Eight games away from another disastrous season under Ole

[Sylar]

I think we were handicapped before the season started. To make top4 comfortably, I think we were 3 signings short.
We all knew we needed about 6 signings on the back of last season (whilst getting rid of most of the players that we have done so for)

We 'could' have got Bruno in before the season started, but for some reason we didnt and waited until January (and even with Jan, we waited until the end when it should have been the beginning).
We been unlucky with Pogba being out, and seeing injuries to Rashford (who was on a good run) and Martial (he got injured whilst being on a good run, right?). And DDG having his worst season ever once we are starting to get things in front of him correct.
I think now we look much stronger in attack and midfield.

I think 2 or 3 signings in the summer could see us challenging (but im worried we only get 1 and are once again short / behind)
In terms of big games, I think Ole has done really well with his tactics and choices.
The lesser games has been an issue but thats where quality comes in (and having pogba, martial, bruno, rashford all playing together will help)

 

[Schmeichel's Cartwheel]

If we don't match that and still end up in the top 4 then nothing should be done. Likewise if we won the Europa.

We had a horrible horrible start to the season, we're lucky the other top 4 candidates have been poor too.

Why? We should accept a manager who is statistically our worst ever in the PL era just because everyone else other than Liverpool and City are shit too? You said it yourself, we are lucky our rivals have been shit too, or else we would have no chance of top 4. Why should Ole keep his job despite being shit? Chelsea, Spurs and Arsenal's results should be irrelevant in that conversation. You're saying you would be happy for us to keep a terribly underperforming manager because our rivals are also terribly underperforming. That attitude is not going to get us back to the top.

I'm sorry mate but you're demonstrating the horrific lack of ambition that seems to be riddling our fanbase right now.

Anyone who has a basic understanding of football can see Ole is not the man to take Manchester United forward. We don't have a tactical identity. We have no patterns of play. There is no system in place. Every result we get is down to individual magic/mistakes.

And no, parking the bus and playing long ball counter attack against City and Chelsea is not a tactical identity. Anyone could do that.

 

[The Boy]

I think he's being sarcastic in response to a comment above his about Ole being lucky, but I could be wrong. I can never tell in caf esp. when it comes to Ole threads.

Thank you. Sorry @Samid that went right over my head!

 

[elmo]

People always call a poor season a "transitional" season, but in this case I think it's accurate. For the first time in a while I dont think we need major surgery to be successful. We have a couple of key spots to fill either this summer or next (RW, Matic replacement) and we have a couple of players with question marks over them (Lindelof, DDG) but nothing like the situation under Mourinho, where you looked at the outfield players and 7 or 8 of them you just knew were not good enough. I mean, think back to the days where we were playing Smalling, Young, Valencia, Fellaini, Herrera, Lukaku and Sanchez, and its pretty clear we're moving in the right direction.

Indeed, if we can get Sancho this summer, upgrade Lindelof and get a really consistent striker up front, I think we have a team that can challenge repeatedly over the next few years. The only thing missing is experience, which as a collective they can gain together. So I'm pretty relaxed about the points total, because for the first time in ages I feel like we've carefully built a team rather than chucking it together and hopefully we'll see the rewards for that in the coming years.

From all the players you say we have questions or need replacing, it's nearly half the starting lineup.

You're all blinded by the Jose hate that you all think Ole is competent despite the stats saying otherwise.

 

[big rons sovereign]

F365 are all Liverpool fans. They could lose 6-0 to Barnet and klopp could strangle cats on the touchline, they'd still be reported as the greatest ever and nicest guy. They have nothing good to say about anybody else.

 

[Gehrman]

Even though i was an ole outer before i want to see him get another season, his transfers in and out has been about right and most of the players back him. It will be a blow if we lose pogba in the summer, but because of the corona virus none may be able to afford him. We were on a good run before the suspension and it will be interesting to see if we can pick up where we left.

 

[Lynty]

It’s Uniteds own fault if we don’t get 4th place we knew what we were getting when we signed Ole, so there is no point complaining now.

The football hasn’t been very good at all and it won’t get any better either, it’s individual brilliance rather than good football getting us points.

But, we get a win tonight against Sheffield and we are in a good position to get 4th so let’s all get behind the team for the remaining games and forget these clickbait bullshit articles only designed to play on the insecurity of United fans..

Thats bollocks. We've played great football many times this season, admittedly we've played some shocked football to. As to be expected from such a young squad plagued with injuries to key players in a time of transition.

OT: The only disaster this season is this thread.

 

[bsCallout]

I get the point of the article but the reality is the improvements are clear and obvious, especially to us fans who were basically done with football when Mour was in charge.

We have to get top 4 and then there should be no question marks about if he deserves next season.

Whether or not he has the tactical ability to have us win things is a question for a later date in my opinion.

Next season I expect top 4 to be comfortably achieved and for us to have a decent run in the CL. That would be the progress I expect him to achieve. If not, he'll go.

Anybody claiming there arent big improvements across the board is just sticking to their guns with their view on Ole. Not based on reality.

 

[Red Company]

It’s Uniteds own fault if we don’t get 4th place we knew what we were getting when we signed Ole, so there is no point complaining now.

The football hasn’t been very good at all and it won’t get any better either, it’s individual brilliance rather than good football getting us points.

But, we get a win tonight against Sheffield and we are in a good position to get 4th so let’s all get behind the team for the remaining games and forget these clickbait bullshit articles only designed to play on the insecurity of United fans..

In all fairness, who else would you have preferred to get instead of Ole?
Most good managers were taken and the only available good one (Allegri) apparently didn’t want to take the job during such a transition.

As time passes, I become increasingly confident in Ole’s team. He’s been ensuring we acquire players that actually match our club DNA for once.

He also has Phelan who helps fulfill the lack in coaching prowess that Ole did not have as yet, by bringing SAF’s teachings to the table.

Not to mention SAF’s increased involvement behind the scenes which previous managers (LVG, Mourinho) did not encourage much.

As for the quality of football, it hasn’t been good due to lack of quality and injuries to the ones who did have enough quality to be our starters.

 

[Gum_gum]

Hilarious. I could maybe understand if fans were somewhat content with the season and were willin' to see it out but all this talk of the team now bein' far better than the one that finished second is pure delusion.

Ashley Young is a superior player to Shaw in every way so I don't see how he's deadwood. Smalling is at least as good as Maguire and even if you don't think so, he's better than our other options. He wasn't deadwood.
Lukaku was out only CF and we sold him for 20 less than we bought him. He was not deadwood. (please no rubbish about style of play, we still play the same way. Please no rubbish about 'but he wanted to leave'. Pogba is still here)
Sanchez is better than James and him leavin' on loan doesn't solve the issue of his wages.

Young players? Every manager since Fergie has blooded at least one. Januzaj, Rash and Lingard, then McTom and Tuanzebe now Brandon. So it can't or shouldn't be young players that makes Ole fans swoon.

As for this plan you guys all seem to be privy to. What is it? Does it involve buyin' the slowest CB in the league? If we're an attackin' team now why don't we have attackin' fallbacks? Why don't the forwards press? Please what is this plan?

 

[Gum_gum]

I get the point of the article but the reality is the improvements are clear and obvious, especially to us fans who were basically done with football when Mour was in charge.

We have to get top 4 and then there should be no question marks about if he deserves next season.

Whether or not he has the tactical ability to have us win things is a question for a later date in my opinion.

Next season I expect top 4 to be comfortably achieved and for us to have a decent run in the CL. That would be the progress I expect him to achieve. If not, he'll go.

Anybody claiming there arent big improvements across the board is just sticking to their guns with their view on Ole. Not based on reality.

What are the clear improvements?

 

[EwanI Ted]

From all the players you say we have questions or need replacing, it's nearly half the starting lineup.

No, its not. At least raise a serious point if you want to discuss it further

 

[Rozay]

‘If we lose our games, we’ll have had a terrible season.’

Well that’s one way to look at it.

 

[elmo]

No, its not. At least raise a serious point if you want to discuss it further

Matic's replacement
Lindelof
Dave
A striker who can score goals
Right winger

That's 5/11 players in the starting 11. How's that not close to half.

 

[jackal&hyde]

From all the players you say we have questions or need replacing, it's nearly half the starting lineup.

You're all blinded by the Jose hate that you all think Ole is competent despite the stats saying otherwise.

Or it's the other way around and you can't or don't want to see the positives after the toxic one was booted out.

 

[kirk buttercup]

Ole has been so lucky this season. If Rashford hadn't scored 14 goals we would have been bottom half. If Bruno hadn't been signed we would have been in a relegation battle. If we had conceded more than a goal a game we would have finished rock bottom.

All of a sudden he has Pogba available too. Can't believe his luck.

If if if , If my Aunt had balls she would be my uncle .

Even the most anti Ole poster cant deny United now look a different side to the one at the start of the season . We are getting there slowly but surely

 

[fps]

Honestly, if United get CL qualification this season then the club's future to my mind looks very bright. If they don't, not so much, that's where I am. I am much happier with Ole as manager than anyone since Fergie. He gets it, and his recruitment and mentality show it.

 

[Ryan Bobson]

If we had signed Bruno before the start of the season like we were lead to believe we would of been in a much stronger position than now , so is it the board and woodys fault

 

[TrustInJanuzaj]

I think one of the main things I like about Ole is you can clearly and honestly analyse the squad for what it truly is because all the players are all performing to their maximum capacity. What I mean by this is that under Mourinho you could never be sure what was the players fault or what was just down to a shocking manager. Now we can look forensically at the squad and say with absolute certainty that we still need a RW, midfielder and perhaps another CB. The rest of the squad appears to be taking shape.

I agree with the poster above saying for the first time in ages I looked at our team against Spurs and thought we have genuine quality both in the 11 and on the bench. Additionally, we actually played the game like the bigger team between the twowhich is a complete change in how our last few seasons against Poch’s Spurs played out.

For me this is easily the most excited I’ve been about Utd in the last few years and I think we can grow into a great team here. Clearly we still need many factors to go in our direction;
- Rashford builds and becomes world class,
- Martial takes it up a further gear,
- Pogba stays and proves many people wrong,
- Bruno continues his form and becomes one of the best in the league,
- Greenwood develops into a top class striker/wide forward.

Lots of ifs and buts still but I don’t think it’s crazy to see those things happening at all and if they do we are going to be some team.

 

[Welbeckham]

We would have made top 4 this season and last season if he had the guts to drop De Gea.

 

[KeanoMagicHat]

The biggest mistake of the season if they don't get top 4 will be that they didn't buy Fernandes at the start of the season when he was available. Pereira and Lingard have been terrible in the attacking midfield position. Granted had to give Pereira a chance at some point and didn't know he'd struggle so much, but if we actually had an established top-class number 10 I think we'd be around where Leicester are now. Wouldn't have taken much, the odd draw with a team sitting back we would have won is all it would take.

 

[elmo]

Or it's the other way around and you can't or don't want to see the positives after the toxic one was booted out.

Funny how everyone thinks Ole is good despite being on track to miss out on top 4 yet again when Chelsea is ahead of us with their transfer ban.

 

[jackal&hyde]

Funny how everyone thinks Ole is good despite being on track to miss out on top 4 yet again when Chelsea is ahead of us with their transfer ban.

Transfer ban while actually getting two players in. Still in the FA cup and Europa too. Most of the players are improved, the atmosphere is good, very good results vs our rivals and the team is taking shape now. You see none of this?

 

[cbmufc]

We're on our best run of results in 18 months, have players back from long term injuries, are still in the race for top 4 and in a couple of cups. Bizarre time to roll out the negatives.

Agreed, I'm buzzing to watch United again. Lots of decent young talent coming through, Williams/Greenwood almost certainly have benefited from Ole. Rashford best season yet to boot as well. I genuinely think we are a Sancho away from being in an outside title challenge.

Lot's of positives but you accept its a results business and champions league is crucial - need to kick on now rest of the season.

 

[Deery]

Thats bollocks. We've played great football many times this season, admittedly we've played some shocked football to. As to be expected from such a young squad plagued with injuries to key players in a time of transition.

OT: The only disaster this season is this thread.

We have had some good games mainly Chelsea, Man City and LASK, but over the course of the season we haven’t played all that well.

We build ourselves up every game and then it’s usually turns very boring real quick..

 

[12OunceEpilogue]

We've had years of looking entirely rudderless - even in the year we finished second, you didn't look at the squad and our play and think "there's a proper plan here and we're moving in the right direction.

Finally now, under Ole, we are moving in that right direction. We're slowly weeding out the shite that had infected the club and replacing it with actual quality. Everybody seems to be on the same page and playing for the coach which is the first time you can say that since Fergie left.

We haven't been perfect but we are getting slowly better all the time and to make a change now would be madness. Ole has earned the right to more time and the club needs a period of stability after several years of upheaval. There are still a few players that need to leave and still a few gaps in the first team and squad that need filling - let Ole finish that rebuild and give him a year with a finished squad.

A decent summary of where I am too. I was ready to show Ole the door around Christmas because I thought we were going nowhere under him, and that therefore giving him more time would simply be guaranteeing a longer wait until we were ready to even start on an upward trajectory. However there is not an objective fan in the world who could claim we haven't got the squad in a better condition now than when Ole joined, so even if the football is not yet stellar and the results are not flooding in that is a big tick from me considering the state we've been in at times post-Fergie.

I have to say I do find some the bashing hilariously unfair. He's lucky Greenwood came through from the academy yet takes no credit for bringing him through, he's lucky Pogba has been injured all season as he's been able to give others a chance yet he's caned for not fostering enough creativity from midfield, he's lucky Bruno fell into his lap and deserves zero credit for getting him in and integrating him into the squad.

The lowest PL points total for me is double-edged. On the one hand the whole 'How low are expectations gong to sink at United? What a scandal!' viewpoint is rooted in a ridiculous nostalgia for Fergie's era, as though nothing less than competing at the top is acceptable despite us being saddled with Moyes, saddled with Woodward, saddled with LVG and to a lesser extent Jose whose tactics and outlook seem anathema to modern football, while City got near infinite oil money and one of the greatest modern managers and Liverpool awoke from their long slumber under a top manager. Ole has come into a club in turmoil a good five years after Fergie left and yet we are not able to lower our expectations from the best times we ever saw because we're Man United?

On the other hand it's been a very frustrating season results-wise, the sheer amount of games in which we've been the better team but have not managed to get the win has been staggering. Fortunately for us every team except Liverpool and to a lesser extent City have been inconsistent themselves, but what even three or four of those bloody draws converted to wins would have done for us this season. Transition or not that's on Ole and the players, and is for me the main black mark against him; I worry Ole hasn't got the mental grit as a manager to instill a winning philosophy here, where when we get ourselves on top we stay there. The game tonight is massive and I for one do not want to hear a single excuse if we come away with less than three points, I find threads like this to be massively unfair when you consider the job Ole has had to do but we are running out of gift horses to look in the mouth.

 

[rotherham_red]

An interesting piece in F365 this morning about how terrible this season has been for us, if it wasn't for the decent run after Fernandes joined who knows what situation we would be in. We need 19 points from our last 24 available just to beat our worst ever Premier League total which was achieved under Moyes. If we don't match that then surely something has to be done?

https://www.football365.com/news/man-utd-and-solskjaer-have-eight-games-to-avoid-disaster

All that hand wringing and yet, we're on the cusp of finishing Top 4.

These ifs are pointless as well. If my auntie had bollocks, she'd be my uncle. It literally doesn't matter because we DID buy Fernandes. It's hardly a fecking cheat code...

 

[Tibs]

We must finish top 4 this season otherwise he should be sacked.

With the financial mess that we are win, to stay at the top we need to be winning things. Our squad is now strong enough to be challenging or trophies/top 4 minimum.

For me, Europa or FA cup, and Top 4. If not, fire him,

 

[Deery]

In all fairness, who else would you have preferred to get instead of Ole?
Most good managers were taken and the only available good one (Allegri) apparently didn’t want to take the job during such a transition.

As time passes, I become increasingly confident in Ole’s team. He’s been ensuring we acquire players that actually match our club DNA for once.

He also has Phelan who helps fulfill the lack in coaching prowess that Ole did not have as yet, by bringing SAF’s teachings to the table.

Not to mention SAF’s increased involvement behind the scenes which previous managers (LVG, Mourinho) did not encourage much.

As for the quality of football, it hasn’t been good due to lack of quality and injuries to the ones who did have enough quality to be our starters.

Am sure we could have found a better manager than Molde’s for what’s supposed to be the biggest club in the world or one of.

 

[EwanI Ted]

Matic's replacement
Lindelof
Dave
A striker who can score goals
Right winger

That's 5/11 players in the starting 11. How's that not close to half.

Because Matic isn't in the starting 11 and the striker up front can mean one of our current crop being more consistent. And we already have a DDG replacement available in Henderson, it's only a question of when he comes in, so that's not a big problem either. And besides, few teams are every truly finished, there's always a question mark or two. But we're as close as we've been in a good long while.

 

[dal]

Ole is changing the club even if we finish fifth, he needs one more season.

A manager has to have two full seasons before he gets the sack, we aren’t even doing that badly. We are not the club SAF left in 2013, top 5 is good this year.

I think he will do it in all honestly. However points totals mean nothing, I mean we finished sixth under Mourinho for crying out loud.

 

[Cardboard elk]

I like the football emerging a lot, we havent lost a match in ages and we WILL get the CL spot. The team is in harmony, the club also more or less, the squad is getting younger and better and the future is ours. On top of that Ole has proven to be an adept tactician in big games. We are gonna end up 3rd or 4th with a great run.

 

[noodlehair]

I know what you mean, but it works both ways. If Pogba hadn't been injured for ever as well as lengthy spells out for Martial and Rashford you could be 4th and surely Rashford's goals have to be partly down to the manager playing him and setting up for him rather than just pure luck. Finally presumably Ole had a say in who they should sign in Jan to help the team so again more than just luck.

It's a bit like saying if Salah hadn't scored 16 goals Liverpool would be struggling for top 4, fecking lucky Klopp!

I think he was being sarcastic. Or at least I hope he was

I've enjoyed our football more this season when we've played well than any other since SAF retired. I also think for the first time we actually look like we're building a very good team rather than just signing people in the hope they immediately fix everything.

On the other hand though, basically we'd have lost or drawn every game since Fernandes signed if you took out the contributions made by Fernandes...and before he signed there were large spells where this basically is what was happening. Nothing wrong with signing a good player but it's baffling why we waited until we'd ruined our season to do it when he was clearly available in the summer.

 

[EngimaMK]

Ole was and still is one of the luckiest coach I've met

Ability aside the timing of events is always on his side.

What a load of shit. We were flying before the covid break... How was timing on his side then?

 

[dal]

Why? We should accept a manager who is statistically our worst ever in the PL era just because everyone else other than Liverpool and City are shit too? You said it yourself, we are lucky our rivals have been shit too, or else we would have no chance of top 4. Why should Ole keep his job despite being shit? Chelsea, Spurs and Arsenal's results should be irrelevant in that conversation. You're saying you would be happy for us to keep a terribly underperforming manager because our rivals are also terribly underperforming. That attitude is not going to get us back to the top.

I'm sorry mate but you're demonstrating the horrific lack of ambition that seems to be riddling our fanbase right now.

Anyone who has a basic understanding of football can see Ole is not the man to take Manchester United forward. We don't have a tactical identity. We have no patterns of play. There is no system in place. Every result we get is down to individual magic/mistakes.

And no, parking the bus and playing long ball counter attack against City and Chelsea is not a tactical identity. Anyone could do that.

I think people are confusing points total with league position. It’s the league position that counts, points are merely a by-product.

 

[GorgeousGeorge]

Put it this way, how many years has it truly been since we played away at Spurs where most people felt we were favourites, had the superior team on paper, and managed kept them on the front foot for most of the game, Fergie days?

 

[Red Company]

Am sure we could have found a better manager than Molde’s for what’s supposed to be the biggest club in the world or one of.

His post as the manager of MOLDE is probably the last reason he was signed for though.

Its his history with, and relationship to, our club that played a bigger role. He understands our club DNA better and that has been evident during his tenure.

As I also mentioned, his coaching team set up, is the reason he makes sense for us. Having Sir Alex’s influence around him is ideal long term wise.

 

[londonredmaniac]

Funny how everyone thinks Ole is good despite being on track to miss out on top 4 yet again when Chelsea is ahead of us with their transfer ban.

I don't think it needs to be so black and white, I think there is a tendency to think people fall into the 'Ole is a fraud feck him off' camp...which leads to the 'defend Ole at all costs' camp.

There are positives and negatives. I think the squad is improving, I think we are better than we were the last few years as a whole and alot depends how we kick on obviously (though I do think that, at times, our improvement though clear is slightly overstated...again only my opinion).

There are always going to be questions about Ole until we win the league. Even then I don't doubt some would still question if he is the man to lead a new generation.

The finish to this season is hugely important in that context, without necessarily being defining...as finishing outside of the top 4 and being trophyless can only be seen as a failure in alot of respects.

The Chelsea transfer ban is a good point tbf, and it's a petfectly understandable argument that we should be finishing above a team that couldn't sign players and lost their only world class performer (IMO).

Lampard has done really well considering. Especially after the result first day of the season.

We are, pretty much, where I expected to be. We lacked in so many key areas in the last few years, and though some have been dealt with, they weren't all going to get fixed in two windows...

The rebuild needs to continue in the summer, and needs to continue quite heavily. If it does, the pressure is ramped up, because you're running out of excuses in this day and age.

I like Ole, though I remain sceptical as to whether he is the right man for the job...though obviously I hope he is.

He is a young manager developing and there is a question as to whether this is the job to develop in I suppose.

Nights like tonight are a case in point. We should, and need to be beating Sheff Utd.

Teams who sit deep and defend in well organised numbers have proven a problem all season...but hopefully Pogba, Fernandes, Rashford and potentially Greenwood can open the game up.

A poor result tonight and this place will be a little toxic you feel.

Ole has had a mixed bag really for me, but a strong finish to the season will hopefully build some more confidence....unlike the whimper we managed last season, which was pretty pathetic.

You get the feeling next season is the defining point for Ole, if he's supported in the window.

 

[andersj]

Due to injuries we played the biggest part of the first half of the season with two midfielders with less than 4000 minutes in the PL or similar level. We lost our entire midfield from last year (Herrera, Pogba and Matic). One of them, Paul Pogba, our only WC player.

We were also a bit thin upfront. Hopefully, with one more signing and Mason coming along, we will be in a better position next year.

It also always felt like we sacrificed this season from the beginning, selling Romelu Lukaku and moving Sanchez without replacing them. One must think the idea was long term over short term.

In my opinion, several players have developed alot the past year (McT, Fred, Rashford and AWB). But he need to continue developing them and our pattern of play. The alternativ is to replace several players, because few of them have been good enough. That being said, Bruno and Pogba will also replace two who have been below our standard.

 

[Godfather]

This has been a very very poor season no matter how the last games pan out. I am still convinced Ole is not a good enough manager. As he'll surely be given another season though I hope he proves me wrong.