F1 2021 Season

Adam-Utd

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My comment is still valid, they want to reduce costs, but they want to add a second race :houllier:
OK the race might not count for Sunday, but I bet there will be points awarded
Keep the format the way it is, it works and works well.
That isn't what he's saying though. They aren't saying they want 2 races.
 

dinostar77

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That’s odd that Bottas would take his penalty here, a track he can legit finish ahead of Max on. Seems like a tactical error from Merc.
Youve got that wrong mate as martin brundle said. Its smart from Mercedes. Bottas starts in front of max for the sprint so in theory can take points off max. He needed a new engine anyway and Mercedes are so quick around here that Bottas should be able to get a good haul of points on sunday.
 

Leg-End

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Youve got that wrong mate as martin brundle said. Its smart from Mercedes. Bottas starts in front of max for the sprint so in theory can take points off max. He needed a new engine anyway and Mercedes are so quick around here that Bottas should be able to get a good haul of points on sunday.
But it’s only 3,2,1 points in the sprint. He would have done more damage finishing 2nd if Lewis wins to Max’s 3rd.
 

hobbers

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Will Bottas try to actually win tomorrow or will Mercedes piss their collective pants again and demand he cede that 1 extra point for winning the sprint to Lewis?

What am I saying it's Bottas. He'll be 4th before the chicane.
 

United Hobbit

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They'll make Bottas get straight out the way, then back him into Max letting Lewis disappear into the distance. I hope Bottas defies team orders to make what I can forsee being a dull race, interesting

Why not qualify Friday, then do a stand alone reverse grid (based on say either finishing order from last race, or championship) on the Saturday, for half points, then use Fridays qualifying for the race as normal Sunday.
 

wattsy7

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Surely the FIA are going to have to not allow towing anymore somehow, being able to gain up to 7 tenths of a second simply by having a good tow surely isn’t fair? Would also stop the dangerous queues we are seeing.

Regarding the new sprint race format, I’m okay with it & thought it was exciting at Silverstone but I don’t like how it takes away qualifying giving you pole position, what I would suggest is keeping the sprint race but the top three from qualifying stay the same for the race on sunday regardless of what happens in the sprint race.

An example would be:

Qualifying Result:
Bottas
Hamilton
Verstappen
Norris
Ricciardo
Gasly
Sainz

Hypothetical sprint race result:
Ricciardo 3 pts
Sainz 2 pts
Norris 1 pt
Verstappen
Hamilton
Gasly
Bottas

Would be grid for Sunday:
Bottas
Hamilton
Verstappen
Ricciardo
Sainz
Norris
Gasly

This seems to work for me in my head but i’m sure there’s some flaw in it that someone will find.
 
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dinostar77

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Will Bottas try to actually win tomorrow or will Mercedes piss their collective pants again and demand he cede that 1 extra point for winning the sprint to Lewis?

What am I saying it's Bottas. He'll be 4th before the chicane.
Totto has already said bottas will get out of lewis way. Bottas is starting from back of grid on sunday so no point holding lewis up. That is obviously dependent on lewis getting a good start and getting past bottas without max overtaking him or bottas.
 

Cheimoon

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Totto has already said bottas will get out of lewis way. Bottas is starting from back of grid on sunday so no point holding lewis up. That is obviously dependent on lewis getting a good start and getting past bottas without max overtaking him or bottas.
Really? From past behaviour and his interviews in Drive To Survive, I got the impression that Bottas had always been pretty unhappy to have to cede to Hamilton. I'd expect him to do it less now it's already certain he's switching teams next year. We'll see, I guess.
 

hobbers

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Bottas' spinelessness is pretty impressive. To still bend over for the team that's ditched you, even after all the times they've hung you out to dry, when you have a seat at a different team with a different engine already signed.... should be prioritising himself since this is the last time he's ever going to be in a competitive car or have a chance to rack up any more GP wins or podiums.
 

pauldyson1uk

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Really? From past behaviour and his interviews in Drive To Survive, I got the impression that Bottas had always been pretty unhappy to have to cede to Hamilton. I'd expect him to do it less now it's already certain he's switching teams next year. We'll see, I guess.
I have always thought that Bottas knew he was second fiddle, despite Mercedes saying there is no team order, Lewis has always been top dog.
I have no doubt he did not like it.
Could he have won a WC or 2, yes I think he could have, if Lewis had not been around.
You got the impression from his radio after qualifying he was rather pleased at beating Lewis, the laugh was a feck you laugh.
 

dinostar77

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Bottas' spinelessness is pretty impressive. To still bend over for the team that's ditched you, even after all the times they've hung you out to dry, when you have a seat at a different team with a different engine already signed.... should be prioritising himself since this is the last time he's ever going to be in a competitive car or have a chance to rack up any more GP wins or podiums.
How exactly is bottas going to win the gp from the back of the grid?
 

dinostar77

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I have always thought that Bottas knew he was second fiddle, despite Mercedes saying there is no team order, Lewis has always been top dog.
I have no doubt he did not like it.
Could he have won a WC or 2, yes I think he could have, if Lewis had not been around.
You got the impression from his radio after qualifying he was rather pleased at beating Lewis, the laugh was a feck you laugh.
He never deserved a WDC, as a package he isnt in that elite calibre of driver.
 

elmo

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My comment is still valid, they want to reduce costs, but they want to add a second race :houllier:
OK the race might not count for Sunday, but I bet there will be points awarded
Keep the format the way it is, it works and works well.
There's not much extra cost in doing a sprint race but you can be sure they're getting a lot more money from advertising.
 

Zarlak

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Truth like rain don't give a feck who it falls on.
Surely the FIA are going to have to not allow towing anymore somehow, being able to gain up to 7 tenths of a second simply by having a good tow surely isn’t fair? Would also stop the dangerous queues we are seeing.

Regarding the new sprint race format, I’m okay with it & thought it was exciting at Silverstone but I don’t like how it takes away qualifying giving you pole position, what I would suggest is keeping the sprint race but the top three from qualifying stay the same for the race on sunday regardless of what happens in the sprint race.

An example would be:

Qualifying Result:
Bottas
Hamilton
Verstappen
Norris
Ricciardo
Gasly
Sainz

Hypothesised sprint race result:
Ricciardo 3 pts
Sainz 2 pts
Norris 1 pt
Verstappen
Hamilton
Gasly
Bottas

Would be grid for Sunday:
Bottas
Hamilton
Verstappen
Ricciardo
Sainz
Norris
Gasly

This seems to work for me in my head but i’m sure there’s some flaw in it that someone will find.
The spring race should be less laps and should follow immediately after Q3. There's no reason to have everyone tune in on a different day for half an hour.
 

dinostar77

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Surely there should be no fp2, cars should be in parc fermme conditions and we should have the spirit race today and thats all.

This whole sprint weekend thing is so poorly thought out and rubbish.
 

Ayush_reddevil

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Bottas' spinelessness is pretty impressive. To still bend over for the team that's ditched you, even after all the times they've hung you out to dry, when you have a seat at a different team with a different engine already signed.... should be prioritising himself since this is the last time he's ever going to be in a competitive car or have a chance to rack up any more GP wins or podiums.
This sort of thought process is so weird. He is still driving for a f1 team and do you really think that the new team would appreciate a driver acting selfishly and not following team orders ?
 

slyadams

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Youve got that wrong mate as martin brundle said. Its smart from Mercedes. Bottas starts in front of max for the sprint so in theory can take points off max. He needed a new engine anyway and Mercedes are so quick around here that Bottas should be able to get a good haul of points on sunday.
Disagree. He can take 1 or 2 points off Max in the sprint or 7, 3 etc. in the main race. I also found it a strange decision because Bottas is flat out bad at coming from the back.
 
Italian GP FP2 Timings New

pauldyson1uk

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Italian GP Practice Two Timesheet
DriverTeamTime
1) Lewis HamiltonMercedes1:23.246
2) Valtteri BottasMercedes+0.222
3) Max VerstappenRed Bull+0.416
4) Sergio PerezRed Bull+0.671
5) Esteban OconAlpine+1.017
6) Robert KubicaAlfa Romeo+1.034
7) Antonio GiovinazziAlfa Romeo+1.256
8) Fernando AlonsoAlpine+1.293
9) Pierre GaslyAlphaTauri+1.408
10) Lando NorrisMcLaren+1.419
11) Charles LeclercFerrari+1.524
12) Daniel RicciardoMcLaren+1.528
13) Nicholas LatifiWilliams+1.559
14) George RussellWilliams+1.837
15) Yuki TsunodaAlphaTauri+2.176
16) Nikita MazepinHaas+2.483
17) Lance StrollAston Martin+2.517
18) Sebastian VettelAston Martin+2.689
19) Mick SchumacherHaas+2.766
20) Carlos SainzFerrari+2.878
 

pauldyson1uk

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Top 10 grid for Saturday's F1 Sprint
1) Valtteri Bottas, Mercedes
2) Lewis Hamilton, Mercedes
3) Max Verstappen, Red Bull
4) Lando Norris, McLaren
5) Daniel Ricciardo, McLaren
6) Pierre Gasly, AlphaTauri
7) Carlos Sainz, Ferrari
8) Charles Leclerc, Ferrari
9) Sergio Perez, Red Bull
10) Antonio Giovinazzi, Alfa Romeo
 

hobbers

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This sort of thought process is so weird. He is still driving for a f1 team and do you really think that the new team would appreciate a driver acting selfishly and not following team orders ?
Why would Alfa give a shit about whether he follows Mercedes' team orders in the last few races of his contract with them? Of course they won't.

There's supposed to be a level of competitiveness in F1 drivers and Bottas obviously doesn't have it. No chance you'd catch Alonso or Lewis or Max acting like that if they were in Bottas' position. The only things on their minds would be: "I have 8 races left in my career in the fastest car on the grid. I want as many poles, as many wins, and as many fastest laps as possible in those 8 races". That is the normal thought process for any ambitious sportsman.


How exactly is bottas going to win the gp from the back of the grid?
Who said anything about just tomorrow? I'm obviously talking about all of the remaining GPs and the sprint race today which would count as another pole position in his driver record.
 
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Ayush_reddevil

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Why would Alfa give a shit about whether he follows Mercedes' team orders in the last few races of his contract with them? Of course they won't.

There's supposed to be a level of competitiveness in F1 drivers and Bottas obviously doesn't have it. No chance you'd catch Alonso or Lewis or Max acting like that if they were in Bottas' position. The only things on their minds would be: "I have 8 races left in my career in the fastest car on the grid. I want as many poles, as many wins, and as many fastest laps as possible in those 8 races". That is the normal thought process for any ambitious sportsman.




Who said anything about just tomorrow? I'm obviously talking about all of the remaining GPs and the sprint race today which would count as another pole position in his driver record.
You really think that they wouldn’t give a shit if a driver they signed to a multi million dollar deal doesn’t follow team orders from his current team just because he doesn’t have a future with them ? It’s called being professional
 

elmo

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Why would Alfa give a shit about whether he follows Mercedes' team orders in the last few races of his contract with them? Of course they won't.

There's supposed to be a level of competitiveness in F1 drivers and Bottas obviously doesn't have it. No chance you'd catch Alonso or Lewis or Max acting like that if they were in Bottas' position. The only things on their minds would be: "I have 8 races left in my career in the fastest car on the grid. I want as many poles, as many wins, and as many fastest laps as possible in those 8 races". That is the normal thought process for any ambitious sportsman.




Who said anything about just tomorrow? I'm obviously talking about all of the remaining GPs and the sprint race today which would count as another pole position in his driver record.
Basically he's not a selfish prick that most WDCs tend to be. For the 90% of the remaining drivers in F1 history, they tend to follow what the team says because not doing so would be career suicide.
 

hobbers

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You really think that they wouldn’t give a shit if a driver they signed to a multi million dollar deal doesn’t follow team orders from his current team just because he doesn’t have a future with them ? It’s called being professional
No. Of course they wouldn't give a shit. Such a weird argument. :lol:

They're signing him to be their leading driver alongside what will probably be a total rookie. Not to be subservient to his team mate. What he does in his last few races at Mercedes is his own business.


Basically he's not a selfish prick that most WDCs tend to be. For the 90% of the remaining drivers in F1 history, they tend to follow what the team says because not doing so would be career suicide.
After all he's given to Mercedes selfishness doesn't even come into it.

In 5-10 years time when Bottas looks back on his F1 career what would give him happier memories? That he helped Lewis win an 8th world title? Or that, even after Mercedes effectively dumped him mid-season, he went and proved them wrong and won a race or two, got a couple of poles, put in some fastest laps etc. I just cant fathom such an uncompetitive unambitious mindset from a racing driver.
 
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Fluctuation0161

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No. Of course they wouldn't give a shit. Such a weird argument. :lol:

They're signing him to be their leading driver alongside what will probably be a total rookie. Not to be subservient to his team mate. What he does in his last few races at Mercedes is his own business.
Maybe you don't appreciate the concept of professionalism...
 

hobbers

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Maybe you don't appreciate the concept of professionalism...
Just an absolute nonsense argument. He's been "professional" for 6 years, helped Lewis to 4 world titles and Merc to 4 constructors titles in a row, and they've still dumped him. Trying to be the fastest driver on the track every week when in the fastest car is what I would call being professional.

Even if we pretend that Alfa's team boss is a total weirdo who cares about his behaviour in the last 8 races in a Merc. Bottas is 32 and the contract is signed. So "looking unprofessional" :lol: by trying to go out with a bang wouldn't affect the rest of his F1 career at all.
 

United Hobbit

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That was an exciting start.

I don't think they should have safety car in the sprint races as they're so short it's wiping out about 1/4 of the race, should use a red flag instead