staff members and I’m yet to see any clarification as to who comes in to replace them.
 

TheReligion

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As it stands, it is just a new manager. Murtough seems to have more control, too, but nobody is any position to really assess whether this is a good thing or a bad thing. Other than that we appear to be losing other staff members and I’m yet to see any clarification as to who comes in to replace them.
The staff aren’t all being replaced like for like as the structure is changing (as many have been calling for).

Van der Gaag and McClaren are pretty much confirmed and imagine may be announced tomorrow.

We also know which players are going on frees.

Quite a lot of change confirmed and I’m struggling to see what’s not positive about it?

Unless we should just crack on how we are?
 

Kag

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The staff aren’t all being replaced like for like as the structure is changing (as many have been calling for).

Van der Gaag and McClaren are pretty much confirmed and imagine may be announced tomorrow.

We also know which players are going on frees.

Quite a lot of change confirmed and I’m struggling to see what’s not positive about it?

Unless we should just crack on how we are?
Of course not. We need to bring in at least six quality players. Do you think the club will pull this off?
 

AndySmith1990

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This season will be the big wake up call this club needs. Things will change for the better, but we're not going to transform into a title winning team in a season. Patience is needed
 

TheReligion

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Of course not. We need to bring in at least six quality players. Do you think the club will pull this off?
I can see us bringing in 3 starters and 3 squad players (we need both)

I also see EtH getting more out of what he has and a surprise or two from the academy appearing.
 

Tyrion

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My thoughts exactly, Rangnick should have been allowed to stay beyond this season regardless of the results. There is a clean up job that needs to be done before we even start thinking about progression and its not a job that can easily be addressed by one or two signings.

Our lot will ruin this manager like they did the previous ones and our descent into the abyss won't be complete until we are rid of this toxic ownership that doesn't understand anything about football. Our worst ever season and how do we react? Keeping the poisonous players and spending our standard budget that we have always spent. That's not how a big team reacts to a season like this.
As long as ten Hag is given time and money, I think it will improve.
 

Waynne

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I don't think this will be an impossible fix because with the squad of players we have (apart from maybe the lack of quality in the midfield) we have a decent squad if they're all on top of their game not fighting each other in the dressing room.

If these players put aside their differences and put that energy into fighting for the badge, there is a chance they can give anyone good competition.
I believe Ten Hag will repair the broken team spirit then work on adding some much needed quality to the areas in which we are lacking.

The job is not impossible (as much as the media makes it out to be) and I'm very excited for the future.
 

Dansk

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What's this "briefing against Maguire" thing? Haven't heard of that before and google isn't being helpful.
 

Billy Bullcrap

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I think it’s fair to say that E 10 H has a mountain to climb sorting this shambles out.
 

bosnian_red

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Of course not. We need to bring in at least six quality players. Do you think the club will pull this off?
Why do we "need" 6 players? We need a turnover but we can have a good transfer window with just 3-4 signings to get us started. This is never going to be a 1 year turn around, but if we get started right and a few of the right signings with the right coaching is enough to have us back in the top 4, before taking more steps next year. We aren't 6 signings off top 4. We are good coaching off of top 4. The signings are to help Ten Hag implement his system and improve us as a team, which is an ongoing thing. Nobody should be expecting enough transfer business to make the step up to be a top 5 team in Europe instantly, as it's entirely unrealistic. A few good signings, something even like Timber, De Jong and Antony and that's it would go a hell of a long way for us next season.
 

Bastian

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Why do we "need" 6 players? We need a turnover but we can have a good transfer window with just 3-4 signings to get us started. This is never going to be a 1 year turn around, but if we get started right and a few of the right signings with the right coaching is enough to have us back in the top 4, before taking more steps next year. We aren't 6 signings off top 4. We are good coaching off of top 4. The signings are to help Ten Hag implement his system and improve us as a team, which is an ongoing thing. Nobody should be expecting enough transfer business to make the step up to be a top 5 team in Europe instantly, as it's entirely unrealistic. A few good signings, something even like Timber, De Jong and Antony and that's it would go a hell of a long way for us next season.
We need one centre back in order to have two competent ones (and yet Varane is suspect in terms of injuries), unless Laird is going to be promoted to the first XI we are a right back short, we need a new midfield, that's two, and we cannot go into a season with only one recognised striker pushing 40. So that's five. Six if you want a right sided attacker, given our most promising player is awaiting trial.

Not all of these will be elite players, maybe only one or none, but they'll need to be a lot better than what we have, which is a low bar. Thankfully, or hopefully, we have footballing people taking charge now and they'll use our resources as they're meant to be used, smartly.
 

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So it’s not the briefing against all our coaches, old manager, old interim manager or even Ronaldo that’s been atrocious and an act of disloyalty. It’s the supposed briefing against Maguire, which happened once and stated players thought he was a bit rubbish?

It does help when the press love you.