Frenkie de Jong | The last muppeting lap

Frenkie to United?


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Stobzilla

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Do we really think he'll have something good to say ?

I imagine it should be something like:

"Old manager didn't fancy him, new manager came in and the new structure decided to risk their own well being in order to get Donny some consistent first team football at a top level and prepare to come in with a clean slate at the start of the upcoming season"
 

Noc-Z

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The rebuild has to start somewhere but I feel this could be repeating the mistakes of the past. Would he arrive, delighted to be here and raring to go and prove himself. Or will he come for the money and lack of other options, bitter about being sold by Barca, with no hunger or desire? I'd be more excited by signing emerging talent with hunger and desire to prove themselves and win something. We've not exactly had success signing big names players from big clubs. The only glimmer of hope here is that with Ten Hag as manager, maybe, just maybe he can make it work. It's a lot of money and a slim chance I feel. All that said I hope my fears are misplaced.
 

JPRouve

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The rebuild has to start somewhere but I feel this could be repeating the mistakes of the past. Would he arrive, delighted to be here and raring to go and prove himself. Or will he come for the money and lack of other options, bitter about being sold by Barca, with no hunger or desire? I'd be more excited by signing emerging talent with hunger and desire to prove themselves and win something. We've not exactly had success signing big names players from big clubs. The only glimmer of hope here is that with Ten Hag as manager, maybe, just maybe he can make it work. It's a lot of money and a slim chance I feel. All that said I hope my fears are misplaced.
We have had even less success signing emerging and presumably hungry talents. If we use our recent past to eliminate signings we either start targetting non-footballers or stop purchasing players. :angel:
 

BusbyMalone

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So has he been a failure at Barcelona then?

Because it seems their desire to get him out of the club is not purely down to finances. They're obviously rebuilding, yet don't want this supposedly excellent, young midfielder in their team. For what it's worth, the little I have seen of him, I like him. But they don't seem that arsed about letting him go if what you read is correct.
 

JPRouve

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So has he been a failure at Barcelona then?

Because it seems their desire to get him out of the club is not purely down to finances. They're obviously rebuilding, yet don't want this supposedly excellent, young midfielder in their team. For what it's worth, the little I have seen of him, I like him. But they don't seem that arsed about letting him go if what you read is correct.
They don't really have room for him and used him higher and in a different role to the one he excelled in. I wouldn't say that he has failed because he has been good but there is a case to call the transfer a failure because he was expensive and didn't displace Busquets.
 

Yagami

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I wouldn't be surprised if FdJ is offered the Captaincy within six months as part of joining.
No doubt if he joins. He's the perfect embodiment of EtH's philosophy, isn't afraid to be vocal on the pitch to senior squad players, and is a winner. I'd expect him to play the same as he currently does for the Netherlands where everything goes through him starting from the CB position, which is why he makes obvious captain material. To me, anyway!
 

Rozay

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So has he been a failure at Barcelona then?

Because it seems their desire to get him out of the club is not purely down to finances. They're obviously rebuilding, yet don't want this supposedly excellent, young midfielder in their team. For what it's worth, the little I have seen of him, I like him. But they don't seem that arsed about letting him go if what you read is correct.
Think he’s just not irreplaceable. Think Coutinho, who was by any metric good for Liverpool, but not a player they thought they couldn’t afford to lose.
 

BusbyMalone

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They don't really have room for him and used him higher and in a different role to the one he excelled in. I wouldn't say that he has failed because he has been good but there is a case to call the transfer a failure because he was expensive and didn't displace Busquets.
Fair enough. More of just a bad fit then, perhaps, as opposed to him not being good enough. I'm so jaded when it comes to United transfers I immediately look for the negatives!
 

VanDeBank

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VDB and Klaassen superb for Ajax but cannot blow out a candle in England and yet this guy can come and tear it up in a Utd shirt......groundhog day :houllier:
Stuck in 2019?

Were not signing him from Ajax. He starts for Barcelona.

Also VDB and Klaassen were nowhere as spectacular for either Ajax or Holland as De Jong.

Not sure why I'm bothering. Following your flawed logic we shouldn't have been in for Van Dijk or Suarez because Tadic wasn't that great. They're different players.
 

L1nk

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So has he been a failure at Barcelona then?

Because it seems their desire to get him out of the club is not purely down to finances. They're obviously rebuilding, yet don't want this supposedly excellent, young midfielder in their team. For what it's worth, the little I have seen of him, I like him. But they don't seem that arsed about letting him go if what you read is correct.
It's more about the question is who else can they sell that will net them some money, who is on as big a wage as he is, who somebody wants to sign? Yes I imagine plenty of clubs will want to sign Pedri, Gavi, Ansu Fati etc but there's no way they will let those go mainly because they're 5/6 years younger and will have a much longer careers at Barcelona than FDJ. Players like Memphis and Ferran Torres they've only just signed so it would be a surprise to bin them off so quickly. Dembele I believe can leave for a free?

I wouldn't say he's failed but it's more like he's one of the only viable options, along with maybe some fringe players, that allows them to bring in new players this summer because their finances are so ridiculous
 

elnorte

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Fair enough. More of just a bad fit then, perhaps, as opposed to him not being good enough. I'm so jaded when it comes to United transfers I immediately look for the negatives!
As you should be. If somehow this even happens it'll be another to add to the list.
 

BusbyMalone

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Think he’s just not irreplaceable. Think Coutinho, who was by any metric good for Liverpool, but not a player they thought they couldn’t afford to lose.
Yeah, seems like just a bad fit then. I've only had limited experience with him. I saw him a few times for Ajax and then when he played for the Netherlands, where I thought he had a couple of great performances in the Euros
 

Mr Pigeon

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I'm not a smart man. Can someone kindly explain how FDJ would fit into a high pressing team? I get that he's press resistant but I keep seeing line up examples with him, Fernandes and Fred as a midfield three and it just makes me think that we'd be horribly overrun by quick passing opposition.

I'm guessing we'd need a very active DM for it to work?
 

BusbyMalone

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It's more about the question is who else can they sell that will net them some money, who is on as big a wage as he is, who somebody wants to sign? Yes I imagine plenty of clubs will want to sign Pedri, Gavi, Ansu Fati etc but there's no way they will let those go mainly because they're 5/6 years younger and will have a much longer careers at Barcelona than FDJ. Players like Memphis and Ferran Torres they've only just signed so it would be a surprise to bin them off so quickly. Dembele I believe can leave for a free?

I wouldn't say he's failed but it's more like he's one of the only viable options, along with maybe some fringe players, that allows them to bring in new players this summer because their finances are so ridiculous
I remember posting in a thread on here a while back about some of their transfers over the last 5 - 6 years. Absolutely ridiculous. Although I think they've FINALLY got Coutinho off their books. One of the worst transfers in history, no doubt.

£77m De Jong cost them apparently. And supposedly we can get him for a "cut-price"
 

DWelbz19

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I'm not a smart man. Can someone kindly explain how FDJ would fit into a high pressing team? I get that he's press resistant but I keep seeing line up examples with him, Fernandes and Fred as a midfield three and it just makes me think that we'd be horribly overrun by quick passing opposition.

I'm guessing we'd need a very active DM for it to work?
Probably in a similar way to how he did in the first instance under our new manager.
 

UNITED ACADEMY

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I'm not a smart man. Can someone kindly explain how FDJ would fit into a high pressing team? I get that he's press resistant but I keep seeing line up examples with him, Fernandes and Fred as a midfield three and it just makes me think that we'd be horribly overrun by quick passing opposition.

I'm guessing we'd need a very active DM for it to work?
Don’t worry, our manager is aiming for 2 new midfield. If we sign FDJ, I also expect us to sign another midfield to play next to FDJ. I hope it’s going to be new midfielders of FDJ, new midfield, and VDB. Bruno would be playing wide in my ideal scenario. Or Bruno can rotate with VDB as the no 10 and whoever the wide player is.

 

laughtersassassin

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Would be a humongous upgrade.
Most importantly about those two is it's a pair that makes sense together.

Our biggest issue in my opinion has not been indivuals it's that we make partnerships that make zero sense.

Pogba Matic was the closet we had to one that made sense together but even that was flawed as Matic was on a downward slope fast.
 

Remember the geese

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I'm not a smart man. Can someone kindly explain how FDJ would fit into a high pressing team? I get that he's press resistant but I keep seeing line up examples with him, Fernandes and Fred as a midfield three and it just makes me think that we'd be horribly overrun by quick passing opposition.

I'm guessing we'd need a very active DM for it to work?
Yeah, you're spot on with your last sentence. De Jong is the Thiago. We would still need our Fabinho. Bruno is also very difficult to slot in because ideally you would want to play with three midfielders, not two and a number ten. In my opinion, ten Hag should either mould Bruno into a number 8, like Pep has with De Bruyne, or play him as part of the front three.
 

croadyman

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Yeah, you're spot on with your last sentence. De Jong is the Thiago. We would still need our Fabinho. Bruno is also very difficult to slot in because ideally you would want to play with three midfielders, not two and a number ten. In my opinion, ten Hag should either mould Bruno into a number 8, like Pep has with De Bruyne, or play him as part of the front three.
Yeah he would definitely need a midfield partner but then applies to most players with that style
 

JPRouve

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I'm not a smart man. Can someone kindly explain how FDJ would fit into a high pressing team? I get that he's press resistant but I keep seeing line up examples with him, Fernandes and Fred as a midfield three and it just makes me think that we'd be horribly overrun by quick passing opposition.

I'm guessing we'd need a very active DM for it to work?
He already played in that kind of system for ETH and he had a converted winger as one of his main partner in Schone. And De Jong is defensively sound to the point where he has been used as a CB. On paper Fred is a good fit because he is very active but we could do with an upgrade mainly for technical reasons.
 

Rozay

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Most importantly about those two is it's a pair that makes sense together.

Our biggest issue in my opinion has not been indivuals it's that we make partnerships that make zero sense.

Pogba Matic was the closet we had to one that made sense together but even that was flawed as Matic was on a downward slope fast.
I agree. Phillips and Frenkie makes sense.

I think the best we have had is a Matic - Herrera - Pogba trio. Not used nearly enough for me, but it’s the most balanced we’ve had.
 

ti vu

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I'm not a smart man. Can someone kindly explain how FDJ would fit into a high pressing team? I get that he's press resistant but I keep seeing line up examples with him, Fernandes and Fred as a midfield three and it just makes me think that we'd be horribly overrun by quick passing opposition.

I'm guessing we'd need a very active DM for it to work?
High pressing team means press as an unit. Fred's engine in theory would make him a good fit in a pressing unit. In a long run, Fred is upgradable, but that's a matter for another year. Bruno does not lack in effort, but let's wait and see whether he's coachable enough to fit in. DvB is a back up option if Bruno not working well in that unit. This is all in theory of course.

FdJ is more athletic than stereotype of DLP. He's quite decent ball winner himself. Not quite prime Matic, but IMO better than Fred who is weak physically. He's comparable to Ander Herrera level defensively IMO. He's comfortable slotting into gap in the defensive line when required too. So he's both capable of high pressing, and recovering if the pressing fails.
 
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Holocene

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I agree. Phillips and Frenkie makes sense.

I think the best we have had is a Matic - Herrera - Pogba trio. Not used nearly enough for me, but it’s the most balanced we’ve had.
During Ole's first spell? That's the best our midfield has looked post Fergie.
 

OmarUnited4ever

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So if Barca ‘force him out’, is that the end of his career?
No, his career is not over if Barca force him out, but if he comes here, he must have the resolve and the desire to be at a club that is going through a rebuild.

If not, then it's best for him to go to a stable top European club like Bayern or City.
 

roseguy64

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Don’t worry, our manager is aiming for 2 new midfield. If we sign FDJ, I also expect us to sign another midfield to play next to FDJ. I hope it’s going to be new midfielders of FDJ, new midfield, and VDB. Bruno would be playing wide in my ideal scenario. Or Bruno can rotate with VDB as the no 10 and whoever the wide player is.

You're placing an enormous amount of faith in VDB
 

laughtersassassin

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I will forever and always be convinced that if we had signed Fabinho to play beside Pogba our Midfield issues would not have existed. Midfields are about partnerships and styles that compliment eachother

Get the wrong group together and there is no chance it can work.
 

croadyman

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I'd only want him at the club if he wants to come. If he's coming because Barca are forcing him out, then I don't want him here.
Yeah Erik needs to ascertain that information from his agent, like many have said don't want another Di Maria situation
 

Rozay

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No, his career is not over if Barca force him out, but if he comes here, he must have the resolve and the desire to be at a club that is going through a rebuild.

If not, then it's best for him to go to a stable top European club like Bayern or City.
Well given Barcelona themselves are a club going through a rebuild I’m sure he’ll be fine.
 

croadyman

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I expect we’ll enquire just like all the top clubs, but we’d really need to get him to buy into the project which is gonna be hard because we’re a mess right now, and a big gamble if he has his pick, and he’ll have seen what happened to Pogba too.
Yeah buying into the project is key, he needs to feel from Erik that the midfield will be rebuilt around him.
 

Suv666

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I will forever and always be convinced that if we had signed Fabinho to play beside Pogba our Midfield issues would not have existed. Midfields are about partnerships and styles that compliment eachother

Get the wrong group together and there is no chance it can work.
Yeah spot on.
The individual doesn't matter. Its about how they operate as a unit.
 

laughtersassassin

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Yeah spot on.
The individual doesn't matter. Its about how they operate as a unit.
Exactly. It's why I'm not excited about FDJ if he is our only Midfield signing. Or why I'm not excited about a DM if they are our only signing.

But FDJ and Phillips together sounds to me like a Midfield that should work. They have different attributes that should help control the games in different ways.
 
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