[Litch]

RR is as blind as a bat if he can't see how abysmal he was. I think he does see it though and if it's his decision he would want to replace him. I mean come on man, that was a wonderful pass for the goal, but he did so many criminal passes it was ridiculous. Simple switch to Dalot, he misplaces it by 5 meters. It was criminal imo.

….So if he sees it, and he is as bad as you and others say then why does he play him? He could play Matic or Donny……

 

[Litch]

Good questions. In my opinion he is usually a better option than the alternatives and brings a little more than them. But this is really a comment on the terrible state of our midfield. I would keep him in the squad and he would get games but we need to recruit in CM and use Fred as back up / rotation.

I hear you but this isn’t new I guess. Whether Fred is good enough or not, I don’t understand then why other players who potentially were not good enough either were loaned out or sold. We still had Scott, Matic, Bruno and Pogs. In the past, we have even loaned players in to offer cover.

Unpopular as it may be, consistently separate managers including RR believe he is good enough. Whilst we want to offer reasons why he isn’t, I’m sorry RR has benched Rashford and brought in an academy player who starts. Our club captain, benched along with 50m RB. Shaw another one benched. I don’t believe RR would play Fred if he was anyway as bad because he’s already proven in others than he wouldn’t.

 

[OrcaFat]

I hear you but this isn’t new I guess. Whether Fred is good enough or not, I don’t understand then why other players who potentially were not good enough either were loaned out or sold. We still had Scott, Matic, Bruno and Pogs. In the past, we have even loaned players in to offer cover.

Unpopular as it may be, consistently separate managers including RR believe he is good enough. Whilst we want to offer reasons why he isn’t, I’m sorry RR has benched Rashford and brought in an academy player who starts. Our club captain, benched along with 50m RB. Shaw another one benched. I don’t believe RR would play Fred if he was anyway as bad because he’s already proven in others than he wouldn’t.

Yeah he’s one of the best we’ve got. Can’t really say more than that.

 

[Kostov]

….So if he sees it, and he is as bad as you and others say then why does he play him? He could play Matic or Donny……

Christ I feel sorry for you. So was Fred playing good according to you? If yes you are beyond reason.

 

[Litch]

Christ I feel sorry for you. So was Fred playing good according to you? If yes you are beyond reason.

Don’t feel sorry for me, been supporting Utd for 45 years so been here a few times. Good is clearly subjective and if I’m beyond reason, I’m comfortable with that as so must RR, the person we are pinning our hopes to for the next 2 years. Who do you think is better informed to make that assessment, you or him?

Maybe it’s me, but not sure there’s many any managers that play players that will cost them games. That’s why Harry, AWB et al are on the bench and so would Fred if that was the case. Sometimes for me, it’s not whether a player is playing good, it’s the sacrifices they make in order that the betters players can express themselves to win games. That’s why Fred plays and that’s why he is such a popular player amongst his peers and managers alike.

 

[Foxbatt]

He is playing not because he is good. He is playing because we have no other options.

 

[Kostov]

Don’t feel sorry for me, been supporting Utd for 45 years so been here a few times. Good is clearly subjective and if I’m beyond reason, I’m comfortable with that as so must RR, the person we are pinning our hopes to for the next 2 years. Who do you think is better informed to make that assessment, you or him?

He is hardly comfortable, he just playед Matic in our previous game, he has hardly any choice.

Maybe it’s me, but not sure there’s many any managers that play players that will cost them games. That’s why Harry, AWB et al are on the bench and so would Fred if that was the case. Sometimes for me, it’s not whether a player is playing good, it’s the sacrifices they make in order that the betters players can express themselves to win games. That’s why Fred plays and that’s why he is such a popular player amongst his peers and managers alike.

So he can't hit simple passes because it's the needed sacrifice in order for our forwards to go and score a fecking goal? Harry and AWB are not playing for 2 different reasons, one of them was injured and will probably get back in the line up, the other one has Dalot who has proven many including me wrong, and has played pretty good. Fred has been lucky with MCT getting knocks and his competition being Matic, otherwise, he has been awful and no sane manager will be happy with that performance.

 

[Foxbatt]

I know that he runs a lot but a lot of could be useless running. I mean there was an instant late in the second half, their keeper had the ball and Fred sprints to him and the keeper calmly passes it to a defender to ran into midfield. Fred should have not sprinted and got back to cover the space. Who cares if the keeper takes an hour to pass? So much the better for us.

 

[Litch]

He is hardly comfortable, he just playед Matic in our previous game, he has hardly any choice.

So he can't hit simple passes because it's the needed sacrifice in order for our forwards to go and score a fecking goal? Harry and AWB are not playing for 2 different reasons, one of them was injured and will probably get back in the line up, the other one has Dalot who has proven many including me wrong, and has played pretty good. Fred has been lucky with MCT getting knocks and his competition being Matic, otherwise, he has been awful and no sane manager will be happy with that performance.

Some fans say the most stupid things to make their point, honestly it beggars belief. It’s impossible that a 28 year old footballer plays for Utd and Brazil if he can make a simple pass.

Hardly any choice, if Fred breaks his leg, you think RR is going to start the next game with 10 players? Thats just equally a ridiculous thing to suggest, there is always options.

Maybe it’s me, but teams are made up of all sorts of qualities even beyond just football ability. Steve Bruce was not the most gifted CB and Utd have over the years had a number of fan favs that were not the best footballers on the planet. One of my favs was O’Shea. I understand and agree with others that Fred doesn’t compare with our best midfielders but he certainly compares with many that we signed who didn’t also. When the bar is set at not only the greatest PL footballers but some of the best ever to lace up a pair of boots, Keano don’t come around very often. Fred shouldn’t be first team but if Keano et al are the barometer, there are no current players that would in any position.

I think most would say Harry, Shaw and AWB are dropped whether they were fit or injured.

Fred been lucky for a long time then, for me you make your own luck. Again maybe it’s me but most balanced knowledgable people who have played football at most levels, would have played with players who are not the best players but they are the glue or cog that allows those who are to play better. When they don’t play, something is missing. I’m guess for many managers and players alike, that’s Fred.

Unless you can have a ‘grown up’ conversation beyond, he can’t pass when Fred generally makes more completed and forward passes on the team, there really is no point. He’s added assist to his game, and whilst he along with 10 other players were far from perfect, the world class pass to create our first goal, changed the game. That’s often what Bruno and Pogs dine out on….

 

[shamans]

For me Fred is a victim of our team. Any other top team and he would be a regular industrial starting midfielder for them.

For instance, many times his first touch gets ridiculed the ball is rocketed into him from someone.

 

[romufc]

For me Fred is a victim of our team. Any other top team and he would be a regular industrial starting midfielder for them.

For instance, many times his first touch gets ridiculed the ball is rocketed into him from someone.

Yep, like the clearance he tried to make overhead? Did the ball change shape that made him miskick it? Or the numerous stray passes he makes?

 

[Bebestation]

I feel sorry for the fans he has at this club.

Fred is far from perfect - but he is definitely a good player and a good midfielder to be in our squad.

I just feel like people view alot of opposition fans as these "perfect" players or midfielders - which comes much more from the tactical balance given through their managers (like Pep's possesion football) than it does from just the player.

We saw the rise of Fred from a better more experienced coach than Ole - you do wonder what he could do under a proper world class one.

 

[Remember the geese]

Yep, like the clearance he tried to make overhead? Did the ball change shape that made him miskick it? Or the numerous stray passes he makes?

The ball didn't change shape, but the powder puff punch from De Gea was pretty pathetic.

 

[shamans]

Yep, like the clearance he tried to make overhead? Did the ball change shape that made him miskick it? Or the numerous stray passes he makes?

Stray passes can literally be due to tactical movement of the team.

 

[Litch]

I feel sorry for the fans he has at this club.

Fred is far from perfect - but he is definitely a good player and a good midfielder to be in our squad.

I just feel like people view alot of opposition fans as these "perfect" players or midfielders - which comes much more from the tactical balance given through their managers (like Pep's possesion football) than it does from just the player.

We saw the rise of Fred from a better more experienced coach than Ole - you do wonder what he could do under a proper world class one.

I feel often when fans don’t get what they want, the negative focus is on those players playing in that position. Fred and Scott are not CDM’s, they are being asked to fill in. They don’t pick themselves and not sure why people criticise players that aren’t playing their natural position. I think as 8’s playing further forward, both have already proved they are more than capable of doing that by goals and assists….

 

[Redlyn]

He has his uses but the excuses being made here for him are hilarious.

 

[CloneMC16]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

 

[Ali Dia]

Tweet

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He’s absolutely shit

 

[UpWithRivers]

We either ask McTominay to be the DM and then he gets abused and is sht and everyone wants him out. Or we ask Fred to be the DM and then he's sht. Or we play Fred high up like against Villa. If we ever get a natural DM and play either McTominay or Fred next to them and let them play their natural games then we will see if they are good or not. One of them is always having to sacrifice their games for the good of the team.

 

[Ali Dia]

More creative than Greenwood or Rashford for the last few months while running rings around them on the pitch trying to get us going. Maybe people should start looking at the areas of the team that are actually underperforming and take it from there instead of carrying on an agenda

 

[OrcaFat]

I feel often when fans don’t get what they want, the negative focus is on those players playing in that position. Fred and Scott are not CDM’s, they are being asked to fill in. They don’t pick themselves and not sure why people criticise players that aren’t playing their natural position. I think as 8’s playing further forward, both have already proved they are more than capable of doing that by goals and assists….

Yeah they’re both okay as 8s.

 

[Foxbatt]

At this level players need to be able to control and make good passes almost all the time. Fred loses possession too often. Yes he does make the occasional fantastic pass.
Maybe he is having to compromise for the lack of a good DM?

 

[Litch]

At this level players need to be able to control and make good passes almost all the time. Fred loses possession too often. Yes he does make the occasional fantastic pass.
Maybe he is having to compromise for the lack of a good DM?

Whether they are good enough to start in a good Man Utd team is questionable but DM is a specialist position, with a skill set that’s completely against Fred’s natural game and exposes his weaknesses. Pogs is one of the best players in the world and we have seen for Utd and France, he has been caught on the ball that’s lead to goals, he’s no DM either.

For me it’s like playing strikers as a target man, yes they can do it but would be wrong to criticise the player if they weren’t as someone that’s their natural position. It’s no coincidence that when RR allows him to get the ball further forward, only Bruno has created more chances.

 

[OrcaFat]

At this level players need to be able to control and make good passes almost all the time. Fred loses possession too often. Yes he does make the occasional fantastic pass.
Maybe he is having to compromise for the lack of a good DM?

I agree. I think the people defending him have made some decent points. He is an 8 who was often being asked to play as some sort of a 6-8 hybrid, or so it appeared. As an orthodox 8 he is decent and, I think, a worthy squad option, even after we recruit another couple of CMs.
I like him, his attitude is great and his fitness record is pretty good. He is one of our best midfielders at the moment but I think it’s probably true that he wouldn’t get into the first 11 at Liv, City or Chelsea, or West Ham, or Leicester; possibly a few other clubs have better CMs than him as well.

He is part of our problems but without him we are not any better at the moment.

 

[Litch]

I agree. I think the people defending him have made some decent points. He is an 8 who was often being asked to play as some sort of a 6-8 hybrid, or so it appeared. As an orthodox 8 he is decent and, I think, a worthy squad option, even after we recruit another couple of CMs.
I like him, his attitude is great and his fitness record is pretty good. He is one of our best midfielders at the moment but I think it’s probably true that he wouldn’t get into the first 11 at Liv, City or Chelsea, or West Ham, or Leicester; possibly a few other clubs have better CMs than him as well.

He is part of our problems but without him we are not any better at the moment.

Agree, he probably won’t get into those sides playing CM. If he was 8 putting up those kind of numbers, might do for some. Clearly I like Fred but even more, I find myself defending certain players as often the criticism is often not justified in context. You don’t have to be Roy Keane to contribute and in whilst other players appear better, playing in the shirt is a weight and to deal with the criticism that comes with it. I don’t think fans often consider that…..

 

[Lecland07]

One of the better performers. Solid game from him.

Shame he didn't put the ball in the net or he would be the Man of the Match.

 

[Devil may care]

Couple of lovely passes but ran around on the periphery of the game for a lot of the time, it's tough for him and McTominay as even in a 4-3-3 neither have a defined role, they keep rotating between 6 and 8 during the game when neither are any good as a 6.

 

[jamesjimmybyrondean]

This might be the first game I didn't see him lose the ball

 

[Kostov]

Much better showing than the last game. Looked calm and composed to be fair, something I don't think he usually demonstrates.

 

[Lost bear]

He’s absolutely shit

That's some sophisticated analysis there, man.

 

[Ali Dia]

That's some sophisticated analysis there, man.

I was being sarcastic. If you read this thread it’s always me saying the midfield is doing fine doing the grunt work and now adding creativity. Fred is currently my favourite player at Utd but he could have no complaints about coming off today. I thought they did just as good as the West Ham midfield. Rice made some nice interceptions. Our forwards and wingers aren’t really meshing at all. Good to see Rashford and Greenwood pop up with goals recently but I can’t really see where we are going as an attacking unit. Not even about Ronaldo because I felt the same way last season too.

 

[Litch]

Solid midfield performance.…not a hater in sight….

 

[Lost bear]

I was being sarcastic. If you read this thread it’s always me saying the midfield is doing fine doing the grunt work and now adding creativity. Fred is currently my favourite player at Utd but he could have no complaints about coming off today. I thought they did just as good as the West Ham midfield. Rice made some nice interceptions. Our forwards and wingers aren’t really meshing at all. Good to see Rashford and Greenwood pop up with goals recently but I can’t really see where we are going as an attacking unit. Not even about Ronaldo because I felt the same way last season too.

Yeh- I thought I’d seen you backing Fred- I’m in a minority there so I usually tend to notice. Apologies for missing the humour….I think maybe Ralf has focused on stopping us leaking goals, and making the midfield sane. Hopefully he’ll now turn his eye to our attack…

 

[CloneMC16]

Yeh- I thought I’d seen you backing Fred- I’m in a minority there so I usually tend to notice. Apologies for missing the humour….I think maybe Ralf has focused on stopping us leaking goals, and making the midfield sane. Hopefully he’ll now turn his eye to our attack…

That is exactly what has happened and needed to happen. We were conceding too many goals. We had to get that under control first. If we can put in more defensive displays like today, that'll be a big improvement from where we were. Then we can work on the attack.

Fred played well today. He had a much better all around performance than against Brentford. 90% pass completion. I wish he would have scored when he had that great opportunity.

 

[NZT-One]

I really like that he is one of not many players who tend to put enough juice in every pass he does. While Maguire, Shaw, McTom, Rashford, Greenwood tend to play at walking speed, Fred puts always enough zip on it. Yes sometimes he overdoes it, but a) he adds momentum to our play and b) he keeps momentum alive with it. Good performance from him today, well done!

 

[Cutch]

Didn't see the whole game but 90% pass completion rate for Fred. That is most unlike him so must have played pretty well

 

[GledTheRed]

I love Fred & i love McSauce.

They just need help / rotation.

 

[Litch]

Didn't see the whole game but 90% pass completion rate for Fred. That is most unlike him so must have played pretty well

Perception is a strange as I’m sure I read on the team his pass completions are only second to Matic but he makes more forward passes and is on the ball more?

 

[SamVimes]

I love Fred & i love McSauce.

They just need help / rotation.

They are squad players.

 

[Cutch]

Perception is a strange as I’m sure I read on the team his pass completions are only second to Matic but he makes more forward passes and is on the ball more?

Just went through his last half dozen games and it's at 80-85% which is still higher than I expected in fairness so you might be right