European Super League | 18th April 2021 - 20th April 2021 RIP

Do you want the ESL to happen?


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FujiVice

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So by implication, we chuck out a B team most weeks in the Premier League, with the A squad traipsing around Europe. Not for me, Clive.
If there are 18 teams in it, I cant imagine United will remain a Premier League club. I imagine the big plan is for this EuroPrem to be the worlds big league eventually and sod the rest.
 

Big Ben Foster

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This is it. It's finally happening. Was always inevitable IMO.

Massive blow for the PL but other European leagues have grown incredibly stale with the same team winning every year.
 

Rob

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Exactly what the footballing World needs, more inequality, and, more importantly, more money in the hands of the owners.

It's a horrendous idea and one made to pave the way for eventually breaking away from the domestic leagues entirely.
 

Majima

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''Each of the founding teams is expected to earn fees paid hundreds of millions of pounds to participate, with clubs such as Manchester United and Real Madrid receiving the biggest sums for joining.''

''If the discussions are successfully concluded, the European Premier League would effectively usurp UEFA's Champions League competition.''

''As part of that blueprint, the founder clubs could not be relegated for 20 years.''

''Sources said the result of the new format, if it gets off the ground, would be to give England's wealthiest clubs greater leverage in future negotiations with the Premier League and with broadcasters and sponsors.''
The Glazers get a nice lump sum to take out, and then get the Champions League money every year, without being directly punished for neglecting the club like they are now.

This is a horrifying idea for us as fans. We would never be able to get rid of them if this goes ahead.
 
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Wazza4Gaffa

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I have never understood the arguments that matches would lose their luster. People still tune in the millions to watch Man Utd vs Southampton every year why would they not draw a bigger audience for a Man Utd vs Dortmund match instead? Everybody still gets excited to face City/Chelsea etc 2+ times a year how would this be any different? In essence we are replacing all the 'small' teams with 'big' teams around Europe which I think will increase global viewership drastically.

Arguments for the damage it can cause to other leagues such as Championship/Ligue 1 etc I fully understand and are a big issue that needs to be handled with the inevitable 'European Premier/Super League'.
 

big rons sovereign

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American owners desperate make football shit like all American sports are. Next will be 4 quarters, in play clock and time outs so they can cram endless bullshit commercials in there.
It's already saturated with pointless stats.
 

Stretender

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It makes me laugh when people say not for me, I oppose this idea and that.

The truth is as fans we are just a commodity, we don't make decisions so any idea that the foreign club owners agree on, we as fans have no power to overturn it.

That is why the German model is the best because it places fan ownership at the heart of each club and this gives fans real power to reject such ridiculous moves.

When the Glazers, Sheikh Mansoor, Stan Kroenke and Roman Abramovich decide they are happy with it, we have no choice. People think these foreign owners buy these clubs because they love football, thats far from it. It is a business for them and any opportunity to make money and grow their influence is great for them.

Lets be honest when that eventually happens most of us will buy into the idea, otherwise we can all go and support FC United of Manchester.
 

Dec9003

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I have never understood the arguments that matches would lose their luster. People still tune in the millions to watch Man Utd vs Southampton every year why would they not draw a bigger audience for a Man Utd vs Dortmund match instead? Everybody still gets excited to face City/Chelsea etc 2+ times a year how would this be any different? In essence we are replacing all the 'small' teams with 'big' teams around Europe which I think will increase global viewership drastically.

Arguments for the damage it can cause to other leagues such as Championship/Ligue 1 etc I fully understand and are a big issue that needs to be handled with the inevitable 'European Premier/Super League'.
If you don’t play well in the premier league, you don’t get to play in the champions league against the best teams. Playing the smaller teams in the premier league will always be exciting because anyone can win, and you don’t have a divine right to European football based on how big your club is. If it’s like the NFL where they all just play each other each time and then do the super bowl or whatever it won’t be the same. This is just a way for owners to neglect their clubs whilst not having any kind of negative financial impact, it’s not a sport for the fans anymore at that point.
 

JB7

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This is being sold as a CL replacement but lets be honest, this is an attempt by the biggest clubs to create a European NFL system where it is a closed shop and then the owners can milk the profits to the detriment of the little clubs and the players as they would surely move to a salary cap. Glazers, FSG, Barca and Real have their fingerprints all over this.
It's absolutely disgusting and led by people that do not understand the core of the sport & what it is that makes it so beloved around the world. Awful people.
 

Redplane

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Seems like these types of "discussions" appear every few years to generate some headlines, and then fizzle out again. No point taking it seriously imho.

Way too many obstacles and competing interests to overcome. I mean hell, the Dutch and the Belgians couldn't even agree to combine their footie leagues - what makes anyone think they could do this across the whole of Europe? For starters more fiscal transparency would be necessary and do you really think the Germans, English, Spanish and Italians for instance will see eye to eye on that? Yeah- didnt think so.
 

Damien

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Not surprising given the leak from a couple of years ago.



Most of the clubs will probably stay the same. Spurs might make it but can't see there being six English clubs in it and they're the ones most likely to miss out.
 

Tarrou

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I'd be gutted if this happens

maybe we need to start getting used to the idea of football being something that used to be good
 
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If there are 18 teams in it, I cant imagine United will remain a Premier League club. I imagine the big plan is for this EuroPrem to be the worlds big league eventually and sod the rest.
So the premier league games and the champions league games are both discarded in favour of the Euro league?

Less games is less revenue though right?

Would fans keep shelling out for european away games if they are once a week?

This smacks of a threat to the other premier league clubs who didn't accept the other offer.
 

Guy Incognito

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Seems like these types of "discussions" appear every few years to generate some headlines, and then fizzle out again. No point taking it seriously imho.

Way too many obstacles and competing interests to overcome. I mean hell, the Dutch and the Belgians couldn't even agree to combine their footie leagues - what makes anyone think they could do this across the whole of Europe? For starters more fiscal transparency would be necessary and do you really think the Germans, English, Spanish and Italians for instance will see eye to eye on that? Yeah- didnt think so.
Yep, these stories usually appear when the CL TV contracts are up for renewal.

But hard not to think change is afoot.
 

Shane88

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When is enough enough for these fecking cnuts? The top teams in the Premier League are making an absolute fortune but it still isn't good enough.
 

diarm

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The only way I could get onboard with this, is if it was a construct to keep the state owned cheat clubs out of the top table of European football.

If they can't make them play by the rules through the courts or legislation, then I guess it makes sense to just neglect to invite them into the inner circle of a ringfenced tournament.

But if as reported, they include PSG and City in such a league, then it's just a rat race of greed to the bottom and I'd have no interest in any of it.
 

Solius

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If this happened I could see myself losing interest in football, which would be really sad because it's a big part of my life.
 

#07

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When is enough enough for these fecking cnuts? The top teams in the Premier League are making an absolute fortune but it still isn't good enough.
When you can get guaranteed Champions League level money while not investing in your team at all, cos there's no threat of not qualifying for the competition as its closed shop.

They'll make European Football like the NFL and that'll be that.

If this happened I could see myself losing interest in football, which would be really sad because it's a big part of my life.
Same. Feels like a relationship that's about to run its course. The memories were great, had some wonderful times but its not like that anymore is it?
 

Untied

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The biggest issue with it is creating a closed shop, where there is no chance of new sides breaking in to the elite tournament. Clearly that is bad in a number of ways, both in terms of fairness and because it let's owners like the Glazers run 'elite' sides poorly whilst continuing to pocket the same TV revenue.

But if it's replacing the CL, let's be honest, how often has a non-top 6 side managed to qualify? Once in the last 15 years. The idea that the CL is merit based? Well those were the same arguments against expanding it to non-league winners, but that happened. What is so meritous about finishing 4th? And as for the meaningless of fixtures: basically every year there are 48 group games played, many of which are not particularly attractive fixtures, in which the two richest sides almost inevitably progress from the group. Are people really that wedded to the, definitely not about the money, Gazprom sponsored, current CL format?
 

VP89

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So founding members can't be relegated for 20 years? This sounds like a pile of piss. No surprise its led by money grabbing owners in England. I want to watch the Premier League with full strength teams, I don't have a big problem with the current format of the Champions League. Stop pissing around
 

TheGame

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I have never understood the arguments that matches would lose their luster. People still tune in the millions to watch Man Utd vs Southampton every year why would they not draw a bigger audience for a Man Utd vs Dortmund match instead? Everybody still gets excited to face City/Chelsea etc 2+ times a year how would this be any different? In essence we are replacing all the 'small' teams with 'big' teams around Europe which I think will increase global viewership drastically.

Arguments for the damage it can cause to other leagues such as Championship/Ligue 1 etc I fully understand and are a big issue that needs to be handled with the inevitable 'European Premier/Super League'.
What makes the Champions League so special is that you get multiple big teams that rarely play each other which makes every match a special occasion. Seeing them play each other twice a season takes that away. Also The Champions League and PL have history and tradition. This proposed competition is just a sell out.
 

jeff_goldblum

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It's a moneygrab plain and simple, orchestrated by people who see no value in football beyond profit. They're banking on international audiences being willing to pay more money to watch Manchester United play Real Madrid in this new league than they will to watch Fulham play Burnley in the EPL or Rennes play Krasnodar in the UCL. The solution? Get rid of these pesky unprofitable games and their pesky fans and replace them with lovely
marketable games. feck the heart of the game, feck the fan experience, feck the 99% of clubs who won't be offered a seat on the gravy train. There have been a lot of times I've looked at the state of modern football and wanted to walk away but not done it, but I think this would be the final straw for me personally.

I hope the proposal crashes and burns. But if it go aheads I hope the whole thing crashes and burns and takes every club involved along with it.
 

Majima

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When is enough enough for these fecking cnuts? The top teams in the Premier League are making an absolute fortune but it still isn't good enough.
They won't stop until they are raking it in, and they have removed all financial threat to if the club performs poorly, i.e. us right now. They want to guarantee the CL money every year without investing, or being punished for not investing (founders also can't get relegated for 20 years).
 

Wazza4Gaffa

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If you don’t play well in the premier league, you don’t get to play in the champions league against the best teams. Playing the smaller teams in the premier league will always be exciting because anyone can win, and you don’t have a divine right to European football based on how big your club is. If it’s like the NFL where they all just play each other each time and then do the super bowl or whatever it won’t be the same. This is just a way for owners to neglect their clubs whilst not having any kind of negative financial impact, it’s not a sport for the fans anymore at that point.
I partly agree but look at how successful those leagues have been in their respective market. NBA moreso has grown significantly over recent years in comparison to the NFL as the sport of basketball is more global. Now with how global the sport of football is, it doesn't take much to imagine how much money there is to be made in the sport having a centralised league. I'm not saying I agree with it, but it makes a lot of financial sense for the big clubs to want to take part in an essentially closed league. TV money has slowly gained on gate receipts and as more countries in the world start paying premium money for TV rights, it wont be long until the gate money becomes miniscule in comparison. This will allow for the clubs to disregard the hardcore fan as they know for every local fan they may lose they will gain one in US, one in Asia, one in Africa etc.
 

DevilRed

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It seems like this is a replacement for the CL rather than a replacement for the PL?

Don't see an issue with that. Especially if we tell that corrupt fecking organisation known as UEFA to stick it up their arses.

Obviously it benefits us greatly because it means guaranteed European money every year (most likely more than the CL pays) as we won't need to be in the "top four" of our domestic league to qualify. In fact, we can't be "relegated" from this league for 20 years as we are one of the "founders" :lol:

On one hand, I feel sick to my stomach as this could feck over alot of the smaller teams.

On the other, does it mean that dortmund or watford or aston fecking villa won't be able to charge 120m, 40m and 80m respectively for their players? If so, I'm all for that.
 

TheGame

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It seems like this is a replacement for the CL rather than a replacement for the PL?

Don't see an issue with that. Especially if we tell that corrupt fecking organisation known as UEFA to stick it up their arses.

Obviously it benefits us greatly because it means guaranteed European money every year (most likely more than the CL pays) as we won't need to be in the "top four" of our domestic league to qualify. In fact, we can't be "relegated" from this league for 20 years as we are one of the "founders" :lol:

On one hand, I feel sick to my stomach as this could feck over alot of the smaller teams.

On the other, does it mean that dortmund or watford or aston fecking villa won't be able to charge 120m, 40m and 80m respectively for their players? If so, I'm all for that.
Yes because the proposed teams and owners involved in this are angels with the highest morals:rolleyes:.

In terms of your last comment, those teams charge those prices because thick teams pay them, if teams didn't pay ridiculous prices in the first place, they know they couldn't charge them.
 

sun_tzu

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Pretend inferiority and encourage his arrogance.
If there are 18 teams in it, I cant imagine United will remain a Premier League club. I imagine the big plan is for this EuroPrem to be the worlds big league eventually and sod the rest.
ultimate 18 teams 3 games a season (home, away and neutral venue game (Shanghai, Tokyo, Bangkok, Singapore, Miami, LA, Sao Palo, Quatar, Dubai for example) playing the neutral games somewhere warm in the European winter over a couple of months - long term I could see that
 

padr81

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It seems like this is a replacement for the CL rather than a replacement for the PL?

Don't see an issue with that. Especially if we tell that corrupt fecking organisation known as UEFA to stick it up their arses.

Obviously it benefits us greatly because it means guaranteed European money every year (most likely more than the CL pays) as we won't need to be in the "top four" of our domestic league to qualify. In fact, we can't be "relegated" from this league for 20 years as we are one of the "founders" :lol:

On one hand, I feel sick to my stomach as this could feck over alot of the smaller teams.

On the other, does it mean that dortmund or watford or aston fecking villa won't be able to charge 120m, 40m and 80m respectively for their players? If so, I'm all for that.
It would be minimum 30 games, thats no CL replacement.
 

Dec9003

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I partly agree but look at how successful those leagues have been in their respective market. NBA moreso has grown significantly over recent years in comparison to the NFL as the sport of basketball is more global. Now with how global the sport of football is, it doesn't take much to imagine how much money there is to be made in the sport having a centralised league. I'm not saying I agree with it, but it makes a lot of financial sense for the big clubs to want to take part in an essentially closed league. TV money has slowly gained on gate receipts and as more countries in the world start paying premium money for TV rights, it wont be long until the gate money becomes miniscule in comparison. This will allow for the clubs to disregard the hardcore fan as they know for every local fan they may lose they will gain one in US, one in Asia, one in Africa etc.
Financially yeah it may end up making more sense than the Premier League does. They could even play matches at times that better suits an American and Asian audience. In terms of getting excited to play European teams every season which was your point, its obvious to see why people wouldnt get the same entertainment value knowing we'd be playing the same teams every single season no matter how anyone performs. It wouldn't be the same for many of us, I couldn't see myself sticking with football if we weren't playing in the English league, which would be a shame.
 

Majima

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It seems like this is a replacement for the CL rather than a replacement for the PL?

Don't see an issue with that. Especially if we tell that corrupt fecking organisation known as UEFA to stick it up their arses.

Obviously it benefits us greatly because it means guaranteed European money every year (most likely more than the CL pays) as we won't need to be in the "top four" of our domestic league to qualify. In fact, we can't be "relegated" from this league for 20 years as we are one of the "founders" :lol:

On one hand, I feel sick to my stomach as this could feck over alot of the smaller teams.

On the other, does it mean that watford and aston fecking villa won't be able to charge 40m and 80m respectively for their players? If so, I'm all for that.
Yes.

Don't see the issue? The current format of the CL forces the owners to invest into the club, if they want to see any of the CL money by getting top 4. This format removes that risk completely.

It doesn't benefit us at all. All that will happen is the Glazers get to take even more money out of the club (Founders get a lump sum upon joining), whilst not being punished for not investing (founders can't get relegated). If we think they are taking a lot out now, what will it be like when there's no way there's no direct financial impact to them? That's the only reason they let the club invest any of the money now.
 

RUCK4444

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Beginning of the end if it happens.

It won't happen though.
Seems the teams and people involved are exhausting a LOT of effort for something that won't happen, I think at this stage they would have a pretty good idea that this could well happen.

Never underestimate the greedy.

I don't see any benefit of this to the fans, it's just another version of the CL which is already the best tournament in the sport. It's all about $$$$ though.
 

Wazza4Gaffa

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What makes the Champions League so special is that you get multiple big teams that rarely play each other which makes every match a special occasion. Seeing them play each other twice a season takes that away. Also The Champions League and PL have history and tradition. This proposed competition is just a sell out.
What matters to the money men at the end of the day is how much it sells for. Even if a Man Utd vs Real Madrid match becomes as anticipated as say a Man Utd vs Arsenal game, that is still equal to a significant amount of money to be made in a market they are currently not exploiting as much as they can. I personally would rather watch a less glamorous Man Utd vs Barcelona than Man Utd vs Sheffield Utd.

Also it would not be the first time or the last time a new competition is formed that changes tradition it has always happened including the Premier League which was founded as a money grab not to mention the UCL has changed so much over the years too.
 

sun_tzu

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The Glazers get a nice lump sum to take out, and then get the Champions League money every year, without being directly punished for neglecting the club like they are now.

This is a horrifying idea for us as fans. We would never be able to get rid of them if this goes ahead.
Actually i think they would sell up pretty quick and cash in ... I suspect their portfolio of out of town shopping in the USA has taken a battering during Covid and assuming clubs get their own TV rights in the new set up? they could make a big profit i would have thought