Germany have no stars

OutlawGER

Full Member
Joined
May 25, 2012
Messages
3,635
Location
Cologne
Supports
Bayern München, 1. FC Köln
This clichee is annoying me for a very long time now. Always the same sentences "Germany have no stars, no outstanding players, but they are strong as a TEAM and have a great mentality", etc.
It is true, we are strong as a team! But to think that our players get restricted to this properties (not by everyone though) is kinda disrespectful imo.

Of course, we have no Messi, no Ronaldo and no Robben. But only 3 teams in the world have them.


But let me start individually.

GK - Neuer
By far the best keeper in the world. No doubt about that. I wouldn't go as far yet, but some are already claiming that he could be the best of all time.

CB - Hummels, Boateng, Mertesacker, (Badstuber!)
The Hummels and Boateng pairing was the best CB pairing in this whole tournament. Hummels is playing at the very highest level constantly for BVB, and Boateng doing the same for Bayern. His performance vs Argentina was sensational. Mertesacker is doing well for Arsenal and not even mentioning Badstuber, who was the #1 CB for both Germany and Bayern before his injury. How are they no 'stars' at their position? Are the likes of David Luiz really better?! I doubt that.

FB - Lahm
Together with ST our weakest position. But still: Lahm is easily the best RB in the world for quite some years, captain from both Bayern and Germany. Aside from the EUROs, he has won everything possible now as a captain.

CM - Schweinsteiger, Kroos, Khedira, (Gündogan, many decent players and talents like Kramer, Benders, etc.)
Schweinsteiger is a legend. Not only after winning the WC. Kroos is just 24 years old, probably the biggest prospect in the world at his position and his age. Khedira earns a lot of critismn but still there are reasons why he is playing regularly for both Germany and Real Madrid.

Wings - Reus, Schürrle, Podolski
Okay, Schürrle and Poldolski are decent but no real stars. But what about Reus? He was injured though so he maybe does not count. But still, i think he is potentially one of the VERY best players in the world. He even has flair. :eek:


CAM - Özil, Götze, Müller
Now im beeing serious. Neymar and Götze were called the 2 biggest talents in the world last year (maybe together with Hazard) before they moved to Bayern and Barca. I think everyone will agree on this one. I remember a lot of people saying in this forum that they rate Götze higher than Neymar. And they had obvious reasons for that opinion. Götze is playing on the very highest stage since he's 18. He won titles with BVB and played Champions League football as a keyplayer at the age of 20,21. He has proven himself for years already in the european elite even though he is just 22 (same as Neymar and James).
He had a very tough first season for Bayern, playing out of position and beeing injured when the season started. Neymar had almost the same tough season for Barca. And i believe you can excuse both of them. Playing the very first season for 2 of the best teams in the world for a player at this age is really tough. I think both of them could and should explode in the next few years.

But now my question(s):
Why is Neymar seen as a worldwide superstar and Götze not?
What has Neymar done in his career?
What has Götze done in his career?
Think about it.

I think the only thing what Neymar has done better than Götze is his promotion. He is doing commercials all over the world. Because of that he is more popular and well better known. But what has that to do with football? Are we groupies or football fans? Especially now, after Götze beeing a fecking legend scoring the winner in a WC final, Neymar shouldn't even be seen anywhere near him.

And still, the 'experts' and pundits would say "Brazil have Neymar, Germany have no star". wtf?!

I don't even want to start about Müller. How could some argue that he's not a superstar? He has won everything, is just 24, and easily one of the best players in the world. And not only because of his intelligence, workrate, finishing, mentality and positioning, even his pace, passing and dribbling is extremly strong even though it doesn't look(!) like magic. Some are now taking him into the "WC player" bracket like Klose. But what about his CL and Bundesliga archievements?

I think the problem from the german players in that case is that they don't think it is necessary to make promotion all over the world. They have no flair, are not from the south, not handsome enough for some people and they are natural. Most of them just stay in their homecountry and just do what is necessary.


But how could people really argue that we have no stars?
Why only the popular players get rated? Messi player of the tournament says it all. Ronaldo 3rd? If its true: :lol::lol::lol:


So, what do you think about this theory:
Germany have no outstanding player, because almost everyone is outstanding. Not only as a team, but individually.

And why are german players not as popular as others? Just because of commercials and flair?

PS.: Sorry maybe this is the wrong forum. If so, you can move it to the football forum.
 
Last edited:

Batrider

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Aug 6, 2013
Messages
379
Said noone ever

They are probably a bit more then the sum of their parts, but frankly, they have crazy good players that would walk into virtually any team in the world.
 

VorZakone

What would Kenny G do?
Joined
May 9, 2013
Messages
19,585
Yeah, it's nonsense. Germany's team just oozes quality, just look at those players damn.
 

Ducklegs

Part of first caf team to complete Destiny raid
Joined
Jun 17, 2011
Messages
8,737
Who says Germany have no stars?

They have a team packed full of players that would walk into any side at club or national level world wide.

If what people mean is, they don't have a team packed with media limelight whoring bellends, then yes I would agree with them.
 

OutlawGER

Full Member
Joined
May 25, 2012
Messages
3,635
Location
Cologne
Supports
Bayern München, 1. FC Köln
Who says Germany have no stars?

They have a team packed full of players that would walk into any side at club or national level world wide.

If what people mean is, they don't have a team packed with media limelight whoring bellends, then yes I would agree with them.
For example, David Beckham.
 

Cina

full member
Joined
Aug 10, 2007
Messages
50,871
I didn't even know that cliché existed?

Of course they have stars, their team is outrageous. They don't have a Messi but they have around 7-8 players amongst the best in the world in their position.
 

TheShedEnd

Anti-Football WUM
Joined
Dec 28, 2013
Messages
2,031
Supports
Chelsea
Sorry, since when did Neuer become 'far better' than Courtois? His sucidial sweeper keeper tactics could and should have left him with egg on his face in this tournament.
 

legolegs

duploarms
Joined
Mar 17, 2014
Messages
1,110
Location
Munich
Supports
Ajax
Well tbh I think people don't want to say that Germany has no star at all but that they don't have one big superstar player who's clearly above the rest.
 

Cina

full member
Joined
Aug 10, 2007
Messages
50,871
Well tbh I think people don't want to say that Germany has no star at all but that they don't have one big superstar player who's clearly above the rest.
Well yeah but they only don't have one who's above the rest because their entire team is so good.

Also, Reus probably fits that category. Shame he was injured.
 

Kostur

海尔的老板
Joined
Mar 8, 2012
Messages
28,759
Location
Poland, Kraków
Sorry, since when did Neuer become 'far better' than Courtois? His sucidial sweeper keeper tactics could and should have left him with egg on his face in this tournament.
But they didn't.

At the moment he is the best keeper in the world and it's not down to this WC. He was one before it too.

And I absolutely detest him.
 

legolegs

duploarms
Joined
Mar 17, 2014
Messages
1,110
Location
Munich
Supports
Ajax
Well yeah but they only don't have one who's above the rest because their entire team is so good.

Also, Reus probably fits that category. Shame he was injured.
I know. I think people are just using the wrong words when they say stuff like that. I don't think they really believe Germany has no stars.

Don't know if Reus can be the most outstanding player. He certainly is absurdly talented but he has a lot of competition.
 

OutlawGER

Full Member
Joined
May 25, 2012
Messages
3,635
Location
Cologne
Supports
Bayern München, 1. FC Köln
Sorry, since when did Neuer become 'far better' than Courtois? His sucidial sweeper keeper tactics could and should have left him with egg on his face in this tournament.
Become? Was there ever a competition between Neuer and Courtois? :confused:
 

Balu

Full Member
Joined
Dec 2, 2010
Messages
15,102
Location
Munich
Supports
Bayern Munich
Am I the only one who understood Beckham's comments differently and actually think that it was a fairly reasonable statement to say, Germany have no particular star while Argentina have Messi? To me it sounded like he meant, we don't rely on a single individual as much as Argentina does which is simply true. Don't think he meant, we don't have top top players at all.
 

Dirty Schwein

Has a 'Best of Britney Spears' album
Joined
Feb 6, 2012
Messages
12,808
Location
The Infirmary
A lot of TV "pundits" and "experts" do say Germany have no stars, but are a better team. But clearly, we all know most of these bellends don't know their knees from their elbows.
 

talkin2me

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Mar 31, 2010
Messages
8
Location
Land of the Autobahn...and beer
Am I the only one who understood Beckham's comments differently and actually think that it was a fairly reasonable statement to say, Germany have no particular star while Argentina have Messi? To me it sounded like he meant, we don't rely on a single individual as much as Argentina does which is simply true. Don't think he meant, we don't have top top players at all.
That's exactly how I understood it as well. People hear what they wanna hear, I guess, but I thought he meant it as a compliment.
No main go-to-guy, unpredictable, responsibilities on many shoulders, no divas, etc...
 

OutlawGER

Full Member
Joined
May 25, 2012
Messages
3,635
Location
Cologne
Supports
Bayern München, 1. FC Köln
That's exactly how I understood it as well. People hear what they wanna hear, I guess, but I thought he meant it as a compliment.
No main go-to-guy, unpredictable, responsibilities on many shoulders, no divas, etc...
As Dirty Schwein said already. A lof of pundits and experts are saying that. And a lot of fans too. Beckham was just an current example.
 

Lynk

Obsessed with discrediting Danny Welbeck
Joined
Aug 28, 2009
Messages
14,976
Perhaps it's good they have no "stars". Hype and pressure destroys players at international level see Rooney, Ronaldo, Raul and Messi. Spain won in 2010 with no talisman either.
 

OutlawGER

Full Member
Joined
May 25, 2012
Messages
3,635
Location
Cologne
Supports
Bayern München, 1. FC Köln
Perhaps it's good they have no "stars". Hype and pressure destroys players at international level see Rooney, Ronaldo, Raul and Messi. Spain won in 2010 with no talisman either.
Spain is a good shout. Iniesta and Xavi really didn't get the praise they've deserved. They were the main reason why Barca dominated Europe, not Messi. They have proven that with Spain.
 

TheShedEnd

Anti-Football WUM
Joined
Dec 28, 2013
Messages
2,031
Supports
Chelsea
Spain is a good shout. Iniesta and Xavi really didn't get the praise they've deserved. They were the main reason why Barca dominated Europe, not Messi. They have proven that with Spain.
:houllier:
 

Golden Nugget

Full Member
Joined
May 7, 2011
Messages
1,665
The way I see it, it's not meant as an offensive term - rather than a term that praises the current German team. My understanding of a star player is the team's go to man - the Messi's, the Ronaldo's, Robben's, Bale's.... So for example, the star player for United would have been Rooney in the past - does that mean he would walk into the German side because he is a star? Most probably not.

This is just my my take of it, but say for example, Netherlands, by marking their star player Robben, even though they have other impressive players like van Persie and Sneijder, if you mark Robben out of the game, Netherlands lose half their effectiveness. From where I see it, there isn't a single player that you would be able to mark out of the German team, as they don't have one go to man for their attacks - they have a lot. The team is well balanced throughout the attack and if Reus was here as well, it would have only been better.
 

anchan1989

New Member
Joined
Sep 26, 2013
Messages
1,503
Location
Germany
To be fair QutlawGER; that theory lives mostly in the heads of old England guys, often true Haters.
Most of the world knows that we are a superpower with great players. Even in the 2000s (our "bad" time)Kahn and Ballack were superstars.
I learned that years ago; some guys(mostly old English ones) are talking bull about the Nationalmannschaft.

P.S. I like Becks. I agree with Balu. Hope that he meant it in a good way aka "they share between great players".
 

Gorefest

Full Member
Joined
Jun 2, 2014
Messages
180
Location
Sheffield
For example, David Beckham.
Don't think that is what he meant at all. He most likely meant that Germany did not have one outstanding performer in their ranks. Countries like Brazil, Argentina and Holland were dependent on one or two exceptional individuals to pull the rest through, whereas Germany had quality all around and was not reliant on one or two players to pull them through. Which is why they were in a class of their own (well, maybe with Chile) and are probably here to stay for quite some time (which is a tough thing for a Dutchman to say, but there you have it).
 

pk05

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Jun 28, 2014
Messages
82
Germany is a team full of world class players and they even won the tournament by being the most balanced and consistent performers with some of their key players injured before and during the tourny.kudos germany.Worthy champions and the best part is that they didn't have to rely on a particular individual,each and every one of the german team have put their best foot forward.Well done.:)
 

talkin2me

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Mar 31, 2010
Messages
8
Location
Land of the Autobahn...and beer
As Dirty Schwein said already. A lof of pundits and experts are saying that. And a lot of fans too. Beckham was just an current example.
But then again, the term 'star' is so subjective. You can't argue for or against a pundits opinion unless you know what his definition of 'star' is.
To me, a star is a player that is amongst the 3-5 best players in their position. So we've got at least two stars in Neuer and Lahm, and arguably Schweinsteiger and Hummels as well.

To others, a star player may only be a top flair player in the bracket of Messi, CR7, J. Rodriguez, Robben, etc. and our two only flair players (Özil and Götze) had both underwhelming seasons and an average WC.
So yeah, one could argue Germany had no 'stars' at the WC, by that logic.
 

Joemo

whistling in the wind
Joined
Feb 27, 2012
Messages
8,343
You've clearly missed Beckham's point. What he was trying to say, and actually I thought it was quite clear, is that there's no talisman for Germany and that it seems like every player pulls their weight and is capable of winning the match.

You look at that Germany team and there's no real "star" to their team. You have Neuer, Schweinsteiger and Lahm who you could argue are the best in the world in their position but apart from that it's just a group of extremely good players without having a real superstar. Whereas with Brazil, Neymar is clearly their star player, likewise for Ronaldo, Messi, Robben/RVP.
 

OutlawGER

Full Member
Joined
May 25, 2012
Messages
3,635
Location
Cologne
Supports
Bayern München, 1. FC Köln
You look at that Germany team and there's no real "star" to their team. You have Neuer, Schweinsteiger and Lahm who you could argue are the best in the world in their position but apart from that it's just a group of extremely good players without having a real superstar.
So your'e basically saying that the likes of Hummels, Özil, Götze and Müller are no superstars.

Why is Neymar a superstar in your opinion, and Götze and Müller not?

David Luiz vs Hummels?
 

Batrider

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Aug 6, 2013
Messages
379
You've clearly missed Beckham's point. What he was trying to say, and actually I thought it was quite clear, is that there's no talisman for Germany and that it seems like every player pulls their weight and is capable of winning the match.

You look at that Germany team and there's no real "star" to their team. You have Neuer, Schweinsteiger and Lahm who you could argue are the best in the world in their position but apart from that it's just a group of extremely good players without having a real superstar. Whereas with Brazil, Neymar is clearly their star player, likewise for Ronaldo, Messi, Robben/RVP.
That's perfectly reasonable by Beckham then. The fact that there is less of a quality slope in the German team as opposed to NL, Argentina, Brazil and Portugal is surely a compliment to the German team?
 

hamad138

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Apr 21, 2014
Messages
198
Beckham says germany have no stars and no talented players.


What has England then? Im german i dont know any of eng player expect rooney
 

Joemo

whistling in the wind
Joined
Feb 27, 2012
Messages
8,343
So your'e basically saying that the likes of Hummels, Özil, Götze and Müller are no superstars.

Why is Neymar a superstar in your opinion, and Götze and Müller not?

David Luiz vs Hummels?
Because he's on another level compared to his compatriots. What I'm saying is there's a extremely high standard within the German team that not many of the players deviate away from. Yes @Batrider, I intended it as a compliment.
 

Amar__

Geriatric lover
Joined
Sep 2, 2010
Messages
19,101
Location
Sarajevo
Supports
MK Dons
Am I the only one who understood Beckham's comments differently and actually think that it was a fairly reasonable statement to say, Germany have no particular star while Argentina have Messi? To me it sounded like he meant, we don't rely on a single individual as much as Argentina does which is simply true. Don't think he meant, we don't have top top players at all.
I read it after google-translating it from German, so I wasn't sure, but it did sound the same for me, I don't understand why that interview got so much criticism.
 

rpitroda

Full Member
Joined
May 9, 2013
Messages
14,005
Location
Los Pollos Hermanos...
Am I the only one who understood Beckham's comments differently and actually think that it was a fairly reasonable statement to say, Germany have no particular star while Argentina have Messi? To me it sounded like he meant, we don't rely on a single individual as much as Argentina does which is simply true. Don't think he meant, we don't have top top players at all.
Pretty certain that's how 99% of people understood it. This is a non-thread.
 

BW.k

Full Member
Joined
Mar 5, 2013
Messages
1,740
Location
The Chosen Van
Germany have stars and they have a team full of stars. What people actually say is that they don't have an 'individual brilliance'. Which is far from saying they have no star players.
They are an efficient as a team and efficient as players but there's nobody who could take the game from the scruff of the neck which people have different definition to. For some its a simple fact that they don't have anyone at the standard of Cristiano Ronaldo or Messi. Which is arguably correct.
They don't rely on one player who can get the job done instead they work as a team.
 

NoLogo

Full Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2009
Messages
16,688
Location
I can't remember why I joined this war.
Well I think the main reason for why someone like Becks would be saying this is because we don't really have a poster boy for our team. There are a lot of really great players in this team but no one who gets hyped around the world and sells millions of shirts on his own.

Becks is a global brand and was/is a star of a level we just don't have. The question is though how Becks could confuse this with not having talented players in our side. I think of all teams at this world cup we had by far the biggest assembly of world class and potential world class players on the field.
 

Hell Raiser

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Aug 10, 2013
Messages
2,348
Spain is a good shout. Iniesta and Xavi really didn't get the praise they've deserved. They were the main reason why Barca dominated Europe, not Messi. They have proven that with Spain.
I agree, Xavi was the main man, always was.
 

OutlawGER

Full Member
Joined
May 25, 2012
Messages
3,635
Location
Cologne
Supports
Bayern München, 1. FC Köln
I have edited the OP now. Too much Beckham in this thread. :D
 

JustFootballFan

Thinks Balotelli & Pogba look the same
Joined
Jan 16, 2013
Messages
4,245
Supports
Liverpool
Individual stardom s all about being flashy and marketing. Germans are not flashy.