Elliot Anderson | Athletic: United's main target

A couple of things being mostly lost here in the price discussion. Firstly, the PL market is insanely inflated, and is reflected in prices across the board. The midfield rebuild we need is very likely to cost us very, very large sums of money. You can argue that a certain amount is too much for Anderson, but you can make that same argument for almost every transfer fee nowadays, unless there’s a buy out clause or it’s for a hidden gem (which are incredibly hard and risky to find).

Secondly, we’ll have a shortlist of CM targets and we’ll end up buying the ones who want to come to us and who we feel we can do the most reasonable deals on. If Brighton are holding out for £110 million for Beleba and Anderson can be done for £85, then we’ll go for the latter. But it could be the other way around, or there could be a better deal to be done for Wharton or someone else. But at this stage it’s anyone’s guess the real amounts Wharton, Anderson, Baleba and whoever else we target will be valued at by their clubs come next summer, and what the competition for each player will be.
 
We need a new Anderson in our midfield

But yes doubt this happens in January, whatever or whoever it ends up being, I just hope to god we get it right, so many wrongs in that area for so many years
 
A couple of things being mostly lost here in the price discussion. Firstly, the PL market is insanely inflated, and is reflected in prices across the board. The midfield rebuild we need is very likely to cost us very, very large sums of money. You can argue that a certain amount is too much for Anderson, but you can make that same argument for almost every transfer fee nowadays, unless there’s a buy out clause or it’s for a hidden gem (which are incredibly hard and risky to find).

Secondly, we’ll have a shortlist of CM targets and we’ll end up buying the ones who want to come to us and who we feel we can do the most reasonable deals on. If Brighton are holding out for £110 million for Beleba and Anderson can be done for £85, then we’ll go for the latter. But it could be the other way around, or there could be a better deal to be done for Wharton or someone else. But at this stage it’s anyone’s guess the real amounts Wharton, Anderson, Baleba and whoever else we target will be valued at by their clubs come next summer, and what the competition for each player will be.
Lets hope thats not what we are doing. I would agree with everything you say but to a degree, this is just the latest iteration of an attempt to make it somehow reasonable to spend a fortune. Same thing happened last summer with Baleba. Now its more shared between Wharton, Baleba and Anderson. I do agree that we have to try to bring in instant impact but I think it is key to still be reasonable when it comes to prices. 70+ amounts don't really seem sensible, especially for a club that has more big flops than big successes. The moment to bring in Anderson has passed last summer (in my opinion).
 
The more I see of Mbuemo and how he's just slotted in and carried on his Premier League form from his Brentford time, the less I care about price tag. I think we just need to do a great job of identifying the number one candidate and go get him with authority.

If we think that's Anderson, just make it happen for 60m or 100m whatever.
 
For me signing Anderson would be a game changing signing. I think he's a superb player with a well rounded game. A player who has the ability to play in confined spaces and aslo has a strong progressive passing game which is then backed up by his ability to cover ground quickly in defensive transition. This player for me is the exact profile of player that is needed to propel us as far as playing a more proactive attacking game with and without the ball. I like Baleba from Brighton, but I feel we can potentially sign a similar type of profile for cheaper from either France or Germany. But for me Anderson should be the #1 target for midfield.

The only worry for me is that reports coming out are stating that Wilcox and Vivell favour the signing of Angelo Stiller, who is a good player but not as good as Anderson imo. I just hope Vivell can broaden his horizons and attempt to look past players from the RedBull clubs.
 
I like Anderson, he clearly has a decent skill set and was a big part of Forest’s successes last year. His stats and the eye test come out pretty well. However, becomes an obvious question of juice being worth the squeeze if they start banding £100m+ figures out like this.

I always think (somewhat seriously and somewhat flippantly) — surely there’s some Spanish geezer pinging it about somewhere who might be available for half the fee? Normally can’t go wrong with Spanish central midfielders. Zubimendi at Arsenal has turned out to be a huge upgrade on HMPartey — averaging 60+ passes a game on the regular with most of them being progressive. Nico Gonzalez is now starting to find his footing at City doing similar sorts of things etc.

The current PL champion, and the pervious one, don't have a 100m CM. They seem like doing fine.
 
He was brilliant against us. Absolutely dominated the midfield. Seems like the kind of player we badly need. But also one that we should have signed this past summer. Now he’ll cost a fortune.

Would I be right in saying that he’s more well rounded than Baleba (at his form from last season)? Just seemed like he was was everywhere and doing everything.
 
He was brilliant against us. Absolutely dominated the midfield. Seems like the kind of player we badly need. But also one that we should have signed this past summer. Now he’ll cost a fortune.

Would I be right in saying that he’s more well rounded than Baleba (at his form from last season)? Just seemed like he was was everywhere and doing everything.


And that's what Bruno is criticized for. People seems to want a CM with discipline and to "hold the shape".
 
A couple of things being mostly lost here in the price discussion. Firstly, the PL market is insanely inflated, and is reflected in prices across the board. The midfield rebuild we need is very likely to cost us very, very large sums of money. You can argue that a certain amount is too much for Anderson, but you can make that same argument for almost every transfer fee nowadays, unless there’s a buy out clause or it’s for a hidden gem (which are incredibly hard and risky to find).

Secondly, we’ll have a shortlist of CM targets and we’ll end up buying the ones who want to come to us and who we feel we can do the most reasonable deals on. If Brighton are holding out for £110 million for Beleba and Anderson can be done for £85, then we’ll go for the latter. But it could be the other way around, or there could be a better deal to be done for Wharton or someone else. But at this stage it’s anyone’s guess the real amounts Wharton, Anderson, Baleba and whoever else we target will be valued at by their clubs come next summer, and what the competition for each player will be.

It doesn't need to be hidden gem price range, e.g an unknown young rare player, just needs to be someone who can come in and do a job now but also at the age where they can improve over the next couple seasons. Liverpool signed Gravenberch and Mac Allister for under £40m each. We need our recruitment team to show their worth and find deals like that. We can't spend £150-200m on two midfielders and neglect other positions. These big money signings rarely work out either. I just don't think it's true to say that we the midfield rebuild is "very likely to cost us very, very large sums of money" when other teams find a way of getting these £30-50m players that work out for them. We need to do better at recruiting in that price bracket as it isn't sustainable otherwise.
 
The more I see of Mbuemo and how he's just slotted in and carried on his Premier League form from his Brentford time, the less I care about price tag. I think we just need to do a great job of identifying the number one candidate and go get him with authority.

If we think that's Anderson, just make it happen for 60m or 100m whatever.
Wharton, Anderson and Baleba for a combined £250-270m!
 
Wharton, Anderson and Baleba for a combined £250-270m!
I think Wharton might be the one im interested in least, which I think is against most peoples opinion. I am really unsure about him even though I love the player profile he is.
 
I think Wharton might be the one im interested in least, which I think is against most peoples opinion. I am really unsure about him even though I love the player profile he is.
Yea fair, I was saying get it all done in one go muppet style.
 
The more I see of Mbuemo and how he's just slotted in and carried on his Premier League form from his Brentford time, the less I care about price tag. I think we just need to do a great job of identifying the number one candidate and go get him with authority.

If we think that's Anderson, just make it happen for 60m or 100m whatever.
For one Mbeumo, there are dozen PL proven players who didn't adapt well in bigger club. Or at least needed season or two to adapt.
Look at PL inside transfers this year. How many of them were instant success, despite "knowing a league" and other things?

Paying fortune for Anderson could be expensive mistake. My opinion about premium transfer fees is that you pay premium price only in two situations;
1. For player in his prime who has multiple great seasons in his career.
2. Generational talent
 
And Anderson was bought for £35 million. What would Vitinha go for now?
Anderson is fighting relegation while PSG are in the top 5 teams in the world at the moment winning the champions league and many others with Vitinha being probably top 3 player in that team. Ofcourse Vitinha is going to go for more, what has Anderson achieved besides being "premier league proven".
 
I always think (somewhat seriously and somewhat flippantly) — surely there’s some Spanish geezer pinging it about somewhere who might be available for half the fee?

Funnily enough, following on from our conversation yesterday - I just saw a (probably nonsense, unreliable) twitter account link Man Utd with Javi Guerra of Valencia again. He looks creative with his passing and dribbling, though appears to offer surprisingly little defensively at the moment given his size.

and Stiller and we are set for CMs

How many times do I have to keep saying this regarding Stiller?...

steve-carell.gif


He is a terrible pick for United's midfield two. He's basically non-existent defensively and too weak. It'll be a Kagawa/Wirtz/Van De Beek type of mistake.
 
I always kind of thought of Anderson as a McT type who is much better at tackling and who starts every week and has had more oppurturnity to iron out his game...

I guess I was dead wrong because he keeps improving and hes beaten our midfield nearly every time they've faced off. I just wish we could spot these players earlier before they slip into mega transfer territory every single time.
 
I am very skeptical about the 100m price. I think he is like a 60-70 player.

- He is below average for CMs in goal contributions.

- He is good defensively but below the elite players

- Passing is good but not elite

- Best part of his game is probably carries and take-ons.

While he is a good all round CM, he is not elite in creativity or in stopping the opposition. For comparisons to Rice or Caicedo. Rice is 94% for NP Goals and 95% for assists. Caicedo has 93% pass completion and 75% progressive passing and is genuinely elite as a DM.

Overall a good solid CM who will improve us significantly but not deserving of 100m price tag.
People used to say almost the exact same things about Declan Rice.
 
How many times do I have to keep saying this regarding Stiller?...

steve-carell.gif


He is a terrible pick for United's midfield two. He's basically non-existent defensively and too weak. It'll be a Kagawa/Wirtz/Van De Beek type of mistake.

Apparently our scout wanted to sign him in the summer but he rejected us. Real Madrid is also interested in him. Even Toni Kross the player he is likened to approved of him.

He is complete midfielder with impressive passing and defending stats.
 
I am very skeptical about the 100m price. I think he is like a 60-70 player.

- He is below average for CMs in goal contributions.

- He is good defensively but below the elite players

- Passing is good but not elite

- Best part of his game is probably carries and take-ons.

While he is a good all round CM, he is not elite in creativity or in stopping the opposition. For comparisons to Rice or Caicedo. Rice is 94% for NP Goals and 95% for assists. Caicedo has 93% pass completion and 75% progressive passing and is genuinely elite as a DM.

Overall a good solid CM who will improve us significantly but not deserving of 100m price tag.
Anderson.png

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They complement each other quite well.

Maybe I'm wrong but when I see United and the system Amorim employs, I feel like the profile of Anderson is someone you'd want to have in your midfield more. An all round combative midfielder.
 
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He is the latest MUST HAVE signing, even the classic £100M price tag is included.

Ticks every box…but one look at the Baleba thread can show you how quickly it can change.
 
But they also have said that about many players who never came close to being worth it.
Who? Which players in the PL have performed like Anderson and Rice (for West Ham) in Premier League at a young age, sold for a large amount, and then went on to not be worth it?
 
But they also have said that about many players who never came close to being worth it.
Im not saying we should pay that fee or whether he’s a guaranteed success. But, every signing we make is a gamble to some extent.

So id rather take a gamble on Anderson. He’s playing at a level Rice was prior to joining Arsenal. Lots of United fans didn’t want him either and they were wrong. If we let Anderson go to city or Liverpool we will regret it
 
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Feel like there's a flavour of the month midfielder every season now. Mainoo 2 years ago, Wharton last season and now Anderson. All excellent but none warrant the price quoted during their breakout season in the long-term.
 
He is complete midfielder with impressive passing and defending stats.

He is not a "complete midfielder" - his defending is basically non-existent.

Stiller has also literally just been dropped from the German national team ffs...

Ignore Toni Kroos being kind about a compatriot, he is not right for United.
 
I think there's better value to be found out there. He's 23 years old so we are basically looking at the finished product here. Anyone else get Kalvin Philips vibes?

Worth a punt for the right price but for me the correct price is around £50m, they can shove it if they want 100.
 
Feel like there's a flavour of the month midfielder every season now. Mainoo 2 years ago, Wharton last season and now Anderson. All excellent but none warrant the price quoted during their breakout season in the long-term.

The Baleba hype in the summer was mental.
 
Who? Which players in the PL have performed like Anderson and Rice (for West Ham) in Premier League at a young age, sold for a large amount, and then went on to not be worth it?
Plenty....Fofana, Mount, Bissaka, Richalison, Lukaku, Lavia etc. Ones I don't rate although it's to early but feel they aren't worth their price and won't be worth it are Madueke, Elanga, Neto, Isak and a few more. All these players went for 50 million and up which is big money especially considering some were bought years ago and all at young ages considering their positions.
 
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He is the latest MUST HAVE signing, even the classic £100M price tag is included.

Ticks every box…but one look at the Baleba thread can show you how quickly it can change.
Baleba was never this good. Everyone was just desperate for a midfield signing.
 
Plenty....Fofana, Mount, Bissaka, Richalison, Lukaku, Lavia etc. Ones I don't rate although it's to early but feel they aren't worth their price and won't be worth it are Madueke, Elanga, Neto, Isak and a few more. All these players went for 50 million and up which is big money especially considering some were bought years ago and all at young ages considering their positions.
It’s a risk, no matter where they come from. Stiller, Vitinha etc can be complete stinkers too, you never know. At this point Anderson is surely less risk of failure than the ones from abroad, resulting in 20M extra price
 
Who? Which players in the PL have performed like Anderson and Rice (for West Ham) in Premier League at a young age, sold for a large amount, and then went on to not be worth it?
I didn't mention being sold for a large amount, but for example jack Rodwell was hyped in a similar way also, and he was average. Closer to home Mainoo and Nick powell though we do not have the stats for the latter. I am not good at thinking of past players off the top of my head, but there always hyped players.
 
He is not a "complete midfielder" - his defending is basically non-existent.

Stiller has also literally just been dropped from the German national team ffs...

Ignore Toni Kroos being kind about a compatriot, he is not right for United.
Agreed. He lacks pace and intensity in my opinion. Not a good fit for the PL
 
I like how we’re targeting these type of players now. These players will bring us back to the top.
 
I didn't mention being sold for a large amount, but for example jack Rodwell was hyped in a similar way also, and he was average. Closer to home Mainoo and Nick powell though we do not have the stats for the latter. I am not good at thinking of past players off the top of my head, but there always hyped players.
Nick Powell was never hyper in the same way.

Plus injuries ruined his chances
 
Plenty....Fofana, Mount, Bissaka, Richalison, Lukaku, Lavia etc. Ones I don't rate although it's to early but feel they aren't worth their price and won't be worth it are Madueke, Elanga, Neto, Isak and a few more. All these players went for 50 million and up which is big money especially considering some were bought years ago and all at young ages considering their positions.
I am not asking for players who went for big money, though. I am asking for players that performed at a level like Anderson and Rice did, and then failed when they went elsewhere in the league. The players you mentioned are a combination of injuries and players that didn't perform at their level. Anderson is one of the best CMs in the league at 23, and he has had only one injury in his career. Lukaku is probably the only one in that list in terms of being among the best in their position in the league, but I would not say he failed. He just didn't like playing for us, and he had some weaknesses that we were not really used to seeing in our strikers. He helped us to 2nd in the league with 24 goal contributions with no penalties. That's pretty good, in my opinion.
 
Who? Which players in the PL have performed like Anderson and Rice (for West Ham) in Premier League at a young age, sold for a large amount, and then went on to not be worth it?

Grealish, Maguire, Lavia and Fofana (due to injuries), Lukaku. There are a few. Schneiderlin was someone who had a similar profile (young, good performance for a weaker club, lacking elite physicality) and struggled with us.
 
I didn't mention being sold for a large amount, but for example jack Rodwell was hyped in a similar way also, and he was average. Closer to home Mainoo and Nick powell though we do not have the stats for the latter. I am not good at thinking of past players off the top of my head, but there always hyped players.
That is the thing, this is all hype. Not performance-related. Mainoo was getting hyped because of his calm presence and technical skills, but his weaknesses were there for everyone to see. Non-existant passing range, slow, poor stamina, and more. Nick Powell came from League Two.

The difference is that Anderson is performing at such a high level in the league that he is considered one of the best CMs in it. Most would probably only have 5 or 6 midfielders from PL ahead of him, and some of those are genuinely world class.
 
Im not saying we should pay that fee or whether he’s a guaranteed success. But, every signing we make is a gamble to some extent.

So id rather take a gamble on Anderson. He’s playing at a level Rice. Lots of United fans didn’t want him either and they were wrong. If we let Anderson go to city or Liverpool we will regret it
We missed the opportunity to sign him when he was picked up by Nottingham Forest from Newcastle for a reported £35m. Absolute steal.
I watched him when he was on loan to Bristol Rovers. He was played on the left wing and his potential was obvious even then. Even as a teenager, he always wanted the ball and had an eye for the goal, including a towering header when they had to beat Scunthorpe 7-0 and did that in extra time to get promoted.

So we mustn't miss the chance again. Top player.