Eredivisie 2021-22

mu4c_20le

Full Member
Joined
Jul 7, 2013
Messages
26,708
Equalized just before the break
 

VanDeBank

Ma’am
Joined
May 13, 2021
Messages
3,500
Onana has been terrible since he returned from suspension. It's like he doesn't want to play for Ajax anymore, since he's leaving anyway. Too bad Ten Hag keeps playing him...
How does that even work? He doesn't make a proper reflexive safe or the right decisions cause he's making a move in the summer? He still needs to train hard for Cameroon even if he didn't care about Ajax. Although maybe the fans turning on him has affected his confidence.

Most likely, he's just really rusty because he hasn't played for ~9 months. He was bad for Cameroon as well.
 

Stadjer

Full Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2013
Messages
4,737
Location
The Netherlands
Onana has been terrible since he returned from suspension. It's like he doesn't want to play for Ajax anymore, since he's leaving anyway. Too bad Ten Hag keeps playing him...
Does he have a choice? Stekelenburg has been injured and is out for the season. Pasveer is injured but was actually first choice even after Onana came back from suspension. Right now it is Onana or failed former PSV goalkeeper Tyton (that Ajax signed as a bandaid). Dont think ten Hag has a better option than Onana.
 

VanDeBank

Ma’am
Joined
May 13, 2021
Messages
3,500
Does he have a choice? Stekelenburg has been injured and is out for the season. Pasveer is injured but was actually first choice even after Onana came back from suspension. Right now it is Onana or failed former PSV goalkeeper Tyton (that Ajax signed as a bandaid). Dont think ten Hag has a better option than Onana.
Agreed. They got a young goalie to replace Scherpen, Jay Gorter (I think?). He plays for the youth team but isn't deemed ready.
 

Terranova

Full Member
Joined
Nov 12, 2020
Messages
605
Supports
United/Ajax
How does that even work? He doesn't make a proper reflexive safe or the right decisions cause he's making a move in the summer? He still needs to train hard for Cameroon even if he didn't care about Ajax. Although maybe the fans turning on him has affected his confidence.

Most likely, he's just really rusty because he hasn't played for ~9 months. He was bad for Cameroon as well.
well a goalkeeper without focus isn't that great, he doesn't seem like he's trying sometimes.

Does he have a choice? Stekelenburg has been injured and is out for the season. Pasveer is injured but was actually first choice even after Onana came back from suspension. Right now it is Onana or failed former PSV goalkeeper Tyton (that Ajax signed as a bandaid). Dont think ten Hag has a better option than Onana.
Onana had to play for like 2 matches, but after those performances and Tyton and Gorter being able to play, why bother playing someone who doesn't want to play.
 

Cheimoon

Made of cheese
Scout
Joined
Jun 22, 2020
Messages
8,884
Location
Canada
Supports
no-one in particular
Teletekst is reporting (based on other media) that Alfred Schreuder is going to be Ten Hag's successor at Ajax. Signing for two years apparently.

Does anyone know how he's doing at Brugge? I know that, after two victories against Union, Brugge have finally caught up with and overtaken them (unfortunately; what a story that would have been!) and will likely be champions of Belgium again. How are they playing though? @onemanarmy, @RobinLFC, @Orestetes?
 

RobinLFC

Cries when Liverpool doesn't get praised
Joined
May 20, 2014
Messages
17,747
Location
Belgium
Supports
Liverpool
Teletekst is reporting (based on other media) that Alfred Schreuder is going to be Ten Hag's successor at Ajax. Signing for two years apparently.

Does anyone know how he's doing at Brugge? I know that, after two victories against Union, Brugge have finally caught up with and overtaken them (unfortunately; what a story that would have been!) and will likely be champions of Belgium again. How are they playing though? @onemanarmy, @RobinLFC, @Orestetes?
I don't really watch any Belgian league games so the only things I know about Bruges is what I've heard on the radio or read in the newspaper. It hasn't been as convincing domestically this year as in years past but that was already the case under Clement in the beginning of the season before he left for Monaco. I know Schreuder has tried a lot of different things in midfield but has yet to find a real winning formula with every player in a set position (although that's also due to personnel, e.g. Odoi only coming in mid-season).

I think you shouldn't (right away) expect the football Ten Hag brought to the table but Schreuder seems like he's more than capable enough to keep Ajax competitive and win the league with them. I think @onemanarmy is a Bruges fan so he should be able to tell you a lot more than me.
 

onemanarmy

Full Member
Joined
Jul 18, 2013
Messages
4,121
Location
Belgium
Teletekst is reporting (based on other media) that Alfred Schreuder is going to be Ten Hag's successor at Ajax. Signing for two years apparently.

Does anyone know how he's doing at Brugge? I know that, after two victories against Union, Brugge have finally caught up with and overtaken them (unfortunately; what a story that would have been!) and will likely be champions of Belgium again. How are they playing though? @onemanarmy, @RobinLFC, @Orestetes?
He's done ok, nothing spectacular. It surprises me Ajax go for him. He's made some very weird choices and got lucky with them in the last couple of games. The Brugge squad is a lot better than the Union one, so it was to be expected they would overtake them in the final games. I would have loved to see Union become champions.
 

do.ob

Full Member
Joined
Jun 19, 2010
Messages
12,264
Location
Germany
Supports
Borussia Dortmund
Schreuder's work in Hoffenheim wasn't bad either. In true Dutch fashion he seemed to have stumbled over his attitude more than his results there.
 

Graveyard

New Member
Newbie
Joined
May 10, 2018
Messages
87
Schreuder is a good choice. Ajax will always play the same style anyways. I'd worry more about the DoF role.
 

Cheimoon

Made of cheese
Scout
Joined
Jun 22, 2020
Messages
8,884
Location
Canada
Supports
no-one in particular
He's done ok, nothing spectacular. It surprises me Ajax go for him. He's made some very weird choices and got lucky with them in the last couple of games. The Brugge squad is a lot better than the Union one, so it was to be expected they would overtake them in the final games. I would have loved to see Union become champions.
I kinda, ish, like the idea of the final league phase where points are halved, cause it adds some tension. But then it sucks how a good lead built up in the course of a year is (half) wiped out. It really screwed over Union this year - although they had started faltering already, of course.

(I also only follow that through the news btw, I haven't seen a minute of Belgian football.)
 

VanDeBank

Ma’am
Joined
May 13, 2021
Messages
3,500
I kinda, ish, like the idea of the final league phase where points are halved, cause it adds some tension. But then it sucks how a good lead built up in the course of a year is (half) wiped out. It really screwed over Union this year - although they had started faltering already, of course.

(I also only follow that through the news btw, I haven't seen a minute of Belgian football.)
Really? The only upside for me is the top teams playing each other more frequently. Are the Belgians still doing that?

There is nothing more boring than watching Ajax play a 2nd half of football with a 6-0 lead.
 

onemanarmy

Full Member
Joined
Jul 18, 2013
Messages
4,121
Location
Belgium
Really? The only upside for me is the top teams playing each other more frequently. Are the Belgians still doing that?

There is nothing more boring than watching Ajax play a 2nd half of football with a 6-0 lead.
Yeah, top 4 play each other in a playoff type of competition. It's been a couple of fantastic games, like the one last night.
 

do.ob

Full Member
Joined
Jun 19, 2010
Messages
12,264
Location
Germany
Supports
Borussia Dortmund
I kinda, ish, like the idea of the final league phase where points are halved, cause it adds some tension. But then it sucks how a good lead built up in the course of a year is (half) wiped out. It really screwed over Union this year - although they had started faltering already, of course.

(I also only follow that through the news btw, I haven't seen a minute of Belgian football.)
I guess a playoff system or something similar would be one thing. But I think just arbitrarily halving points is a really lazy and desperate fix that tries to fix the symption without touching the underlying cause.
 

Cheimoon

Made of cheese
Scout
Joined
Jun 22, 2020
Messages
8,884
Location
Canada
Supports
no-one in particular
I guess a playoff system or something similar would be one thing. But I think just arbitrarily halving points is a really lazy and desperate fix that tries to fix the symption without touching the underlying cause.
I don't think they were trying to fix the kind of symptom you are (probably) thinking about, as there isn't really a runaway club in Belgium. Club has been dominant for a bit now, but nothing like Bayern: it hasn't been that long, they're not far in the distance, and there are other champions as well. (May have been Union this year - who just came up! - if it weren't for the play-off system. Which anyway does not involve play-offs btw. There are no knock-out matches, it's rather four parallel mini-leagues.)

Instead, I think this is rather about a lack of interest in the league, especially in the final stages, and even more so for fans of mid-table clubs. Cause this mini-league isn't just for the top spot: the numbers 5-8 simultaneously do a mini-league for a spot in the Conference League, and there are also mini-leagues in the bottom half of the league around the relegation spots. So what this mini-league system accomplished, is that every team has something to play for until the end; and for watchers, every match is interesting cause clubs are only playing their direct competitors. This is further strenghtened through the halving of points, which make sure no-one has disappeared into the distance at either the bottom or top end of the table.

I can see pros and cons of that, but the halving of the points I feel is really unfair (even if it does add further excitement).
 

Bloedrood

Full Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2013
Messages
551
He's done ok, nothing spectacular. It surprises me Ajax go for him. He's made some very weird choices and got lucky with them in the last couple of games. The Brugge squad is a lot better than the Union one, so it was to be expected they would overtake them in the final games. I would have loved to see Union become champions.
He left a really good impression at Ajax while he was Ten Hag's assistant, highly rated by the players aswell. In the Netherlands he's basically seen as the safe choice.
 

Cheimoon

Made of cheese
Scout
Joined
Jun 22, 2020
Messages
8,884
Location
Canada
Supports
no-one in particular
I wonder what this means for Ajax and PSV for next year. Both will have the unknown of new coaches with a limited pedigree and both will lose some key players whose input will be hard to replace. I'm thinking this might be a good moment for Feyenoord to challenge for the title - provided Slot stays and they don't also lose key players. I don't expect much from the subtop; except if the likes of AZ (maybe), Vitesse or Twente (both rather unlikely) have the sort of magical year where everything somehow comes together, none seem strong enough to push on and mount a challenge.
 

Bloedrood

Full Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2013
Messages
551
Ajax will loose a lot of good players. Mazraoui, Tagliafico, Gravenberch are certain to leave. Antony and Haller also likely to leave. Onana, but he was already written off. Tadic and Blind are getting older. Schreuder has quite a tough rebuilding job ahead of him.
 

Cheimoon

Made of cheese
Scout
Joined
Jun 22, 2020
Messages
8,884
Location
Canada
Supports
no-one in particular
why do people think this is how it works
At least Schreuder is likely to continue Ten Hag's approach. I couldn't believe when Ajax hired Martin Jol previously. But yeah, either way, all remains to be seen and proven.
 

VanDeBank

Ma’am
Joined
May 13, 2021
Messages
3,500
He left a really good impression at Ajax while he was Ten Hag's assistant, highly rated by the players aswell. In the Netherlands he's basically seen as the safe choice.
He's seen as the cheap option as well. Feyenoord's Arne Slot is the natural successor but his buy out clause is 7 million.
Maybe he's not interested because he doesn't want to deal with the bullshit that comes with such a move.

I wonder what this means for Ajax and PSV for next year. Both will have the unknown of new coaches with a limited pedigree and both will lose some key players whose input will be hard to replace. I'm thinking this might be a good moment for Feyenoord to challenge for the title - provided Slot stays and they don't also lose key players. I don't expect much from the subtop; except if the likes of AZ (maybe), Vitesse or Twente (both rather unlikely) have the sort of magical year where everything somehow comes together, none seem strong enough to push on and mount a challenge.
Malacia and Senesi are certainly leaving. Til is free to leave because of his Russian parent club.

These players are incredibly hard to replace. Feyenoord's problem is that they can't invest all the incoming $$$ because of their massive debt and their youth team is underperforming.

Ajax have a better youth setup they can look towards for replacements (Rensch, Ihattaren, maybe Regeer) They do need investment, but they'll fetch bigger fees as well. They're also capable of saying "no" like they've done with Tagliafico and Alvarez this season.

The difference in budget between the 3 teams is just too big. Any disruption in the Ajax > PSV > Feyenoord food chain will come from a manager losing the plot and doing a Moyes.
 

do.ob

Full Member
Joined
Jun 19, 2010
Messages
12,264
Location
Germany
Supports
Borussia Dortmund
I don't think they were trying to fix the kind of symptom you are (probably) thinking about, as there isn't really a runaway club in Belgium. Club has been dominant for a bit now, but nothing like Bayern: it hasn't been that long, they're not far in the distance, and there are other champions as well. (May have been Union this year - who just came up! - if it weren't for the play-off system. Which anyway does not involve play-offs btw. There are no knock-out matches, it's rather four parallel mini-leagues.)

Instead, I think this is rather about a lack of interest in the league, especially in the final stages, and even more so for fans of mid-table clubs. Cause this mini-league isn't just for the top spot: the numbers 5-8 simultaneously do a mini-league for a spot in the Conference League, and there are also mini-leagues in the bottom half of the league around the relegation spots. So what this mini-league system accomplished, is that every team has something to play for until the end; and for watchers, every match is interesting cause clubs are only playing their direct competitors. This is further strenghtened through the halving of points, which make sure no-one has disappeared into the distance at either the bottom or top end of the table.

I can see pros and cons of that, but the halving of the points I feel is really unfair (even if it does add further excitement).
Yes, to be honest I had the Austrian league in mind when posting, because they take the top 6 and halve their points, before they let them play out another mini-league. What I mainly wanted to say, but didn't elborate on enough, was that I think it's a terrible idea to cut points, because it messes too much with the integrity of the competition.

I can see how these mini leagues help create a bit more interest at the end of the season though.


Ajax will loose a lot of good players. Mazraoui, Tagliafico, Gravenberch are certain to leave. Antony and Haller also likely to leave. Onana, but he was already written off. Tadic and Blind are getting older. Schreuder has quite a tough rebuilding job ahead of him.
It could also be a blessing in disguise (TM) - I'm thinking about Spurs' drop off after their CL final. The last few years must have been a very intense journey for everyone involved. I could see some players lose their edge if they tried to basically just do the same with another coach. To a degree they also began to fade out a bit after exiting the CL, didn't they?
 
Last edited:

VanDeBank

Ma’am
Joined
May 13, 2021
Messages
3,500
Dutch preliminary squad:

Doel: Jasper Cillessen (Valencia), Mark Flekken (SC Freiburg), Tim Krul (Norwich City).
Verdediging: Nathan Aké (Manchester City), Daley Blind (Ajax), Virgil van Dijk (Liverpool), Denzel Dumfries (Internazionale), Hans Hateboer (Atalanta Bergamo), Rick Karsdorp (AS Roma), Matthijs de Ligt (Juventus), Tyrell Malacia (Feyenoord), Jordan Teze (PSV), Jurriën Timber (Ajax), Stefan de Vrij (Internazionale), Owen Wijndal (AZ).
Middenveld: Jordy Clasie (AZ), Frenkie de Jong (Barcelona), Davy Klaassen (Ajax), Teun Koopmeiners (Atalanta Bergamo), Marten de Roon (Atalanta Bergamo), Guus Til (Feyenoord).
Aanval: Steven Berghuis (Ajax), Steven Bergwijn (Tottenham Hotspur), Arnaut Danjuma (Villarreal), Memphis Depay (Barcelona), Cody Gakpo (PSV), Vincent Janssen (Monterrey), Luuk de Jong (Barcelona), Noa Lang (Club Brugge), Wout Weghorst (Burnley).

Van Gaal taking the piss with Vincent Janssen.
No Gini.
 

Cheimoon

Made of cheese
Scout
Joined
Jun 22, 2020
Messages
8,884
Location
Canada
Supports
no-one in particular
Dutch preliminary squad:

Doel: Jasper Cillessen (Valencia), Mark Flekken (SC Freiburg), Tim Krul (Norwich City).
Verdediging: Nathan Aké (Manchester City), Daley Blind (Ajax), Virgil van Dijk (Liverpool), Denzel Dumfries (Internazionale), Hans Hateboer (Atalanta Bergamo), Rick Karsdorp (AS Roma), Matthijs de Ligt (Juventus), Tyrell Malacia (Feyenoord), Jordan Teze (PSV), Jurriën Timber (Ajax), Stefan de Vrij (Internazionale), Owen Wijndal (AZ).
Middenveld: Jordy Clasie (AZ), Frenkie de Jong (Barcelona), Davy Klaassen (Ajax), Teun Koopmeiners (Atalanta Bergamo), Marten de Roon (Atalanta Bergamo), Guus Til (Feyenoord).
Aanval: Steven Berghuis (Ajax), Steven Bergwijn (Tottenham Hotspur), Arnaut Danjuma (Villarreal), Memphis Depay (Barcelona), Cody Gakpo (PSV), Vincent Janssen (Monterrey), Luuk de Jong (Barcelona), Noa Lang (Club Brugge), Wout Weghorst (Burnley).

Van Gaal taking the piss with Vincent Janssen.
No Gini.
It's funny, cause Teletekst presented it as if Janssen was called up instead of Wijnaldum. But it's not like they play in the same position at all, and that midfield group does look a bit small now compared to the attack. But then Berghuis could be seen as a midfielder as well I guess.
 

VanDeBank

Ma’am
Joined
May 13, 2021
Messages
3,500
It's funny, cause Teletekst presented it as if Janssen was called up instead of Wijnaldum. But it's not like they play in the same position at all, and that midfield group does look a bit small now compared to the attack. But then Berghuis could be seen as a midfielder as well I guess.
Teletekst still exist? :confused:

It's 30 players. LVG will trim it and put a few in the stands.
Malen and Frimpong have been injured. No real surprises.

U21 squad has some interesting players :D

 

Cheimoon

Made of cheese
Scout
Joined
Jun 22, 2020
Messages
8,884
Location
Canada
Supports
no-one in particular
Teletekst still exist? :confused:

It's 30 players. LVG will trim it and put a few in the stands.
Malen and Frimpong have been injured. No real surprises.
True, someone like Janssen is unlikely to make the final cut.

Yes, Teletekst is still going strong! I read it every day, it's a great source of quick and reliable information. Plus basic info on football from all over Europe (scores and tables of all major leagues and European competitions, as well as all big tournaments). They got a website and an app - I really recommend it. :)

Teletekst was just really loved in the Netherlands. I think that, until some years ago, it continued to rank highly in Dutch website stats, and that love for Teletekst has often been cited as a reason why a news site with short stories like nu.nl (if that even still exists) was enormously popular in the Netherlands.
 

VanDeBank

Ma’am
Joined
May 13, 2021
Messages
3,500
True, someone like Janssen is unlikely to make the final cut.

Yes, Teletekst is still going strong! I read it every day, it's a great source of quick and reliable information. Plus basic info on football from all over Europe (scores and tables of all major leagues and European competitions, as well as all big tournaments). They got a website and an app - I really recommend it. :)

Teletekst was just really loved in the Netherlands. I think that, until some years ago, it continued to rank highly in Dutch website stats, and that love for Teletekst has often been cited as a reason why a news site with short stories like nu.nl (if that even still exists) was enormously popular in the Netherlands.
Thanks, I just checked the darts scores (not that I'm into it)
That process was .. nostalgic :lol:

I could have sworn hearing about the discontinuation of the service years ago
 

Terranova

Full Member
Joined
Nov 12, 2020
Messages
605
Supports
United/Ajax
True, someone like Janssen is unlikely to make the final cut.

Yes, Teletekst is still going strong! I read it every day, it's a great source of quick and reliable information. Plus basic info on football from all over Europe (scores and tables of all major leagues and European competitions, as well as all big tournaments). They got a website and an app - I really recommend it. :)

Teletekst was just really loved in the Netherlands. I think that, until some years ago, it continued to rank highly in Dutch website stats, and that love for Teletekst has often been cited as a reason why a news site with short stories like nu.nl (if that even still exists) was enormously popular in the Netherlands.
Teletekst is just the best way to get info. No bloated stories, no clickbait, no ads. Just easy to read short text.
 

Cheimoon

Made of cheese
Scout
Joined
Jun 22, 2020
Messages
8,884
Location
Canada
Supports
no-one in particular
Thanks, I just checked the darts scores (not that I'm into it)
That process was .. nostalgic :lol:

I could have sworn hearing about the discontinuation of the service years ago
Yes, the nostalgie is definitely there. Checking football scores like the 90s never left! (Although for part of the 90s we actually had a tv that was too old for Teletekst, so I would only get it when we were visiting my grandma's! :lol: )

I think it was discontinued in the UK, and maybe not all TVs support it anymore? But it's definitely still going strong and I've not heard anything about it disappearing.
Teletekst is just the best way to get info. No bloated stories, no clickbait, no ads. Just easy to read short text.
Exactly! It's just amazing.
 

VanDeBank

Ma’am
Joined
May 13, 2021
Messages
3,500
It's weird how there was talk of Heerenveen battling relegation in January and now they're leading in the playoffs.
I hope AZ win, just because they have a better chance of getting us points in Europe next season.

After AZ's poor start (which was understandable giving the sales), they went on a really good run, until they bottled it a bit after their win against Ajax.

Vitesse are in trouble with Openda, Doekhi and Bazoer leaving (possibly Wittek and Dasa too?) and the questions surrounding their ownership and debt.

Twente's home games have a great atmosphere (a bit like Feyenoord without the dated stadium). Them going into Europe is pretty cool.
They have a decent team as well if they manage to hold on to their players.