German Football 22/23 | 2. Bundesliga returns | Hamburg vs Schalke 20:30 |

uamini

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Musiala + an injury-free Wirtz would have been exciting to watch at the World Cup...
 

B20

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What position did Mane play?
 

jadajos

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I like what I've seen so far:D

They're the reigning EL champions. Maybe we're just a bit good tonight
Yes Bayern has a great team. But the rest of the league hasn’t been on the same level for a decade and it’s getting worse and worse. Hockey scores regularly. It’s why I stopped watching years ago - and I’m German. Don’t even watch highlights anymore except 2-3 times a year.

I grew up watching Bundesliga in the 90ies, Bayern were obviously mostly winning then, too. But nowadays it’s on a new level entirely. I think it’s quite unhealthy for the league. I can imagine many young German fans that don’t have a team in their city where they go to the stadium will turn to the EPL.
 

Blackwidow

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The weather conditions in Wolfsburg must be unbearable. Werder leads 2:1 there.

Union leads 1:0 against Big City.

10-man Hoffenheim leads 1:0 in Gladbach.
 

bucky

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Really poor first half between Gladbach and Hoffenheim. Very laborous and a lack of intensity. 1-1.
 

arthurka

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Grifo is probably if not the best free kick specialist in top flight football, what an absolute screamer.

How they manage to get these players up and running, Gregoritsch is just slotting right in there.
 
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do.ob

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Hradecky


Damn refs never told him he must not grab the ball outside the box.
 
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Tacitus56AD

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Bild seems to be reporting that Nico Schulz is accused of domestic violence.(Typical Bild, hiding it behind the paywall :rolleyes:)
Some harsh details in this story.
 

arthurka

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Damn refs never told him he must not grab the ball outside the box.
CM's also stopped Leverkusen from scoring a goal in the first half. It's all about the MM's and CM's. I can understand their frustration.
 

Acrobat7

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Bild seems to be reporting that Nico Schulz is accused of domestic violence.(Typical Bild, hiding it behind the paywall :rolleyes:)
Some harsh details in this story.
I saw a screenshot of his alleged Whatsapp conversation on Twitter and he is done if(!) that is the truth.
 

do.ob

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CM's also stopped Leverkusen from scoring a goal in the first half. It's all about the MM's and CM's. I can understand their frustration.
I mean Hradecky basically scored an own goal in the first half and then got himself sent off, because he lost track of his box. It wasn't fine margin for him personally.

I saw a screenshot of his alleged Whatsapp conversation on Twitter and he is done if(!) that is the truth.

It looks pretty damming. He was already cut out for sporting reasons before this, so there isn't much more Dortmund can do, aside from potentially terminating his contract if he gets convicted, but I hope the authorities do this one diligently.
 
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Tacitus56AD

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It looks pretty damming. He was already cut out for sporting reasons before this, so there isn't much more Dortmund can do, aside from potentially terminating his contract if he gets convicted, but I hope the authorities do this one diligently.
This allegedly happened in 2020. His house has been searched etc. Maybe Dortmund knew a bit more about this and it is not just a coincidence that he was cut.
 

uamini

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Several sources are now reporting that Dortmund is about to bring in Modeste as a Haller replacement.

This is going to be a difficult season for Köln...
 

do.ob

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Total verbal agreement. Here we go. True.

Not sure what to think about it: on one hand you can't argue againt signing someone who scored 20 goals last season, a lot of them with his head, for next to nothing. On the other hand I'm not sure if the rest of his game is good enough.




What a heart breaking return to Bundesliga for Schalke. Three VAR checks against them and it's still 30 minutes to go.
 
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verycute

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Amazing first Game. Feels like how it always feels being Schalke in the Bundesliga


Regular Goal disallowed.a totally wrong Red Card and then conceding a Goal after a Corner that wasnt one

My Hate for the VAR does not get smaller seeing this :D
 

stefan92

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Amazing first Game. Feels like how it always feels being Schalke in the Bundesliga


Regular Goal disallowed.a totally wrong Red Card and then conceding a Goal after a Corner that wasnt one

My Hate for the VAR does not get smaller seeing this :D
Stop crying. I'm not sure about the corner (haven't seen it), but the other two decisions you mentioned were absolutely correct I think. Crying about the ref after such a one sided game is understandable, but apart from the first minutes and few other situations Cologne was in full control, visibly and statistically. 75% possession and 32-5 shots are quite damning stats against Schalke, Cologne even played four times as many successful passes than Schalke. The 3-1 result is absolutely fair I think, actually I think you got lucky that it wasn't even worse (xGoals was 4.6 - 0.38). Obviously it became much more one sided after the red card, I give you that, but as it was given for a stupid action I think it's something you have to live with.
 

do.ob

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Amazing first Game. Feels like how it always feels being Schalke in the Bundesliga


Regular Goal disallowed.a totally wrong Red Card and then conceding a Goal after a Corner that wasnt one

My Hate for the VAR does not get smaller seeing this :D

15 years later and it's still as spot on as ever.
 

do.ob

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Some good news for Gladbach.
 
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uamini

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Stuttgart fans showing us what good hosts traditional clubs are when they have Leipzig as a guest...nevermind that this is taking place in a stadium called Mercedes-Benz Arena.
Is this going to lead to a fine or would you say it's harmless? Covid kinda ended that discussion about what you're allowed to say in a Bundesliga stadium...I wonder how things would have continued after that weird Bayern vs. Hopp game.
 

Hansi Fick

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Stuttgart fans showing us what good hosts traditional clubs are when they have Leipzig as a guest...nevermind that this is taking place in a stadium originally called Mercedes-Benz Arena Adolf-Hitler-Kampfbahn.
Is this going to lead to a fine or would you say it's harmless? Covid kinda ended that discussion about what you're allowed to say in a Bundesliga stadium...I wonder how things would have continued after that weird Bayern vs. Hopp game.
Fixed it for you. "A proud curve full of history" indeed.
 

do.ob

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Stuttgart fans showing us what good hosts traditional clubs are when they have Leipzig as a guest...nevermind that this is taking place in a stadium called Mercedes-Benz Arena.
Is this going to lead to a fine or would you say it's harmless? Covid kinda ended that discussion about what you're allowed to say in a Bundesliga stadium...I wonder how things would have continued after that weird Bayern vs. Hopp game.
I guess we can debate whether the vocabulary of the ultras needs adjustment, though there are actually arguments for and against that. But I don't see why fans should stop protesting this little project, just because the media has been bought off or doesn't want to hurt the product.

Case in point the Hopp incident you're referencing, which apparently was known in advance by the clubs, but milked for sympathy regardless, among other things by evoking racism protocols to protect the fragile ego of a billionaire.

https://www.sport1.de/news/fussball...ussten-bescheid-hopp-skandal-teils-inszeniert
 

Zehner

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I find it amazing that all those ultra groups that of supposedly rather young people are so obsessed with tradition. Probably want nothing to do with it in other aspects of their life.
 

Blackwidow

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I guess we can debate whether the vocabulary of the ultras needs adjustment, though there are actually arguments for and against that. But I don't see why fans should stop protesting this little project, just because the media has been bought off or doesn't want to hurt the product.

Case in point the Hopp incident you're referencing, which apparently was known in advance by the clubs, but milked for sympathy regardless, among other things by evoking racism protocols to protect the fragile ego of a billionaire.

https://www.sport1.de/news/fussball...ussten-bescheid-hopp-skandal-teils-inszeniert
For me that is different. With Red Bull (even if owned by Mateschitz) it is against a corporation and not a single person that got targeted...
 

do.ob

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For me that is different. With Red Bull (even if owned by Mateschitz) it is against a corporation and not a single person that got targeted...
Well, besides the fact that one is owned by a corporation and one by a private person, which you pointed out yourself, Hopp also used Hoffenheim to have journalists fawn over what a great guy he is, just like when he saved the day with his Corona vaccine out of the kindness of his heart. Whereas Mateschitz seems to enjoy taking a back seat and buying up media companies to do the talking or spreading of far right ideology.

I find it amazing that all those ultra groups that of supposedly rather young people are so obsessed with tradition. Probably want nothing to do with it in other aspects of their life.
It's not that mind-blowing if you look past the literal word and how it's interpreted: e.g. the "tradition" of football as an affordable sport for the people, that brings together people of all ages and backgrounds.
 

Skills

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Safe to say Bayern have found their next president
 

unplayable

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I wonder who Frankfurt will sign to replace Kostic? Not many names are popping up in my head. Maybe they will even change their system to a back four, but that would be weird given the season has already started and they almost always played with wing backs last season.
 

do.ob

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I wonder who Frankfurt will sign to replace Kostic? Not many names are popping up in my head. Maybe they will even change their system to a back four, but that would be weird given the season has already started and they almost always played with wing backs last season.
Switching the system seems very unpractical at this point: first of all they did all their prep with Kostic, so I'm assuming in some back three variant. And if you look at their squad they have 5 CBs (though N'Dicka could also still be sold) and 3 central strikers, but no proper LB or RB.

I read the name Philipp Max in connection with other clubs a few times, though I'm not sure he'd be good enough. Stuttgart's Sosa could probably still be sold, but he'd probably be too expensive for Frankfurt. Bensebaini has that Frankfurt thuggishness, but I don't think he's a wing back.

In the end they'll probably sign some guy most of us have never heard of and try toshift that "just do your thing" free role from Kostic to Götze.
 

Zehner

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It's not that mind-blowing if you look past the literal word and how it's interpreted: e.g. the "tradition" of football as an affordable sport for the people, that brings together people of all ages and backgrounds.
For someone with such a critical mind, you're surprisingly romantic and protective of ultra culture ;)
 

do.ob

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For someone with such a critical mind, you're surprisingly romantic and protective of ultra culture ;)
I'm fully aware that Ultras do plenty of bad things as well, but it's the Ultras/organized fans who among other things:
-made sure ticket prices stay down
-create the atmosphere in the stadiums
-made sure that terrible kick-off times like Monday night games got scrapped
-made sure some clubs (e.g.) Dortmund don't play their pre season in Saudi Arabia
-lead the opposition against would be strong men like Kind or Tönnies
-keep reminding everyone about the integrity of the competition with regards to Rasenball and other constructs
 

Zehner

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I'm fully aware that Ultras do plenty of bad things as well, but it's the Ultras/organized fans who among other things:
-made sure ticket prices stay down
-create the atmosphere in the stadiums
-made sure that terrible kick-off times like Monday night games got scrapped
-made sure some clubs (e.g.) Dortmund don't play their pre season in Saudi Arabia
-lead the opposition against would be strong men like Kind or Tönnies
-keep reminding everyone about the integrity of the competition with regards to Rasenball and other constructs
And among other things, ultras are usually behind insults, threats, violence and the usage of illegal pyros. They alone keep many families from bringing children to stadiums, especially at "high risk matches"´, and contribute greatly to football's (and its fans') unpopularity among huge parts of the society. The sport for everybody, indeed.

The idea that those who regularly feel entitled to break the law because they deem their hobby more important than the health of other people protect the "integrity" of the sport against clubs who haven't done anything illegal is a bit ironic. What do you mean with "integrity"?
 

do.ob

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And among other things, ultras are usually behind insults, threats, violence and the usage of illegal pyros. They alone keep many families from bringing children to stadiums, especially at "high risk matches"´, and contribute greatly to football's (and its fans') unpopularity among huge parts of the society. The sport for everybody, indeed.

The idea that those who regularly feel entitled to break the law because they deem their hobby more important than the health of other people protect the "integrity" of the sport against clubs who haven't done anything illegal is a bit ironic. What do you mean with "integrity"?
Like I said there's also plenty of things I don't agree with and privilege and entitlement or emotion and excess are two sides of the the same respective coins.

But Pyro? Everyone seems more than happy to use the images for marketing, clubs seem happy to pay the fines, but during the live moment people act like someone got stabbed and of course there's the mandatory "terrible images.. these people are idiots .. not fans.." . I don't need it and I think the insistence on it is childish, but there is something very dishonest about how it gets discussed.

Violence? Police statistics put the number of injured people usually at around 1200 per year, that includes every game played in every competition by the 68 clubs of the first two divisions, plus Germany games. At the last Oktoberfest 6500 people needed medical attention.

And I don't know what goes on in Leverkusen, once the massive crowds really get cooking, but I see a ton of women and children at football games, I see old and young people and I've never had reason to fear for my safety. Would I take a kid into the ultra block? Definitely not, but there's still the entire rest of the stadium. According to Statista 50 million FIFTY MILLION consider themselves football fans in Germany and you write "unpopularity among huge parts of the society. The sport for everyone indeed".

So yes, I think the positives of organized fans, some of which I listed above, far outweigh the negatives.