[Thaila-X]

I'm not convinced all the blame for Fred's red card should be placed firmly at the managers door. The player himself needs to take some responsibility. Fred is 27, he's played over 50 games in European competitions, he should have enough experience to see Paredes is trying to wind him up.

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

It was basically a case of the next PSG player to go within Fred's general vicinity and scream like a bitch and the yellow was coming out.

The pundits were talking about hindsight after the game but I was screaming at the TV at half time when Fred came back out and I bet others were to. It was so obvious.

And surprise, surprise it was that shithouse faker Ander Herrara. We should have seen it coming.

 

[LuisNaniencia]

And surprise, surprise it was that shithouse faker Ander Herrara. We should have seen it coming.

Yeah, I mean it was great when he did it to Gerrard, buy that was bitter medicine.

 

[Roux]

I place all blame on Fred, you cannot headbutt people or attempt it with VAR overwatching. Paredes played him like a sucker and it worked. Even if Ole made a change - we're losing a key player because of his sheer stupidity, a player who was having a really good game aside from that moment.

Time and Time again, Fred and Luke Shaw collect yellow cards like a badge of honor - its punishing to the team.

 

[1966]

The headbutt rule is so stupid. Paredes initiated it so why cant he move his head out the way? A bit silly to me.

That's a strange reading of what happened. Fred wound up and came back in with his head, clearly making intentional contact. He wasn't just standing his ground or some such shit.

The problem, like all things in football, is that if you determine that there's such a thing as a "soft, acceptable" headbutt, where do you draw the line before it becomes violent and dangerous? It's easier and safer to have a zero tolerance policy on acts whose only purpose is to be aggressive. How Fred only got a yellow, I'll never know. Maybe it wasn't just luck.

 

[Member 120012]

I'm not convinced all the blame for Fred's red card should be placed firmly at the managers door. The player himself needs to take some responsibility. Fred is 27, he's played over 50 games in European competitions, he should have enough experience to see Paredes is trying to wind him up.

NO, can't be complaining about the manager. You are having a laugh. From the minute it happened ,and he stayed on the pitch, it was the time for replacing Fred. I was really surprised he made it to half time. The only folk not seeing iy is Ole's,his staff and a handful of blind supporters. There was numerous time in the second half ,one in particular Neymar was breaking with the ball in midfield. It was obvious to all watching except Ole and his staff that Fred, who was nearest at the time, could only run beside him and could not make any attempt on gaining control of the ball. Basically Fred was a running pal for Neymar. Ole lost that game that was firmly in UTD grasp it wasn't fred or martial, both of whom should have had an early bath.

 

[MattyLT]

That 'headbut' doesn't knock my 6 year old over. Its the cheating of going down like you've been hit by Mike Tyson which is worse than the head movement. But everyone in the game focuses on the player being silly. We don't even call out the play acting anymore. It's really sad.

In saying that Fred could go anyway for a few yellow cards taking away that fake headbut.

I'm dreaming of the day when a player who headbutts another gets a yellow card, and the player who pretends it hurt more than it did gets a straight red.

 

[Member 120012]

On a side issue why doesn't football authorities introduce a rule . "Should a player go down like that when ( we will call it a headbutt) when its really a shunt. That player who goes down must be withdrawn for minimum 10 mins for assessment by medical staff that he fit to continue and hasn't suffered head trauma. Every manager will then get their players to stop this nonsense.

 

[MikeeMike]

On a side issue why doesn't football authorities introduce a rule . "Should a player go down like that when ( we will call it a headbutt) when its really a shunt. That player who goes down must be withdrawn for minimum 10 mins for assessment by medical staff that he fit to continue and hasn't suffered head trauma. Every manager will then get their players to stop this nonsense.

“A shunt” ? So if a player is shunted what is the punishment for the shunter?

 

[Drainy]

Clearly PSG targeted him.
Possibly even they know he got a hothead?

For sure everyone knows his heavy consistent heavy touches and risky plays by now, so couple with those, it's just a matter of times.

Most teams see him as the weak link in midfield.

Some stop him by giving him space but blocking the progressive passing options, others use him as a press trigger to win the ball back.

 

[NinjaZombie]

Most teams see him as the weak link in midfield.

Some stop him by giving him space but blocking the progressive passing options, others use him as a press trigger to win the ball back.

I don't get why Ole doesn't see this. Then again, McTominay isn't much better, Matic can't play consecutive games in a row and Pogba is a write-off at this point, so what's the point?

I won't be surprised if Ole is holding back from buying a ready made centre midfielder because he's holding out hope for the likes of Garner, Levitt or Hannibal to make the step up in a couple of years.

 

[MikeeMike]

Most teams see him as the weak link in midfield.

Some stop him by giving him space but blocking the progressive passing options, others use him as a press trigger to win the ball back.

Totally my view also. Teams are happy to let him have all the space he wants as he is playing so deep and opposition can cope with that. I’d like to see Fred take the ball forward more instead of inst- sideways passing as he can ping in great passes to forwards .

 

[balaks]

I'm dreaming of the day when a player who headbutts another gets a yellow card, and the player who pretends it hurt more than it did gets a straight red.

That is an incredibly strange view to take. Headbutting people is totally fine in your world?

 

[MattyLT]

That is an incredibly strange view to take. Headbutting people is totally fine in your world?

No, hence the yellow card. But a bit of physical altercation between players doesn't at all annoy me as much as feigning injury, whinging and crying. And if there's anything bringing the game into disrepute, it's that. When people who prefer other sports look down on football, its not because of altercations and a bit of abrasiveness and aggressiveness - it's because of the crying, bitching, moaning and faking. There's not a single thing more embarrassing to the game of football, and it should be on top of the priority list of things to stamp out of the game - way higher than a bit of soft violence between opposing players with zero potential for injury.

So yeah, I'd love it if Fred got a yellow card in that situation, and Paredes got a red, and had to take the walk of shame down the tunnel. That would be total humiliation, which is how the game should deal with these ham actors. Add a 3 match ban as well, for brining the game into disrepute. Wouldn't mind that at all.

 

[Member 120012]

“A shunt” ? So if a player is shunted what is the punishment for the shunter?

oh explanation for shunt required ok, "an act of pushing or shoving something."

 

[Irwin99]

If ever there was a hard match to rate a player with a score it'd probably be that one for Fred. Did a lot of good things and a lot of bad things.

 

[MyOnlySolskjaer]

Dropped hopefully. Was a disaster against PSG.

 

[El Zoido]

He’ll be suspended for Leipzig won’t he? So seems strange to drop him now, but perhaps Ole is trying to give a run out to players who will play next week. Fred isn’t much use off the bench so if he’s not starting he’s probably not going to appear. If we’re chasing the game we’ll see Bruno and Rashford, if we’re winning we’ll see Matic.

 

[TrustInOle]

Not even in the squad. Can't play midweek so abit of a surprising one. Maybe jumping the gun, but is Ole blaming him for trusting him?

 

[-Supreme-]

I don't think he's been dropped / disciplined due to the red card but more likely that Ole wanting to see the CM pairing with McT / VdB / Pogba, whoever is playing the deeper role...

Matic is on the bench and also needs some mins too so I don't think Fred is needed and being rested more likely.

 

[Cutch]

He’ll be suspended for Leipzig won’t he? So seems strange to drop him now, but perhaps Ole is trying to give a run out to players who will play next week. Fred isn’t much use off the bench so if he’s not starting he’s probably not going to appear. If we’re chasing the game we’ll see Bruno and Rashford, if we’re winning we’ll see Matic.

Yep you're spot on with all of that imo

 

[Andycoleno9]

We missed him a lot today. I hope that people realise that now

 

[GledTheRed]

We missed him a lot today. I hope that people realise that now

He's quality, best presser we have.

 

[charlenefan]

kinda makes sense to give him and entire week off given the amount he's played for us

 

[Litch]

Def not the answer but he's the best one we got at the moment in that position......

 

[red woppit]

Not even in the squad. Can't play midweek so abit of a surprising one. Maybe jumping the gun, but is Ole blaming him for trusting him?

He's played a lot of games recently, so perhaps just resting him?

 

[AFC NimbleThumb]

We missed him a lot today. I hope that people realise that now

Missed him how? Genuine question.

I saw a team play terribly for 60 minutes then the better players raised their game & we won.

I didn’t see anything in games such as last week vs Southampton for Fred to suddenly get such lofty praise/expectations. He’s been as lacklustre with his first touch as any player; he’s just abit move mobile doing so.

Bruno & Marcus came on, we won.

Far from a terrible player but he wasn’t winning that game today.

 

[Andycoleno9]

He's quality, best presser we have.

Exactly what i meant. Plus he offers a lot in attack. Sure, he will not give some killer ball or score a goal but he is good on one-twos, something what Matic and McT can't offer.
For me, Fred is our best no6 by far

 

[NinjaFletch]

We missed him a lot today. I hope that people realise that now

By virtue of not being Van de Beek, probably, yes. But there's one midfielder that that game really showed we miss when he doesn't play and lucky for us he came on at half time.

 

[Litch]

Not even in the squad. Can't play midweek so abit of a surprising one. Maybe jumping the gun, but is Ole blaming him for trusting him?

I think it was more having to see an alternative before Tuesday. Interesting that Matic is way down the pecking order again....

 

[ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg]

He's played a lot of games recently, so perhaps just resting him?

perhaps the manager Is sending him a message after his headbutt.

 

[Litch]

perhaps the manager Is sending him a message after his headbutt.

Might have been if he didn't start the second half....

 

[GledTheRed]

Exactly what i meant. Plus he offers a lot in attack. Sure, he will not give some killer ball or score a goal but he is good on one-twos, something what Matic and McT can't offer.
For me, Fred is our best no6 by far

I agree, he's brave with his passing too and doesn't hide from a pass.

Because of his stature he's able to distribute the ball quicker too as he's more agile.

 

[UNITED ACADEMY]

No one has his energy & mobility in midfield. Him & Bruno just the combo. If you want to upgrade Fred, you need someone like Keane or Kimmich and we are all know it's not possible.

 

[ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg]

Might have been if he didn't start the second half....

potentially. Not saying it’s definite. Perhaps Ole reviewed the headbutt, and whilst the second booking wasn’t a booking, he shouldn’t have gone to ground. Usually injuries are mentioned, and given he’s not playing midweek clearly he doesn’t need a rest.

 

[RedIan]

I’m not the biggest Fred fan, he has to many limitations (PASSING MAINLY) but i actually felt like we missed his midfield defensive engine first half.

 

[Bwuk]

If he was playing it’d of been instead of Pogba not McTominay.

 

[Thiagoal]

We desperately missed his energy and positioning today! I never feel like we are capable of controlling a game when he’s not on the team sheet

 

[Web of Bissaka]

Is there a fallout?

Surely he should've play today, or at least be in the squad.
He's absent in the next and we need every bodies we could get to last this fitness-challenging month.

Energy from midfield are lacking today.

 

[Web of Bissaka]

He’ll be suspended for Leipzig won’t he? So seems strange to drop him now, but perhaps Ole is trying to give a run out to players who will play next week. Fred isn’t much use off the bench so if he’s not starting he’s probably not going to appear. If we’re chasing the game we’ll see Bruno and Rashford, if we’re winning we’ll see Matic.

The only rational reason so far.
Still doesn't tell why he's not in the squad.

I do think he's useful off the bench, to inject the energy we needed in the centre of the park, and to close games well once we're winning. West Ham has mobile fast players, I don't think Matic is a good choice to handle those, Fred is better.