The thing is these ex players meet up with other players and the manager when they are going to awards or functions. They cant really slag them off. Neville is a turn off anyway as he spouts on an on about the same thing for ages with that tedious voice just to fill up time on the program, but cant really slag off players and the manager, especially at Utd.
Gary Neville
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
A bunch of naive and clueless individuals in this thread.
It was a simple question that’s why and G.Nev wanted to talk about the birds and bee’s instead of just saying who the flipping Dad was. Like he should really go into politics after football.
As much as i'm loathed to agree with Souness on anything he did have a point. Is Mourinho getting the best out of these players? No he isn't.
Did you miss that disaster in Valencia?
Don't mix punditry and football management. Look at Henry at the moment.
These are two very different fields
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Who? And a follow up question; why doesn't he (whoever he is) do it with 5 more players and earn his club a billion?
Don't want Neville anywhere near Utd.
Firstly, He had one crack at management. Failed miserably, gave up entirely and went back to holding a stylus at Sky Sports.
Secondly, He has this weird belief that managers all untouchable. They can and never should be sacked. Regardless of the situation. I don't know why he keeps defending Mourinho maybe he sees himself getting a job at Utd in the future, I don't know but I always feel like he has an ulterior motive.
Firstly, He had one crack at management. Failed miserably, gave up entirely and went back to holding a stylus at Sky Sports.
Secondly, He has this weird belief that managers all untouchable. They can and never should be sacked. Regardless of the situation. I don't know why he keeps defending Mourinho maybe he sees himself getting a job at Utd in the future, I don't know but I always feel like he has an ulterior motive.
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Serious question, what is the truth? Yeah Mourinho isn't great but we do have a lot of unanswered issues.
I like Gary but he's taken a beating here. When you're coming off all Theresa May to Souness' Paxman, it's time to look in the mirror.
Because he does know that our players have done better in the past. Even if we look at last season.
Yep I'm sorry but Mourinho has basically not improved anyone.
Before Jose:
- Lukaku - Top 3 striker in the prem for the past 3 years before we got him right behind Aguero and Kane
- Pogba - Was in the FIFPro World XI, easily the most exciting midfielder in football
- Martial - 17 goals and 10 assists at 19 in his debut season at United, same return as Rooney's debut year in 2004, when Rooney was considered the best young player in football.
- Rashford - Lighting England and Europe on fire in his first season under Van Gaal
- Sanchez - Arguably the best player in the league in 2016-17
- Lindelof/Bailly - Extremely highly rated young center backs who are now "not good enough" because Jose says so
The reality is it's on the manager to get the best out of players, and Mourinho has some extremely good ones at his disposal who he gets very little out of.
Used to rate this guy highly as a pundit but I just can’t take him seriously anymore when it comes to anything United. He’s always been a bit of a ‘try hard’ when it comes to seeming impartial, often going too far the other way and since being sacked at Valencia he’s become almost dogmatic with the whole back the manager mantra. The blame lies everywhere else but Mourinho it’s fecking ridiculous.
This is literally the first time that Souness has actually made sense. Like finding a gold ring in a lot of bird poop.
But I doubt Neville will get his head out of Mourinho's arse. Maybe he is getting some signals from Carrick or someone that he could be offered a position on the coaching team or something.
Really undermines the Red Nev socialist truth monster image he cultivated during those crybaby years of not singing the national anthem. When it might effect Gaz on a financiopsychosexual level -as when he wouldn't criticise the England players he once coached- he is unconvincingly silent. Carrick is texting him a script dictated by Mourinho's midlife crisis and Gary regurgitates it in that high pitch shrieky panic voice. It stinks.
That said, he's still an excellent watch.
Neville has always been a shit pundit, who tends to dominate discussions with little or no facts.
Chelsea have gone through a range of coaches and have done just fine.
Arsenal have changed their coach of 22yrs and are doing better in terms of quality of play compared to recent times.
Jose has been backed to the hilt compared to Unai and Sarri and they both are playing better.
Just like Mourinho, Neville is stocked in the past and those who believe any word coming out his mouth need to give their head a wobble.
Chelsea have gone through a range of coaches and have done just fine.
Arsenal have changed their coach of 22yrs and are doing better in terms of quality of play compared to recent times.
Jose has been backed to the hilt compared to Unai and Sarri and they both are playing better.
Just like Mourinho, Neville is stocked in the past and those who believe any word coming out his mouth need to give their head a wobble.
People just hate the fact G. Neville does not see things like they do. You have to be pretty naive with a childish hatred of Mourinho, if you think G. Neville has no point in what he stated.
United's issues are deeper than Mourinho. Its truly laughble to believe being more cavalier in the style of play will change much.
United's issues are deeper than Mourinho. Its truly laughble to believe being more cavalier in the style of play will change much.
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Neviller was fair game to use adjectives like Rubbish and Pathetic about Tottenham only last week 
His point is awful is why. Nothing to do with being naive or having a childish hatred of Mourinho.
How is the next manager failing relevant to Mourinho's bad performance? If you believe Mourinho is doing a poor job and the club is going nowhere with him, he needs to get sacked. It's moronic or rather cowardly to stick to guaranteed failure all because you're scared of the unknown. It's also rather defeatist to think that no other manager can do better.
This brings us to Woodward. He's a big reason why we're in this mess. He's slow to sack managers when it's obvious it's going nowhere, he's failed to bring in a DOF, he's had 2 managerial hirings gone wrong, he gives the managers too much power, and he has no vision for what he wants United to be apart from successful. Having said all of this, none of this excuses the fact that the very next manager could fix the on field product right now. Woodward isn't some magical force preventing managers from succeeding at their job. That's on the managers. Woodward being the root cause only means that it's more likely he doesn't fix the problem (which is the right managerial hiring). Woodward being the root cause also only means that if he does get the right hiring, yet none of the issues I pointed out are corrected by him, that he only got lucky with his managerial hiring and ultimately after that manager is gone, that we could be back to square one.
So I don't see how Neville's viewpoint is anything more than a stubborn opinion based on his own philosophy, rather than based on evidence.
Imagine if it was rashford that has just scored in 6 goals in 5 games on a spin... This man and the entire English punditry would be foaming at the mouth praising his name to the high heavens
So you claim....
The managers are changing. Not the results on the pitch. If you cant see the connection I plain pity you....
But that ISN'T what he is arguing for is it? He is simply stating that changing the manager because things are not constantly on an upward trajectory is clearly not proving a solution. Meaning its doubtful a different manager wont face the same challenges Mourinho or his precessors have. To deny it is plain naive.
That is not all he does. He literally threw away a chance this summer to build on our second place finish last season, by refusing to properly strengthening the squad with the targets the coaching staff asked for. Instead he second guessed them and thought himself smarter. Frankly If you cant trust your manager. Freaking sack him. He didnt either. But some hoe its only the manager's fault that the season as a result has gobe to shit....
Magical force? Are you kidding me? Is it 'magic' that numpty refused to upgrade on our experienced center backs, refused to sign a right winger and refused to sign competition for Lukaku? All from list of targets he was given as early as freaking APRIL?
Do people think a defence of Shaw, Lindelof, Smalling and Young would definitely be better under another manager?
What a patronising line coming after a hollow argument.
We've had three managers - it can't be a management issue. Game, set, match folks.
I think we all know the real reason Gary Neville is wedged so far up Mourinho's backside he is almost his puppet.. and that is because Mourinho's agent, Jorge Mendes, is invested in Gary Neville's club Salford United and because they share other interests.
Basically, I'd rather listen to Scholes's shooting straight from the hip than hearing Gary Neville's carefully thought out/PR planned political correct answers constantly like he is the moral god of football/the World.. so much fakery. Tired of the Gary Neville experiment now.. he isn't adapting to the modern football.. just the same tired answers he gave years ago.. nothing new. Give me Carragher anyday.
Gary Neville cares too much about his image, hence why he pretends to be neutral by praising City so much but instead he's actually going too far and alienating the United fan.
Basically, I'd rather listen to Scholes's shooting straight from the hip than hearing Gary Neville's carefully thought out/PR planned political correct answers constantly like he is the moral god of football/the World.. so much fakery. Tired of the Gary Neville experiment now.. he isn't adapting to the modern football.. just the same tired answers he gave years ago.. nothing new. Give me Carragher anyday.
Gary Neville cares too much about his image, hence why he pretends to be neutral by praising City so much but instead he's actually going too far and alienating the United fan.
Exactly, silly to use that argument when Matic, Pogba, Sanchez, Lukaku all played only for Jose and players like Rashford barley played for Van Gaal, Martial was the best player under Van Gaal.What a patronising line coming after a hollow argument.
We've had three managers - it can't be a management issue. Game, set, match folks.
Then we have Bailly and Lindelof who played only for Jose.
He has really become an awful pundit this past year, what’s happened him?
Carragher puts him to shame.
Carragher puts him to shame.
The answer is far more nuanced than “yeah, Jose is shit”.
He agreed on Sanchez at Arsenal. I agreed with him though that some players you’d be mad to expect too much from. We have a lot of average players in our side. You can’t ask Lingard, Rashford, Young, Smalling etc to turn into Brazil 1970 just because you tell them to play a bit more attacking. Those players will play to the level they’ve always played at, i.e not good enough.
Yes. Many of the biggest underperformers didn't even play under LVG. This is how you know Gary is grasping. Arr we dumb enough not to remember who played for which manager? Very unreasoned argument
3 managers of utterly opposing styles have been here since Fergie retired and little has improved results wise and style wise. Meaning the issue lies deeper than a mere manager change. But dont let that get in the way of your mocking routine.......What a patronising line coming after a hollow argument.
We've had three managers - it can't be a management issue. Game, set, match folks.
Great question.
What managers? The hypothetical manager for which we have no proof is going to fail? Or the previous managers plus Mourinho? Assuming the ladder, what do they all have in common? All were risk averse and rather conservative, but with their own spin on things. How does that prove the next manager is going to fail? How are you so certain an attacking manager won't turn things around? You can't just conclude all managers will fail here on out. There is no evidence for that. Have we tried a modern attacking manager in the vein of a Klopp? No. Then how can you conclude every manager is going to fail if we ignore the full spectrum of playing style a manager can provide to a side?
What challenges are these? Mourinho was given a lot of money and power over transfer targets like the previous blokes. This summer was the first time Woodward overrided Mourinho's targets. He failed to turn things around. So because these 3 managers failed after Fergie, automatically the next manager is going to fail? Where is the logic in that? The only logic that hints (note, HINTS) at the next manager failing is that Woodward is in charge of selecting the next manager. All this hint means is that it's more likely that the next manager will fail, not that he will fail. That's an important distinction to make. Therefore, it makes all the sense in the world to sack Mourinho and hope the buffoon lucks into a proper hire or that he hires a DOF to take over that flaw. None of this means Mourinho should be given more time though.
He should have been sacked. It was clear it was going nowhere and 2nd place was fool's gold. All the stats pointed towards United being awful in attack, awful in defense, and his transfer record was awful. On top of this, he failed to achieve the bare minimum which was get United to actually be competent at what he used to be famous for, counter attacks. This is why many fans constantly ask the question, "What exactly are United under Mourinho good at?"
Now, I remember the cultists telling me that 2nd place proved it was fine and that the points were all that mattered. The stats that pointed towards a bad side were ignored and then followed that up with complaining about our defense being awful. Now that is is just an extra bit of context for this mourinho debate, but one that has to be said I feel.
Woodward is not the direct cause of Mourinho's failings. Whose fault is it that United had a horrible defense after last season? Mourinho. He bought two CBs and he clearly didn't fancy them. Now this is where you point out how United's defense was good due to the goals conceded stat right? Well then that contradicts the need for another CB and the moaning Mourinho had that he needed more money. Unless of course the goals conceded was all due to the genius of Mourinho getting the maximum out of our joke defense. Oh wait, we had de Gea bailing us out last season and once again, the stat that points towards United giving up the most chances of all the top 6 sides flattens that argument.
Whose fault was it that our players were out of confidence? Mourinho. Whose fault was it for starting the season with negativity and disrupting the locker room? Mourinho. Whose fault was it to play favorites to the detriment of the team? Mourinho.
How much money have Liverpool spent? Roughly the same as United and look where they're at. The money argument is frankly tiring as it does not excuse his bad managerial performance. There's a good chance we end up in a better position than Spurs this season, but right now they're 7 points ahead of us. How much money did they spend this summer? Zero. Not even a Dalot or Fred.
Everywhere we look, it points to failure under Mourinho. I lowered the bar for his initial hiring which was to challenge for the biggest titles in the short term. He failed to do that and failed to show us United fans he's building towards something great. That's on Mourinho, not Woodward.
Now I have plenty negative words for how inept Woodward is. That's a different discussion and does not absolve any blame from Mourinho, nor does it validate Gary's argument that Mourinho should be given more time. There is no reason to persist with guaranteed failure/mediocrity.
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Yes. The right manager would get the team pressing from the front and defending in packs of two or threes, similar to what Klopp did at Liverpool prior to the arrival of Van Dijk. Liverpool and United’s defence were at a similar level. Mourinho creates pressure on a vulnerable defence by defending deep and inviting teams to attack.
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Yes, because the new manager won't be clueless enough to still play defensive football with the likes of those
?
So what?
So if we had appointed three managers from the Championship that had different management styles, without seeing improvement, you'd think management ability was irrelevant to solving the problem. I mean that's your logic.
Why is three the magic number to people like you? Is it impossible to pick the wrong manager three times? It clearly isn't.
You haven't demonstrated how the management/coaching of the team isn't the main issue facing the club performance right now. It's a crap argument thus far with little substance.
And don't get fecking pissy for someone pointing out you're being a patronising git without a strong argument to back it up.
No but Shaw Lindelof Bailly and Dalot would be.
Its something that happens constantly. Just this season alone in the PL Sarri has replaced Conte and Emery has replaced Wenger. They both like to play with very different styles from the men they replaced and yet we very quickly start to see the impact they have had on the training pitch.
Are Moyes, LVG and Mourinho FM regens?
That is untrue. Moyes was never risk averse. Ever. At most he was tactically clueless as that infamous Fulham game with record crosses shows.
LVG was possesion obsessed and regimented. Determined to 'cerebralize' our football which unfortunatrly after a false daen turnes it sterile.
Mourinho has always been a transition manager. Like LVG he had a false dawn.
3 utterly different managers. Same results in terms of the football produced on pitch and results. It ceases being a coincedence when it gets to 3.....
3 managers of entirely opposing styles have failed and you think hiring a 4th will magically change things? That is what Einstein reffered to repeating the same experiement over and over expecting diferent results.
Because the issues lengthening our decline are more than just the manager in charge. If you are fine with United changing manager after manager in the vain hope one will click thats on you. Some of us dont want our club to be the next Inter. Even a Chelsea change managers with a clear plan in mind. We dont have any.
I want firm decision making at the top and a clear long term plan. Not this bullshit of refusing to back a manager whilst not firing him. Not hiring managers whose footballing identity is similar to foster long term squad and playing style harmony. Nor reacting to whatever City or Pool do with their Bosses rather than having a clear 5 year plan as to where we want United to go. Be it driven by a chairman or a DOF.
Its your fault alone that you can't understand 3 managers of opposing styles getting similar results, with a similar group of players largely points to it meaning another manager change wont pull up any trees. To deny that completely is exactly the naivety I reffered to earlier.
Are you kidding me?
He hasnt been given free reign to sign every target he has asked for in ANY window since he arrived.
He hasnt been allowed to upgrade on poorer players in his squad like Jones nor Darmian for example nor to sell them.
He inherited a squad with a dead right flank, no holding players, no right winger and no conpetition at center forward. Yet He hasnt been allowed to invest freely in those areas.
When he signs a player and it doesnt work out for whatever reason it is used as a stick to beat him and an excuse to deny him funds. Whilst he can see a Pep sign Bravo he fails, then uupgrade to Ederson without so much as a blink. Going from Nolito to Mahrez is another example. Even Klopp went from Karius to Alisson and Klavan to Van Dijk and never got second guessed by his board.
Ironically those are some of the things the departed LVG has since moaned about and oh how we laughed. But are we still lauhghing?
I fail to see how the next manager will face anything different with the same structure in place and no long term direction for the club for a manager to fit into.
Really? It was Mourinho's fault that a team with clear weaknesses in defence, forced to rely on Bailly's inexperienced and brittle body, De Gea's brilliance, and cagey football to protect that defence finished 2nd, with one of the best defensive records in the league, due to the cageyness, rather than a credit to him?
And its now HIS fault that suddenly that same defence got exposed defensively this season when even the slightest amount of open football was attempted after a summer of ZERO EFFORT to upgrade the defensive personnel, plus the departure of Blind who helped hide them flaws some what, never being replaced?
How does that work exactly?
This is the kinda stupid argument that gets my goat. Bailly and Lindeloff were bought for the future! Not the now! The CBS that NEED upgrading are the experienced ones. Namely the shit Jones, the painfully average Smalling and the injury prone Rojo! Those are the CB'S he SORT to upgrade on in the summer. NOT because he 'doesn't fancy Bailly or Lindeloff'.
Only if you havent paid aattention to a single thing I posted earlier till now....
You think its mere ' confidence' that makes the likes of Jones, Valencia, Damian or Smalling average to shit at their jobs? This is the naivety I talked about....
More naivety. You seriously think 'mere postivity' would have granted Bailly and Lindeloff the requisite experience to be flawless leaders of our defence? That mere 'postivity' would have stopped Jones fecking up a ggood performance vs Spurs? That its 'lack of positivity' that had us exposed vs Brightonfor example?
Come on
....
I marvel how JM is glibly accused of 'playing favorites'. For example with a Matic. Who has literally been the ONLY fit natural holding player for the longest spell this season.
Alternatives like McTominay, Herrera and the in form Fellaini have all been injured for a month or more. Whilst Pereira, is not only NOT a natural in the role, his last outing was a night mare and to his detriment, our team results went so far down hill since then to make it close to fool hardy to risk him in the role in recent times.
This is a lie. Liverpool and City both have by FAR outstripped or spending on defence. The one department that wins you league titles. Its is thus no suorise where they are whilst we are floundering with a goal difference of negative 1!
And did they have squad isssues like no decent right back, no single quality experienced center halves and no tight sided attackers when they decided to not spend?
There are honestly few things dumber than trying to liken our situation to Spurs'. For us failure to spend was footballing suicide. For Spurs it was just financial sense.
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The only thing Emery doesnt have in common with Wenger is the aggession in pressing. He is pretty much similar in every other aspect.
As for Chelsea, they have built the perfect squad for literally ANY manager to suceed. Their recent bosses have only failed due to player revolts. We are nothing like them. Our squad has holes we refuse to address yet some how some of our fans and our misguided chairman imagine constant changes of managerial direction will miraculously yield different results. Its baffling.
No child. That is YOURS alone!
You simply DONT GET IT do you?
If you've picked wrong thrice whilst changing philsophy and style each time? What would stop you picking wrong 4 and 5 times?
Beyond you actually making an effort to FIX why you pick and sign wrong in the first place?
No sir. Its YOU who hasnt been paying ANY attention to what I nor G. Neville actually said. We are not responsible for what you choose to overlook. Thats on you.....
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Pissy? You are the one being pissy without a leg to stand on. Eagerly mocking what you never understood in the first place. Which is your fault entirely and its not being pissy nor patronizing to point it out.
A actually think if it had not been for Neville's rant before the Newcastle game, Jose would have been away no matter what the result was that day. Neville couldn't answer the question that Souness asked because he couldn't contradict what he's been saying for ages. he will no deep down Jose aint the man for here but just wont admit it in public.
After three seasons, I think better managers would not still have that defence and not be in the business of offering outrageous contract extensions to the likes of Shaw and another 1 year extension to Young. The manager is to blame for the so-called 'state of that defence'.