Jesus walks into our team, Ramsdale as well... But generally the squad is the bigger difference between the 2. They have a lot more depth throughout and much better depth than us.
Erik ten Hag - Manchester United manager
- Thread starter sewey89
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I wouldn't take Saka to start over Sancho or Rashford if he finds his form again, though with Rashford it's fair enough. Smith Rowe wouldn't start here. Tierney vs Shaw or malacia is same thing IMO. Their depth is what they have over us (by far in attack), Jesus and Ramsdale are the 2 clear starters better than ours. Makes a difference though when there are 5 subs to work with per game.
Smith Rowe isn’t even a guaranteed starter for Arsenal. Tierney isn’t better than shaw. Jesus would have been a top signing though. Shame he was at city and they’d never sell to us.
Don't know what's so funny about that mate. You'd have Saka over Sancho ? that's funnier.
And if Rashford does find his form again he is also a better player than Saka. Rashford at Saka's age Had 17 goals and 7 assists in the league.
Hey just my personal opinion. If Rashford is in form, or if we take Rashford between 2019-2021, I would take that player over Saka. More pace, bigger goal threat, more natural ability, and we have Sancho as the creative threat on the other side. We'll see how Rashford does this year but I think he'll be a his normal self.
He didn't bold Sancho so I would assume he isn't arguing that (nobody should be arguing that though, other than Southgate but yeah).
Our performances were pretty good that season, and I remember the football generally being enjoyable to watch.
We just really struggled putting chances away, and ended up drawing many games we should've won (15 draws in the league that season).
Our points haul wasn't horrible either - 69 points would've gotten us top 4 or thereabouts most other seasons, but all the other big teams had a pretty solid season so we never really challenged.
I think you’re underrating Saka a fair bit here. Albeit the other poster is massively underrating Rashford. Personally I’d have Rashford over Saka but only just, and wouldn’t bother arguing with anyone who had them the other way round.
1. Where have I said that, if you look at what I bolded Sancho isn't part of it
2. Rashford is not a better player than Saka
Oh, no doubt he’s been handed a shit sandwich. I don’t see that as a money issue, more of a crisis in leadership. The fact is that the board has decided to pay upwards of €160m on players, maybe more. I don’t think there is necessarily a cap on spending. It’s actually there are very few targets that are the quality we want that are willing to play Europa League football.
Let’s assume that money is no object. Which top shelf strikers / wingers are willing to come here? Antony has CL football, so does Oshimen, Lewandowski, Haaland, etc. Which strikers do you propose we go after? Especially when most of them have CL football and a World Cup to look forward to…
No. The issue (again) is very poor leadership from the Glazers, a failure to build a competent scouting department and general organizational dysfunction that requires a strong hand and personality in the organization to drive transfer and scouting policy. We aren’t Chelsea or Real Madrid who have a top organization no matter the manager, we’re actually more like Liverpool and City who have an icon as a manager driving/influencing club building. Hopefully ETH can be that guy for us because we have very weak leadership from the board and the CEO.
Make no mistake about it, ETH is the big personality we need to be successful, and the results are his and his alone. Is that such a bad thing?
Would take Nketiah over Martial, Partey over McTominay and Martinelli over Rashford too.
I would also like to know the list of players ETH apparently scrapped when he arrived at the club.
They were poor in Rogers final season but no worse than we were last season (in fact 4 points better off) And yes, you could argue that ETH will “benefit” from joining before the season starts but not when that coincides with removing so many first team squad members and not replacing them. Klopp joined a club which had a far more coherent transfer strategy that was already well underway before he was hired. That’s why Rodgers had such an incredible season in 2013/14, far better than anything we’ve seen at United going back at least a decade.
We know Pau Torres was one. Declan Rice being another but way too pricey.
Those were the numbers being mentioned at the time for those players. And this didn't just come from United media, I follow a lot of Ajax media as well. Ajax was also lest reluctant to sell players prior to selling players like Gravenberch and Haller."Probably would have picked up" ... How can you be so certain of something like this
I always love it when less informed people act indignant towards people who are obviously more informed than they are. You have access to all the same tools I do, do some research.
Fair enough. Let's agree to disagree. I think we're better and I really don't think it's delusional or nonsensical to think that, seeing as though you've given me 4 players that make it into our team (which I again disagree with). Maybe have a think before you write.
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Whatever you follow doesn't give you special insight into the exact value of possible deals. That makes no sense. The certainty is very funny to me
Right, but that's the club not willing to pay the fee. Not ETH coming in and ripping it up. I haven't read anything about a list of players being scrapped. Unless I've missed something.
I actually really like Saka, just think Rashford is ridiculously underrated because of last year and we'll see him back to his best this year. I'm with you on "either way is fair" for Rashford vs Saka and just a preference for Rashford, probably because he's our local kid (which does mean something).
Ballpark figures, but these Ajax guys have been absolutely spot on this summer. Called how much we would pay for Martinez, called how much Ajax would demand for Antony post Martinez
If this season goes tits up, Ten Hag is going to be in a world of pain and he's going to have a large portion of blame too.
Chasing with such single mindedness over Antony and De Jong could/will cost him.
Chasing with such single mindedness over Antony and De Jong could/will cost him.
I really disagree that they ever played a «Kloppish brand of football». The competition back then was really poor compared to now and Suarez carried them with 31 goals and 12 assists. When he left, they went back to pre-Suarez level (50-60 points).
Smith Rowe over Bruno?
I think some will also blame him for mainly focusing on the Dutch league too
Are rival fans just making accounting to start saying it's ETH fault?
His normal self is a very productive player, though.
In terms of pure stats, he is - that isn't really up for debate. The idea that he's absolutely useless is based on the idea that he has been having an insane purple patch over several seasons.
To be clear, I'm not a Rashford "fan" in the sense that I think he's a world beater.
But he has produced very respectable numbers in the past - and he has done so over more than one season. Last season was a horror show for most United players.
Not that I'm disagreeing with you in the general sense, since this has happened a lot, but that guy has been here longer than the both of us.
Of course. But I think that is less of an issue as Malacia and Martinez genuinely look good.
on current/last season form I’d take saka, obviously if we get Dortmund sancho and the younger rashford I would take them But I think rashford is done. I find saka offers way more than both sancho and rashford both offensively and defensively.
I Don’t rate shaw at all I mean the guy has something around 25 career assists for us. Tierney already has over half of that in 2 seasons. I think Malacia will be great for us though excited to see him.
ESR is a dodgy pick admittedly but after Bruno looking awful last season he is closer than you’d think.
Which would - potentially - be a valid criticism.
But only if he's the one calling the shots on who we bring in.
Which he shouldn't be.
He shouldn't be a recruiter at United - he should be the coach.
Even if their quality wasn't the highest and if ETH improved our attack/play, just in terms of numbers and options this should be obviously extremely concerning. I mean we have 4 decent attacking options for front 3 in Ronaldo, martial, Rashford and Sancho and the rest are unproven kids. Even in those 4, martial was done last season and his fitness is a worry, Ronaldo would be happily sold by many, Rashford has been woefully out of form.
Not to mention the CM 2 for which we basically have 3 options if you include Eriksen. And then it's the unproven kids.
Man talk about a threadbare squad.
Sigh.
Not that I'm disagreeing with you in the general sense, since this has happened a lot, but that guy has been here longer than the both of us.
So he has,
Just a strange narrative I've seen the last couple days forming and I don't understand it at all. Must be born out of frustration and hormones driving the emotions thru the roof.
Think you misread the post - I'm defending Rashford! I think he'll be back to his best, or even better then ever. Last season for me is in the past and there were other issues going on, better to forget and move on.
No Odegaard? Apart from his absolutely ridiculous challenge against us last season which resulted in a penalty I thought he looked impressive in that match and he's looked good whenever i've seen him.
I agree mainly but I still feel Chelsea were starting to slide a bit. They have a good midfield but defence needs work and they are lacking a class striker unless Tuchel is moving away from the 3421. I see Sterling as being a plan b off the bench if they stick to it or perhaps a 343 false 9 with havertz. Will be interesting to see if they pick back up and what more players arrive.
I think Jesus will be a better fit but i dont see him taking them to a higher level. As alluded to above, they probably have a better balanced squad than us bit are still light in midfield IMO and i still think theres Limitations to Arteta. Young players dont necessarily indefinitely improve either - theres many that sort of reach a level by the age of 23/24 and thats that.
Come on mate, you know the United tax has been a thing since SAF days. Those figures would have immediately gone up another 10-15 million the moment we were ready to make a bid.
As for Gravenberch and the other lot you mentioned, they been basically agreed since early March, way before ETH even set foot through the door. Not much we could have done there.
Aha! Sorry.
We cannot say for sure he is the sole decider but the focus on the Dutch league is down to him I'd say
There was a bunch of free transfers, and they sold Gravenberch and Haller, and since Tagliafico, and Schuurs is just about done. They were anticipating selling Gravenberch, because he was entering the final year of his contract, but either way, once Gravenberch and Haller were sold Ajax closed shop and jacked up the price.
We have a good relationship with Ajax, with Van der Sar and so does Eric. Ajax probably wouldn't have taken us to the cleaners had we got there first but we delayed until they didn't want to sell anymore. And those are the numbers surrounding those players, as they were linked with us, so that would have included the "United tax".