Frank Lampard's Sack Watch / Sacked

Status
Not open for further replies.

Dancfc

Full Member
Joined
Oct 28, 2016
Messages
7,392
Supports
Chelsea
3 games in the PL. 1 expected win against Brighton, 1 expected lose against Liverpool and 1 unexpected draw against Westbrom. Go out of the Carabao cup to Spurs on penalty shootouts. Yep the roof is definitely on fire.
The only gripe I have with Lamps is his inability to nail down a preferred starting XI. He's overplaying the whole meritocracy card a bit. Knockle down on a constant XI and only change personnel when there is an injury or a player has show a consistent drop of form. The whole spine of the team is in flux at the moment and it'll hold back on-pitch chemistry.
Now that we are out of the Carabao think it'll be best to stick and stay with this (bar injuries reoccurring of course)

Mendy
Azpi - Zouma - Tiago - Chillwell
Kante - Jorginho
Ziyech - Havertz - Pulisic
Werner
Sub: Kepa, Christensen, James, Kovacic, Emerson, Tomori, Mount, CHO, Tammy, Giroud.

Stick with this, give them a constant run of 7-10 games regardless of results or what someone comes off the bench to do, let them build chemistry and defined roles, style of a play, defensive cohesion etc. Let the squad players learn and adapt to what the first XI develop or leave. That's how it is at top level football, you're never keeping everybody happy and Lampard just has to accept this instead of chopping and changing every second match which only disrupts the only thing that matters, on -pitch team chemistry.
I think we can get away with rotating the attack to a point, infact that makes sense given the options we have but yeah defense needs to be nailed down atleast for 3 positions out of 4.
 

blue blue

Full Member
Joined
May 23, 2016
Messages
1,136
Supports
chelsea
What wonders? He squeaked past Leicester for 4th place, a country mile behind the league leaders and behind a team that was largely garbage for half the season. Lost in the fa cup final to a rookie manager who took over a disaster site. Got embarrassed in the CL. His team conceded an embarrassing 54 goals in the season, by far the most in the top half of the table. Been saying this before the season had started, I'm not surprised his project is about to fall apart.

Now Chelsea look devoid of ideas, structure and intensity. There really aren't any positives. You can choose to belive otherwise but you'll learn the hard way.

The only positive for Chelsea is Abromovic won't let this continue for much longer. Soon mega coach like Allegri will come strolling in and build something serious. Frank isn't the answer.
In Frank we trust. He's a winner.
 

Paul_Scholes18

Full Member
Joined
Sep 13, 2014
Messages
13,891
I still remember the papers going for Contes throat in his first season after a poor start. It sells papers. Lets get to Christmas at least.
Really? Conte bloody won it after a disaster season in the previous year.
 

blue blue

Full Member
Joined
May 23, 2016
Messages
1,136
Supports
chelsea
3 games in the PL. 1 expected win against Brighton, 1 expected lose against Liverpool and 1 unexpected draw against Westbrom. Go out of the Carabao cup to Spurs on penalty shootouts. Yep the roof is definitely on fire.
The only gripe I have with Lamps is his inability to nail down a preferred starting XI. He's overplaying the whole meritocracy card a bit. Knockle down on a constant XI and only change personnel when there is an injury or a player has show a consistent drop of form. The whole spine of the team is in flux at the moment and it'll hold back on-pitch chemistry.
Now that we are out of the Carabao think it'll be best to stick and stay with this (bar injuries reoccurring of course)

Mendy
Azpi - Zouma - Tiago - Chillwell
Kante - Jorginho
Ziyech - Havertz - Pulisic
Werner
Sub: Kepa, Christensen, James, Kovacic, Emerson, Tomori, Mount, CHO, Tammy, Giroud.

Stick with this, give them a constant run of 7-10 games regardless of results or what someone comes off the bench to do, let them build chemistry and defined roles, style of a play, defensive cohesion etc. Let the squad players learn and adapt to what the first XI develop or leave. That's how it is at top level football, you're never keeping everybody happy and Lampard just has to accept this instead of chopping and changing every second match which only disrupts the only thing that matters, on -pitch team chemistry.
I like the team you have proposed and generally agree with your view. I've got a soft spot for Tammy and think he offers something different. Werner seems to be a little one dimensional with his pace but its very early days and he may improve his link up play. Tammy and Havertz may also get something going.

I think it will help Frank to form a more settled team when the squad gets a bit smaller. Barkley has gone but he could also get rid of Alonso, probably Rudiger (who I thought was a top CH) or Christensen , maybe even RLC who I also thought was going to be a central figure. I just think a smaller group would be easier to manage.

We need time and Pulisic and Ziyech firing on all cylinders. I'm still very positive about the squad. There's no way they were all going to gel immediately. The injury to Ziyech was a real choker and I'm not sure where he is in his recovery. He's top class and experienced. He walks into this team and should be bringing a lot of quality to the crossing. Havertz looks really intelligent. He makes quick passes the opposition don't see coming. He can open the door for us and score. He's young and can't be expected to walk into the premier league and tear it up in the first few games.

People writing off Lampard at this stage are not looking at the facts and the high quality yet to come into the team. Give it until Christmas to see how the players gel. He may not get the opportunity to field the team you suggest for a few weeks yet so lets see how the play is after that lot start gelling.

COYB!
 

One Night Only

Prison Bitch #24604
Joined
Oct 16, 2009
Messages
30,643
Location
Westworld
He seems like a bigger twat than Klopp, and that takes some doing. Talks like he has been a manger for years and won allsorts, condescending to other managers, and is so far up his own arse it's unbelievable.
 

cyberman

Full Member
Joined
May 26, 2010
Messages
37,331
He seems like a bigger twat than Klopp, and that takes some doing. Talks like he has been a manger for years and won allsorts, condescending to other managers, and is so far up his own arse it's unbelievable.
No excuses but we missed chance after chance and they scored with 2 shots. Unbelievable, we have to get better but we controlled the game fron start to finish.
But no excuses, we hold our hands up., we were the better team though.
His interview style after a loss infuriates me! Its so condescending.
 

Footy van de Geek

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Oct 27, 2020
Messages
562
Anyone else worried about how good Chelsea suddenly look since ridding themselves of Kepa?

2 goals conceded from their last 9 games. 22 goals scored.

Like Ole, I have serious doubts about Lampard. But it's all starting to come together for him now.
 

Mike Smalling

Full Member
Joined
Jan 27, 2018
Messages
10,464
Pretty solid string of results, you have to say. Obviously it helps that Chelsea managed to fill pretty much every gap in their team in the transfer window, but give Frank credit for selecting the right teams and getting them to gel.

At this rate they look like a certainty for top 4 and a serious title contender.
 

Pow

New Member
Joined
Feb 1, 2015
Messages
3,516
Location
Somewhere
Supports
Chelsea
Anyone else worried about how good Chelsea suddenly look since ridding themselves of Kepa?

2 goals conceded from their last 9 games. 22 goals scored.

Like Ole, I have serious doubts about Lampard. But it's all starting to come together for him now.
Tbf the writing was on the wall with kepa.
Last season we were one of the best teams in terms of conceding shots at goal yet we conceded a shit ton of goals. Thats a discrepancy that shouldnt happen. But the immediate shift from conceding goals to clean sheets with a goalkeeper change shows exactly who the issue was.
 

Footy van de Geek

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Oct 27, 2020
Messages
562
Tbf the writing was on the wall with kepa.
Last season we were one of the best teams in terms of conceding shots at goal yet we conceded a shit ton of goals. Thats a discrepancy that shouldnt happen. But the immediate shift from conceding goals to clean sheets with a goalkeeper change shows exactly who the issue was.
We have a similar situation with De Gea since 2018. But we went and gave him a new deal with a salary increase. :lol:

I think we would also benefit from a GK change.

I don't think Chelsea will win the title, but this could be your 2013/2014 season before winning it next season. The new signings will have fully settled by then.

I suppose another issue is that Thiago Silva will be 37 next season, so you need to be on the lookout for another CB.
 

Pow

New Member
Joined
Feb 1, 2015
Messages
3,516
Location
Somewhere
Supports
Chelsea
We have a similar situation with De Gea since 2018. But we went and gave him a new deal with a salary increase. :lol:

I think we would also benefit from a GK change.

I don't think Chelsea will win the title, but this could be your 2013/2014 season before winning it next season. The new signings will have fully settled by then.

I suppose another issue is that Thiago Silva will be 37 next season, so you need to be on the lookout for another CB.
De gea was never as shit as kepa. I dont know how it is for you so i cant comment on what you need but even all the stats pointed to kepa being the issue.
Maybe, i do think we are well placed to win the league in the next few years with the age of liverpool and city's best players should start dropping their amazing form with age. But the way the league is right now we have to go for it this season. Especially with our strength in depth as seen yesterday when we rested 9 players and won 4 0 away at seville.
Even 13/14 we should have won it, iirc it came down to if we won our last 4 (sunderland h liverpool a Norwich h cardiff? A ) we would have won. We beat Cardiff and the slippy game but lost at home to sunderland and drew at home to Norwich. No point looking to next year when theres a chance this one.
 

charlenefan

Far less insightful than the other Charley
Joined
Aug 17, 2005
Messages
33,052
Hold your horses, they haven't beaten a single team above 13th yet.
Nor will they if they keep playing for 0-0's

But tbf a good season for Lampard is getting them in the top 4 again and given the level of investment and that those players are mostly performing that looks like a certainty
 

Footy van de Geek

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Oct 27, 2020
Messages
562
De gea was never as shit as kepa. I dont know how it is for you so i cant comment on what you need but even all the stats pointed to kepa being the issue.
Maybe, i do think we are well placed to win the league in the next few years with the age of liverpool and city's best players should start dropping their amazing form with age. But the way the league is right now we have to go for it this season. Especially with our strength in depth as seen yesterday when we rested 9 players and won 4 0 away at seville.
Even 13/14 we should have won it, iirc it came down to if we won our last 4 (sunderland h liverpool a Norwich h cardiff? A ) we would have won. We beat Cardiff and the slippy game but lost at home to sunderland and drew at home to Norwich. No point looking to next year when theres a chance this one.
Not as consistently shit, but he has dropped some real clangers for club and country over the past 2.5 years.

I think he's poor for the Marquinhos goal last night, for example. He came off his line, which is rare. But then let the ball roll under his foot despite anticipating what Marquinhos was going to do. The De Gea of old saves it with his foot. He also saves Ward Prowse's free kick 4 years ago.

Not a bad attitude to have. No talk of a rebuild. :D
 

charlenefan

Far less insightful than the other Charley
Joined
Aug 17, 2005
Messages
33,052
Not as consistently shit, but he has dropped some real clangers for club and country over the past 2.5 years.

I think he's poor for the Marquinhos goal last night, for example. He came off his line, which is rare. But then let the ball roll under his foot despite anticipating what Marquinhos was going to do. The De Gea of old saves it with his foot. He also saves Ward Prowse's free kick 4 years ago.

Not a bad attitude to have. No talk of a rebuild. :D
This better be a WUM
 

TheMagicFoolBus

Full Member
Joined
Nov 5, 2016
Messages
6,502
Location
Lisboa, Portugal
Supports
Chelsea
Not as consistently shit, but he has dropped some real clangers for club and country over the past 2.5 years.

I think he's poor for the Marquinhos goal last night, for example. He came off his line, which is rare. But then let the ball roll under his foot despite anticipating what Marquinhos was going to do. The De Gea of old saves it with his foot. He also saves Ward Prowse's free kick 4 years ago.

Not a bad attitude to have. No talk of a rebuild. :D
If you look at the numbers, De Gea has gone from being very obviously the best keeper by a mile to being more or less exactly average last season. Kepa, on the other hand, put up literally the worst goalkeeping season in the history of the PL and was the worst keeper in all of Europe last year.

De Gea is no longer single-handedly winning matches for you, but he's by no means your biggest issue in defence if you ask me.
 

Pow

New Member
Joined
Feb 1, 2015
Messages
3,516
Location
Somewhere
Supports
Chelsea
Not as consistently shit, but he has dropped some real clangers for club and country over the past 2.5 years.

I think he's poor for the Marquinhos goal last night, for example. He came off his line, which is rare. But then let the ball roll under his foot despite anticipating what Marquinhos was going to do. The De Gea of old saves it with his foot. He also saves Ward Prowse's free kick 4 years ago.

Not a bad attitude to have. No talk of a rebuild. :D
I dont know about that it was so close to him, though i agree with the ward prowse freekick.

A lot of the attitude just like i had last season is down to circumstances.
At the start of last season even i someone who wants us at the top all the time admitted with the ban and losing hazard ( who contributed somthing ridiculous in terms of goals and assists the season prior) and frank being a novice at this level that we will have to give frank a free hit that season. He probably wont get top 4. But he did, though with that success comes more pressure then he got backed in the window even more pressure, it changes expectations. Now i cant sit here and say when i see liverpool with half a team or city floundering the two teams that have carried the standard that right now being the best of the rest is good enough. Not when its this open. There should be no aiming for top 4 again in these circumstances whether we win it i doubt it it remains to be seen but id rather the team aim for top spot than top 4.
 

Mb194dc

Full Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2015
Messages
4,595
Supports
Chelsea
It's not just Kepa, Lampard was trying to shoehorn players in earlier in the season (Mount & Havertz in same team especially) the team wasn't balanced plus lots of individual errors. We didn't have our natural wingers Pulisic and Ziyech fit to play. Mendy hasn't had to do much the last few games though did make some very good saves against Utd.

Got to give credit to Lampard for sorting the balance issues out and the board for reinvesting the Hazard money wisely. We look like a very good team now. Looking at the bench last night as well we have stacks of depth. Very positive times for Chelsea.

Kepa should be moved on in January though as I don't see him ever recovering his confidence at Chelsea. He's not as bad as last few performances would suggest.
 

AshRK

Full Member
Joined
Apr 23, 2017
Messages
12,096
Location
Canada
Fair play to Lampard for doing well but he jas been fortunate with the kind draws in CL and some easy fixtures. But you have to beat what's in front of you and they are doing that.
 

Dancfc

Full Member
Joined
Oct 28, 2016
Messages
7,392
Supports
Chelsea
If you look at the numbers, De Gea has gone from being very obviously the best keeper by a mile to being more or less exactly average last season. Kepa, on the other hand, put up literally the worst goalkeeping season in the history of the PL and was the worst keeper in all of Europe last year.

De Gea is no longer single-handedly winning matches for you, but he's by no means your biggest issue in defence if you ask me.
The issue for them though is similar to the Cech/Courtois situation for us.

De Gea is past his best and given how his athletic acrobatics is/was his biggest attribute the odds of him lasting at even a decent level (scaled for United's expectations) well into his 30's are next to none.

They have an excellent young keeper who in my opinion is better than present day DDG and he could end up slipping through their fingers.
 

Dancfc

Full Member
Joined
Oct 28, 2016
Messages
7,392
Supports
Chelsea
It's not just Kepa, Lampard was trying to shoehorn players in earlier in the season (Mount & Havertz in same team especially) the team wasn't balanced plus lots of individual errors. We didn't have our natural wingers Pulisic and Ziyech fit to play. Mendy hasn't had to do much the last few games though did make some very good saves against Utd.

Got to give credit to Lampard for sorting the balance issues out and the board for reinvesting the Hazard money wisely. We look like a very good team now. Looking at the bench last night as well we have stacks of depth. Very positive times for Chelsea.

Kepa should be moved on in January though as I don't see him ever recovering his confidence at Chelsea. He's not as bad as last few performances would suggest.
Thing is it's not so much the great saves that's so refreshing about Mendy it's the simple basics he's mastering.

Everytime he claims a cross that's otherwise panic stations under Kepa and even some of his straight forward saves I'm not sure would have been likewise saved under Kepa's watch. For example, that long range shot Max Lowe (for Sheffield United) had against us which Mendy plucked from the sky and caught, those type of shots were flying in last season and being made to look unsavable.

Tbf you could quite easily replace Kepa with Willy in this post because truthfully I don't think he was that much better either (if he was he would have comfortably claimed and kept the jersey before the clocks went back).

Maybe Kepa will find a suitable new home for him and I genuinely hope he does but the sheer contrast since Mendy has come in is just too big to be a coincidence, would Kepa or Willy have kept a clean sheet against anyone let alone Sevilla with last night's back four?
 

tomaldinho1

Full Member
Joined
Nov 26, 2015
Messages
17,374
Fair play to Lampard for doing well but he jas been fortunate with the kind draws in CL and some easy fixtures. But you have to beat what's in front of you and they are doing that.
Yes because Seville are notoriously easy to put 4 past...
Credit where it's due, they seem to be a very well oiled machine now that is playing some nice football. Can it last though?
 

AshRK

Full Member
Joined
Apr 23, 2017
Messages
12,096
Location
Canada
Yes because Seville are notoriously easy to put 4 past...
Credit where it's due, they seem to be a very well oiled machine now that is playing some nice football. Can it last though?
I was talking about the overall draw. Rennes and krasnodar were dream draw for Lampard.
 

TheMagicFoolBus

Full Member
Joined
Nov 5, 2016
Messages
6,502
Location
Lisboa, Portugal
Supports
Chelsea
The issue for them though is similar to the Cech/Courtois situation for us.

De Gea is past his best and given how his athletic acrobatics is/was his biggest attribute the odds of him lasting at even a decent level (scaled for United's expectations) well into his 30's are next to none.

They have an excellent young keeper who in my opinion is better than present day DDG and he could end up slipping through their fingers.
Agreed. Hadn't thought about it in those terms but the comparison is spot on.
 

UsualSuspect

Full Member
Joined
Aug 23, 2013
Messages
443
Supports
Chelsea
Yes because Seville are notoriously easy to put 4 past...
Credit where it's due, they seem to be a very well oiled machine now that is playing some nice football. Can it last though?
No reason why it shouldn't. The Sevilla game was the first of the season that Lamps has had a full squad to pick from and more importantly, a full-strength first XI. Pulisic was super impactful in big games last season and is without a doubt our best attacker - so I expect even more of an improvement if he stays fit.
 

GMok

Full Member
Joined
Nov 14, 2020
Messages
221
Location
The Good Place
Supports
ATK Mohun Bagan FC
Chelsea has a very good starting 11 and the strongest bench in the pl at this very moment. If they can sustain this level of performance, Chelsea has a very good chance to win it.

I don't think Liverpool wins it without their main center backs. They are already struggling. City can conjure up consecutive wins to win the pl, but they are quite meh now. Tottenham, probably not, given they are outplayed so many times. United is inconsistent.

However, the way the season's going, injuries are going to hit each team in waves. December schedule has never been more brutal.
 

Dancfc

Full Member
Joined
Oct 28, 2016
Messages
7,392
Supports
Chelsea
Chelsea has a very good starting 11 and the strongest bench in the pl at this very moment. If they can sustain this level of performance, Chelsea has a very good chance to win it.

I don't think Liverpool wins it without their main center backs. They are already struggling. City can conjure up consecutive wins to win the pl, but they are quite meh now. Tottenham, probably not, given they are outplayed so many times. United is inconsistent.

However, the way the season's going, injuries are going to hit each team in waves. December schedule has never been more brutal.
We've actually got it relatively okay so I hope we can take advantage.

Thanks to already securing top spot in CL we can rest our entire first Xl next week, our midweek PL game is on a Tuesday while our following 'weekend' game is on a Monday and we're out of the League Cup.

The one real bastard in that fixture list is we have a 48 hour turnover on 26th and 28th December.
 

tomaldinho1

Full Member
Joined
Nov 26, 2015
Messages
17,374
I was talking about the overall draw. Rennes and krasnodar were dream draw for Lampard.
Of course but harsh to hold the luck of the draw against him. I mean, we lost to Istanbul so you can't just assume these games are bankers. Real test in most of these CL groups where there are two good teams is to finish top which seems guaranteed for them now - the fact they've only conceded once is also pretty impressive. Sterner tests await, that's for sure.
 

Zaphod2319

Full Member
Joined
Oct 23, 2020
Messages
4,207
Supports
Chelsea
Now would be a harsh time to get sacked....being nominated for PL manager of the month.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.