FA to investigate Edinson Cavani | This thread is taking a break

Status
Not open for further replies.

BluesJr

Owns the moral low ground
Joined
May 15, 2013
Messages
9,047
Is he actually going to get banned? Surely they need to take into consideration his culture etc and what was meant. Fine him or make him take an educational course but a ban seems really harsh.
 

DomesticTadpole

Doom-monger obsessed with Herrera & the M.E.N.
Joined
Jun 4, 2011
Messages
100,449
Location
Barrow In Furness
I fear this honest error by Cavani (I believe him) is going to cost him a ban.

Agree with Gary Neville, maybe training of this nature should be done to educate players, and also to avoid situations like this.

FFS we need Cavani man!
So Gary thinks all foreigners are uneducated. Maybe it is the people in this country who need educating about other cultures instead of ours always being the right one.
 

Lennon7

nipple flasher and door destroyer
Joined
May 8, 2013
Messages
10,473
Location
M5
Keep the prick, the bastard and the cnut to yourself. It's rarely that way, that's typically what would indicate negative intent.

It's simply black, and it's in relative terms, more a case of dark(er) than even black. We could easily be calling Bruno Fernandes negro or negrito.
But seriously what the feck? Why mention their race or colour? Is there any other affectionate insults you use besides ugly, big nose, big head, skinny, fat and oh yeah black/dark? Is there an equivalent for lighter skinned people that you use as an affectionate insult?

feck this :lol:
 
Joined
Jun 26, 2014
Messages
21,604
Location
Behind the right goal post as "Whiteside shoots!"
Yes I know he didn't.

My point is that Cavani really should know better. Ok let's put it another way, if you think a word could be taken out of context, don't use it publicly as that completely avoids it being taken out of context.

If some random comments on his instagram all he needs to say is words to that effect 'cheers mate' and there is no issue. No potential for a ban, nobody taking it out of context, no 45 page thread on a forum, nothing.

Not for one minute do I believe it was racist directly, implied or whatever. No doubt it was meant with the very best intentions. I am not an expert on south american culture or dialect but you have to be pretty naive to think using that word isn't leaving you open to some form of interpretation.
That's a fair post. Or at least one that tries to calmly explain an opinion without being dickish like some are.

Totally agree that he could have avoided something and in hindsight, will wish he did. So do I.
 

sammsky1

Pochettino's #1 fan
Joined
Feb 10, 2008
Messages
32,841
Location
London
Absolutely spot on over there by Gary and agree with every word he says. People really need to read the words No Room for Racism and put that into their heads. There's no place for context or intentions when it comes to abolishing any terms with any potential racist connotations whatsoever. We are deep into cancel culture. Any guy with a few thousand Twitter followers understands the consequences of posting something remotely controversial in a public sphere let alone a footballer with a worldwide following who now also plays for one of the most popular clubs in the world. Footballers are not beyond that code of conduct and if a player cannot understand such basic norms and how to abide by them without fail then I'm all for punishing them as severely as possible till they start taking the reach social media gives them seriously.
What we have seen in this incident is that every relevant and reputed authority has immediately reacted sensitively, with tempathy and according to previously agreed policies. That includes FA, Sky, MUFC etc. Wonderful to see.

What we’ve also seen in this thread is people using anonymity of internet to ridicule attempts at stop anti racism. Why they wish to do so, only they know.
 

Will Singh

Full Member
Joined
Jun 19, 2013
Messages
5,675
Location
Theatre of dreams
I’d love him to come out fully British.

“Lads Lads Lads. Sorry about the Negrito, but did any of you Cnuts see that second header”
Pathetic, you know that’s not what happened here. Don’t know about you but I’m born in the UK but also from Indian background so belong to 2 cultures, if you want to see racism look closely at the Indian system and I know it first hand. Point is you can’t translate one culture to show how it’s perceived in another culture as it just doesn’t work!
 

UnrelatedPsuedo

I pity the poor fool who stinks like I do!
Joined
Apr 15, 2015
Messages
10,047
Location
Blitztown
The left are the ones who demand the hate speech laws and that context shouldn't matter when it comes to language, and try to not only police it but try to change it. Why do you think we now use terms for jobs originally denoting a male member of staff as neutral terms, and stop using the female? Why are we now told to use terms like BAME or person of colour? That comes from the far left. Sammsky is displaying all the tell tale signs.
I’m as far left as it comes. I’m just smart and affluent with it.

Progress is not telling 600m people to stop using a word because it looks like a word you’re not allowed to say anymore in a completely different language. That’s just stupidity.
 

Acquire Me

Full Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2006
Messages
8,361
Location
Norway
Yeah, it’s the FA, Manchester United football club, Gary Neville and many other authorities that stand for anti racism are the ones having the meltdown.

Certainly not those trying to justify language that was created during white supremacy era. :houllier:

Oh ffs Gary. He is not making himself any favours.
 

UnrelatedPsuedo

I pity the poor fool who stinks like I do!
Joined
Apr 15, 2015
Messages
10,047
Location
Blitztown
Pathetic, you know that’s not what happened here. Don’t know about you but I’m born in the UK but also from Indian background so belong to 2 cultures, if you want to see racism look closely at the Indian system and I know it first hand. Point is you can’t translate one culture to show how it’s perceived in another culture as it just doesn’t work!
Think you misread what I wrote brother. I was literally making a joke about him acting like a nation that judges everyone, and acts like a prick itself.

Wasn’t about you.
 

fps

Full Member
Joined
Dec 22, 2018
Messages
5,478
I’m as far left as it comes. I’m just smart and affluent with it.

Progress is not telling 600m people to stop using a word because it looks like a word you’re not allowed to say anymore in a completely different language. That’s just stupidity.
Yes. It’s also not really dealing with racism.
 

Will Singh

Full Member
Joined
Jun 19, 2013
Messages
5,675
Location
Theatre of dreams
Cavani’s response and explanation is perfectly fine. I truly believe he responded without knowing the Ik context at that moment. However he will face some sanctions as FA has its pre set regulations.

Responses by some in this thread however leaves a lot to be desired vs 2020 UK cultural norms. Some seem to believe the things they learned growing up are somehow acceptable. Up to them if they want to change in personal loves or when posting anonymously on a forum.

But as Cavani found out, it won’t be tolerated whatsoever in any professional or regulated environment. Denigrate it as political correctness if you like but that tide and turned and times are thankfully changing.
Totally agree he will get some sort of punishment but we have to 1) understand this ain’t nothing like that scum Suarez and 2) he is from a different culture and language and we can’t judge him as racist based on him talking to he’s fans (Spanish speaking) in he’s own language!
 

Olly Gunnar Solskjær

Marxist bacon-hating kebab-dodging Tinder rascal
Scout
Joined
Jan 26, 2008
Messages
36,895
Location
dreams can't be buy
I agree with the worry over the ban, but you can’t seriously think there’s any case to answer here for Cavani?
I don't think he's racist or meant any harm at all. I think this is imply a case of being made aware of words are when used in other countries.

Like if Wayne Rooney called someone he was friends with a "cnut" in public when he was in America, I would say he was obviously not meaning it to offend anyone as it's used casually over here among people you like, but as that particular word is thought of differently over there he would need to be aware of people being offended and needing to be more careful in the future.
 

fergieisold

New Member
Joined
Mar 15, 2008
Messages
7,122
Location
Saddleworth (home) Manchester (work)
Is he actually going to get banned? Surely they need to take into consideration his culture etc and what was meant. Fine him or make him take an educational course but a ban seems really harsh.
He’ll be banned as there isn’t any logic to decision making. It’ll go something like this...

we’ve had players taking the knee every game To declare their opposition to racism.

there might be a phrase used that uneducated nutters find racist.

we can’t back down, we will look stupid.

BAN!
 

hobbers

Full Member
Joined
Jun 24, 2013
Messages
27,359
'If it offends someone, it's a problem'..... Really Gary? Worrying how easily he comes out with that tripe.

Bi-weekly diversity and inclusion training sessions :lol: What an absolutely insane money spinner that'd be. The Premier League is rich but not quite that rich.
 

SalfordRed18

Netflix and avocado, no chill
Joined
Sep 24, 2012
Messages
13,927
Location
Salford
Supports
Ashwood City FC
it is a crazy thread. I was immediately attacked by hotheaded Latino culture lovers for expressing exactly the same opinion. They focus on that he didn’t mean anything racist which I don’t contest, but completely ignore the fact that we Cavani faces potential 3-match ban. United supporters turned into South American culture “defenders“ on the United forum.

the club might lose an important player for three matches in December when we need as many players as possible. It is a fact. Cavani or any other celebrity in a multicultural environment like Instagram and EPL should pay attention to what they post.

I don’t give a shit what his words mean, I am concerned with the consequences.
fecking this. Was told I was a snowflake, had purple hair, a nose ring, didn't understand racism, despite the fact that not once have I said he's racist or what he's said is racist.

Bizarre thread.
 

fergieisold

New Member
Joined
Mar 15, 2008
Messages
7,122
Location
Saddleworth (home) Manchester (work)
I don't think he's racist or meant any harm at all. I think this is imply a case of being made aware of words are when used in other countries.

Like if Wayne Rooney called someone he was friends with a "cnut" in public when he was in America, I would say he was obviously not meaning it to offend anyone as it's used casually over here among people you like, but as that particular word is thought of differently over there he would need to be aware of people being offended and needing to be more careful in the future.
I guess one of the big problems I have with this is it’s social media. ‘Over here’ doesn’t really mean much in the social media world.
 

sammsky1

Pochettino's #1 fan
Joined
Feb 10, 2008
Messages
32,841
Location
London
Totally agree he will get some sort of punishment but we have to 1) understand this ain’t nothing like that scum Suarez and 2) he is from a different culture and language and we can’t judge him as racist based on him talking to he’s fans (Spanish speaking) in he’s own language!
I also stated that in one of my first posts in this thread, Id rather he isn't banned but asked to attend some awareness education (which Im sure the club will now enforce on every single member of staff. A shame Redcafe members cant also gave that enforced too!)
 

kouroux

45k posts to finally achieve this tagline
Joined
Apr 25, 2007
Messages
95,709
Location
Djibouti (La terre des braves)
As a black man myself, not it gives me more right to give my opinion, I think this is blown way way way out of proportion.
The fight against racism will never be without a little bit of common sense applied for each situation. I'm not saying what Cavani said is meaningless just to be clear
 

InfiniteBoredom

Full Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2013
Messages
13,548
Location
Melbourne
The state of Redcafe bending over backwards to justify a culturally insensitive at best and racist at worst comment because they don’t want a player to get banned. When do we whip out our T-shirts?
 

Hugh Jass

Shave Dass
Joined
Apr 16, 2016
Messages
11,244
I would be surprized if he does not get a ban. Most likely one or two games. I understand it was lost in translation sort of, but that is the way it is now.
 

DoomSlayer

New Member
Joined
Jun 20, 2019
Messages
4,875
Location
Bulgaria
Let's see all those who want Cavani to get banned after he gets an 8 game suspension or something ridiculous like this. We are going to be made into an example, as usual, like it was done with Rooney ages ago in that infamous goalscoring celebration.
 

2mufc0

Everything is fair game in capitalism!
Joined
Jan 8, 2014
Messages
16,992
Supports
Dragon of Dojima
it’s the internet, so many people still living in their parents basements. Their only lived experience of the world is through things like the guardian opinion section. Must seem terrifying out there!
And in your case the Dailly Mail opinion section.
 

spiriticon

Full Member
Joined
Feb 3, 2013
Messages
7,384
I guess one of the big problems I have with this is it’s social media. ‘Over here’ doesn’t really mean much in the social media world.
Aye. I actually think it's impossible 'not' to be offensive on social media because the message has limitless reach to all countries and cultures.

Social media is a stain on modern society.
 

Web of Bissaka

Full Member
Joined
Feb 20, 2017
Messages
8,553
Location
Losing to Comeback Winning!
So what do we take on this?
1. Cavani learned his lessons. He's educated now about it. He removed the post and gave good reply and explanation about it. He's not going to use the word nilly-nilly in the future. Done.

2. Time for people who don't understand and get that there are so many different culture, to get themselves educated about it.

Instead of being reactionary, it's easier* to simply just ask "What do you mean?" for any possible racist words. So we get their point of view and contexts in how and where they used it. Some people just don't know when things are considered racism cross-culturally or not. So from that, they'll know it's racist and less likely to do it. We all are against racism, but then making a meal out of anything that are either simply-not-racist or contextually-considered-not-racist is just not helping the cause. Rather it serve to prolong and promote this hate culture. I find it toxic. Surely we can be civilized and handle this issue in the best peaceful way.

*actually it's hard because we're less likely wanting to be rational first.
 

RUCK4444

New Member
Joined
Feb 3, 2015
Messages
9,553
Location
$¥$¥$¥$¥$
I'm one that believes everyone should respect the traditions / customs of the country you are in at the time, or in this case the audience he has online.

Apology needed, one received, move on. He didn't say it with the intention to offend, that's the key and the vast majority of people/races that could potentially be offended by this word would likely say the same. Intent is key.

But Cavani should be aware of what he can/can't post online to millions.

The argument that ''well it's ok in Uraguay" is somewhat of a moot point. The same way I can't travel the world grabbing people by the tits and insist it's my nationalities traditional greeting.
 

2mufc0

Everything is fair game in capitalism!
Joined
Jan 8, 2014
Messages
16,992
Supports
Dragon of Dojima
I'm one that believes everyone should respect the traditions / customs of the country you are in at the time, or in this case the audience he has online.

Apology needed, one received, move on. He didn't say it with the intention to offend, that's the key and the vast majority of people/races that could potentially be offended by this word would likely say the same. Intent is key.

But Cavani should be aware of what he can/can't post online to millions.

The argument that ''well it's ok in Uraguay" is somewhat of a moot point. The same way I can't travel the world grabbing people by the tits and insist it's my nationalities traditional greeting.
This is how I see it really. Don't understand why this thread had to be so drawn out.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.