Erling Haaland | Dortmund player

Zehner

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Everybody who thinks Dortmund is stagnating and in tge same position as 5 or even 8-10 years ago hasn't been paying attention.
 

NYAS

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People in here like to point out that United is still a top club due to it's great financial situation and they're right. The moment you guys get your shit together, it'll take you 2-3 years at most to get ba k to the absolute top. Financial prowess is the one favtor that's most important for success. Money attracts talent which increases the probability of winming titles which again attracts talent.

And that's the thing I believe people miss abaoaut Dortmund when I read that they're 'one bad signing' apart from doing a Bremen or have a small club mentality. What we are witnessing there is quite unique, IMO, because it is one of the very very rare cases in which a club manages to develop into a top team without an investor that fuels the growth. From the top of my mind I can't think of another club that grew organically like Dortmund did. Atletico is probably the closest. They are making one step after the other since almost a decade and by now they've come a really long way. Nowadays they can buy the talent of any other team in the league bar Bayern. The fact that they landed Brandt and are still one of the favourites to sign Havertz from us speaks volumes. Yes, they are still losing their best talents and will also lose Haaland and Sancho but they are season by season, they get closer to keeping them. I'd say they are two, maybe three talent cycles apart from actually being able to retaining those prodigies.

I mean, look at the team they're currently fielding. Player by player, it's already better than the line ups of many clubs who are seen as being one or two tiers above Dortmund, including United. It's a talent hub and that is attracting other talents, Haaland is the prime example of that.

They are already paying wages no other Bundesliga team not named Bayern can pay. A HUGE improvement to their Klopp years. Comparable to the true elite of the business? No, not quite there yet, but give them another probably five years at the current pace and they are. And not only that. Ten years ago, they were reliant on signing players like Kagawa for peanuts. Now it even seems possible that they land Havertz for more than 100m - how many clubs have spent transer sums of that category? Barca, PSG and Atletico?

So yeah, IMO Dortmund is a behemoth of a club in the making. Even for the biggest clubs, it gets harder to bully them around seasom by season.
:lol: On what planet are Dortmund going to pay 100m for Havertz? Come on man
 

Zehner

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:lol: On what planet are Dortmund going to pay 100m for Havertz? Come on man
On a planet that just saw Dortmund generate 489.5m € revenue and 17m € profit last year - without any remarkable player departures. That's a better result than that of Atletico who just spent 120m on Felix. And Dortmund will probably make ~150m from the Sancho exit so they're likely to break the 600m €mark in the upcoming year. And not only that: Since 2015, they made almost 150m € profits from transfers so they're likely to have more than enough on the bank.

But that's not even that important since they are becoming less and less dependent on selling players, which was kind of my whole point from the very beginning. This is also evidenced by numbers, by the way. From 2018 to 2019, they increased their revenue without transfer revenues by almost 50m €. That's what I mean: In the whole world, there is probably no club that is growing organically as much as Dortmund is currently doing. Give them another year or two and they are on the same level financially as Chelsea, Arsenal and Tottenham.

So will they spend 100+m on Havertz? Possibly not since he'll likely go elsewhere. Would they be able to do that? Yes, they would be.
 

NYAS

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On a planet that just saw Dortmund generate 489.5m € revenue and 17m € profit last year - without any remarkable player departures. That's a better result than that of Atletico who just spent 120m on Felix. And Dortmund will probably make ~150m from the Sancho exit so they're likely to break the 600m €mark in the upcoming year. And not only that: Since 2015, they made almost 150m € profits from transfers so they're likely to have more than enough on the bank.

But that's not even that important since they are becoming less and less dependent on selling players, which was kind of my whole point from the very beginning. This is also evidenced by numbers, by the way. From 2018 to 2019, they increased their revenue without transfer revenues by almost 50m €. That's what I mean: In the whole world, there is probably no club that is growing organically as much as Dortmund is currently doing. Give them another year or two and they are on the same level financially as Chelsea, Arsenal and Tottenham.

So will they spend 100+m on Havertz? Possibly not since he'll likely go elsewhere. Would they be able to do that? Yes, they would be.
Sure, I’m certain they could find a way to finance it. My point is that they are not the type of club who will spend that much on one player. Which isn’t a slur against them; it’s just the nature of their decision-makers which can be a good thing.

Also Atlético and Felix isn’t a great comparison because that whole deal was a Jorge Mendes money-laundering operation so really should be taken in isolation.
 

Zehner

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Sure, I’m certain they could find a way to finance it. My point is that they are not the type of club who will spend that much on one player. Which isn’t a slur against them; it’s just the nature of their decision-makers which can be a good thing.

Also Atlético and Felix isn’t a great comparison because that whole deal was a Jorge Mendes money-laundering operation so really should be taken in isolation.
I also think that this is rather untypical for them and wouldn't have expected them to be willing to spend that much but they definitely seem to be in for him. Reus openly claimed in an interview that he wanted to convince Havertz to sign for them and reports that they are interested in Havertz aren't stopping with some even suggesting that they're in the pole position. From my perspective, it is quite obvious that they're very interested in signing him and I don't think they're naive enough to believe they could get him for anything below at least 90m.

Maybe they want to make a mark with that signing. It could mean that this is a turning point in their transfer strategies and ambitions. You don't expect to make profit on a player you signed for 100+m. I think they finally see themselves in a position from which they can challenge Bayern for such players.

For me, they already made a mark with the Brandt transfer. I never expected him to go there. This was a player who exploded completely after Bosz moved him to the CM and had almost 1 goal or assist a game as a midfielder. I thought he'd go to one of the giant clubs out there but he went to Dortmund and I don't think he would've done that without the perspective of winning titles. So they must have promised him something. I have the feeling they finally want to stop fooling around and challenge Bayern for good this time. Like the next step of their long-term project.
 

NYAS

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I also think that this is rather untypical for them and wouldn't have expected them to be willing to spend that much but they definitely seem to be in for him. Reus openly claimed in an interview that he wanted to convince Havertz to sign for them and reports that they are interested in Havertz aren't stopping with some even suggesting that they're in the pole position. From my perspective, it is quite obvious that they're very interested in signing him and I don't think they're naive enough to believe they could get him for anything below at least 90m.

Maybe they want to make a mark with that signing. It could mean that this is a turning point in their transfer strategies and ambitions. You don't expect to make profit on a player you signed for 100+m. I think they finally see themselves in a position from which they can challenge Bayern for such players.

For me, they already made a mark with the Brandt transfer. I never expected him to go there. This was a player who exploded completely after Bosz moved him to the CM and had almost 1 goal or assist a game as a midfielder. I thought he'd go to one of the giant clubs out there but he went to Dortmund and I don't think he would've done that without the perspective of winning titles. So they must have promised him something. I have the feeling they finally want to stop fooling around and challenge Bayern for good this time. Like the next step of their long-term project.
I have to agree about Brandt. I still have trouble understanding that transfer sometimes. It’s a major coup for them.
 

troylocker

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Measured at 39,6 km/h in that sprint....sick!

40 goals and 8 assists in 1993 minutes this season (<50 minutes per goal) . No one has ever scored 40 goals in less than 2000 minutes in any European top 15 league (all comps) before. Messi played 5221 minutes in his 73 goals record season (<72 minutes per goal), CR7 played 4540 minutes in his 61 goals record season (>74 minutes per goal), Lewandowski has scored 38 goals in 2783 minutes this season (73 minutes per goal) in his by far best season ever and Mbappe's best season: 39 goals in 3504 minutes (90 minutes per goal)
It's hard grasp how insane this 19 year olds' numbers really are.

When you look at the goals vs #xG per 90 chart he's just playing a different sport. Best off the ball movement and positional awareness in the world by several miles, combined with elite mentality, unique physical attributes and world class finishing makes him the beast he is. He will hit the ground running where ever he goes.

Can we just offer them 250M for Sancho/Haaland in the summer and start winning trophies again please?
Not going to happen, but it would put us right back at the top.
 

Josep Dowling

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Measured at 39,6 km/h in that sprint....sick!

40 goals and 8 assists in 1993 minutes this season (<50 minutes per goal) . No one has ever scored 40 goals in less than 2000 minutes in any European top 15 league (all comps) before. Messi played 5221 minutes in his 73 goals record season (<72 minutes per goal), CR7 played 4540 minutes in his 61 goals record season (>74 minutes per goal), Lewandowski has scored 38 goals in 2783 minutes this season (73 minutes per goal) in his by far best season ever and Mbappe's best season: 39 goals in 3504 minutes (90 minutes per goal)
It's hard grasp how insane this 19 year olds' numbers really are.

When you look at the goals vs #xG per 90 chart he's just playing a different sport. Best off the ball movement and positional awareness in the world by several miles, combined with elite mentality, unique physical attributes and world class finishing makes him the beast he is. He will hit the ground running where ever he goes.

Can we just offer them 250M for Sancho/Haaland in the summer and start winning trophies again please?
Not going to happen, but it would put us right back at the top.
Don't need to spend that much. He has a release clause for £65m. Someone is going to pay it, they just have to deal with that idiot agent of his.
 

Swarm

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Measured at 39,6 km/h in that sprint....sick!

40 goals and 8 assists in 1993 minutes this season (<50 minutes per goal) . No one has ever scored 40 goals in less than 2000 minutes in any European top 15 league (all comps) before. Messi played 5221 minutes in his 73 goals record season (<72 minutes per goal), CR7 played 4540 minutes in his 61 goals record season (>74 minutes per goal), Lewandowski has scored 38 goals in 2783 minutes this season (73 minutes per goal) in his by far best season ever and Mbappe's best season: 39 goals in 3504 minutes (90 minutes per goal)
It's hard grasp how insane this 19 year olds' numbers really are.

When you look at the goals vs #xG per 90 chart he's just playing a different sport. Best off the ball movement and positional awareness in the world by several miles, combined with elite mentality, unique physical attributes and world class finishing makes him the beast he is. He will hit the ground running where ever he goes.

Can we just offer them 250M for Sancho/Haaland in the summer and start winning trophies again please?
Not going to happen, but it would put us right back at the top.
I think you're getting a bit ahead of yourself there. You are still comparing goals in the Austrian league to goals in La Liga and the Bundesliga and also different time frames. If he puts up these numbers over 4000-5000 minutes in a top league/champions league we can compare him to the likes of Messi and Ronaldo again, this kind of hype is a little over the top as much as I enjoy watching the lad.
 

troylocker

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Don't need to spend that much. He has a release clause for £65m. Someone is going to pay it, they just have to deal with that idiot agent of his.
The release clause won't kick in before summer 2022, and we would compete with literally every top club then. So this summer or the next for market price is probably our best chance of actually signing him.
 

Swarm

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The release clause won't kick in before summer 2022, and we would compete with literally every top club then. So this summer or the next for market price is probably our best chance of actually signing him.
Do you think you can buy a player at market price from Dortmund after he has been there for half a season only?
 

amolbhatia50k

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I think you're getting a bit ahead of yourself there. You are still comparing goals in the Austrian league to goals in La Liga and the Bundesliga and also different time frames. If he puts up these numbers over 4000-5000 minutes in a top league/champions league we can compare him to the likes of Messi and Ronaldo again, this kind of hype is a little over the top as much as I enjoy watching the lad.
Agree.
 

troylocker

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I think you're getting a bit ahead of yourself there. You are still comparing goals in the Austrian league to goals in La Liga and the Bundesliga and also different time frames. If he puts up these numbers over 4000-5000 minutes in a top league/champions league we can compare him to the likes of Messi and Ronaldo again, this kind of hype is a little over the top as much as I enjoy watching the lad.
You are aware that his stats are better in the German Bundesliga and CL than in the Austrian Bundesliga (19 goals and 2 assists in 859 minutes - 45 minutes per goal) ?
I know it is early in his career, and a lot of things might happen down the road, but if you want to compare numbers; his numbers are dwarfing everyone elses'...…..

My point is that 19 year olds don't score 40 goals a season, not in Austria or anywhere else for that matter. And he has done it in less than 2000 minutes, breaking every possible record on the way. Worth getting excited about in my book.
 

Josep Dowling

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The release clause won't kick in before summer 2022, and we would compete with literally every top club then. So this summer or the next for market price is probably our best chance of actually signing him.
If Sancho wants to leave there will be no need for Dortmund to sell Haaland as well. Plus the player, Dad and agent will know it's their payday in 2 year's time. I expect the release clause is low so they can haggle larger signing on and agent fees. Hopefully UEFA will get the restricted agent fees rule in place soon to stop this nonsense. Agents are now deciding which clubs can be successful, it isn't right.
 

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Do you think you can buy a player at market price from Dortmund after he has been there for half a season only?
More importantly, what makes you think you could persuade a player leaving a club he snubbed you for after just 6 months, when everything' has been turning out nicely so far?
 

troylocker

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More importantly, what makes you think you could persuade a player leaving a club he snubbed you for after just 6 months, when everything' has been turning out nicely so far?
I am 99,9% sure it won't happen, and his market price might rocket way past the 100M mark as well depending on the rest of the season and the upcoming EURO champs. I was just playing with the thought. Pretty sure he will follow his chosen path and choose the next destination carefully when the release clause is triggered in 2022, unless a fat bid with a fat contract and an interesting project in a top club turns up this or next summer. He, his father and Raiola obviously wants to be in control of his future, so it will be very interesting to see what kind of contract the next club must sign to get him. So far they have played towards development and control over money and prestige.
 

Swarm

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You are aware that his stats are better in the German Bundesliga and CL than in the Austrian Bundesliga (19 goals and 2 assists in 859 minutes - 45 minutes per goal) ?
I know it is early in his career, and a lot of things might happen down the road, but if you want to compare numbers; his numbers are dwarfing everyone elses'...…..

My point is that 19 year olds don't score 40 goals a season, not in Austria or anywhere else for that matter. And he has done it in less than 2000 minutes, breaking every possible record on the way. Worth getting excited about in my book.
I am aware of Haalands statistics, it is currently one of my favourite pastimes to salivate over them. 859 minutes however are still not even a full 10 matches and the numbers are further inflated by him being brought in at the end of matches vs tired opposition. Out of the 13 matches in CL and BL you are looking at he was supped on 4 times and subbed off 5 times, leaving him with 4 matches playing the entire 90 minutes. His numbers are incredible, especially for a 19 year old but they are hardly sustainable. Any player able to keep that up (or close to it) for a year or more in multiple competitions is among the best in the world and was in recent times usually named Messi or Ronaldo.
So again, Haaland is a remarkable player doing absolutely insane things currently and I have no reason to believe he does not have a great career ahead of him, but it just does not do any good to compare his still relatively short run of good form in strong competitions to some of the best players ever to grace this sport. Well, you can compare them, but always try to set them into context.
 

troylocker

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I am aware of Haalands statistics, it is currently one of my favourite pastimes to salivate over them. 859 minutes however are still not even a full 10 matches and the numbers are further inflated by him being brought in at the end of matches vs tired opposition. Out of the 13 matches in CL and BL you are looking at he was supped on 4 times and subbed off 5 times, leaving him with 4 matches playing the entire 90 minutes. His numbers are incredible, especially for a 19 year old but they are hardly sustainable. Any player able to keep that up (or close to it) for a year or more in multiple competitions is among the best in the world and was in recent times usually named Messi or Ronaldo.
So again, Haaland is a remarkable player doing absolutely insane things currently and I have no reason to believe he does not have a great career ahead of him, but it just does not do any good to compare his still relatively short run of good form in strong competitions to some of the best players ever to grace this sport. Well, you can compare them, but always try to set them into context.
There is of course some context behind his numbers, such as playing for well functioning, attack minded teams with creators around him, and 20 of his 40 goals this season was scored in the Austrian league and cup. That doesn't change the fact that no one has done anything like this before and maybe it's time to realize that we are witnessing something really special here.

If he kept delivering at this level for a full season without injuries, playing 5200 minutes (like Messi did in his 73 goals record season) he would end the season on 104 goals, which is a ridiculous number. Do I think he can keep this up for a full season? Unlikely, but even if he slowed down his goals per minute ratio by 30%, he would be on par with Messi's record numberwise given they played the same amount of minutes.
Messi and Ronaldo were a lot better on the ball than Haaland at 19, but they were lightyears behind in terms of end product.

Comparing his CL record to our first choice #9 is both funny and sad:
Haaland: 10 goals and 1 assist in 464 minutes (46 minutes per goal)
Martial: 4 goals and 3 assists in 1780 minutes (445 minutes per goal). Martial has played 15 of his 29 games in the CL as a CF, the rest as a LW.

Can't we just sit back, enjoy the ride and be excited about the possibility that we might be witnessing the next goat goalscorer? Unique kid!
 

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It's been reported that Ed has offered 51M to RB-Salzburg (33m extra as a sweetener to consider bid from UTD on priority) but in the end it was all down to Haaland who picked Dortmund.

I think Ed has made some mistakes in the past but when I see this I really appreciate his seriousness and effort in trying to bring in best players.
Some can argue that he could have given some of that amount to Riola to complete this transfer but I like his stance against that parasite agent and it shows we are not a club kneel down for stupid agent demands.

Riola has 20 years career on top but we are UTD been there for more than 140 years with rich history and will remain in future so there is no need to bow down to these stupid agents, that way we made a point here.

I know we lost a good player here but sure we can sign some other players who can take us to next level and who knows Haaland himself can come out of Riola net and sign for us in future.
 

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It's been reported that Ed has offered 51M to RB-Salzburg (33m extra as a sweetener to consider bid from UTD on priority) but in the end it was all down to Haaland who picked Dortmund.

I think Ed has made some mistakes in the past but when I see this I really appreciate his seriousness and effort in trying to bring in best players.
Some can argue that he could have given some of that amount to Riola to complete this transfer but I like his stance against that parasite agent and it shows we are not a club kneel down for stupid agent demands.

Riola has 20 years career on top but we are UTD been there for more than 140 years with rich history and will remain in future so there is no need to bow down to these stupid agents, that way we made a point here.

I know we lost a good player here but sure we can sign some other players who can take us to next level and who knows Haaland himself can come out of Riola net and sign for us in future.
That doesn't make any sense. He had release clause, so what's the point of giving more money for Salzburg? It doesn't make any difference.

Report was ManUtd offered 60 million for Salzburg + player camp without wages, which is obvious PR stunt now.

 

.mica

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I think Ed has made some mistakes in the past but when I see this I really appreciate his seriousness and effort in trying to bring in best players.
The funniest post of the day. Thanks! I had a laugh.
 

sp_107

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That doesn't make any sense. He had release clause, so what's the point of giving more money for Salzburg? It doesn't make any difference.

Report was ManUtd offered 60 million for Salzburg + player camp without wages, which is obvious PR stunt now.

If it is just PR stunt soon RB-Salzburg will reject this claim so Ed will be seen as a fool?
I don't think they will come out with this PR stuff if Ed didn't offer that money.

God 40M extra for player camp still he went to Dortmund, looks like Haaland really meant it when he says the decision was purely based on football.
 

roonster09

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If it is just PR stunt soon RB-Salzburg will reject this claim so Ed will be seen as a fool?
I don't think they will come out with this PR stuff if Ed didn't offer that money.

God 40M extra for player camp still he went to Dortmund, looks like Haaland really meant it when he says the decision was purely based on football.
It's not PR stunt by Salzburg, they have nothing to gain in this. It's by Dortmund or just nonsense by German paper.

We can pay 1 billion to Salzburg, makes 0 difference to the deal as Haaland had 20 million release clause, so paying extra money to Salzburg makes no sense.
 

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It's not PR stunt by Salzburg, they have nothing to gain in this. It's by Dortmund or just nonsense by German paper.

We can pay 1 billion to Salzburg, makes 0 difference to the deal as Haaland had 20 million release clause, so paying extra money to Salzburg makes no sense.
The buy out clause is the trigger, you can bid however much above it you want if you're stupid enough to.

And it's most likely a PR stunt by Dortmund.
 

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Sayros

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Now I understand why he went to Dortmund, His father said not just coach but they like to see the interest from whole club. I think it was Riola poured poison in their ears that Ole may not be at the club next season and that might hamper Haaland progress with new coach coming in.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-8152587/Erling-Haalands-dad-aims-dig-Man-United-speaks-sons-Borussia-Dortmund.html
Nah, I think they were reading the Caf and seeing people didn't want him because it would hamper Martial's development.

I think he would have been fine if Bruno came along and would complement with Martial nicely. Either way, he's made a good choice for his career. He is having a monster season, but I think he has to prove himself over the next couple of season. Right now, he is still some distance away from Mbappe in my eyes when it comes to the player that's going to take over the mantle from CR7/Messi, because every defenders know Mbappe now and he's still producing at a higher level each and every season. The way Kimpembe handled Haaland in the CL showed that the big Norwegian doesn't seem to handle physical pressure very well despite his frame, he will have some growing pains. He might very well end up being the best player in the world if he adjusts and keeps developing, or a solid striker for years to come, or he could also be a flash in the pan and is having one of the best season of his career, it's just too early to make any definitive statements, no matter how eye-popping his numbers in the league and CL are right now.
 

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Nah, I think they were reading the Caf and seeing people didn't want him because it would hamper Martial's development.

I think he would have been fine if Bruno came along and would complement with Martial nicely. Either way, he's made a good choice for his career. He is having a monster season, but I think he has to prove himself over the next couple of season. Right now, he is still some distance away from Mbappe in my eyes when it comes to the player that's going to take over the mantle from CR7/Messi, because every defenders know Mbappe now and he's still producing at a higher level each and every season. The way Kimpembe handled Haaland in the CL showed that the big Norwegian doesn't seem to handle physical pressure very well despite his frame, he will have some growing pains. He might very well end up being the best player in the world if he adjusts and keeps developing, or a solid striker for years to come, or he could also be a flash in the pan and is having one of the best season of his career, it's just too early to make any definitive statements, no matter how eye-popping his numbers in the league and CL are right now.
Your last sentence is correct, yet in the bolded part you draw a conclusion from one game? A game where none of the Dortmund players really impressed, I might add.
 

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It was a no-brainer to NOT sign him. If Raiola is his agent and Raiola insisted on a low buy-out clause, £70 million I believe, then we'd be simply giving the power to the agent to screw us over again a season down the line.

Raiola is in bed with Juventus, so essentially he likes for his young clients to eventually end up there, as Juventus cut Raiola deals that no other club are willing to do, so that Raiola gets a giant slice of the pie once the player goes onto Real Madrid or onto bigger things.