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2019-20 Performances


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Litch

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Nah Scott was even worse. We are nuts if we think these 2 can replace Matic when needed next season.
Think you are being a bit harsh of your assessment of him last night. I don't think he's Matic's replacement as I don't rate him either but he suits when we line up with Pogs and Bruno. It's funny cause I think a better balanced midfield was Matic, Fred and Bruno.
 

Kostov

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Think you are being a bit harsh of your assessment of him last night. I don't think he's Matic's replacement as I don't rate him either but he suits when we line up with Pogs and Bruno. It's funny cause I think a better balanced midfield was Matic, Fred and Bruno.
I don't see how he suits them to be fair, he lacks composure, very little defensive awareness, losses duels often, not good when pressured and erratic passer. I think we need a proper destroyer behind Pogba and Bruno that will bring better defensive stability, or the other option is some calming influence and someone who can dictate play from deep like Carrick could. I don't see how Fred fits any. Or most damning I don't see with his characteristics how we can fit him in a functioning midfield.
 

jamesjimmybyrondean

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Ole should just sell him and get a DM. Its obvious he prefers Mctominay and both are better as Pogba's backups than DMs. I don't understand why we don't want a DM and why we want to play Mctominay there when he's clearly a box to box like Pogba. We don't have a decent cover for Matic as DM while we have Fred and Mctominay that covers for Pogba. So Sell Fred and get a DM that way at least Mctominay still gets game time as Pogba's backup if that's what the worry is
 

AneRu

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Ole should just sell him and get a DM. Its obvious he prefers Mctominay and both are better as Pogba's backups than DMs. I don't understand why we don't want a DM and why we want to play Mctominay there when he's clearly a box to box like Pogba. We don't have a decent cover for Matic as DM while we have Fred and Mctominay that covers for Pogba. So Sell Fred and get a DM that way at least Mctominay still gets game time as Pogba's backup if that's what the worry is
It's a blindspot that will come back haunt us during the season of that I am sure. It's not so much about performances but player profile which sees both Fred and McTominay not suitable for Matic's role.

The club needs to be proactive and move Fred in whilst his stock is high because the only way for him is down as next season he won't play much. Ole clearly prefers Scot and for registration issues he is homegrown so Fred won't play much if Pogba doesn't suffer another major injury.

In this COVID economy we could sell Fred and buy an upcoming player like Koopmeiners for a fee in the €30m to €35m range, I don't think AZ would resist much. We would then use next season and the following one to evaluate his capacity before spending big on a DM.
 

youngrell

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He seems to have lost his rhythm somewhat since being benched. For the majority of the season it was like he was playing one long game such was his consistency for 90 mins each week. Looks like he needs a run of games to get back in that groove but I'm not sure he will get it unless we pick up some injuries in the new season.
 

Andersons Dietician

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He had his good moments last night. For a spell he seemed content to sit back and spray passes like he was Carrick. Then he went through a spell of every pass he tried to play was an attempt at a killer ball. Some came off some didn’t, some were close.
thought he was pretty good in his defending duities as well. He basically just pesters people in to submission. Might not get you on the first 2nd or 3rd tackle but he will get you eventually. You aren’t shaking him.

Hes a good player and an asset to the team. It’s just in our system his best position has Pogba and Bruno infront of him.
 

Kostov

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It's a blindspot that will come back haunt us during the season of that I am sure. It's not so much about performances but player profile which sees both Fred and McTominay not suitable for Matic's role.

The club needs to be proactive and move Fred in whilst his stock is high because the only way for him is down as next season he won't play much. Ole clearly prefers Scot and for registration issues he is homegrown so Fred won't play much if Pogba doesn't suffer another major injury.

In this COVID economy we could sell Fred and buy an upcoming player like Koopmeiners for a fee in the €30m to €35m range, I don't think AZ would resist much. We would then use next season and the following one to evaluate his capacity before spending big on a DM.
We's be lucky to get 25m for him imo. Considering that we paid 50 it's a shit situation to be in.
 

AneRu

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We's be lucky to get 25m for him imo. Considering that we paid 50 it's a shit situation to be in.
Agree it's a horrible situation but I think we can easily get £20m to £25m for him but even if we get around £15m and add maybe £10m or so it should be enough to get a young upcoming DM.
 

Kostov

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Agree it's a horrible situation but I think we can easily get £20m to £25m for him but even if we get around £15m and add maybe £10m or so it should be enough to get a young upcoming DM.
That's maybe true, but I think we need a proved DM so he can start over Matic. A proper DM talent could be a good option too. Even those are 30-40m nowadays.
 

jamesjimmybyrondean

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We's be lucky to get 25m for him imo. Considering that we paid 50 it's a shit situation to be in.
I think any club that watched him this season would value him as a 30m player. But it seems like however good he plays people will always see him as a not so good player.
 

Kostov

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I think any club that watched him this season would value him as a 30m player. But it seems like however good he plays people will always see him as a not so good player.
Considering the wages he most probably is on, I doubt that anyone would pay 30m pounds for him. Maybe I am harsh but if I saw how he played this season, I wouldn't want United to buy him for 30m pounds.
 

AneRu

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That's maybe true, but I think we need a proved DM so he can start over Matic. A proper DM talent could be a good option too. Even those are 30-40m nowadays.
I think Matic's return to form and on Ole's good side presents us with a unique opportunity where we can sign a young DM and us him as rotation whilst assessing his long term status in the side.

This is why I suggested Koomeiners, he won't demand an immediate starting berth but will be a handy understudy who could either become a starter in a few years or revert to a squad role. The potential upside is huge and the likely fee makes the financial risk negligible.
 

jamesjimmybyrondean

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Considering the wages he most probably is on, I doubt that anyone would pay 30m pounds for him. Maybe I am harsh but if I saw how he played this season, I wouldn't want United to buy him for 30m pounds.
120k per week. His wages are definitely high but I think a 30m price tag is fair but only to a team that wants to play a specific style
 

Kostov

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I think Matic's return to form and on Ole's good side presents us with a unique opportunity where we can sign a young DM and us him as rotation whilst assessing his long term status in the side.

This is why I suggested Koomeiners, he won't demand an immediate starting berth but will be a handy understudy who could either become a starter in a few years or revert to a squad role. The potential upside is huge and the likely fee makes the financial risk negligible.
I also though of the Dutch lad when you first mentioned young DMs. Nor sure though since I've only seen highlights, maybe Tonali could be a good bet too. Mainly I agree with your thinking and share the sentiment that we need another DMs, if we don't bring one, I hope we give Garner a chance.
120k per week. His wages are definitely high but I think a 30m price tag is fair but only to a team that wants to play a specific style
It is high and when you mention the figures I can only think of a PL club paying that. Not sure who would bite on that to be fair.
 

AneRu

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I also though of the Dutch lad when you first mentioned young DMs. Nor sure though since I've only seen highlights, maybe Tonali could be a good bet too. Mainly I agree with your thinking and share the sentiment that we need another DMs, if we don't bring one, I hope we give Garner a chance.

It is high and when you mention the figures I can only think of a PL club paying that. Not sure who would bite on that to be fair.
With his size I don't see anyone biting in the PL, if he was a foot taller then Moyes would have been the obvious candidate.
 

BehemothTerror

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Suprised people seem to think he had a good first half. Was infuriating watching his positioning at times and he passed the ball back far too much when even remotely pressured (which is why his pass % is higher than McT who actually did try to be proactive at times even if it was unsuccessful.)

Correct by Ole to haul him off which is a shame as he's been solid at points this season
 

zurnalist

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It's a weird case again. It's like everyone in the first 11 has improved and everyone after that has taken a step back. Fred was one of the most consistent performers before the virus break.
He was regarded to be a good candidate for the player of the season at that time. Now his stock has plummeted. Seems like consistent playtime is a big factor for him and unfortunately we can't provide that at the moment.
Still I haven't given up hope on him. He has shown that he can be a very-very useful midfielder. Hope he gets his changes and will use them accordingly. It's too early to be talking about selling him...
 

MadDogg

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I don't see how he suits them to be fair, he lacks composure, very little defensive awareness, losses duels often, not good when pressured and erratic passer. I think we need a proper destroyer behind Pogba and Bruno that will bring better defensive stability, or the other option is some calming influence and someone who can dictate play from deep like Carrick could. I don't see how Fred fits any. Or most damning I don't see with his characteristics how we can fit him in a functioning midfield.
He's only been given the opportunity to play that role once when he came on for 25 minutes against Bournemouth and he actually did very well. Enough that it's a shame he hasn't been given more opportunities to see if it was a one-off against a bad team or whether he would be an option.
 

MadDogg

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Suprised people seem to think he had a good first half. Was infuriating watching his positioning at times and he passed the ball back far too much when even remotely pressured (which is why his pass % is higher than McT who actually did try to be proactive at times even if it was unsuccessful.)

Correct by Ole to haul him off which is a shame as he's been solid at points this season
Strange how people see things so differently. For me, he was the only player on the pitch actually looking to and able to play passes through the lines to get our attacking players into good position, and he did it quite regularly. I thought he was easily the best player on the pitch.
 

Adam-Utd

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Strange how people see things so differently. For me, he was the only player on the pitch actually looking to and able to play passes through the lines to get our attacking players into good position, and he did it quite regularly. I thought he was easily the best player on the pitch.
Same. Played 2 great forward passes for James to run into (first on the right to cross for Ighalo, the 2nd where he cut inside to shoot and got tackled)

I don't think he was playing badly at all but Ole just seems to prefer Scott staying on, I guess due to his height more than anything.
 

TrustInJanuzaj

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He’s honestly miles better than McTominay, thought overall Fred played well last night. I think Ole has to test Fred - Pogba- Bruno midfield. It should work in easier games and Fred should just be miles ahead of McTomminay in the pecking order.
 

Ali Dia

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He’s honestly miles better than McTominay, thought overall Fred played well last night. I think Ole has to test Fred - Pogba- Bruno midfield. It should work in easier games and Fred should just be miles ahead of McTomminay in the pecking order.
i agree with this. Scott is good if we just want to disrupt other teams play which isn’t great when we have a lot of the ball. At least Fred can get on it and make something happen and he can provide decent tackling and industry too. I wouldn’t be particularly against selling anyone in the squad at moment as we are still so far behind and we may need to sell to buy. If we were to sell Fred this summer then his would have to go down as one of the stranger transfers we’ve been invoked in. Expensive player. Bad first season with glimpses of quality. Really good second season until covid. Relegated to squad player when the season resumes and sold before 3rd season
 
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jamesjimmybyrondean

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He’s honestly miles better than McTominay, thought overall Fred played well last night. I think Ole has to test Fred - Pogba- Bruno midfield. It should work in easier games and Fred should just be miles ahead of McTomminay in the pecking order.
This. Its a shame we haven't seen it but If Ole is keen on playing Mctominay in Matic's position why not try out Fred who is the better player. Didn't Guardiola want to get him for DM? I also don't see any risk in playing him with Bruno and Pogba instead of Mctominay in easier games at least as a means to rest Matic because Fred is more useful than Mctominay when we have the ball
 

Kostov

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He's only been given the opportunity to play that role once when he came on for 25 minutes against Bournemouth and he actually did very well. Enough that it's a shame he hasn't been given more opportunities to see if it was a one-off against a bad team or whether he would be an option.
What do you mean given that opportunity once? He has played plenty of times as the deepest MF in a two man pivot, maybe you mean with Pogba and Bruno? If you mean alongside those 2 I agree he hasn't played much with them. However I don't think playing alongside those 2 will magically transform him as a player. He isn't a DMF imo, he is a B2B midfielder who excels at disrupting opposition play, and I don't see how we fit him alongside Pogba and Bruno.
 

romufc

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He’s honestly miles better than McTominay, thought overall Fred played well last night. I think Ole has to test Fred - Pogba- Bruno midfield. It should work in easier games and Fred should just be miles ahead of McTomminay in the pecking order.
I do not understand why Ole is so hesitant on trying this. Fred has the ability to break the press with his first time passing and his passing is under rated.

I am not sure why Ole does not pick him much.
 

TrustInJanuzaj

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I do not understand why Ole is so hesitant on trying this. Fred has the ability to break the press with his first time passing and his passing is under rated.

I am not sure why Ole does not pick him much.
To be honest me neither. I think it’s probably that Ole just doesn’t trust Fred and Pogba defensively but I don’t think that would be a massive issue when we dominate. Having McTomminay means we end up turning over the ball more anyway so he negates any benefit he might have from being more physically imposing than the Brazilian.
 

romufc

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To be honest me neither. I think it’s probably that Ole just doesn’t trust Fred and Pogba defensively but I don’t think that would be a massive issue when we dominate. Having McTomminay means we end up turning over the ball more anyway so he negates any benefit he might have from being more physically imposing than the Brazilian.
I can understand that he doesnt trust them but in games like Norwhich or something, It's not about defending as much, its just about a body in that position. They just have to press to force a mistake and then control the ball.
 

Van Piorsing

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Lost his flow when Bruno arrived and Matić returned to his former self.

If he's okay to be bench player then happy to have him, he can do so much better than yesterday.
 

BlahRules

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Fred can do the defensive role something McTominay won't be able to who lacks football IQ.
 

Nou_Camp99

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Fred can easily play that DM role. He's got the intelligence and discipline to do it and he's certainly got the legs.

Wouldn't shock me to see him take Matic's place next season in the best 11. Matic has definitely improved under Ole but I think we've been here before with him. He seems to pull 2 to 3 months of decent to good form out of nowhere and then goes back to being Matic.
 

Who's Kissing Cameras?

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Comments in here saying sell him are strange. Yes he’s been average in limited appearances (he’s not been able to play into form) post lockdown but people have seem to forgotten it was between him, Rash and AWB for our POTS? Some immense performances pre lockdown and added that much needed consistency in our midfield and kept us in the running for a European place.

He’s had a great season and is a good player to keep in the squad to cover for midfield.
 

Teja

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Pretty firmly set as Pogba's back-up and won't play unless Pogba's rested. We have plenty of games next season though so as long as he's happy I think the club should be happy to have him as well.

I know McTominay likes to play in that role as well but think the club sees him as the more defensive of the double pivot. He will get rotated with Matic and not with Pogba.
 

EwanI Ted

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Comments in here saying sell him are strange. Yes he’s been average in limited appearances (he’s not been able to play into form) post lockdown but people have seem to forgotten it was between him, Rash and AWB for our POTS? Some immense performances pre lockdown and added that much needed consistency in our midfield and kept us in the running for a European place.

He’s had a great season and is a good player to keep in the squad to cover for midfield.
Its not about his performances, its just a calculation based on the squad composition. If you play Pogba in that deeper midfield position, he needs a specialist DM alongside him. Fred and McTominay are box to box players, and while one can act as backup to Pogba, two is overkill. People tend to overplay the degree to which Fred and McTominay can't play in the DM position, for some games they're ok, but swapping one out for a specialist DM would definitely be a good thing.

McTominay is a United youngster and probably has more room for development left in his game, plus Fred seems more likely to move aboard, which would always be United's preference in a sale, so it makes sense for him to be sold first. Plus, unlike some of our players, he's actually worth something.

I dont think there's a rush to sell him, especially in this market, better to wait another year. But if a really good offer came in that let us pay for other positions it would be good for the squad overall.
 

Based Adnan

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Fred can do the defensive role something McTominay won't be able to who lacks football IQ.
The most dribbled past midfielder per 90 in the top 5 European leagues with a 40% tackle sucess rate can do the defensive job?

He's probably our worst central midfielder defensively.
 
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