Football Leaks: Manchester City accused of using shadow firms to flout rules

Champ

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And you’ll still have Gary Neville on Sky every week, crowing about how incredibly amazing they are and that they’re gods gift to the game of football.

Pundits and fans alike should be as outraged about this as they were about the Super League.
Exactly this,

I get they are irrelevant as a club, and generally anonymous, but this for me is up there with the Italian match fixing scandals and the Super league.

It's flagrant disrepect of competition and any financial rules and regulations, but somehow it's accepted by many. I think the fans showed that they can achieve something when they worked together...
 

stevoc

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What I don't get is why fans just 'accept' this?!

City have been found to have essentially cheated their way to the top, we all know it to be true, yet we all accept it and carry on.

What happened to fair competition, to legitimate competition, seems like everyone has accepted this without kicking up a fuss, yet are happy to discuss that against their owners.
City have brought the game into disrepute but no one cares, I get that they are fairly anonymous as a club anyhow, so maybe that's why noone cares!! :lol:
What can you do though?

The revelation that Man City have been cheating and circumventing FFP since day one will surprise absolutely fecking no one. And by this stage everyone knows the people who control football are a bunch of crooks primarily interested in lining their own pockets. So there's no point thinking that UEFA, the PL or the FA will grow a set of balls and actually punish them. They're probably already on the phone negotiating bribes to make it disappear.
 

cyberman

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And you’ll still have Gary Neville on Sky every week, crowing about how incredibly amazing they are and that they’re gods gift to the game of football.

Pundits and fans alike should be as outraged about this as they were about the Super League.
Neville is one of the clowns who talks around this by sucking them off when praising them for the work in local areas as if that makes up for the atrocities their government carries out on an entire country.
It hurts my head. Itd like praising Trump for being able to sell MAGA hats
 

Champ

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What can you do though?

The revelation that Man City have been cheating and circumventing FFP since day one will surprise absolutely fecking no one. And by this stage everyone knows the people who control football are a bunch of crooks primarily interested in lining their own pockets. So there's no point thinking that UEFA, the PL or the FA will grow a set of balls and actually punish them. They're probably already on the phone negotiating bribes to make it disappear.
I get what you're saying,

No one said this about the Super League, why should the fans be a silent majority in this?

To me this is essentially City crapping all over the competition, it's like the spoilt kid at school who's not very good but has brought those banned nike shoes which help him shave a second of his time to beat everyone!

The fans can have their say, like they did against the Super League, social media campaigns, calls for the Government to get involved, banners, protests, they can all be done and make a difference if people got together, but it seems like people have just accepted this.

I may be a tad melodramatic with all this, but it winds me up that City and other clubs feel they can disregard the history of fair play and competition, it should bring out a similar feeling to that of the Super League, but for some reason it hasn't!
 

TrueRed1999

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Cloud7

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I get what you're saying,

No one said this about the Super League, why should the fans be a silent majority in this?

To me this is essentially City crapping all over the competition, it's like the spoilt kid at school who's not very good but has brought those banned nike shoes which help him shave a second of his time to beat everyone!

The fans can have their say, like they did against the Super League, social media campaigns, calls for the Government to get involved, banners, protests, they can all be done and make a difference if people got together, but it seems like people have just accepted this.

I may be a tad melodramatic with all this, but it winds me up that City and other clubs feel they can disregard the history of fair play and competition, it should bring out a similar feeling to that of the Super League, but for some reason it hasn't!
I don't think the vast majority of football fans actually care. I may be very wrong about this, as this is purely anecdotal based on what I see around the internet, but it seems like the only fans that are this upset about it are fans of the traditional big clubs, like us, Pool, Barcelona, Madrid etc. You don't really see fans of your Norwich or Sheffield or Real Betis up in arms about this in the same way you would see a United fan or a Real fan.

Maybe from their POV the clubs don't seem that different. Sure, you can talk about having earned the money and what not, but for someone who supports a small club, are you really going to care or put any sort of emotion into saying United earned the right to spend 90 million on Lukaku, but City haven't earned the right to spend 100 million on Kane, they just got lucky. For the vast majority of fans of other clubs, why would that matter?

The reason there was such an uproar over the Super League was because everyone was against it, because it represented something that all football fans resented. I don't think we'll ever see the same thing against the nation backed clubs because they just aren't viewed that differently to the traditional big clubs.
 

Tincanalley

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Things have changed since the super League- FA/UEFA took a shock to the core. They better do SOMETHING about oil clubs or their heads could roll. I sense some big changes are on the way.
 

stevoc

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I get what you're saying,

No one said this about the Super League, why should the fans be a silent majority in this?

To me this is essentially City crapping all over the competition, it's like the spoilt kid at school who's not very good but has brought those banned nike shoes which help him shave a second of his time to beat everyone!

The fans can have their say, like they did against the Super League, social media campaigns, calls for the Government to get involved, banners, protests, they can all be done and make a difference if people got together, but it seems like people have just accepted this.

I may be a tad melodramatic with all this, but it winds me up that City and other clubs feel they can disregard the history of fair play and competition, it should bring out a similar feeling to that of the Super League, but for some reason it hasn't!
The Super League united all fans, but the truth is most fans (even some United fans) don't care or don't want to make a big fuss about this shit because I suspect they secretly (or in some cases not so secretly) hope that their club gets bought by a middle eastern regime and breaks rules to win trophies.
 

Champ

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The Super League united all fans, but the truth is most fans (even some United fans) don't care or don't want to make a big fuss about this shit because I suspect they secretly (or in some cases not so secretly) hope that their club gets bought by a middle eastern regime and breaks rules to win trophies.
And this fundamentally is the major issue with top level football and the fickle nature of fans.

Willing to stand up against the greedy fat cat clubs willing to join the super League, but not willing to care a jot about a greedy fat cat club who have dismissed the opposition clubs and competition with complete disdain and lack of respect for any rules, regulations or fairness.

Strange, and I just don't get it.
 

Champ

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I don't think the vast majority of football fans actually care. I may be very wrong about this, as this is purely anecdotal based on what I see around the internet, but it seems like the only fans that are this upset about it are fans of the traditional big clubs, like us, Pool, Barcelona, Madrid etc. You don't really see fans of your Norwich or Sheffield or Real Betis up in arms about this in the same way you would see a United fan or a Real fan.

Maybe from their POV the clubs don't seem that different. Sure, you can talk about having earned the money and what not, but for someone who supports a small club, are you really going to care or put any sort of emotion into saying United earned the right to spend 90 million on Lukaku, but City haven't earned the right to spend 100 million on Kane, they just got lucky. For the vast majority of fans of other clubs, why would that matter?

The reason there was such an uproar over the Super League was because everyone was against it, because it represented something that all football fans resented. I don't think we'll ever see the same thing against the nation backed clubs because they just aren't viewed that differently to the traditional big clubs.
But this affects small clubs probably more than anyone else.
United have the financial clout to maintain a level of relative success, the likes of Burnley don't and so have to stick within the rules in order to get by, all the while watching a growing entity on City crap on the rules from a great hight and get away with it.

Surely every other football fans wants a resemblance of fairness in abiding by the rules?
 

Sassy Colin

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Nothing will happen, any Court will laugh at the Premier League.

° First they need to prove that the Money is laundered into Sponsors, which is already difficult to Prove.

° Every Court will laugh at the Premier League. Like do u want a Court to stop Investment ?


I'm not defending City but FFP was created by the American Owner's and Perez , so they stay the biggest club forever and can suck the Money from Consumers and get all new Fans. It's like a Cartell. Without FFP the Glazers actually has to spend and couldn't take Money so easily from United
Oh, so now it's the Glazer's fault.

That's new take.
 

Dave Smith

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Don't think that's how it works in these situations mate. When Marseille and Juventus got caught match fixing they were stripped of previous titles. The seasons in which they had been cheating not docked points in current or future seasons.

Not that I expect this to actually result in any significant punishment for City as the PL are as corrupt as UEFA.
Slightly different cases, Juve bribed referees and Marsaille bribed pretty much everyone. Man City have instead moved money around to create a Financial irregularities case that is lower level stuff than bribery.

Additionally, every club in England that has been found guilty of financial issues have always had their penalty applied moving forward rather than prior. I mean the football league want to apply Derby's when technically still that season (they want to apply it in May and the season officially ends in June) and they weren't allowed.

There is no precedent for City to be stripped of their titles. At worst it will be a 10pts deduction and a heavy fine.
 

The holy trinity 68

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Nothing will happen, any Court will laugh at the Premier League.

° First they need to prove that the Money is laundered into Sponsors, which is already difficult to Prove.

° Every Court will laugh at the Premier League. Like do u want a Court to stop Investment ?


I'm not defending City but FFP was created by the American Owner's and Perez , so they stay the biggest club forever and can suck the Money from Consumers and get all new Fans. It's like a Cartell. Without FFP the Glazers actually has to spend and couldn't take Money so easily from United
What a ridiculous point of view this is :houllier:
 

stevoc

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Slightly different cases, Juve bribed referees and Marsaille bribed pretty much everyone. Man City have instead moved money around to create a Financial irregularities case that is lower level stuff than bribery.

Additionally, every club in England that has been found guilty of financial issues have always had their penalty applied moving forward rather than prior. I mean the football league want to apply Derby's when technically still that season (they want to apply it in May and the season officially ends in June) and they weren't allowed.

There is no precedent for City to be stripped of their titles. At worst it will be a 10pts deduction and a heavy fine.
Well let's see how it plays out, to be honest I wouldn't even bet on them getting any sort of points deduction.
 

Andersonson

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Just a question, its the owners money. Can the Prem actually deny him using his own money onto his club?

Shouldnt someone be able to use his money the way he wants?
 

Cassidy

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Just a question, its the owners money. Can the Prem actually deny him using his own money onto his club?

Shouldnt someone be able to use his money the way he wants?
You are allowed, you're not allowed to pretend its not your own...
 

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I don't think the vast majority of football fans actually care. I may be very wrong about this, as this is purely anecdotal based on what I see around the internet, but it seems like the only fans that are this upset about it are fans of the traditional big clubs, like us, Pool, Barcelona, Madrid etc. You don't really see fans of your Norwich or Sheffield or Real Betis up in arms about this in the same way you would see a United fan or a Real fan.

Maybe from their POV the clubs don't seem that different. Sure, you can talk about having earned the money and what not, but for someone who supports a small club, are you really going to care or put any sort of emotion into saying United earned the right to spend 90 million on Lukaku, but City haven't earned the right to spend 100 million on Kane, they just got lucky. For the vast majority of fans of other clubs, why would that matter?

The reason there was such an uproar over the Super League was because everyone was against it, because it represented something that all football fans resented. I don't think we'll ever see the same thing against the nation backed clubs because they just aren't viewed that differently to the traditional big clubs.
You're not wrong. And I'll never understand the fans of big clubs shamelessly wondering why neutral fans or fans of smaller clubs would give a feck.
 

Teja

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Just a question, its the owners money. Can the Prem actually deny him using his own money onto his club?

Shouldnt someone be able to use his money the way he wants?
That's the City argument - Not allowing new money is a way of saying we'll keep the status quo - big clubs stay big, small clubs stay small. I'm sure they'll backtrack on that 100% if the Saudis take over Newcastle and outspend City to the title consistently for 5-10 yrs.

Right now the rules say you're not allowed to spend significantly more than what you make as a club. The rules may be fair / unfair depending on your point of view. To basically everyone but the City fans it's obvious that they're cooking the books to make sure they're not in violation of the said rules.
 

Zehner

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Have mixed feelings on this topic. On the one hand, I enjoy City's brand of football and think they've spent their vast amounts of money quite well but watching them was always a guilty pleasure because of the despicable people in the background. So I think it's good if they were to be put into their place.

On the other hand, who cares if they doped financially? It sure was refreshing to see the elite clubs that bullied the smaller clubs continuously and put rules in place to ensure nobody could challenge them being bullied themselves for once. Some of them have really annoying and self entitled fans and them tasting their own medicine was quite nice and I don't want to see them back on top of the food chain again. But to be fair, that's probably still the lesser evil compared to oppressive regimes whitewashing their wrongdoings through spending big on football and getting another foot on the doorstep of Western politics this way.
 

Zehner

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I don't think the vast majority of football fans actually care. I may be very wrong about this, as this is purely anecdotal based on what I see around the internet, but it seems like the only fans that are this upset about it are fans of the traditional big clubs, like us, Pool, Barcelona, Madrid etc. You don't really see fans of your Norwich or Sheffield or Real Betis up in arms about this in the same way you would see a United fan or a Real fan.

Maybe from their POV the clubs don't seem that different. Sure, you can talk about having earned the money and what not, but for someone who supports a small club, are you really going to care or put any sort of emotion into saying United earned the right to spend 90 million on Lukaku, but City haven't earned the right to spend 100 million on Kane, they just got lucky. For the vast majority of fans of other clubs, why would that matter?

The reason there was such an uproar over the Super League was because everyone was against it, because it represented something that all football fans resented. I don't think we'll ever see the same thing against the nation backed clubs because they just aren't viewed that differently to the traditional big clubs.
You're not wrong. And I'll never understand the fans of big clubs shamelessly wondering why neutral fans or fans of smaller clubs would give a feck.
Pretty much this. New money vs. old money. But from the outside, it's nice to see the establishment being teased a little bit ;)

You know, as a fan of a smaller club fans of elite clubs see the players you developed already as their property. They expect you to be grateful that you can sell him for a bit of money to a bigger club. And if you get into discussions, they tell you that their club is simply bigger than yours, you should get to know your place. It was nice to tell them that there are even bigger fish in the pond that can easily outbid them ;)
 

Kentonio

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Just a question, its the owners money. Can the Prem actually deny him using his own money onto his club?

Shouldnt someone be able to use his money the way he wants?
Allowing owners to do what they like was what caused the kind of spectacular collapses like Leeds that led us to FFP in the first place. When FFP came in in 2009 the 20 PL teams had around £3.1 billion in debt and there were real fears that they would go the Leeds route.
 

blackhawk747

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If the "rumor" of financing dose continued to spread, UAE will quit man city eventually. IMO UAE won't invest in manc just because they need some fun, it is because they need a new source of revenue to replace their declining Oil business. As soon as they realize they wont make any profit out of it, they will cut their losses without any hesitation.
 

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If the "rumor" of financing dose continued to spread, UAE will quit man city eventually. IMO UAE won't invest in manc just because they need some fun, it is because they need a new source of revenue to replace their declining Oil business. As soon as they realize they wont make any profit out of it, they will cut their losses without any hesitation.
It's pretty evident that UAE has no interest in turning a profit out of the City Football Group, if anything, they are using the brands to make UAE look better publicly. I'm sure the Sheikh's have other more lucrative endeavours to throw their oil profits into.
 

stevoc

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Have mixed feelings on this topic. On the one hand, I enjoy City's brand of football and think they've spent their vast amounts of money quite well but watching them was always a guilty pleasure because of the despicable people in the background. So I think it's good if they were to be put into their place.

On the other hand, who cares if they doped financially? It sure was refreshing to see the elite clubs that bullied the smaller clubs continuously and put rules in place to ensure nobody could challenge them being bullied themselves for once. Some of them have really annoying and self entitled fans and them tasting their own medicine was quite nice and I don't want to see them back on top of the food chain again. But to be fair, that's probably still the lesser evil compared to oppressive regimes whitewashing their wrongdoings through spending big on football and getting another foot on the doorstep of Western politics this way.
Which rules were those?

I think you need to familiarize yourself with the history behind FFP and why it was needed. Without it here's what would have happened to many more clubs.

https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...-need-for-ffp-efl-league-one-two-owners-wages
 
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stevoc

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Allowing owners to do what they like was what caused the kind of spectacular collapses like Leeds that led us to FFP in the first place. When FFP came in in 2009 the 20 PL teams had around £3.1 billion in debt and there were real fears that they would go the Leeds route.
And Portsmouth, Malaga and others.

But apparently FFP weren't rules to protect clubs from going bust if they spent beyond their means. No they were only put in place by the big clubs so no one could challenge them or something.
 

Hulksmash

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What a ridiculous point of view this is :houllier:
No it's not.

Look at this Idea. No FFP and No Oil clubs like Chelsea and City.

Manchester United would probably become the Bayern Munich. Winning the league in February and the most disgusting thing is that the Glazers could leech United even more. They wouldn't even have to spend that much Money.

The American doesn't want to spend money , they want to leech the money from the Fans and Clubs. That's why Super League was so great about them, since they would be guaranteed Money in their Pocket. In the end the Fans would suffer.

Oil Clubs stops the leeching from greedy Owners and allow smaller Clubs to catch up.


But thats my point of View
 

cyberman

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Have mixed feelings on this topic. On the one hand, I enjoy City's brand of football and think they've spent their vast amounts of money quite well but watching them was always a guilty pleasure because of the despicable people in the background. So I think it's good if they were to be put into their place.

On the other hand, who cares if they doped financially? It sure was refreshing to see the elite clubs that bullied the smaller clubs continuously and put rules in place to ensure nobody could challenge them being bullied themselves for once. Some of them have really annoying and self entitled fans and them tasting their own medicine was quite nice and I don't want to see them back on top of the food chain again. But to be fair, that's probably still the lesser evil compared to oppressive regimes whitewashing their wrongdoings through spending big on football and getting another foot on the doorstep of Western politics this way.
Utter nonsense. The likes of Spurs, Leicester, Arsenal, Liverpool etc were up there in the league during the City era and the big spending Utd were behind all of them. Which of those clubs set these secret rules to keep their foot down on the throat of the league?was it Utd when selling Ronaldo to buy Valencia?
 

OverratedOpinion

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Pretty much this. New money vs. old money. But from the outside, it's nice to see the establishment being teased a little bit ;)

You know, as a fan of a smaller club fans of elite clubs see the players you developed already as their property. They expect you to be grateful that you can sell him for a bit of money to a bigger club. And if you get into discussions, they tell you that their club is simply bigger than yours, you should get to know your place. It was nice to tell them that there are even bigger fish in the pond that can easily outbid them ;)
Don't get this, it's like you are cheering on a club that will do the exact same thing to your club but do it with blood money whilst bending rules. I am almost sure that if you go on Blue Moon you will find city fans talking about how little old Villa should gladly sell their best player to the mighty City.
 

11101

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I get what you're saying,

No one said this about the Super League, why should the fans be a silent majority in this?
Most fans have grown up with Liverpool or us dominating and hate us for it. They're so desperate to see the big clubs beaten they turn a blind eye to the damage it does to all clubs and the game itself.
 

stevoc

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No it's not.

Look at this Idea. No FFP and No Oil clubs like Chelsea and City.

Manchester United would probably become the Bayern Munich. Winning the league in February
and the most disgusting thing is that the Glazers could leech United even more. They wouldn't even have to spend that much Money.

The American doesn't want to spend money , they want to leech the money from the Fans and Clubs. That's why Super League was so great about them, since they would be guaranteed Money in their Pocket. In the end the Fans would suffer.

Oil Clubs stops the leeching from greedy Owners and allow smaller Clubs to catch up.


But thats my point of View
In this hypothetical alternative history that you've dreamed up where are some of the worlds biggest and/or richest clubs like Liverpool or Arsenal? Have they left the league?
 

tomaldinho1

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Have mixed feelings on this topic. On the one hand, I enjoy City's brand of football and think they've spent their vast amounts of money quite well but watching them was always a guilty pleasure because of the despicable people in the background. So I think it's good if they were to be put into their place.

On the other hand, who cares if they doped financially? It sure was refreshing to see the elite clubs that bullied the smaller clubs continuously and put rules in place to ensure nobody could challenge them being bullied themselves for once. Some of them have really annoying and self entitled fans and them tasting their own medicine was quite nice and I don't want to see them back on top of the food chain again. But to be fair, that's probably still the lesser evil compared to oppressive regimes whitewashing their wrongdoings through spending big on football and getting another foot on the doorstep of Western politics this way.
How can anyone have mixed feelings on this? Even if don’t believe in FFP, you are aware of how City are funded right?

Honestly, if City were just owned by some random billionaire without the link to human rights violations I don’t think most people would care about cooking the books, it’s the combo that makes it unacceptable.
 
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How can anyone have mixed feelings on this? Even if don’t believe in FFP, you are aware of how City are funded right?

Honestly, if City were just owned by some random billionaire without the link to human rights violations I don’t think most people would care about cooking the books, it’s the combo that makes it unacceptable.
It’s the state funded part I have the biggest issue with. Money that should belong to that nation and it’s people, and that should be used for the greater good of humanity, instead flushed down the toilet of a massive vanity project.
 

JJ12

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Are many in the media even reporting this?
 

Sandikan

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As much as we hated it, of course it was.
Recent football fan?

If you goole Liverpool 0 Arsenal 2 "it's up for grabs now", you'll see that the ending to that season was Aguero x100 as it was a last min goal, last day, but between the two top teams. With the away team stealing it.

Impossible to beat that ending.
 
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Recent football fan?

If you goole Liverpool 0 Arsenal 2 "it's up for grabs now", you'll see that the ending to that season was Aguero x100 as it was a last min goal, last day, but between the two top teams. With the away team stealing it.

Impossible to beat that ending.
I still can’t get my head around the losing team later signing the fecker who did that to them.

Absolutely incredible end to a league season that, doubt we’ll ever see anything like it again.