[Pogue Mahone]

I have 0 problems with him constantly fouling. In fact no, scratch that, I do have a problem. He should aim to significantly increase those, those are rookie numbers in this racket.

When Fernandinho was doing it, committing 10 fouls a game to break up opposition attacks while getting away with it, people were calling it art. When someone does it on our side, it’s suddenly a problem.

I like what he does. So long as he doesn’t misplace easy passes I don’t have major complaints for the rest of his game. He was good yesterday.

Yup. Three City players made 2 or more fouls yesterday. Fred was the only United player to make more than 1. The stat he chose to (deliberately) ignore was interceptions. Fred made 5. AWB made 2. No other player on the pitch made more than 1.

 

[Oranges038]

Fred’s inconsistency is a problem. I wouldn’t argue with that. Turning on him after a game where he was one of our best players, following a string of good performances during the season run in, makes no sense.

He barely played in the run in.

Since March 1st he started 6 out of 21 games and only played 1 full 90 (yesterday), only played for more than 60 mins 6 other times, in the 14 other games he played for less than 30 mins.

So where was this string of good performances that you speak of?

 

[Ekeke]

I have 0 problems with him constantly fouling. In fact no, scratch that, I do have a problem. He should aim to significantly increase those, those are rookie numbers in this racket.

When Fernandinho was doing it, committing 10 fouls a game to break up opposition attacks while getting away with it, people were calling it art. When someone does it on our side, it’s suddenly a problem.

I like what he does. So long as he doesn’t misplace easy passes I don’t have major complaints for the rest of his game. He was good yesterday.

The most Fernandinho averaged in a PL season was 1.8 which is the same as our most this season Malacia also at 1.8 so thats very much overstated. It wasnt the number, more the obvious fouls to stop attacks when City were in a bad position that he was known for.

Still this is 1 game, Fred doesnt normally make that many fouls. He simply did in this 1 match

 

[Litch]

Never understand why some fans focus on some players like they are the problem. Fred doesnt lose us games, he just doesnt win us them but there are other who should. Where was Bruno yesterday?
Yep sell Fred but it wont make any difference cause its the consistency of those that should make the difference and if they were, you dont need a Fred to start or to bring 'energy'.....it should be there anyway!!!
Fred was in for MoTM yesterday and if thats the case, you arent winning major trophies

 

[Litch]

He barely played in the run in.

Since March 1st he started 6 out of 21 games and only played 1 full 90 (yesterday), only played for more than 60 mins 6 other times, in the 14 other games he played for less than 30 mins.

So where was this string of good performances that you speak of?

Our best performances generally whether under Ole or ETH, Fred has been a feature and often in the discussion for MoTM.
He played yesterday because how good he was against City when we beat them and arguably the best match we have played in years against Spurs, he was MOTM.

 

[Oranges038]

Our best performances generally whether under Ole or ETH, Fred has been a feature and often in the discussion for MoTM.
He played yesterday because how good he was against City when we beat them and arguably the best match we have played in years against Spurs, he was MOTM.

Doesn't explain how he had a string of good performances in the run in when he barely started and rarely played more than 30 mins..

 

[jesperjaap]

Baffled how Fred is stil backed and defende so much. The one positive was he brought energy and tenaciousness to our game, any player should bring that so yes can dig out other players for ot doing so.

But Fred is a £60m signing that has been here years that has poor passing, positioning, clumsy decisions, makes fould in the wrong areas. He brings so little to the side for such a huge fee. He is one of several that I dont understand how they have been here so long and even more so dont understand how they are still getting support and people wanting them in the squad.

 

[Lentwood]

Showed once again the most damning part of his game is that he isn't actually a good ball-winner/DM

How many times did Grealish and KdB breeze past him? He runs about a lot but he is slow and weak and rarely turns the ball over.

And that's supposed to be what he's good at...

 

[GL21]

Baffled how Fred is stil backed and defende so much. The one positive was he brought energy and tenaciousness to our game, any player should bring that so yes can dig out other players for ot doing so.

But Fred is a £60m signing that has been here years that has poor passing, positioning, clumsy decisions, makes fould in the wrong areas. He brings so little to the side for such a huge fee. He is one of several that I dont understand how they have been here so long and even more so dont understand how they are still getting support and people wanting them in the squad.

Mind baffling how some have settled for this garbage. Some fans want him to be good just and convince themselves. I'll never settle for Fred. Used to be annoyed when we had the makeshift Phil nev in midfield but looking back he was levels better. Ferguson would not have had Fred anywhere near it

 

[MadDogg]

The most Fernandinho averaged in a PL season was 1.8 which is the same as our most this season Malacia also at 1.8 so thats very much overstated. It wasnt the number, more the obvious fouls to stop attacks when City were in a bad position that he was known for.

Still this is 1 game, Fred doesnt normally make that many fouls. He simply did in this 1 match

It also should be noted that at least one, arguably two of those 'fouls' were incorrect decisions from the ref.

 

[MadDogg]

Baffled how Fred is stil backed and defende so much. The one positive was he brought energy and tenaciousness to our game, any player should bring that so yes can dig out other players for ot doing so.

It's easy to say that, but in reality there are very few midfielders around who actually bring as much energy and tenaciousness as Fred does. It's especially important in a team like ours where we actually do have quite a few players who are significantly below average in that aspect; Fred being one of the best around actually goes some way towards covering for other's limitations.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

He barely played in the run in.

Since March 1st he started 6 out of 21 games and only played 1 full 90 (yesterday), only played for more than 60 mins 6 other times, in the 14 other games he played for less than 30 mins.

So where was this string of good performances that you speak of?

During the season run in. The words are in my post. Coming on as a sub. Which is the way he should be mainly used in future, assuming we sign the players we need to sign.

 

[Oranges038]

During the season run in. The words are in my post. Coming on as a sub. Which is the way he should be mainly used in future, assuming we sign the players we need to sign.

I'd disagree with that.

He should be shipped out, ETH would rather play a legless Eriksen than Fred. Which tells you how much he values his running around.

 

[CloneMC16]

Never understand why some fans focus on some players like they are the problem. Fred doesnt lose us games, he just doesnt win us them but there are other who should. Where was Bruno yesterday?
Yep sell Fred but it wont make any difference cause its the consistency of those that should make the difference and if they were, you dont need a Fred to start or to bring 'energy'.....it should be there anyway!!!
Fred was in for MoTM yesterday and if thats the case, you arent winning major trophies

Yeah, this is the issue. I thought him and AWB were two of our best players yesterday. If they're our best players, we have problems. The players that should be stepping up and winning us games didn't do it.

That being said, I wouldn't be surprised if he left this summer. There has been no talk of extending him and you'd think there would be when he only has one year left. ETH has benched him quite a lot as well. Even after very good performances. I would still keep him and use him as a bench player. We need a new starting midfielder pretty desperately.

 

[jesperjaap]

It's easy to say that, but in reality there are very few midfielders around who actually bring as much energy and tenaciousness as Fred does. It's especially important in a team like ours where we actually do have quite a few players who are significantly below average in that aspect; Fred being one of the best around actually goes some way towards covering for other's limitations.

Dont agree at all. There are plenty of players that are tenacious and have a lot of energy, the difference is those at the top clubs also have far more to there game as well.

We shouldnt be keeping Fred at 30 for that reason, just as shouldnt be keeping some players with limitations around him that also are not helping us. Having somebody within the squad that isnt good enough, to cover other players that are not good enough.....how on earth is that some kind of recipie for success?.

We have had plenty of limitde valuable squad players over the years that were average players, a £60m signing that is now 30 doesnt fit that criteria at all. Fred that has been here wouldnt be gettign anywhere near the pitch after a season or so with his performances at the best clubs around Europe. The reasoning of some on here for why he should stay really baffles me

 

[Borys]

Dont agree at all. There are plenty of players that are tenacious and have a lot of energy, the difference is those at the top clubs also have far more to there game as well.

We shouldnt be keeping Fred at 30 for that reason, just as shouldnt be keeping some players with limitations around him that also are not helping us. Having somebody within the squad that isnt good enough, to cover other players that are not good enough.....how on earth is that some kind of recipie for success?.

We have had plenty of limitde valuable squad players over the years that were average players, a £60m signing that is now 30 doesnt fit that criteria at all. Fred that has been here wouldnt be gettign anywhere near the pitch after a season or so with his performances at the best clubs around Europe. The reasoning of some on here for why he should stay really baffles me

I think it's just your evaluation of Fred is very different to those people who think he should stay. I certainly think he is a good squad player and it won't be easy to get a better option in the same money that we can get for Fred. Would you argue that?

If we have money to spend then fine, although the goal should be to improve our first XI. Which is why I'm surprised he's getting so much stick. Especially after yesterday game, where he was one of the brightest spots for United.

But weird so many people want to ship him out. Also not sure what the fee we paid for him has to do with the decision on Free future.

 

[top1whoisman]

I have 0 problems with him constantly fouling. In fact no, scratch that, I do have a problem. He should aim to significantly increase those, those are rookie numbers in this racket.

When Fernandinho was doing it, committing 10 fouls a game to break up opposition attacks while getting away with it, people were calling it art. When someone does it on our side, it’s suddenly a problem.

I like what he does. So long as he doesn’t misplace easy passes I don’t have major complaints for the rest of his game. He was good yesterday.

Fernandinho made those smart tactical fouls in the middle of the pitch. Fred gives out free kicks in dangerous areas due to poor positioning and reading of the game.

 

[top1whoisman]

Never understand why some fans focus on some players like they are the problem. Fred doesnt lose us games, he just doesnt win us them but there are other who should. Where was Bruno yesterday?
Yep sell Fred but it wont make any difference cause its the consistency of those that should make the difference and if they were, you dont need a Fred to start or to bring 'energy'.....it should be there anyway!!!
Fred was in for MoTM yesterday and if thats the case, you arent winning major trophies

Bruno scored and played that beautiful pass to Garnacho who almost scored. Bruno has his weaknesses for sure but he very rarely struggles to create something even he plays badly.

 

[jesperjaap]

I think it's just your evaluation of Fred is very different to those people who think he should stay. I certainly think he is a good squad player and it won't be easy to get a better option in the same money that we can get for Fred. Would you argue that?

If we have money to spend then fine, although the goal should be to improve our first XI. Which is why I'm surprised he's getting so much stick. Especially after yesterday game, where he was one of the brightest spots for United.

But weird so many people want to ship him out. Also not sure what the fee we paid for him has to do with the decision on Free future.

How many times is the point ignored when talking of him as a squad player....He cost £60m, he is on over £100k a week, the fact he is now being regarded as a squad player is because he hasnt been and isnt good enough.
He also has a year left on his contact so we give him a new contract or he goes for free next season.

You ask do I think do I think it is hard to get a better option for similar money than Fred as if that is really difficult. Why is that difficult? Hell yes we can, he has been here several years and put in 3/4 decent spells and only a couple of any quality, of course that is easy to replace as it isnt good enough.

Yesterday he was one of the few to show desire, all good.....other side is the lack of qualit and intelligence, giving away a silly free kick when we in no danger....it lead to the winning goal.

So to summarise he cost £60m and is on a big wage, he is 30 and goes for free next season and hasnt been a very good player in hi stime here.

 

[Litch]

He is what he is. Maybe never lived up to the price tag in an evaluated per Covid market and played in a time of turmoil and disfunction.

People will forget when Pogba, Matic et al were constantly injured, Fred held the midfield together contributing to 2nd and 3rd finishes.

Never came here as a DM but like Scott, both honest players who may have lacked in quality but not in endeavour. I think he'd have played anyway he was asked with no fuss.

Like said, all our best matches hes featured some with MotM performances. Also anything kicks off on the pitch, hes always the first there to support the player when others go missing.

If he leaves this summer, I'll wish him well cause if so called better players gave as much as he does, we would win more than we have lost. Whilst fans might question him, I guarantee those that play with him recognises his value.

 

[MadMike]

Fernandinho made those smart tactical fouls in the middle of the pitch. Fred gives out free kicks in dangerous areas due to poor positioning and reading of the game.

Maybe I’m forgetting, but I don’t remember any dangerous free kicks as a result of a Fred foul yesterday.

Also the free kicks wouldn’t be dangerous if we had a keeper that comes out to punch the ball instead of being rooted on his line. Every free kick or corner crossed into the box is a danger with De Gea in goal. You can’t expect the outfield players not to foul at all for fear your weak keeper might concede for a simple cross.

 

[top1whoisman]

Maybe I’m forgetting, but I don’t remember any dangerous free kicks as a result of a Fred foul yesterday.

Also the free kicks wouldn’t be dangerous if we had a keeper that comes out to punch the ball instead of being rooted on his line. Every free kick or corner crossed into the box is a danger with De Gea in goal. You can’t expect the outfield players not to foul at all for fear your weak keeper might concede for a simple cross.

In general, not talking about yesterday. In direct shooting positions where the opponents don’t cross. And DDG is actually decent at saving direct free kicks.

 

[Swedish_Plumber]

Obviously not good enough as a starter but he seems like a top guy. Someone you’d love having in the squad. Deserves to be a starter somewhere else.

 

[Silverman]

Would be disappointed to see him go. Definitely deserves his place in the squad.

 

[OrcaFat]

He is what he is. Maybe never lived up to the price tag in an evaluated per Covid market and played in a time of turmoil and disfunction.

People will forget when Pogba, Matic et al were constantly injured, Fred held the midfield together contributing to 2nd and 3rd finishes.

Never came here as a DM but like Scott, both honest players who may have lacked in quality but not in endeavour. I think he'd have played anyway he was asked with no fuss.

Like said, all our best matches hes featured some with MotM performances. Also anything kicks off on the pitch, hes always the first there to support the player when others go missing.

If he leaves this summer, I'll wish him well cause if so called better players gave as much as he does, we would win more than we have lost. Whilst fans might question him, I guarantee those that play with him recognises his value.

“He is what he is” and never has that phrase been so apt. He is good at what he’s good at (which ain’t a lot) and not so good at the rest. He’s terrible in a MF two but seems to do well in a three. There are games when he seems a good pick to start but he can’t really compete for a regular spot in EtH’s system because he’s the wrong profile.

He played some great matches for Ole but him and McT were the main reason we lost control and struggled so badly towards the end of games when we just couldn’t hold onto the ball long enough to relieve pressure.

He is an example of a tactical squad player, he gets played when we need what he brings. In the bold bright future he has no place but for now he might as well stay and we can enjoy that Fred Magic a while longer.

(If someone puts up some stats to say we’ve actually won more games with him than without him I’ll lose faith in human nature).

 

[Borys]

How many times is the point ignored when talking of him as a squad player....He cost £60m, he is on over £100k a week, the fact he is now being regarded as a squad player is because he hasnt been and isnt good enough.
He also has a year left on his contact so we give him a new contract or he goes for free next season.

You ask do I think do I think it is hard to get a better option for similar money than Fred as if that is really difficult. Why is that difficult? Hell yes we can, he has been here several years and put in 3/4 decent spells and only a couple of any quality, of course that is easy to replace as it isnt good enough.

Yesterday he was one of the few to show desire, all good.....other side is the lack of qualit and intelligence, giving away a silly free kick when we in no danger....it lead to the winning goal.

So to summarise he cost £60m and is on a big wage, he is 30 and goes for free next season and hasnt been a very good player in hi stime here.

And I agree he hasn't been "a very good player". I will admit he was never 60m midfielder. But that makes no difference if we payed 10m or 60m for him if he's a squad player now, the only thing that matters is whether it will be easy to upgrade on him.

With a year left on his contract, how much you think we're getting for Fred? 15-20m would be my guess. You seriously think we get a better player than Fred for that money, and we sign someone on similar wages?
I certainly don't think so. 11 G+A over the season, top 15% for xAG, shot creating actions, and all that on top of top 3% for tackles and blocks. Really seems to me like he simply isn't liked and people go from one extreme to another, with the idea to bin everyone who is not on Gundogan level.

Again, if we have all the money in the world we can just release 70% of the squad and buy whoever we want, but we're living in different reality at the moment and Fred has his value. He is very close to being perfect squad player who will not moan when not playing for a month, can play 90' of intensive football, has great injury record and is actually an effective patch whenever called on the pitch. But since you're very confident about finding an upgrade on him I am open to your suggestions.

 

[Kostov]

Never understand why some fans focus on some players like they are the problem. Fred doesnt lose us games, he just doesnt win us them but there are other who should. Where was Bruno yesterday?
Yep sell Fred but it wont make any difference cause its the consistency of those that should make the difference and if they were, you dont need a Fred to start or to bring 'energy'.....it should be there anyway!!!
Fred was in for MoTM yesterday and if thats the case, you arent winning major trophies

No single player loses game on consistent basis, neither has Fred. But I also can not understand how Manchester United fans can watch Fred play in the engine of the team, one of the most crucial positions in football, then go and blubber how we need a new GK because we can not play modern football with someone like DDG. And I absolutely agree about Bruno, but that's what happens when you overload one player, and on top of that we are so predictable 8/10 times.

 

[jesperjaap]

And I agree he hasn't been "a very good player". I will admit he was never 60m midfielder. But that makes no difference if we payed 10m or 60m for him if he's a squad player now, the only thing that matters is whether it will be easy to upgrade on him.

With a year left on his contract, how much you think we're getting for Fred? 15-20m would be my guess. You seriously think we get a better player than Fred for that money, and we sign someone on similar wages?
I certainly don't think so. 11 G+A over the season, top 15% for xAG, shot creating actions, and all that on top of top 3% for tackles and blocks. Really seems to me like he simply isn't liked and people go from one extreme to another, with the idea to bin everyone who is not on Gundogan level.

Again, if we have all the money in the world we can just release 70% of the squad and buy whoever we want, but we're living in different reality at the moment and Fred has his value. He is very close to being perfect squad player who will not moan when not playing for a month, can play 90' of intensive football, has great injury record and is actually an effective patch whenever called on the pitch. But since you're very confident about finding an upgrade on him I am open to your suggestions.

So we shouldnt sell him because it may cost us more to replace him? He is on well over £100k a week, you talk as if he is on a small weekly wage? He also goes for free next season so then we lose out on £150/20m altogether so why do we need to sign someone for a similar fee or less,. If we spent £40m on a player this summer an dsold Fred for £20m, that is the same as keepinh im value wise, do you not understand that? SO the list is absoilutely huge of replacements that would be better than Fred

 

[Borys]

So we shouldnt sell him because it may cost us more to replace him? He is on well over £100k a week, you talk as if he is on a small weekly wage? He also goes for free next season so then we lose out on £150/20m altogether so why do we need to sign someone for a similar fee or less,. If we spent £40m on a player this summer an dsold Fred for £20m, that is the same as keepinh im value wise, do you not understand that? SO the list is absoilutely huge of replacements that would be better than Fred

On the bolded part - this is exactly the reason.
The alternative is to keep Fred and extend his contract, he can definitely play another season at this level. Then next year we can decide if he's needed, if not then we can just sell him (no worse than now). This is why you extend contracts - also to protect value in terms of getting the money back.

I already mentioned this before, if we have unlimited budget then sure, bin him and half the squad. But if we do have a spending limit then sorry but replacing Fred is low on priority list. Because he is quite clearly a squad/backup player and that is really nowhere near our biggest issue.

 

[Litch]

On the bolded part - this is exactly the reason.
The alternative is to keep Fred and extend his contract, he can definitely play another season at this level. Then next year we can decide if he's needed, if not then we can just sell him (no worse than now). This is why you extend contracts - also to protect value in terms of getting the money back.

I already mentioned this before, if we have unlimited budget then sure, bin him and half the squad. But if we do have a spending limit then sorry but replacing Fred is low on priority list. Because he is quite clearly a squad/backup player and that is really nowhere near our biggest issue.

Agree. Its funny cause I think as squads evolve and improve, those that start now should be relegated to more squad players e.g. DDG and Eriksen. Fred as truly a squad player with a significant improved first 11, we arent having this discussion in the same way.

 

[Borys]

Agree. Its funny cause I think as squads evolve and improve, those that start now should be relegated to more squad players e.g. DDG and Eriksen. Fred as truly a squad player with a significant improved first 11, we arent having this discussion in the same way.

I understand why people talk about keeping standards and "would he play for City first XI week in week out" kind of questions, but ETH needs to BUILD a winning team and this is a process that requires compromises. We will get there, but not overnight. Unless we win a lottery.

 

[KikiDaKats]

I like Fred and will say he looks a good guy, whether it’s good enough is up for debate. Seen comparisons to a Park or Fletcher barring engine no similarities nothing else to really draw from. Park was technically very good with manipulating the ball and his dribbling were all of very high standards, Fletcher was no mug on the ball either but his physical presence was superior.
Their roles might look similar in certain games but he lacks an edge in executing said roles.
He might be a good guy to have around the squad but he is physically declining and we can’t plan for the new season with him in it for a central role like this one.

 

[Alfie092]

Guardiola wanted Fred from Shakhtar for a reason!

 

[jesperjaap]

On the bolded part - this is exactly the reason.
The alternative is to keep Fred and extend his contract, he can definitely play another season at this level. Then next year we can decide if he's needed, if not then we can just sell him (no worse than now). This is why you extend contracts - also to protect value in terms of getting the money back.

I already mentioned this before, if we have unlimited budget then sure, bin him and half the squad. But if we do have a spending limit then sorry but replacing Fred is low on priority list. Because he is quite clearly a squad/backup player and that is really nowhere near our biggest issue.

His contract ENDS nezt season, we get NO transfer fee for him if we keep him this season...I give up

 

[Borys]

His contract ENDS nezt season, we get NO transfer fee for him if we keep him this season...I give up

Literally one sentence before the part you put in bold is mention about the alternative in extending his contract. You must have missed it.

 

[The Substitute]

"I'll never settle for Fred" blabla, the fact is, Fred is usually amongst our top 3 performers against high possession and pressing teams.

If you don't want to settle for him, fine, but there are way more players which offers far less and should be out of the first team before him.

I usually see the team perform better with him than without him and that's what matters.

The bias of labeling him as useless is ridiculous, it's a made up narrative without a proper rationale.

How can people even claim he had a bad game Saturday, without him, we'd be power-played out of the pitch

 

[Licha-Vidic]

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[Canucantona20]

We should get at least 30 million for him

 

[Ghostrider318]

We should get at least 30 million for him

Our board will get half that

 

[Devil You Know]

Rubbish player. Emblematic of our decline post-Fergie.

In 2018, at the point he signed, he was the 2nd most expensive midfielder in the world. Pogba was 1st. Between them, they were peak Woodward projects in his concept of how to build a squad.

I like his attitude, but will breathe a sigh of relief when he's no longer coming onto the pitch in a United shirt. I'd take £5m to £10m to be honest.