Florian Wirtz | Der Fußballgott | Der Fluch ist gebrochen!

amolbhatia50k said:
What a a terrible signing. To spend 116m on this weak unimpressive footballer.
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They were asking for a similar price for Sancho who was also doing ridiculous things in the BL. I do think Diomande is the real deal though and Liverpool are supposedly in for him. He looks physically up to the task. Physicality is the major thing on if a player can hit the ground running in this league. A really good technical player can obviously stat pad in the BL but will get found out in more physical surroundings.

I think Wirtz will be fine once the Liverpool team settle down. Yes he's been poor for that transfer fee but I think he'll prove a good player that they will build around over the next seasons
 
Salt Bailly said:
Sky asking Tim Sherwood about the failure of Liverpool's recruitment:

"Wirtz is a very good player. I don't have a problem with him."

Then he moves on to frimpong. Unbelievable Jeff.
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The same Sherwood, who watched Sesko score two against Burnley and at HT go ' I don't really care - he's not good enough for United'

The biggest idiot in football by far.
 
I wonder if the Bayern board is thinking about making an offer in the summer.
 
Ali Dia said:
They were asking for a similar price for Sancho who was also doing ridiculous things in the BL. I do think Diomande is the real deal though and Liverpool are supposedly in for him. He looks physically up to the task. Physicality is the major thing on if a player can hit the ground running in this league. A really good technical player can obviously stat pad in the BL but will get found out in more physical surroundings.

I think Wirtz will be fine once the Liverpool team settle down. Yes he's been poor for that transfer fee but I think he'll prove a good player that they will build around over the next seasons
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I think it's a little bit easier for a wide player because they're less exposed to the frenetic chaos that is the middle third in the PL. Wirtz doesn't have the physicality and he hasn't adjusted to the speed with which you need to make a decision in the PL, and how much more difficult it is to dribble your way out of tight spaces compared to the BL. He could still adjust, but this was always going to be a risk given the money they spent on him.
 
BayernFan87 said:
I wonder if the Bayern board is thinking about making an offer in the summer.
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I think it would have worked out somewhat. Obviously not "100m great" but he would have played in Musiala's spot for months while playing with Diaz, Kane, Olise. Gnabry looked good/great there and Wirtz is a better player technically than him. (Love you Serge!)
 
He’s one of many of these bitch made modern attackers who are good technically but do nothing of note. Then when you criticize them, some egghead will pull up stats on how he completed 91% of his passes and he must be better than Bruno because Bruno gave possession away 4 times.
 
Zero posts after he scored a brilliant goal last week, 3 pages after a game with no goal contribution.

There is no debate that his season has been very underwhelming but its not as awful as people make it out to be. Just for comparison on a very broad basis, not including any context, he has 8 G/A this PL season, Cole Palmer sits on 10 (with various penalties), Saka on 11, Cunha on 11, Odegaard on 6, Mbeumo on 12, Foden on 10, Szoboszlai on 11 (who is supposedly having a really good season). There are obviously better performing players in similar positions like Cherki or Bruno and he should aim to be there one day but hes not much worse in terms of output than some of the biggest names in the league. Still underwhelming but its not like he has done nothing.
 
Ali Dia said:
They were asking for a similar price for Sancho who was also doing ridiculous things in the BL. I do think Diomande is the real deal though and Liverpool are supposedly in for him. He looks physically up to the task. Physicality is the major thing on if a player can hit the ground running in this league. A really good technical player can obviously stat pad in the BL but will get found out in more physical surroundings.

I think Wirtz will be fine once the Liverpool team settle down. Yes he's been poor for that transfer fee but I think he'll prove a good player that they will build around over the next seasons
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I hope they build around a “fine” played. Mediocrity guaranteed.
 
ForEverEleven said:
Zero posts after he scored a brilliant goal last week, 3 pages after a game with no goal contribution.

There is no debate that his season has been very underwhelming but its not as awful as people make it out to be. Just for comparison on a very broad basis, not including any context, he has 8 G/A this PL season, Cole Palmer sits on 10 (with various penalties), Saka on 11, Cunha on 11, Odegaard on 6, Mbeumo on 12, Foden on 10, Szoboszlai on 11 (who is supposedly having a really good season). There are obviously better performing players in similar positions like Cherki or Bruno and he should aim to be there one day but hes not much worse in terms of output than some of the biggest names in the league. Still underwhelming but its not like he has done nothing.
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He walked into the runaway title winners for a record price tag. None of them other players cost anywhere near that or were in the same privileged (football wise) situation he was.

At different times Bruno, Cunha, Mbuemo, Odegaard to name the most recent have also been given pelters.

Small reminder he cost double or triple all them players.

Edit - maybe even quadruple Cherki and possibly others, can’t be bothered checking fees
 
ForEverEleven said:
Zero posts after he scored a brilliant goal last week, 3 pages after a game with no goal contribution.

There is no debate that his season has been very underwhelming but its not as awful as people make it out to be. Just for comparison on a very broad basis, not including any context, he has 8 G/A this PL season, Cole Palmer sits on 10 (with various penalties), Saka on 11, Cunha on 11, Odegaard on 6, Mbeumo on 12, Foden on 10, Szoboszlai on 11 (who is supposedly having a really good season). There are obviously better performing players in similar positions like Cherki or Bruno and he should aim to be there one day but hes not much worse in terms of output than some of the biggest names in the league. Still underwhelming but its not like he has done nothing.
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Does who he was playing against yesterday not give a hint as to why there were more posts yesterday?

And against any decent side he's done absolutely nothing. I think against the top 9 sides in the PL he has zero goals or assists.
 
ForEverEleven said:
Zero posts after he scored a brilliant goal last week, 3 pages after a game with no goal contribution.

There is no debate that his season has been very underwhelming but its not as awful as people make it out to be. Just for comparison on a very broad basis, not including any context, he has 8 G/A this PL season, Cole Palmer sits on 10 (with various penalties), Saka on 11, Cunha on 11, Odegaard on 6, Mbeumo on 12, Foden on 10, Szoboszlai on 11 (who is supposedly having a really good season). There are obviously better performing players in similar positions like Cherki or Bruno and he should aim to be there one day but hes not much worse in terms of output than some of the biggest names in the league. Still underwhelming but its not like he has done nothing.
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A game against Manchester United. In a thread on Manchester United forum. Strange.
 
ForEverEleven said:
Zero posts after he scored a brilliant goal last week, 3 pages after a game with no goal contribution.

There is no debate that his season has been very underwhelming but its not as awful as people make it out to be. Just for comparison on a very broad basis, not including any context, he has 8 G/A this PL season, Cole Palmer sits on 10 (with various penalties), Saka on 11, Cunha on 11, Odegaard on 6, Mbeumo on 12, Foden on 10, Szoboszlai on 11 (who is supposedly having a really good season). There are obviously better performing players in similar positions like Cherki or Bruno and he should aim to be there one day but hes not much worse in terms of output than some of the biggest names in the league. Still underwhelming but its not like he has done nothing.
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Mate he’s fecking shite but he’ll be back at your club within a few years so all good
 
Ali Dia said:
Doesn't he have 7/8 goals and 7/8 assists in his first season? I know he's been pretty shite in general but they are decent numbers ( like Cunha and Mbuemo) but a little fella like that was never going to come in and become an instant squad leader in a transitional season in a much tougher league. Their other big transfers have bombed just as hard if not worse. Once Isak gets back to resembling a footballer and they stick Ekiteke out on the left wing, one really good signing for Salah they'll annoyingly be fine for top 4 again next season.
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In isolation, the numbers aren’t terrible, but when factoring in
a) his price
b) who those goals and assists mostly came against (I doubt he’s influenced or decided any important games?)
c) his general play has been bad and his lack of overall influence on the team (considering point a);

It’s been a disaster of a first season imo.

edit: @Djemba-Djemba answered my post - zero goals or assists against the top 9. Wow.
 
The highlight of his season was the dive against Inter, really says it all
 
Regulus Arcturus Black said:
He’s absolutely bang average. Leverkusen will be offered him back for about 40 million in 2027 and will probably reject the opportunity at that price.
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I mean, he was very good there. It's not as though Liverpool bought a player who had never shown anything. He just isn't suited for the Prem at all.
 
FriedClams said:
Mate he’s fecking shite but he’ll be back at your club within a few years so all good
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Exactly. A nothing player, won't be surprised if he's loaned back to Leverkusen after next season
 
Regulus Arcturus Black said:
He’s absolutely bang average. Leverkusen will be offered him back for about 40 million in 2027 and will probably reject the opportunity at that price.
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I was taking the piss out of plastic scouse mate saying that when it came to Wirtz he was Homer chasing after the pig saying “it’s still good, it’s still good”. The “it’s gone, Homer” moment will be when he joins Dortmund on a loan with a €30m option to buy in January 2028
 
ForEverEleven said:
You mean, all of the 164 pages in here are solely posts regarding games he played against Man United? Wow!
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I suppose that indicates how often he's been shite that there are 164 pages if there are barely any or none after he scores a brilliant goal, which is about right. He's been poo.
 
SilentWitness said:
I suppose that indicates how often he's been shite that there are 164 pages if there are barely any or none after he scores a brilliant goal, which is about right. He's been poo.
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Even the Liverpool fans I know have give up defending his terrible performances.
 
He's the German Shinji Kagawa. At least Kagawa scored a hat trick for us one time so he wasn't totally a background NPC for once.
 
ForEverEleven said:
You mean, all of the 164 pages in here are solely posts regarding games he played against Man United? Wow!
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You wondered why that page total went up quicker to 164 after a game against Manchester United, the very fact you can't comprehend why that might happen is disturbing. I'm not sure everything is alright with you, you seem waaaaaaaay too invested in the opinions of a bang average player for your own good.
 
It was a goal at home vs Palace in a game they were already winning, it's not the stuff of legends. Their own fans won't remember it in 2 weeks.
 
In fairness it really is a bit strange how a Wirtz thread on a United forum got 164 pages :lol:

Most seem to despise him. He just turned 23 and he is playing for a strange Liverpool team where most of the players look like shadows of their former selves. He hasn't been that bad, think he's 5th for chances created in the league and he isn't even Liverpool's main set piece taker (does he even take them?). Whenever I've seen him play for Liverpool he looks really nervous and hesitant, but watching him for Germany it's like another player, full of confidence and understanding with his team mates.
 
Trigestis said:
In fairness it really is a bit strange how a Wirtz thread on a United forum got 164 pages :lol:

Most seem to despise him. He just turned 23 and he is playing for a strange Liverpool team where most of the players look like shadows of their former selves. He hasn't been that bad, think he's 5th for chances created in the league and he isn't even Liverpool's main set piece taker (does he even take them?). Whenever I've seen him play for Liverpool he looks really nervous and hesitant, but watching him for Germany it's like another player, full of confidence and understanding with his team mates.
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It’s not that strange when United fans have had to listen to endless criticisms from Liverpool-centric pundits (and pundits generally) whenever they have bought expensive players that haven’t delivered. The fact this player gets such an easy ride in general from the media has added to the vitriol from United fans. I don’t think anyone ‘despises’ him, at all.
 
Trigestis said:
In fairness it really is a bit strange how a Wirtz thread on a United forum got 164 pages :lol:

Most seem to despise him. He just turned 23 and he is playing for a strange Liverpool team where most of the players look like shadows of their former selves. He hasn't been that bad, think he's 5th for chances created in the league and he isn't even Liverpool's main set piece taker (does he even take them?). Whenever I've seen him play for Liverpool he looks really nervous and hesitant, but watching him for Germany it's like another player, full of confidence and understanding with his team mates.
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No one hates him, we hate Liverpool. They’re the enemy and they’ve spent record sums on a crock and an absolute pup. That’s catnip to us.

That thread is so long is mainly due to the complete lack of scrutiny. It’s actually getting a bit weird. £120m and he’s been, at best, absolutely bang average. I’ve only heard one pundit properly dig him out.
 
IrwinwasbetterthanCarlos said:
No one hates him, we hate Liverpool. They’re the enemy and they’ve spent record sums on a crock and an absolute pup. That’s catnip to us.

That thread is so long is mainly due to the complete lack of scrutiny. It’s actually getting a bit weird. £120m and he’s been, at best, absolutely bang average. I’ve only heard one pundit properly dig him out.
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Many of them actually say he’s been good or even very good. It’s peak gaslighting.
 
Trigestis said:
In fairness it really is a bit strange how a Wirtz thread on a United forum got 164 pages :lol:

Most seem to despise him. He just turned 23 and he is playing for a strange Liverpool team where most of the players look like shadows of their former selves. He hasn't been that bad, think he's 5th for chances created in the league and he isn't even Liverpool's main set piece taker (does he even take them?). Whenever I've seen him play for Liverpool he looks really nervous and hesitant, but watching him for Germany it's like another player, full of confidence and understanding with his team mates.
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Seems to be a polarising topic that there might be an active thread on a high profile player in the football forum section of a massive internet message board. A few things maybe to take into consideration - it's not only been about him at Liverpool, there were about 50-60 pages of messages about him when he was still at Leverkusen. Also, despite all the snarky messages about "Utd fans making fun of Wirtz lol", the main contributors to this thread aren't Utd fans. When you look at the top posters in here, the top 10 ones aren't Utd fans - they're German or Liverpool fans. So let's take the number of posts with a pinch of salt as well.

Also, number of "chances created" is a bit of a silly stat. I think if you really want to judge the creativity of a player, looking at "big chances created" is a much better indicator - and in that ranking, he falls to 71st in the league, in the illustrious company of Dalot, Guéhi-playmaker-extraordinaire or Neko Williams.

Pretending that this transfer and his season have been anything else than an unmitigated failure at this stage is plain nonsense. He has puffed up his stats against mediocre opposition to make them look ok, but as soon as he's up against decent opposition, it's pretty bad. Beyond not impacting big games, he actively goes missing in them. He's shy, weak and doesn't seem up to it.

Now that may change (I've consistenly said that I think he'll be better in his second season in England) and I guess a change of manager, a fresh start after the summer, whatever, might be exactly what he needs to confirm his potential, but currently he's shown nothing in England and it's a bit tiring that Utd fans have to justify on a Utd forum why they're playfully mocking (I don't believe there's anything particularly egregious in the way he's talked about on here) a guy who was plain terrible in the last game against Manchester United.
 
Rooney in Paris said:
Seems to be a polarising topic that there might be an active thread on a high profile player in the football forum section of a massive internet message board. A few things maybe to take into consideration - it's not only been about him at Liverpool, there were about 50-60 pages of messages about him when he was still at Leverkusen. Also, despite all the snarky messages about "Utd fans making fun of Wirtz lol", the main contributors to this thread aren't Utd fans. When you look at the top posters in here, the top 10 ones aren't Utd fans - they're German or Liverpool fans. So let's take the number of posts with a pinch of salt as well.

Also, number of "chances created" is a bit of a silly stat. I think if you really want to judge the creativity of a player, looking at "big chances created" is a much better indicator - and in that ranking, he falls to 71st in the league, in the illustrious company of Dalot, Guéhi-playmaker-extraordinaire or Neko Williams.

Pretending that this transfer and his season have been anything else than an unmitigated failure at this stage is plain nonsense. He has puffed up his stats against mediocre opposition to make them look ok, but as soon as he's up against decent opposition, it's pretty bad. Beyond not impacting big games, he actively goes missing in them. He's shy, weak and doesn't seem up to it.

Now that may change (I've consistenly said that I think he'll be better in his second season in England) and I guess a change of manager, a fresh start after the summer, whatever, might be exactly what he needs to confirm his potential, but currently he's shown nothing in England and it's a bit tiring that Utd fans have to justify on a Utd forum why they're playfully mocking (I don't believe there's anything particularly egregious in the way he's talked about on here) a guy who was plain terrible in the last game against Manchester United.
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Agree with almost all of that, but while most on here were initially correct to call him out in the first few months of the season, I don't think there's anyone sane who will try to argue otherwise on the bolded part.

He's had some decent performances - and even then they can only be qualified as "above average to good", nothing out of the extraordinary, and definitely nothing you wouldn't expect from such a high-profile signing. But they were few and far between, and they weren't in the games that we needed them most. The big excuse you can make for him is that he came into a new league in a dysfunctional team that's not playing to his strengths under a manager that still doesn't even know where he's best used imo, but the big counter-argument to that is that you'd expect from a player of his stature to actively take the team by the scruff of the neck and drag us through bad games, which he simply hasn't done, he goes down with the rest of them.

Like you I still think he might come good and will have a better season next year, but it won't happen under Slot imo.
 
RobinLFC said:
Agree with almost all of that, but while most on here were initially correct to call him out in the first few months of the season, I don't think there's anyone sane who will try to argue otherwise on the bolded part.

He's had some decent performances - and even then they can only be qualified as "above average to good", nothing out of the extraordinary, and definitely nothing you wouldn't expect from such a high-profile signing. But they were few and far between, and they weren't in the games that we needed them most. The big excuse you can make for him is that he came into a new league in a dysfunctional team that's not playing to his strengths under a manager that still doesn't even know where he's best used imo, but the big counter-argument to that is that you'd expect from a player of his stature to actively take the team by the scruff of the neck and drag us through bad games, which he simply hasn't done, he goes down with the rest of them.

Like you I still think he might come good and will have a better season next year, but it won't happen under Slot imo.
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Emphasis on "anyone sane" then :D
 
As per wiki he is the joint 8th most expensive transfer in the history of the game (grealish also cost £100m up front).
It’s been so long since Liverpool messed up badly in the transfer market so we are all allowed to laugh.
Not even mentioning Isak.
 
Trigestis said:
In fairness it really is a bit strange how a Wirtz thread on a United forum got 164 pages :lol:

Most seem to despise him. He just turned 23 and he is playing for a strange Liverpool team where most of the players look like shadows of their former selves. He hasn't been that bad, think he's 5th for chances created in the league and he isn't even Liverpool's main set piece taker (does he even take them?). Whenever I've seen him play for Liverpool he looks really nervous and hesitant, but watching him for Germany it's like another player, full of confidence and understanding with his team mates.
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I think this largely stems from the fact that a large proportion of United’s big-money signings are quite literally slaughtered by the media after 5 or 6 games. Sesko was a recent example he’s the same age as Wirtz and was taking flak just weeks into his move. We also saw it with Pogba and others. The funny thing is that both Pogba and Sesko have been better than Wirtz in their first year, yet he hasn’t taken any stick from the mainstream media, whereas Pogba was being hammered weekly and Sesko, until recently, was taking a lot of stick too. Wirtz had been sold to the league as this world beater, ready to take the league by storm. When he has looked as good if not worse than Jesse Lingard at West Ham.
 
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