Gündogan vs. Wilshere

RDCR07

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Germany vs England. Given a choice, who would you want to sign for United? Who has more potential? Who is going to be better in the years to come? Both of them are very good in their own right. In my opinion they are two of the biggest CM talents in the world right now.


 

KiD MoYeS

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Wilshere, proven in the Premier League, less likely to feck off if he reaches his potential.
 

Kevin

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Wilshere is injuryprone. And i'm not even sure he is better than gundogan anyway, so the 'german' it is.
 

Sarni

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Gundogan, far more proven, consistent and can actually stay fit.
 

Brightonian

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Wilshere. Gundogan does it in a unit whose team-play, work ethic and coaching are truly phenomenal. There are a couple of fairly average players looking exceptional because of it, and Gundogan is an exceptional player looking even more so. I just don't think he'd shine like this in our backing-off, neither-here-not-there approach to midfielding.

Of course, it's like asking a man dying of hunger if he wants a roast turkey or a roast goose. Either of them would be a phenomenal addition.
 

Minkaro

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Gundogan has nine minutes worth of highlights in his video. Wilshere only has three. Easy decision.
 

RDCR07

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:lol: I couldnt find a good Wilshere video. Too lazy to go through the hundreds of videos to find one.
 

Scrumpet

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I don't think I've seen Gundogan have a bad game, but on the other hand, Wilshere would push Piers Morgan over the edge.
 

KiD MoYeS

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I'm pretty sure Sahin looked more handy than Gündogan before he went to Madrid. I took that into consideration too.
 

Kevin

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We will get neither anyway, still it's ncice to imagine what it's like for that jewish kid to steal a shiny box from the rich normal kids.
 

Sarni

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I'm pretty sure Sahin looked more handy than Gündogan before he went to Madrid. I took that into consideration too.
He didn't. He was good but Gundogan looks like a complete midfielder.
 

Brightonian

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I'm pretty sure Sahin looked more handy than Gündogan before he went to Madrid. I took that into consideration too.
Sahin is a classic example of what I'm talking about. Much more of what a player produces is to do with the team, the coaching, and the management than people think. A lot of Dortmund's players would simply not produce the same level with us, or with any team that doesn't employ that relentless, high-energy game.
 

KiD MoYeS

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He didn't. He was good but Gundogan looks like a complete midfielder.
I seem to remember nearly every Tom, Dick, and Harry drooling over Sahin here before his move to Madrid, certainly a lot more than for Gündogan.
 

KiD MoYeS

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You can all take your lensless glasses, scarves, and dirty trainers off and start saying Wilshere.
 

Joemo

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On the basis that Wilshere is tried and tested in the Premiership, I'd rather have him. I'd obviously love to have Gundogan too, but as other posters have said, I'd be wary that he doesn't benefit from a specially manufactured formation and set-up. That being said, he's already shown in his relatively brief career so far that he has the ability to play anywhere in midfield.

Potential wise I think they're inseparable, both have the ability to be top, top players.
 

Brwned

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I'm pretty sure Sahin looked more handy than Gündogan before he went to Madrid. I took that into consideration too.
Sahin's never looked this good, IMO. Gundogan's the better of the two for me and he's more suited to that deeper role so he'd be ideal in this United side. Wilshere went toe-to-toe with Xavi and co., Gundogan on the other hand was the best player in a midfield that completely overrun Toure, Schweinsteiger and Alonso in the past 12 months alone. They've both got a bit of Scholes about them in the tackle but Gundogan's a natural at dictating the play which is something I wouldn't really say about Wilshere.
 

KiD MoYeS

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Sahin's never looked this good, IMO. Gundogan's the better of the two for me and he's more suited to that deeper role so he'd be ideal in this United side. Wilshere went toe-to-toe with Xavi and co., Gundogan on the other hand was the best player in a midfield that completely overrun Toure, Schweinsteiger and Alonso in the past 12 months alone. They've both got a bit of Scholes about them in the tackle but Gundogan's a natural at dictating the play which is something I wouldn't really say about Wilshere.
I think that's a bit unfair on Wilshere, he has the ability to dictate the play from the centre, definitely.

Anyway, both would be an upgrade on our current midfield options, Carrick aside. But, neither are moving anywhere anytime soon.
 

Sphaero

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Probably around the same amount of talent. Gündogan is probably a little more complete, because he plays an better AM than Wilshere.

The biggest difference between them is simple, though. One is injury prone, the other isn´t.
 

Brightonian

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Sahin's never looked this good, IMO. Gundogan's the better of the two for me and he's more suited to that deeper role so he'd be ideal in this United side. Wilshere went toe-to-toe with Xavi and co., Gundogan on the other hand was the best player in a midfield that completely overrun Toure, Schweinsteiger and Alonso in the past 12 months alone. They've both got a bit of Scholes about them in the tackle but Gundogan's a natural at dictating the play which is something I wouldn't really say about Wilshere.
Wilshere dominated that Barca midfield at the height of its power twice in a row, and also walked all over Brazil this season. City were shit when Dortmund played them this season, and I've rarely seen Madrid look so poor in midfield as today. Ok, they were struggling to cope with Dortmund's tempo, and Gundogan is a big part of that. But as Joemo says, that's entirely the point - he's part of a very specialised system. There's no evidence that he'd do much better once removed from it than Sahin has. (I recognise that he's playing better now than Sahin was, but it doesn't change the point.) Wilshere, on the other hand, has shown he can boss a big game regardless of how his team-mates are playing on plenty of occasions.

Not shitting on Gundogan - I'd love to have him. But Wilshere is still the one, for me.
 

Revan

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Gundogan is and I think will be a better player than Wilshere. Being fit most of the time helps a lot.

Wilshere would very likely suit our style more for obvious reasons.

If I had to pick (assuming that Wilshere will not pick 2 injuries a day) then I would probably go with him - though Gundogan is better - but the nationality and the experience in EPL decides this for me.
 

alastair

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Wilshere didn't dominate the Barcelona midfield once - he played at their standard, which is a great achievement in itself for a then 19 year old.
 

Brightonian

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Just for the rush of it:

Carrick Gundogan
Wilshere
Rooney Kagawa
RVP​

Who the feck needs wingers now, eh?
 

Brightonian

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Wilshere didn't dominate the Barcelona midfield once - he played at their standard, which is a great achievement in itself for a then 19 year old.
Ok, fair enough, dominate is an exaggeration. But if you had to pick the best midfielder from that game, it would have been him. A 19 year old.

Which is another point in his favour, actually. For those saying Gundogan has proven more consistent - he's had two years more than Wilshere to do it in.
 

alastair

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Wilshere has gone a little out of fashion now he's been injured a bit and his form's been a little off. I still feel he's superior to Gundogan, but clearly I see Wilshere in the flesh week in week out, which might make me biased.

I just think Wilshere has that penetrative element to his game that Gundogan doesn't have. The ability to glide past players.
 

alastair

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Ok, fair enough, dominate is an exaggeration. But if you had to pick the best midfielder from that game, it would have been him. A 19 year old.

Which is another point in his favour, actually. For those saying Gundogan has proven more consistent - he's had two years more than Wilshere to do it in.
Yep, agree entirely.
 

Brwned

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That's like saying Xavi is part of a specialised system and might not perform to the same level outside of that. It's true but it's sort of irrelevant because there's an excellent player there anyway. Gundogan's got the better range of passing, he's better defensively and he's said he dreams about United whereas Wilshere says he's a life-long Arsenal fan (except when he supported West Ham for half his life) - I know which one I prefer. Gundogan could be the catalyst for United taking their pressing game up a notch and Kagawa, Welbeck, Rooney, van Persie, Carrick, Rafael, Jones, Evans and co. are all well capable of making that transition.
 

shaggy

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That's like saying Xavi is part of a specialised system and might not perform to the same level outside of that. It's true but it's sort of irrelevant because there's an excellent player there anyway. Gundogan's got the better range of passing, he's better defensively and he's said he dreams about United whereas Wilshere says he's a life-long Arsenal fan (except when he supported West Ham for half his life) - I know which one I prefer. Gundogan could be the catalyst for United taking their pressing game up a notch and Kagawa, Welbeck, Rooney, van Persie, Carrick, Rafael, Jones, Evans and co. are all well capable of making that transition.
Wait, what? Where? :drool:
 

do.ob

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Wilshere dominated that Barca midfield at the height of its power twice in a row, and also walked all over Brazil this season. City were shit when Dortmund played them this season, and I've rarely seen Madrid look so poor in midfield as today. Ok, they were struggling to cope with Dortmund's tempo, and Gundogan is a big part of that. But as Joemo says, that's entirely the point - he's part of a very specialised system. There's no evidence that he'd do much better once removed from it than Sahin has. (I recognise that he's playing better now than Sahin was, but it doesn't change the point.) Wilshere, on the other hand, has shown he can boss a big game regardless of how his team-mates are playing on plenty of occasions.

Not shitting on Gundogan - I'd love to have him. But Wilshere is still the one, for me.
Maybe you should watch his games for Germany?

When Sahin played for Dortmund they were just one of many teams. Teams didn't fear them and were destroyed on the counter. Often Sahin had all the time in the world to play a pass. When Gündogan joined Dortmund they were respected and feared champions. Teams played a lot deeper, making long passes much harder and they began pressing them a lot harder.
 

KiD MoYeS

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That's like saying Xavi is part of a specialised system and might not perform to the same level outside of that. It's true but it's sort of irrelevant because there's an excellent player there anyway. Gundogan's got the better range of passing, he's better defensively and he's said he dreams about United whereas Wilshere says he's a life-long Arsenal fan (except when he supported West Ham for half his life) - I know which one I prefer. Gundogan could be the catalyst for United taking their pressing game up a notch and Kagawa, Welbeck, Rooney, van Persie, Carrick, Rafael, Jones, Evans and co. are all well capable of making that transition.
“I know there was an offer for me,” the player said. “But who put in the offer was of no big interest to me.”

That was on apparent interest for Gündogan from United. I don't think much of these German young players have any interest in moving to England and the Premier League.