Fact or Fiction: Jamie Redknapp "Man Utd turning good players into bad ones"

[meamth]

Reading this made my blood boiling:

JAMIE REDKNAPP ON SSN

"But what you have to remember is, right now United have an amazing record of making good players turn into bad ones.

"They've got to look after this guy because he's a super player. But the players they're signing have got to perform better and they have to find a way of getting the best out of these players.

"I don't subscribe to this theory they keep signing bad players, they're just not working correctly with these players and they need to create an environment where these players know if they're not doing well enough and not just be able to turn it on when they want.

"And that sometimes comes down to the manager."

What do you think? Is the genius Redknapp right on this one?

 

[AR87]

Of the players we've sold how many have become significantly better? It doesn't feel like it's very many. Redknapp is just relishing his moment at the top which isn't even his moment.

 

[Buchan]

Of the players we've sold how many have become significantly better? It doesn't feel like it's very many. Carragher I'd just relishing his moment at the top which isn't even his moment.

Redknapp.

Otherwise, your post is spot on.

 

[Tarrou]

It's hard to argue with it. Most of the attacking players we've signed post-Fergie have come in and looked wank.

Well, they sometimes look decent for a bit first. Though mostly just utter shit right from the get-go.

For the past few years our attacking group of players have looked lost, almost as if every single game is the first time they've ever set eyes on each other - let alone played with each other. This year the attack actually starts to look like we have a plan, with players complimenting each other (well Rashford and Martial), so maybe it's getting better.

 

[Dyslexic Untied]

I don't think that criticism is fair today but it has been in the last few years.

 

[CallyRed]

As long as he isnt putting himself forward as our next manager....

Kinda agree with him.
I think people will be more pissed off because its Jamie Redknapp saying it.

 

[POF]

As long as he isnt putting himself forward as our next manager....

Kinda agree with him.
I think people will more pissed off because its Jamie Redknapp saying it.

It really is amazing how someone can be a pundit on Sky Sports for so long and have so little respect from everyone in the game.

He's a laughing stock and nobody takes what he says seriously, nor should they.

 

[meamth]

Of the players we've sold how many have become significantly better? It doesn't feel like it's very many. Carragher I'd just relishing his moment at the top which isn't even his moment.

I find it lazy by Redknapp, yes we bought good players, but none of them has been a fit for united. Let's get back to the signings shall we?:

Marouane Fellaini, £27.5m
Good player, scored some important goals for us, had the right mentality but not a good fit for us. Thought he reached his match potential with us.

Juan Mata, £37.1m
Great player in his prime, but coming to United, he still caught by the dilemma of not playing him in 10. Over the years he has given us goals and assists, while slowly regressing due to his age. Thought we got what we paid for.

Ander Herrera, £29m
We got what we paid for, was quality for us, and then got his move to PSG.

Luke Shaw, £31m
Was good pre-injury, but after that suffered from the lack of fitness and now Brandon Williams. Still an okay-ish investment.

Marcos Rojo, £16m
Van Gaal signed him on the back of a World Cup was ominous. Rojo has played in 113 out of a possible 274 games. Had a good five-month spell in Mourinho's first season that was halted by an anterior cruciate ligament injury, other than that he has almost always been poor. Impressively never been sent off. United have tried to sell him in three out of four summers.

Angel di Maria, £59.7m
Got the ability but not the right fit for United. We didn't make him shit, he failed to perform for us.

Daley Blind, £13.8m
Was technically very good for us, but seems like PL is not his level. He can play at European level apparently at Ajax, but he was never signed to be world class. We got what we paid for.

Radamel Falcao, £6m loan fee
Already shit after injury.

Victor Valdes, free
Already shit, retirement years.

Memphis Depay, £26.3m
Still shit/mediocre/decent at Lyon, found his level. We didn't turn him to shit, he can't handle the pressure and hopes here.

Matteo Darmian, £12.7m
Basic football player, did we made him into shit? Can't say so.

Morgan Schneiderlin, £25m
The moment he came for us, he seems shot of confidence, can't believe he was the same player at Soton. He can't cope with our hopes and expectations, is that for us to blame?
Then he went to Everton and still shit.

Bastian Schweinsteiger, £6.8m
Retirement age, injury prone, already shit.

Sergio Romero, free
Turns out to be solid.

Anthony Martial, £44m rising to £58m
Is he shit now? Don't think so. Decent.

Eric Bailly, £30m
He gets injured a lot, is that down to us too?

Zlatan Ibrahimovic, free
Light up the league, then got injured, United didn't turn him to shit either.

Henrikh Mkhitaryan, £26.3m
Arsenal and us failed to turn this player into the player he was at Dortmund. Us to blame?

Paul Pogba, £89m
Seriously can you blame Pogba when our team is filled with undeserving players to wear the jersey? The expectations towards him is Messi/Ronaldo like, but people forgets he is a fecking midfielder first.

Victor Lindelof, £30.9m rising to £39m
Improving steadily.

Romelu Lukaku, £75m rising to £90m
Brought in to carry an elite team. Found out that he can't do that, he is a shit player. His level is supporting cast, and leading striker at Everton/Inter Milan/Serie A.

Nemanja Matic, £35m rising to £40m
Already regressing at Chelsea, we got what we paid for.

Alexis Sanchez, swap
Already a shit player according to Arsenal fans. Swapped with another shit player. Club to blame?

Diogo Dalot, £19m
Youngster, improving over time. No verdict yet.

Fred, £52m
Raised his level into a power house. Turned to shit? I guess not.

Lee Grant, £1.5m
3rd choice keeper.

 

[InspiRED]

Generally hard to see how he’s not right. Well see how maguire and awb continue. And how fernandes starts.

Looks to me like maguires heads starting to go. AWB is no shrinking violet but you do fear for him.

there’s been some mild improvement recently, but where we have no well drilled possession game, it’s putting our players under great pressure and stress when they get the ball, esp upon pressing. That’ll wear them down eventually.

 

[RedRonaldo]

This season:
Maguire - seems getting abit worse, verdict still out [???]
AWB - better than expected, becoming better [HIT]
James - better than expected, becoming better [HIT]
Bruno - just joined, lets see [???]

Last season:
Fred - flop in his first season, good in his 2nd [???]
Dalot - not much expectation on him, didn't improve much [???]

Season before:
Lukaku - getting worse, sold him for fair price [MISS]
Sanchez - getting a lot worse, biggest flop ever [MISS]

Other previous signings (post-Fergie era):
Pogba - getting abit worse? expectation was really high though, he is still our best outfield player, and still easily world class when he's on form [???]
Lindelof - meet our expectation for the price, he improves from very bad start, nothing less nothing more [???]
Baily - worst than expected, flop [MISS]
Ibra - as good as expected, unlucky with injuries [HIT]
Mkhitaryan - good at the start, flop in the end [MISS]
Blind - from decent to average [MISS]
Depay - from decent to average [MISS]
Rojo - from decent to average [MISS]
Martial - went through some bad patches, but turn out as good as expected I think [???]
Matic - we bought him for 40m, he has 1 good season and 1 bad season, from good to average [MISS]
Mata - we bought him with high expectation, he didn't really turn out as good as expected, but still a good squad player and serve us for many years, from good to decent [???]
Shaw - from decent to decent, 30m was a lot back then, we've overpaid abit, and he didn't exactly meet his price tag yet [???]
Herrera - from decent to good, he is good investment and turn into key player, disappointed he left us for free [HIT]
Felliani - from decent to decent, he is exactly what he is, not Man Utd quality though, and we've overused as plan B [???]
Romero - from decent to decent, good backup keeper [???]
Darmian - from decent to bad [MISS]
Di Maria - from good to average [MISS]
Schweinsteiger - from good to bad [MISS]
Schneiderlin - from decent to average [MISS]

Overall we have 4 HIT, 12 MISS and 11 as expected/undecided

So Redknapp was right, we have turned many good/decent player into average/bad players. But I don't think its the same case anymore in the recent 1-2 years.

 

[SATA]

He’s a Ihni binni dimi diniwiny anitaime that’s what he is

 

[sunama]

Well, they sometimes look decent for a bit first. Though mostly just utter shit right from the get-go.

Di Maria - started well then turned to shit.
Memphis Depay - was shit throughout
Falcao - was shit throughout
Miki - started well, then turned to shit
Dan James - started well and is currently turning to shit
Martial - started well and has been "okay". Not great. He hasn't really improved. IMO, he is as good today as he was 2 years ago.
Sanchez - was shit throughout
Lukaku - started well. Did well in his first season. In his second season got really fat and turned to shit.

I can do this for all our players, but you get the point.
There is definitely a trend that we turn good players into bad ones.

I would go further and say that we turn decent/great managers into bad ones.
Moyes - he was Mr Safe. He kept Everton in a respectable position. Not great, but definitely not bad. He joined us and turned to complete shit. He has since managed other clubs and has been a disaster.
LVG - big reputation. He turned us into the most boring team in Europe. After he left us, he could not find a suitable job and retired.
Jose - elite level manager. He wins the league with every time....except us. He gave up in his last season with us. I think he wanted to get fired (resigning would mean that he would not get a huge payout).
Ole - Championship (or lower) level manager who did VERY well in his first 3 months, then returned to his usual level. Basically, he turned to shit.

 

[Dyslexic Untied]

Fred, McTom and Rashford are three examples of players who have taken significant strides this year. Isn’t Redknapp the same who said Rashford had to leave to develop a while back?

 

[AR87]

Redknapp.

Otherwise, your post is spot on.

Been drinking haha

 

[caid]

Nah dont buy it. Theres about 2 examples in 20 odd signings where his point has merit. Most weren't that good before they got here

 

[Jev]

I thought we pretty much all shared that view, but maybe that was before Redknapp said it? It's obviously true.

 

[sammsky1]

Of the players we've sold how many have become significantly better? It doesn't feel like it's very many. Redknapp is just relishing his moment at the top which isn't even his moment.

Well plenty of posters have said exactly the same thing post SAF retirement.

so perhaps the only offence here is that the comment comes from an ex Liverpool player!

 

[BlackBen]

I mean the guy is mostly right. It’s hard to swallow for some because it’s coming from a Liverpool fan. If Garry Neville had said it instead, most on here would be lapping it up.

On that note feck Jamie, I know he’s enjoying rubbing it in.

 

[dasty]

So what? Not long ago Liverpool were turning the likes of Carroll, Downing, Lambert, C.Adam, Balotelli, Benteke etc into complete shite.

 

[Adisa]

I agree.
Most of the players we signed had very good reps before signing. That's why we bought them.
At times, you feel we could sign Messi and then him into a turd.
That's how dysfunctional we've been.

 

[M Bison]

I’ve said something similar for a while, there’s no point in spending a fortune every season if we’re not getting more out of our players.

For the first time post Fergie however, it feels as though that is changing. Fred is probably the best example of a player Ole has well and truly converted, but we’re also seeing Rashford becoming a world class talent as well as bringing through some quality youth.

Even Matic, we’ll miss him today, and again he was written off by everyone at the start of the season but has raised his game significantly over the past few weeks.

In summary, I think Redknapp has a point but the tide is definitely turning.

 

[Zen86]

I’ve said something similar for a while, there’s no point in spending a fortune every season if we’re not getting more out of our players.

For the first time post Fergie however, it feels as though that is changing. Fred is probably the best example of a player Ole has well and truly converted, but we’re also seeing Rashford becoming a world class talent as well as bringing through some quality youth.

Even Matic, we’ll miss him today, and again he was written off by everyone at the start of the season but has raised his game significantly over the past few weeks.

In summary, I think Redknapp has a point but the tide is definitely turning.

Agreed. It feels like the curse has been lifted.

 

[M Bison]

Agreed. It feels like the curse has been lifted.

It definitely feels like we’re on the right path, still a long way to go and we’ll still have some poor results before the seasons out but for me I feel like we’re going the right way.

Even our transfer dealings this window and signing Ighalo, a Mourinho would have pushed for Cavani, short term expensive signing and then pushed for another big signing in summer. Not sure what’s (or who) happened to our transfer dealings but there’s definitely a shift in the approach in my view.

Bruno also, we negotiated hard (or so it seems) and whilst it would have been nice to bring him in sooner, I think the fact we’ve paid less at the front end and linked more to longer term performances etc is a positive sign reduces risk and again shows a shift in approach.

 

[R'hllor]

Name one player that we bought and improved after joining, highly increased their value etc., usually they are at their best when they join us, they keep being on that level for 1-3 months until we get hold of them and after that -> downhill, some of them drop so low, that when they finally manage to look ok in a period, we make it out to be some improvement when in reality even at that point, they are still below level before joining.

 

[Josep Dowling]

Who out of any players that have left us over the last 7 years have gone on to do better?

Di Maria has hardly done well at PSG. Maybe Zlatan but he was playing in the MLS.

All Liverpool supporting pundits have become unbearable this season. Now everything is going right for Liverpool they just stick in the knife proclaiming they know what’s wrong with our club. The only reason Liverpool are doing well is because of Klopp. That’s the formula for a club doing well, get a decent manager that’s the right fit the club. It’s not exactly rocket science.

 

[r3idy]

Another sound bite from a nearly man footballer who never was.

He can harp on about turning good players into bad. How about some of the players take a bit of responsibility for their own performances on the pitch.

Lingard - A few good seasons under LVG and Jose, he chose not to kick on, nothing to do with the club, all to do with HIS mindset and mentality

Sanchez - Ask any Arsenal fan, he was dog shit for a good 18 months before came to us, a loner at the club and toxic with his attitude. He was on the downward spiral well before he put on number 7 for us

Lukaku - Not willing to grind it out or dominate Elite level defenders. Yes people can harp on about he is ripping up trees in Italy but let's be fair Serie A is not once what it was.

Smalling - Apparently he is the new Maldini over in Italy. See above, Serie A isn't what it used to be

Credit where credit is due,

Ibra, Leader and an inspiration for the time he was here, hang on isn't that to do with mindset ?

Rashford - Improving all the time and looks a menace. 18 Months ago many on here ready to have his head on a stake !!

Greenwood - Being managed into the team in exactly the right way, not too much too soon, he is being kept hungry. Amazing that the new Pirlo from Burnage, Phil Foden is lauded as some kind of second coming under the tutelage of Pep. 'A Special Player' and other nonsense. Mark my Words both Rashford and Greenwood will be better players than him.

Fred - Improving and will get better with better players around him

McTominay - Time will tell if he will go onto be a truly world class player but great teams are usually more than the some of their own parts (Jordan Henderson) as an example. He's learning and was improving before the injury.

In Short, no I dont buy what Redknapp is spouting. Easy target to hit but a lot of players bought by the club were vanity signings by Ed, DiMaria and Falcao etc

 

[Spark]

It’s all because of Kagawa and the fact Klopp reckons we broke him.

I think if he hadn’t come to United and been shit, then United wouldn’t be considered a club as Redknapp describes in the OP.

 

[Mainoldo]

Don’t even know why this is a debate. This is what we all have been saying.

No one will be surprised if Bruno goes backwards too.

 

[Mainoldo]

It’s all because of Kagawa and the fact Klopp reckons we broke him.

I think if he hadn’t come to United and been shit, then United wouldn’t be considered a club as Redknapp describes in the OP.

I don’t think anyone remembers that far neither Redknapp.

 

[Spark]

I don’t think anyone remembers that far neither Redknapp.

It booted off the narrative though.

 

[Web of Bissaka]

He emphasized environment and players mentality mainly. Also attribute some of it due to manager.

It's very good points.

Risiculous high wages, contracts, favouritism, rubbish performances with no consequences, lack of dof, lack of football structure, coaching, etc are things we already know doesn't promote good competitive football environment.

 

[Bilbo]

The only discussion worthy aspect of this is how Redknapps opinions even make it to print.

 

[cyberman]

Na, too many players like Fred and Rashford have kicked on for this to be true.

 

[Contano]

FACT: Jamie Redknapp is a twat
FICTION: Jamie Redknapp is worth listening to

 

[Mainoldo]

It booted off the narrative though.

How If no-one even remembers? There’s was still too many good performing players for it to be a thing.

 

[Mainoldo]

He emphasized environment and players mentality mainly. Also attribute some of it due to manager.

It's very good points.

Risiculous high wages, contracts, favouritism, rubbish performances with no consequences, lack of dof, lack of football structure, coaching, etc are things we already know doesn't promote good competitive football environment.

Agreed. It’s all into one.

 

[Acole9]

He's right to an extent but he was making loads of snide remarks about us yesterday.

 

[Brightonian]

Nonsense. To my eye we have the same ratio of players improving, staying at the same level and dropping off as any other big club not cruising at the top of their league. You could craft the same narrative around Chelsea, Spurs or City if you wanted to. The only way to have a huge majority of signings succeed is to be at the top of your league and winning trophies so that the pressure to make things happen is reduced, and those players who don't make it are seen as not breaking through against better competition in the squad, rather than 'becoming shit'.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

He should have cited some players to validate his point.

He couldn't though, because there are none.

What good player did we sign and he turned into a bad one?

Alexis? Signs were there in his final half-season at Arsenal that he had declined.

Mata? Signs of decline in his final half-season at Chelsea.

Schweinsteiger? Declined before we bought him.

Falcao? He was coming off an ACL tear. Was awful at Chelsea afterwards too.

Pogba? His performances for us are no different than his at Juventus.

Di Maria? Never wanted to come here.

So the point is futile. It's a bunch of nonsense.

 

[Spark]

How If no-one even remembers? There’s was still too many good performing players for it to be a thing.

Once a narrative begins it doesn’t matter if the original reason is forgotten. I distinctly remember that being the first time the “United breaks good players” thing come about and it’s been used to tar multiple players since, as per the thread. I genuinely do not think it would be as associated with Manchester United (and it is, according to opposition fans) had we not signed him but still gone on to sign all the other examples.

Also Kagawa wasn’t even that long ago, however I fully appreciate if people have erased Moyes’ season on wards.