England Squad Confirmed vs Holland & Italy

MikeKing

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I think Smalling would be the most decorated player in that team, and yet he isn't picked. Hopefully it's just so he can rest, because him not going to the world cup is truly silly when you look at that defence. On a slightly different note. I really can't see this idea of England playing possession based football successfully coming to fruition. Henderson, Welbeck, Vardy, Dier, Walker, etc... Its not going to work, is it? Sacrificing a good defence to pretend Henderson is some sort of Pirlo makes a lot of sense.
If he had some balls he would try something weird like this, and try to play on people's strength.
Pope
Walker-Smalling-Maguire-Shaw
Dier
Shelvey-Lewis Cook
Sterling-Vardy-Rashford
On the grand scale its terrible, but to rely on Henderson, Wilshere and Oxlade as CM's is silly. Play some actual CM's at least, that might pass through lines and into the pacey attackers. Have a decent defence, with some cover from midfield to prevent silly mistakes and easy goals against. Then man-manage the shit out of them so they keep consistency
 

MadDogg

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Is Smalling actually playing that well?

Dived for the free kick that lead to the Newcastle winner the other week and poor positioning for the first on Tuesday.

Rather see Harry Maguire in there.
It really should be a Smalling-Maguire partnership.

Or if Southgate really wants to focus on his ideal and use Stones-Maguire, Smalling should at least be there on the bench so he can be bought in if England play matches where the team can't get control (lets be honest, with that midfield it will probably happen a lot). Smalling is easily the best actual 'defender' that England have. Maybe Jones will fill that role when we get to the WC itself, but IMO he's not as good as Smalling (although many on here would disagree) and more importantly who knows if he'll actually be fit when he's needed.
 
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LFCKop

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Welback is in but no Murray. No wonder England never makes beyond QF in major tournaments. Star quality preferred over actual playing skills.
 
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SpyLuke10

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If I was England manager then I'd play a back 3 of Smalling Stones and Jones.
 

SoCross

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Welbeck over Murray is a puzzling decision if selections happen on form.

Who's that CB playing for Newcastle? He's been quite good this season hasn't he. I'd have considered Ward-Prowse too.
 

Pexbo

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Hart has Southgate nudes. Only explanation.
 

SkeppyRed

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Is it really a suprise there’s no Smalling. He’s shite and in the 4 seasons he’s been a first choice cb for United we’ve finished 7th, 4th, 5th and 6th.
 

Yagami

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Should be one of United’s summer signings; potentially world class footballer who’s performances are going under the radar because he’s got a dull name and plays for a mediocre team. If he was doing it in the Bundesliga or France he’d be getting a lot more attention.
I'd be all for signing him. He's the type of CM we should be looking at the partner Matic and Pogba. A midfielder who can playmake, resist pressing players and can contribute in defence. He may not fulfill his potential but I think he's worth taking a chance on.
 

12OunceEpilogue

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Kane out would be a big blow (let's hope he's not taking the corners this year) but attack isn't too bad in terms of talent and depth.

Sterling been underwhelming for England and an easy target for the boo boos but like him or nor he's been excellent for Man. City this season.

I tip my hat to Vardy. Thought he was a one season wonder but here he is two years later still scoring and giving the best defences in the leagues major trouble. Problem at international level is many teams will sit deep and England won't get far enough to play a major team who'll park their defence on the halfway line. Still a credible option though, he'd cause someone like Argentina major issues.

Rashford. Not played a huge amount but still a good scoring record.

Defence and particularly midfield options worry me far more than upfront.
Agreed on that, with or without Kane attack is the least of our worries. I suppose my issue is, unfair though it may be given they aren't to blame for past failings, we've seen good players and good prospects try and fail for England time after time and so I've no faith in the current incumbents producing anything of note in Russia.

Couple that rock with the hard place that is the marked regression in quality behind them, when compared to that of the previous ten major tournaments, and you can see the problems we're likely to have.
 

Kag

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Welback is in but no Murray. No wonder England never makes beyond QF in major tournaments. Star quality preferred over actual playing skills.
I don't know why international managers get criticism for this. I understand it, but just disagree completely. They pick players that they like. Glenn Murray might be scoring a few but he's largely shite and falls into the Lambert/Holt bracket of player that isn't good enough to play for England.

Now you might not rate Welbeck but managers do. He's a good egg (which is important at international tournaments) and has good pedigree for England. He's also one of only a few options that can genuinely offer pace and width. Sterling and Rashford (who is better up top) aside, we lack any real width.

Rewarding players with an England call up on the basis of a couple month's good form isn't how managers should go about it. Jack Wilshere could sit on the bench for the rest of the season but he'd still be the first central midfielder on my team sheet come June.

It has nothing to do with 'names' either. It's merely preference. Martin Samuel at the Mail once argued that you should pick your best 18 players and gloss it off with good eggs that get along with everybody. When you look at the numbers and how many players actually get a kick, it's a good idea. It's why Welbeck might be in the squad, as it's likely he won't be anywhere near the starting line up or first three substitutions.
 

roonster09

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Welback is in but no Murray. No wonder England never makes beyond QF in major tournaments. Star quality preferred over actual playing skills.
Who is this star quality you are talking about? Murray is 34 years old and adds nothing to the team. As it is both won't start anyways, at least Welbeck gives you option on wings too.
 

12OunceEpilogue

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I don't know why international managers get criticism for this. I understand it, but just disagree completely. They pick players that they like. Glenn Murray might be scoring a few but he's largely shite and falls into the Lambert/Holt bracket of player that isn't good enough to play for England.

Now you might not rate Welbeck but managers do. He's a good egg (which is important at international tournaments) and has good pedigree for England. He's also one of only a few options that can genuinely offer pace and width. Sterling and Rashford (who is better up top) aside, we lack any real width.

Rewarding players with an England call up on the basis of a couple month's good form isn't how managers should go about it. Jack Wilshere could sit on the bench for the rest of the season but he'd still be the first central midfielder on my team sheet come June.

It has nothing to do with 'names' either. It's merely preference. Martin Samuel at the Mail once argued that you should pick your best 18 players and gloss it off with good eggs that get along with everybody. When you look at the numbers and how many players actually get a kick, it's a good idea. It's why Welbeck might be in the squad, as it's likely he won't be anywhere near the starting line up or first three substitutions.
Agree, although if we're honest neither Murray nor Welbeck answer any of the stark questions that will face this squad in the summer. Obviously you have to pick somebody, and if Kane doesn't make it I could see forwards behind Vardy, Rashford and Sterling having a role to play, particularly as the latter two may be deployed in wider areas.
 

Classical Mechanic

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I don't know why international managers get criticism for this. I understand it, but just disagree completely. They pick players that they like. Glenn Murray might be scoring a few but he's largely shite and falls into the Lambert/Holt bracket of player that isn't good enough to play for England.

Now you might not rate Welbeck but managers do. He's a good egg (which is important at international tournaments) and has good pedigree for England. He's also one of only a few options that can genuinely offer pace and width. Sterling and Rashford (who is better up top) aside, we lack any real width.

Rewarding players with an England call up on the basis of a couple month's good form isn't how managers should go about it. Jack Wilshere could sit on the bench for the rest of the season but he'd still be the first central midfielder on my team sheet come June.

It has nothing to do with 'names' either. It's merely preference. Martin Samuel at the Mail once argued that you should pick your best 18 players and gloss it off with good eggs that get along with everybody. When you look at the numbers and how many players actually get a kick, it's a good idea. It's why Welbeck might be in the squad, as it's likely he won't be anywhere near the starting line up or first three substitutions.
I think Hart is there as a cheerleader. I hope so anyway.
 

giorno

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The way people go about Smalling you'd think he was Bobby Fecking Moore

He's a bang average defender with years of experience of failures, who instead of learning, maturing and improving with age has instead turned into a nervous wreck who plays with less confidence in himself than Claude has in Wenger

If Kane is fit, England will be a tough cookie in Russia, mark my words
 

Litch

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Worse England team ever that will be going to a World Cup.....
 

Classical Mechanic

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No it isn't, even if Southgate is still a question...
It probably is to be fair, can't think of a worse one to go to any tournament in terms of individual player quality.

edit: maybe the last one was worse, you had Gerarrd, Lampard and Rooney but all were past their best by that point.
 

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It probably is to be fair, can't think of a worse one to go to any tournament in terms of individual player quality.

edit: maybe the last one was worse, you had Gerarrd, Lampard and Rooney but all were past their best by that point.
:lol: After reading your first sentence I was going to reply the same, for me the one from 2014 was worse, actually I don't think this team is bad in terms of individual quality, my question is more around how will they perform with the back 3 under Southgate.
 

Web of Bissaka

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I guess Southgate is still uncertain who the 3 GK should be.

:lol: He hates Smalling? His defensive ability is useful. Fair enough for sticking to seriously change the team, but the CB zone may be leaky.
Their loss, our gain I suppose, don't want him to get needlessly injured and to get good rest.

Shelvey is a fair shout, but I suppose his discipline can be a risk.

Okay, the current England squad is boring, uninspiring. Love to be surprised otherwise this upcoming World Cup.
 

RoyH1

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An unintended benefit of such a shite England squad, is that perhaps this time the sycophantic press might lower their expectations and the team can play with a bit less pressure than previous England teams? Just a thought. I mean seriously, no one expects this lot to get further than the quarterfinals if that.
 

Danny Roberts

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We're not very good, that's all there is to it. We don't have the players from a technical point of view, we don't have a defined identity and we don't have the mentality. Hopefully some of this is changing with the success of the youth teams but more than likely they'll get huge money when they've achived nowt, stop working and then rot on the bench as better foreign players get the game time.
 

MUFC OK

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Plenty of players that aren't bad on their day. A far cry from all the world class talent we once had and how passionate they were too.
Think this is a myth, the likes of Lampard, Gerrard Terry, Ferdinand, A.Cole were passionate for their club sides, but not for England.. In fact they admitted that club rivalries got in the way of success of the team..

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...ds-golden-generation-held-club-rivalries.html

Excuse the Daily Mail link.
 

MUFC OK

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An unintended benefit of such a shite England squad, is that perhaps this time the sycophantic press might lower their expectations and the team can play with a bit less pressure than previous England teams? Just a thought. I mean seriously, no one expects this lot to get further than the quarterfinals if that.
No, the bandwagon will start and the press will build us up before the tournament starts without fail.. After all, if they can't build the team up, they can't break them down when the inevitable failure occurs.. which would mean less paper sales and clicks on both counts.

The media will develop a narrative that we have a genuine chance before the tournament starts.
 

VeevaVee

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MUFC OK

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I was thinking more like Gazza, Beckham etc
Ah, I agree on those two. In fact the whole Euro 96 squad seemed to grasp what it meant to wear the shirt despite not being the most technically gifted team England have had. That said, the professionalism in terms of drinking culture etc was a lot worse back then from what I have heard.
 

JustFootballFan

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I don't know why international managers get criticism for this. I understand it, but just disagree completely. They pick players that they like. Glenn Murray might be scoring a few but he's largely shite and falls into the Lambert/Holt bracket of player that isn't good enough to play for England.

Now you might not rate Welbeck but managers do. He's a good egg (which is important at international tournaments) and has good pedigree for England. He's also one of only a few options that can genuinely offer pace and width. Sterling and Rashford (who is better up top) aside, we lack any real width.

Rewarding players with an England call up on the basis of a couple month's good form isn't how managers should go about it. Jack Wilshere could sit on the bench for the rest of the season but he'd still be the first central midfielder on my team sheet come June.

It has nothing to do with 'names' either. It's merely preference. Martin Samuel at the Mail once argued that you should pick your best 18 players and gloss it off with good eggs that get along with everybody. When you look at the numbers and how many players actually get a kick, it's a good idea. It's why Welbeck might be in the squad, as it's likely he won't be anywhere near the starting line up or first three substitutions.
Rightfully so. Marcotti said the same thing and Burley/Nicol looked at him like he was a lunatic. No wonder England and Scotland suck at these tournaments. That´s just common sense. The top international teams plan to be together 5-7 weeks with prep and the whole tournament. You can´t have a guy that will be sulking for six weeks, if he´s not playing, maybe trying to undermine the starters internally or in the press. Or one who is partying too hard and living in the next brothel for a month. Ideally you take a 2-3 youngsters to learn (maybe with some specialist skillsets), 1-2 veterans that are always positive, well-respected and trusted by their peers, but still able to do a job, when called upon as last resort. Then you have two goalies and that leaves you with 16-18 guys who are the real core of the team.

That´s why Southgate also needs these friendlies. Spend a week with some new players to get to know them.
 

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Rightfully so. Marcotti said the same thing and Burley/Nicol looked at him like he was a lunatic.
I keep saying the same thing all the time, a lot of posters, pundits or football fans keep thinking International Football is the Champions League or the Premier League.

It's totally different, only Spain or Germany can try to replicate some habits they have from Bayern, Madrid or Barcelona. Brazil can't do it, Argentina or France also, their main players are spread around Europe.
 

YouOnlyLiveTwice

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Rashford - Welbeck
Sterling
Rose - Wilshere - Henderson - Walker
Maguire - Dier - Stones
Pickford​
 
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Random Task

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Goalkeepers

Joe Hart, Nick Pope, Jordan Pickford, Jack Butland

Defenders

Ryan Bertrand, Joe Gomez, Harry Maguire, Alfie Mawson, Danny Rose, John Stones, James Tarkowski, Kieran Trippier, Kyle Walker

Midfielders

Dele Alli, Lewis Cook, Eric Dier, Jordan Henderson, Adam Lallana, Jesse Lingard, Jake Livermore, Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain, Jack Wilshere, Ashley Young

Forwards

Marcus Rashford, Jamie Vardy, Danny Welbeck, Raheem Sterling
This has got to be the most uninspiring England squad ever created, not a single world class player among them.
 

ThierryHenry

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I don't know why international managers get criticism for this. I understand it, but just disagree completely. They pick players that they like. Glenn Murray might be scoring a few but he's largely shite and falls into the Lambert/Holt bracket of player that isn't good enough to play for England.

Now you might not rate Welbeck but managers do. He's a good egg (which is important at international tournaments) and has good pedigree for England. He's also one of only a few options that can genuinely offer pace and width. Sterling and Rashford (who is better up top) aside, we lack any real width.

Rewarding players with an England call up on the basis of a couple month's good form isn't how managers should go about it. Jack Wilshere could sit on the bench for the rest of the season but he'd still be the first central midfielder on my team sheet come June.

It has nothing to do with 'names' either. It's merely preference. Martin Samuel at the Mail once argued that you should pick your best 18 players and gloss it off with good eggs that get along with everybody. When you look at the numbers and how many players actually get a kick, it's a good idea. It's why Welbeck might be in the squad, as it's likely he won't be anywhere near the starting line up or first three substitutions.
Good post.
 

Danny Roberts

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I disagree that Welbeck won't be near the starting team. Managers love him and have largely played him for Enghland when fit. If he has a decent run to the end of the season I could see him playing or coming off the bench.
 

Mb194dc

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The England squad is very limited these days and the tactics and players in the 11 need to be adjusted to match the players available.

We aren’t going to dominate possession, especially against the better international sides. Getting out of the group at the WC is about as much as we can hope for. Wouldn’t be surprised though if we finished bottom below Tunisia and Panama at the WC.

We need to setup to play on the counter attack. We have a few quick forwards, Vardy, Rashford, Welbeck , Sterling who are suited to it.