Honestly I love Ole and I hope he does well for us but this defending is a disgrace. I know we're not the only team in the league right now who can't defend, I know we have some really shit, brainless defenders, but for a club of our standing it's not good enough. Whoever works on our defending needs to put in some overtime, and Ole seriously needs to consider making up with Smalling who right now is our best option to partner Maguire. Or Lindelof. Woodward is a fecking idiot but our defence is not as bad as they've showed today, the coaching needs to improve.
For all the Ole Iners
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
I find it hypocritical people have an issue with patience then state they want another manager appointed and given time to implement their style. Real have a very strange approach to managers.
I swear if this start of the season was Moyes, LVG or Jose, they would be getting absolutely slaughtered from all corners... but because of OGS, it’s no big deal apparently 
And if our two most recent former managers in charge were in charge now and hadn’t been backed this summer, it’d be “He’s spent so much millions on players already. He should be doing better with what he’s got”, but because it’s OGS, it’s “He needs more money. He hasn’t been backed at all!”
Apparently its the players fault they lost 6-1, yet I’m told that the players all love playing for him and enjoy him compared to Jose Mourinho.
And its Glazers / Woodwards fault... well yes it is to an extent but everyone and their dog knows they are a problem, but they don’t take training and do tactics for the games. Their job is to simply provide funds for transfers and they have done since he’s been here as manager. Maguire, Wan-Bissaka, James, Bruno, Ighalo, VDB and soon to be Cavani and Telles. If we somehow get Sancho over the line then he has been definitely backed this summer.
I have no idea why some people get extremely riled up over someone plainly saying they don’t think OGS is the man for the job, yet I guarantee two years ago they were saying Jose is a fecking idiot and hoped he fell down the stairs of the Stretford End. It really is like a cult of the manager in here at times.
And if our two most recent former managers in charge were in charge now and hadn’t been backed this summer, it’d be “He’s spent so much millions on players already. He should be doing better with what he’s got”, but because it’s OGS, it’s “He needs more money. He hasn’t been backed at all!”Apparently its the players fault they lost 6-1, yet I’m told that the players all love playing for him and enjoy him compared to Jose Mourinho.
And its Glazers / Woodwards fault... well yes it is to an extent but everyone and their dog knows they are a problem, but they don’t take training and do tactics for the games. Their job is to simply provide funds for transfers and they have done since he’s been here as manager. Maguire, Wan-Bissaka, James, Bruno, Ighalo, VDB and soon to be Cavani and Telles. If we somehow get Sancho over the line then he has been definitely backed this summer.
I have no idea why some people get extremely riled up over someone plainly saying they don’t think OGS is the man for the job, yet I guarantee two years ago they were saying Jose is a fecking idiot and hoped he fell down the stairs of the Stretford End. It really is like a cult of the manager in here at times.
Everyone(ok 99%) that "personally attack" Ole around here are calling him inept and generally "attacking" his managerial acumen. It's beggar's belief how even remotely those "personal attacks" can compare to regularly calling our manager from gollum to cnut which was the case with Moyes till Jose, before he came in.
It’s a dreadful start to the season, I’m not disputing that but it’s not the first we’ve had. Last season we had a lot of games and used the same players so fatigue set in (Ole should have rotated more).
Ole overall had a good record last season. I’m not stopping people complaining with constructive criticisms. It’s the personal attacks I have an issue with.
The Jose hate hasn't ended, either...Everyone(ok 99%) that "personally attack" Ole around here are calling him inept and generally "attacking" his managerial acumen. It's beggar's belief how even remotely those "personal attacks" can compare to regularly calling our manager from gollum to cnut which was the case with Moyes till Jose, before he came in.
Sorry, you’re just not a worse supporter or toxic for thinking that the club you support would be better off with a different coach in charge of the first team. It doesn’t make any sense.
We should support the team and not resort to insults or abuse when things don’t go well, but OP is not a better supporter just because he has a different opinion on the head coach.
It’s a baffling point of view and you don’t get extra points for having a certain opinion, and it doesn’t make you a better supporter.
We should support the team and not resort to insults or abuse when things don’t go well, but OP is not a better supporter just because he has a different opinion on the head coach.
It’s a baffling point of view and you don’t get extra points for having a certain opinion, and it doesn’t make you a better supporter.
Every single manager had their defenders on here until the very end. "He wasn't backed" was possibly the most used phrase on the Caf during the final months of Mourinho's tenure. And there were people who, in all seriousness, suggested that Moyes should be given at least three years before we judge the job he's doing.I swear if this start of the season was Moyes, LVG or Jose, they would be getting absolutely slaughtered from all corners... but because of OGS, it’s no big deal apparently
Solskjaer's no different: there are lots of people who want him gone and he has his defenders, too.
I count 3rd in the league after the start we had a good achievement and a base for further progression. I think we should have won at least one trophy. It’s a dreadful start to this season but 3 games in and important few games coming up and I will be routing for the manager to get us back on track.
For me, this has nothing to do with it being Ole. It no longer really matters all that much who is managing the team. What has become patently obvious over the last 6/7 seasons is how disjointed this club is run. From top to bottom, it is not in sync, it doesn't plan and it certainly doesn't have any serious long term vision.I swear if this start of the season was Moyes, LVG or Jose, they would be getting absolutely slaughtered from all corners... but because of OGS, it’s no big deal apparently
Apparently its the players fault they lost 6-1, yet I’m told that the players all love playing for him and enjoy him compared to Jose Mourinho.
And its Glazers / Woodwards fault... well yes it is to an extent but everyone and their dog knows they are a problem, but they don’t take training and do tactics for the games. Their job is to simply provide funds for transfers and they have done since he’s been here as manager. Maguire, Wan-Bissaka, James, Bruno, Ighalo, VDB and soon to be Cavani and Telles. If we somehow get Sancho over the line then he has been definitely backed this summer.
I have no idea why some people get extremely riled up over someone plainly saying they don’t think OGS is the man for the job, yet I guarantee two years ago they were saying Jose is a fecking idiot and hoped he fell down the stairs of the Stretford End. It really is like a cult of the manager in here at times.
So with this being the case, what use is it really bringing in a new manager and starting the whole process over again? Do you really think Klopp could build what he has built at Liverpool here under the Glazers/Woodward? Do you think they would have listened to their scouts on terrific left-field signings, and then got him his top choices regardless of the cost? Of course not. They would have spent the same amount of money, and then some, but there would never have been the right cohesive culture at the club which sees everyone pulling together.
I think where we're at now sees lots riding on tomorrow. It's going to be very difficult for Ole to get this squad playing with a smile when he has essentially demanded new signings in order to make us competitive. But it's also a chance to restart. Honestly, this season is going to be more affected by Covid than the ending of last. At least then you'd had 75% played with a 5 sub rule to help clubs. Now, with no pre-season and no fans, there is going to be some utterly insane results. Just look at the last 2 weekends. This international break comes at a time which allows players who need a breather to get away and get fit, it also allows some to get their heads in the right place.
We're clearly not ready for this season on either a mental or physical level, and we've clearly got a lot of business to do still in the market. Lets return to assessing Ole in a few months time, but I think he's earned the right to lead this team this season given how we recovered at the end of 19/20.
He probably isn't the manager who will win Utd their next title - maybe not even their next cup - but he is certainly a manager I trust to instal the right "United" mentality if given the backing.
What's not to love? They get to be paid obscure amount of money with no pressure to perform. It's a dream job really.
It's same for Ole really. Ever since 89/90 season we didn't have 2 consecutive seasons finishing without winning anything apart from the last two seasons. The current start of the season is barely something to write home about and yet here he is.
Difference is we probably should have conceded 6+ in each of our 3 games. This isn't a one off for us.
You're getting a lot of issues conflated.I swear if this start of the season was Moyes, LVG or Jose, they would be getting absolutely slaughtered from all corners... but because of OGS, it’s no big deal apparently
Apparently its the players fault they lost 6-1, yet I’m told that the players all love playing for him and enjoy him compared to Jose Mourinho.
And its Glazers / Woodwards fault... well yes it is to an extent but everyone and their dog knows they are a problem, but they don’t take training and do tactics for the games. Their job is to simply provide funds for transfers and they have done since he’s been here as manager. Maguire, Wan-Bissaka, James, Bruno, Ighalo, VDB and soon to be Cavani and Telles. If we somehow get Sancho over the line then he has been definitely backed this summer.
I have no idea why some people get extremely riled up over someone plainly saying they don’t think OGS is the man for the job, yet I guarantee two years ago they were saying Jose is a fecking idiot and hoped he fell down the stairs of the Stretford End. It really is like a cult of the manager in here at times.
People aren't more lenient with Ole, just look at how many are calling for his head.
More importantly, those that aren't calling for his head have realised, after 4 managers, that the buck doesn't stop with the manager.
Our problems are beyond managers.
We're rotten from the inside and I am certain a part of the reason for our performance is that our players are just as fed up with the club/board as we are. See Luke Shaw's comments.
Ole might not be good enough, but it's kind of irrelevant. Calling for his head distracts from the bigger picture/issues.
Ok, I don’t disagree. As for constructive criticism, I would probably go for Poch, not because I think he is a Fergie (or even Klopp) level winner in waiting, but because he achieved relative success working for Daniel Levy. Sadly, I think relative success is our ceiling under current ownership.
I am in but it is a really critical time for him now. Newcastle will be a must win and after that we have a few really hard games in the league. If we don’t get some wins from them then he will probably be gone.
But what then? If we want to be like Bayern, Real, Chelsea in terms of sacking managers (quickly) then we need their board structure / competence first. Otherwise what’s the point at all in comparing us sacking a manager with them?
Assume Ole goes and Poch comes, what next? We play some good / different football, get some decent results, he buys a couple of mediocre Argentine players, maybe sidelines a couple of our current promising players, at some point isn’t backed, results and performances get worse, and we replace yet another manager and then probably hire someone with a completely different style of play.
We are only getting back to the top if we get competent people at board level or just randomly keep hiring different managers until some manager gets it right quickly.
Having said that I really hope we improve quickly under Ole because it will be hard to see a legend like him sacked but the club is bigger than any legend and he must have known what could happen before he accepted the job.
But what then? If we want to be like Bayern, Real, Chelsea in terms of sacking managers (quickly) then we need their board structure / competence first. Otherwise what’s the point at all in comparing us sacking a manager with them?
Assume Ole goes and Poch comes, what next? We play some good / different football, get some decent results, he buys a couple of mediocre Argentine players, maybe sidelines a couple of our current promising players, at some point isn’t backed, results and performances get worse, and we replace yet another manager and then probably hire someone with a completely different style of play.
We are only getting back to the top if we get competent people at board level or just randomly keep hiring different managers until some manager gets it right quickly.
Having said that I really hope we improve quickly under Ole because it will be hard to see a legend like him sacked but the club is bigger than any legend and he must have known what could happen before he accepted the job.
Think we do need a football person above the manager as well. I’m frustrated by the poor recruitment policy as the next person. The structure of the football element of the club needs to be sorted.
The start we had was on him. Being 14th after 9 games or quarter of the season was also down on him. Two spineless performances in the cups semis were also down on him. He reached the same amount of points we did the year before with one manager sacked during that season - 66.
There was a very good chance of the entire season to be called off due to the virus - that happened in other leagues too and we could've easily finished 5th.
If he starts just like last season and reaches 4th would that be a good achievement? When will the madness end? Have we sunk so low that we embrace mediocrity so easily?
Imagine things doesn't get better like last season. You will essentially scratch this one and the one after with no CL football. Every single one of his signings (bar Bruno and de Beek as most recent ones) have sunken so low that lately I've seen their worst outings as pro footballers, especially with his biggest one Maguire.
We had so many excuses so far that keep getting popped out. First it was Jose's fault. Then it was - at least his signings are good. Now - he's not backed by the board? Really?
Agree with this. It just looks very bleak without a coherent structure in place whoever the manager is.
Liverpool losing today will be used to shout "you see you see..." , they have a cheek compare everything else with Klopp, years in charge, transfers etc. Todays trashing of scouse cnuts is a slam dunk for them.
You are right, but its Ole. A club legend who performed better than was earmarked last season. He is a manager who doesn't bring the negative energy that LVG and mourinho brought in and respects the clubs ethos and culture. He is also a nice persona and has shown he can get the team to play good football. I don't think he should stay and would love for him to resign on his own accord as I'm not sure he is the guy to lead us to the league. He deserves the credit he has, even if it's simply for not being toxic.I swear if this start of the season was Moyes, LVG or Jose, they would be getting absolutely slaughtered from all corners... but because of OGS, it’s no big deal apparently
Apparently its the players fault they lost 6-1, yet I’m told that the players all love playing for him and enjoy him compared to Jose Mourinho.
And its Glazers / Woodwards fault... well yes it is to an extent but everyone and their dog knows they are a problem, but they don’t take training and do tactics for the games. Their job is to simply provide funds for transfers and they have done since he’s been here as manager. Maguire, Wan-Bissaka, James, Bruno, Ighalo, VDB and soon to be Cavani and Telles. If we somehow get Sancho over the line then he has been definitely backed this summer.
I have no idea why some people get extremely riled up over someone plainly saying they don’t think OGS is the man for the job, yet I guarantee two years ago they were saying Jose is a fecking idiot and hoped he fell down the stairs of the Stretford End. It really is like a cult of the manager in here at times.
I'm not in either camp. Do I find some issues with Ole's tactics? Yes. We are constantly caught between trying to press high and others sitting back. We try to play the ball out of the back without have a clear idea of how to do so. We allow license for Maguire to go forward for god knows why when he's a donkey and isn't a good passer out of the back. All that being said, I don't know what the better option is unless people are going to say Poch. However, Ole has also done an excellent job with individual coaching of our young attackers. Quite frankly it's obvious that Ole isn't the issue at this point though. The club structure, transfer policy and tactics are all some of the worst at this stature of club, and none of that will change with a new manager in charge. We do a horrific job of managing the wage bill and squad, and by proxy can't sell any of them for a decent price.
So we sack Ole, bring in Poch, then next summer talk about his "vision" while being active in the transfer market and then having patience with him. Then once we make top 4 we will repeat this summer where we are stingy in our spending and dithering in what we want to bring in.
So we sack Ole, bring in Poch, then next summer talk about his "vision" while being active in the transfer market and then having patience with him. Then once we make top 4 we will repeat this summer where we are stingy in our spending and dithering in what we want to bring in.
Tbh I never got in to the whole, manager a wants to play differently so chops players thing. We simply didnt have good players when each of our other managers arrived. This is the first time in6 years that the manager would leave the club better than he found it. Why would a manager want to chop the key players in our current set up?
Not sure where you got half of that stuff from because it wasn’t from my post. I said 3rd last season was a good point for progression meaning we should push on. It was hoped we had a good transfer window to help with that.
3rd place is 3rd place, points are the same because teams were taking points off each other. Already mentioned fatigue was an element in the latter stages of last season, he should have rotated more. The previous season, he had a good run when taking over which helped us to that points total.
calling the season off comment is irrelevant. It didn’t happen so not sure where you are going with that.
I think the team should be progressing from the previous season. You build towards winning the league to get back to where we belong. It’s a poor start to the season but we’ve had bad starts before. Tough period coming up after the break.
When Ole will be allowed to build something, Martial be 30 years old with a moustache.
Liverpool have in 2 out of 4
be serious please....
Rather its because its very apparent a complete lack of pre season and a delayed strengthening of the side has put the club in a weaker position than last season. Liverpool's simply serves to show precisely why missing the three thibgs mentioned is a pretty valid reason as to why things are as they are at the momment.
If the tactics claim was remotely true. This manager and coaching staff would not have had a record of 3 defeats in 28 games since January before this season. With one of the best defensive records in the league.
Thanks for this marvelous straw man. It truly deserves an art award......
Not sure if serious.
People want silver bullets. If only you can put most of the blame on one person then the solution becomes simple. This is obviously not the case and patience is the hardest thing in life to ask of people.
I watched beach Arsenal 8-2 and then get torn apart by city 6-1 in the space of a month. I saw Fergie suffer far more embarrassing defeats then today against some really shit opposition.
If our team got beat 6-1, you need to cop it on the chin and mark it down as freak match. Nowhere in Ole's tenure apart from the last 2 or 3 games have I seen our defense so incompetent. Whatever happened today happened, move on with life.
I always start conversations off with “I love Ole but...”
That’s not great that I more like the guy for his personality & what he did on the pitch rather than anything meaningful as our manager. I like his recruitment 70 percent of the time though.
Not a fan of our current brand of football personally. I find it naive and not controlling enough but he’s a lovely guy can’t dislike him.
I’m happy to have him as manager so other reds can reminisce about the 90’s and 00’s. You know the days when we were a great club, had a top manager and won stuff.
Our stadium is called the Theatre of Dreams for a totally different reason these days.
I actually think he’s the least of our worries right now yet he’s the only thing that can realistically change too this season. Very frustrating and no wonder fans in fighting because nobody knows what’s best for the club anymore with these owners. It’s all a mess.
That’s not great that I more like the guy for his personality & what he did on the pitch rather than anything meaningful as our manager. I like his recruitment 70 percent of the time though.
Not a fan of our current brand of football personally. I find it naive and not controlling enough but he’s a lovely guy can’t dislike him.
I’m happy to have him as manager so other reds can reminisce about the 90’s and 00’s. You know the days when we were a great club, had a top manager and won stuff.
Our stadium is called the Theatre of Dreams for a totally different reason these days.
I actually think he’s the least of our worries right now yet he’s the only thing that can realistically change too this season. Very frustrating and no wonder fans in fighting because nobody knows what’s best for the club anymore with these owners. It’s all a mess.
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I'm on Ole in camp, but he's got to start to learn on adjusting his tactics whether before or during games. I know it's not ideal for Ole to learn on the job, but I do think he's making progress. But right now that progress is taking a beating because teams with more experienced managers are recognizing the cracks in his tactics, and right now Ole doesn't know how to counter it.
If he can't do it then it's time for him to go and hope that we got the right guy next time.
If he can't do it then it's time for him to go and hope that we got the right guy next time.
I'm quite relaxed to be honest.
The negativity surrounding the club got to the players..bad results, lack of preparation and no new signings can affect player's morale as pointed out by G.nev and Patrice.
I saw United 11 v 11 getting trashed by City, this is nothing for me.
The main thing about this result is that we know how bad our pre season is..
United need a morale booster ASAP.
EDIT:
On a side note, to be honest Ole got it wrong last night.
We should be playing 3-5-2 with Lindelof, Bailly and Maguire. De Beek and Mata should've start.
The negativity surrounding the club got to the players..bad results, lack of preparation and no new signings can affect player's morale as pointed out by G.nev and Patrice.
I saw United 11 v 11 getting trashed by City, this is nothing for me.
The main thing about this result is that we know how bad our pre season is..
United need a morale booster ASAP.
EDIT:
On a side note, to be honest Ole got it wrong last night.
We should be playing 3-5-2 with Lindelof, Bailly and Maguire. De Beek and Mata should've start.
But about that.
Most the players out there tonight have been hit and miss for us in their time here, and i would argue many of them (Rashford, Martial, Fred) has produced their best performances under Ole. Post lockdown we genuinely looked drilled, motivated and well organized. So if its down to coaching, where we well coached back then and badly coached now? That makes no sense.
DDG has been in decline for years
Maguire as you said is much better than this. Hes been a complete disaster though this season
Baily. Everyone on here were clamoring for him to replace Lindelof and this is what you get. Twice as athletic, but no brain at all
AWB has also been shit this new season
Shaw has always been super erratic for us. 1/3 of the season injured, 1/3 getting match fit and 1/3 decent performances.
Matic is a decent holding mid, but needs people with legs around him to do the heavy lifting. A really bad match with Pogba
Pogba might be world class, but has never been it for us. I'd say about 20% of the games hes been here hes been anything resembling world class, the remaning 80% he has fluctuated between mediocre and utter shit
Bruno get a passing grade, but he looks knackered and he cant carry the team on his own
Rashford/Martial/Greenwood have all produced their best under Ole, but now looks completely off the boil and bereft of any ideas or confidence.
And i agree with you premise here, Ole should be getting a lot more out of these players than the gutless shite we served up so far. Yesterday it genuinely looked like the players had downed tools and thats really worrying, because then the largely same group of players would have done it with two managers in less than two years. And if we entertain the idea that Ole and his coaching staff are completely clueless, did it take the players nearly two years to figure that out? That seems unlikely'
My point is that there is a lot going on here, and it has to be more than just coaching and tactics
Time for a new thread like that I think. Got us 3ed in the end so it's worth a shot.
Some Ole outs even pointed out that he is backed by the board, and saying we're dumb for not acknowledging this.
Yeah he was backed for 2 windows and that's it.
Now we're on the right track, and we didn't get our main targets, that's the issue here.
Yeah he was backed for 2 windows and that's it.
Now we're on the right track, and we didn't get our main targets, that's the issue here.
Apart from the fact that no other top manager would now want to come here considering how it has become a suicide ground for even the best managers, I think we should stick with Ole until the end of the season and see where we go from there.
We need a Director of Football and Glazers Out more than Ole Out really.
We need a Director of Football and Glazers Out more than Ole Out really.
I still believe in him. We started the season on the back foot, but these players aren't as bad as they look. We can and will play better football, he's shown that he can learn from his mistakes and get the team going.
The run of 6 games after Newcastle will be absolutely crucial though. If he loses more than 1, he's probably out.
The run of 6 games after Newcastle will be absolutely crucial though. If he loses more than 1, he's probably out.
It's quite simple for me.
We need to stop changing managers before we fully backed them and let them finish their work.
It happened with Jose before.
You either back the manager and let him finish his work, or just don't hire him in the first place if you don't trust him that much.
Back Ole, if he fail while being properly backed, i'll be the first one asking for his firing. Until then, nothing proves that changing managers is the right path. Especially as we saw improvements last year.
We need to stop changing managers before we fully backed them and let them finish their work.
It happened with Jose before.
You either back the manager and let him finish his work, or just don't hire him in the first place if you don't trust him that much.
Back Ole, if he fail while being properly backed, i'll be the first one asking for his firing. Until then, nothing proves that changing managers is the right path. Especially as we saw improvements last year.