Glazers / Woodward out! (One down)

iHicksy

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Here's the full article from the athletic.

Dear Joel, Bryan, Kevin, Avi, Darcie, Edward.

Perhaps you might not consider this an appropriate time to make acquaintances when, as you have discovered more times than you probably wish to remember, it never feels like we are too far away these days from the next occasion when the whole of football is rubbernecking in Manchester United’s direction.

But it has not been particularly easy to get your attention on the fleeting moments our paths have crossed and, with all the security you pay to get you in and out of Old Trafford, I wasn’t entirely confident what might happen if I was ever close enough to your car to tap on the windows.

Let me begin though, by offering an olive branch and acknowledging that maybe I was wrong with some of my assumptions when you came down Sir Matt Busby Way for the first time and there were protest banners letting you know what they thought of it.

It has been 14 years and perhaps this is the time to cut you a little slack, particularly in your case, Joel, when I can see now that I was mistaken in those early days to believe you would prefer to run everything via remote control from Florida.

A little thing, perhaps, but I heard from one of your colleagues recently that you keep a framed shirt at home from the fixture against Manchester City at Old Trafford in 2008 when the two clubs arranged a ceasefire to commemorate the 50th anniversary of the Munich disaster.

I know, Joel, because I have seen you, that you and Avi like to fly over for as many matches as your schedule allows, and I have heard the story of your celebrations on that epic night in 2008 when the Champions League final in Moscow was settled on penalties.

Apparently you wanted to sit outside that night to take in the noise and colour rather than watching from behind the windows of an executive suite. Your colleagues still reminisce about the moment Edwin van der Sar kept out Nicolas Anelka for the game’s decisive moment and how, in the sort of euphoria that was once the norm for this club, you tumbled backwards and ended up on top of Ed Woodward in the next row.

It tells us that maybe you care more than we realised and that you do have the basis of an understanding of what it takes to invest emotionally, not just financially, in a football club. It tells us that perhaps it was unfair to assume your knowledge of football could fit on the back of a postage stamp.

Except, it doesn’t really make much difference, does it Joel?

Financially, of course, it has been an absolute triumph for your family if we tot up how much you have already drained from Old Trafford, the tax benefits of registering the club in the Cayman Islands and the jaw-dropping sums that will eventually come your way when you sign the business over to Saudi Arabia or whoever else makes you an offer you can’t refuse. On that front, you have won. However anyone tries to dress it up, the facts are irrefutable. You have won, big time.

Equally, let’s not kid ourselves that it is working out in any other way besides your collective ability to turn Old Trafford into your own giant fruit machine.

You see, there are certain things you ought to realise about Manchester United and what it is that makes this club so widely cherished. After all this time, it is not greatly encouraging that you still appear to need reminding of them here.

The first thing is that the club’s supporters do not automatically assume their team is going to play majestically all the time. They might have seen great things and, granted, they have experienced the kind of adventures that can breed a certain haughtiness. But there was always a realism, believe it or not, that there might be some difficult challenges once you, and everybody running the club, had lost the safety blanket of Sir Alex Ferguson’s management skills to snuggle against.

What they are not so willing to tolerate, however, is the kind of stagnation that has sent what was once a team of serial champions towards the relegation quicksands of a league when, in different times, United’s participation near the top was the closest thing to a guarantee the sport could ever provide.

What they cannot excuse is the lack of care — for that is what it is — that has left a famous stadium showing its age and badly in need of some TLC over these last few years.

Nor can they excuse the absence of joined-up thinking from the top of the club that helps to explain why the current side are grubbing round for points in the lower reaches of the league and why, six years after Ferguson’s retirement, it is already starting to feel like nostalgia to remember the times when Old Trafford was a monument to brilliant and progressive work.

What none of us outsiders know is how you feel to have the finger of blame pointing in your direction. This is, after all, your watch. They are your fingerprints. And it was you, ultimately, who placed a level of trust in a regime, with Woodward at its forefront, that on the evidence so far has not come close to justifying that faith. Do you feel anything? Is your intention to do something about it?

Or, should I know better and concede it is futile hoping you might provide an insight into your business strategies when, despite all your PR about maintaining an open dialogue, there has been only one interview since your first day in Manchester, and it was boxed off with MUTV (not a station, let’s face it, known for Paxman-esque interrogation) to create the illusion of a good-news story?

That was you, Joel, and no doubt you remember very well the rancour of those days.

Perhaps you also recall – because many people don’t – the clear impression left by David Gill, the club’s then chief executive, that he was initially opposed to your takeover. Gill, awkward as this might seem now, took the view that “debt is the road to ruin” and, to this day, is reminded of that infamous quote among the protest banners.

As for Ferguson, maybe you remember that he, too, didn’t seem too keen initially about putting his name to your empire. He did, of course, become your biggest ally and, if I can lighten the mood for a moment, I can still chuckle about his sulphurous reaction when Stuart Mathieson, of the Manchester Evening News, had the temerity to name-check the fans’ breakaway team known as FC United of Manchester.

Enough of the nostalgia, though, when there is so much to discuss about the modern United and the gathering evidence — if you are aware of the quote — that Liverpool are clambering back on their perch and that it is the team from Anfield, as well as Manchester City, producing football of butterfly beauty. The kind of football, you may recall, that was the hallmark of the great United teams.

Were you aware that the crowd of 71,203 for the recent game against Arsenal was United’s lowest for a Premier League encounter in the post-Ferguson years? Or that the Europa League tie against Astana a fortnight earlier produced the smallest crowd — 50,783 — for any fixture at Old Trafford since 2012? Still a decent turnout, you might think, but 7,000-odd fewer than any other time United have played at home in that competition.

If this strikes you as a negative tone, maybe that is because this is the first time in 20 years of covering United that the club feels more synonymous with a leaky stadium roof and a disenchanted fanbase than everything it used to represent in happier days.

They were the days, even if it was subconscious sometimes, when match-goers at Old Trafford found themselves quickening their pace on the walk to the ground. I can vouch for that personally. Every single game — here’s the thing – felt like a showpiece occasion.

True, there were times when the club made bad signings and the team put in disappointing performances. Ferguson was not immune. Even on the difficult days though, there was something mesmerising about the sight of United chasing a game.

It was the era when David Beckham, Paul Scholes and Roy Keane, then Wayne Rooney and so many others, wore the club’s colours with distinction. It was the time Ryan Giggs, the boy who played football like a man, became the man who played football like a boy. And it was against this backdrop, in 2003, that I watched a skinny 18-year-old with gelled hair, braces on his teeth and a pimply forehead terrorise the defenders of Bolton Wanderers in what George Best described as “undoubtedly the most exciting debut I have ever seen.”

Cristiano Ronaldo, you might remember, made it clear he was going to take a malicious sense of pleasure from menacing opposition defences. When he did the same to Bolton again a couple of seasons later their manager, Sam Allardyce, was asked if his players might have been left with psychological scars. “Scars?” he replied. “We’re going to need a fecking plastic surgeon after that.”

And now? Perhaps the place to start is to ask why it is that Paul Pogba, the player you gave away for nothing in 2012 then bought back for £89 million four years later, wanted out again over the summer.

Maybe, Joel, you are feeling rather pleased with yourself after the Europa League tie against Partizan Belgrade, bearing in mind the match-winner, Anthony Martial, is said to be your favourite player. Indeed, the word behind the scenes is that you regard Martial as “the club’s Pele” and that may have been one of the reasons why the former manager, Jose Mourinho, who was not such a fan, was prevented from moving him out.

But it is 10 years since Ronaldo decided there were better adventures to be had elsewhere and I have to break the news that it is not just Mourinho who has misgivings about whether Martial — a good, occasionally excellent, forward but not one to bet your mortgage on — is the player to help United remember who they are, and what they are supposed to stand for.

It is a touchy subject, I presume, when the men you hire to find the right personnel have squandered untold sums on Alexis Sanchez, Radamel Falcao and Angel Di Maria among a list of vanity projects and transfer-market fails that is far too long to dissect here.

How did they get it so wrong?

Or, to put it another way, how did you get it so wrong?

The real mystery is what you, the Glazers, get out of it, other than the obvious, when you and your security detail must have picked up the vibe that the people who spend fortunes following the team are straying dangerously close to mutiny once again.

Someone, you see, has to ask these questions when so many of the club’s former players, with their freebies and their perks and their reluctance to burn bridges, plainly find it preferable to skirt around the subject.

I will not anticipate a reply, but it is time you thought about providing a few answers, unless you want to risk more of the opprobrium you faced in those early years. It wasn’t pretty, was it? But, can anyone say those people got it wrong?
 

red thru&thru

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There are fans on here who know feck all about the game.
Bandwagon, plastics what have you.
Wish they would go support City or Chelsea.
And what would make you say these fans know less about the game than the fans who you believe should support United?
 

Red Dreams

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And what would make you say these fans know less about the game than the fans who you believe should support United?
they just look at money spent.

Not what has happened to the squad which has been gutted.
Do you think Ole wanted to start the season with this squad?
He has not .complained like Mourinho. That is the difference
 

red thru&thru

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they just look at money spent.

Not what has happened to the squad which has been gutted.
Do you think Ole wanted to start the season with this squad?
He has not .complained like Mourinho. That is the difference
I prefer the positivity of Ole but was Jose incorrect to moan? No. Ed brought in jose to win the league. He wins the League cup, Europa league in his first season. Finish 2nd in his second season. Jose was brought in to win the league asap, so he needed those kind of players. Ed after giving a new contract decided not to fully back him. That was on Ed and the Glazer's.
 

Tincanalley

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Here's the full article from the athletic.

Dear Joel, Bryan, Kevin, Avi, Darcie, Edward.

..............

I will not anticipate a reply, but it is time you thought about providing a few answers, unless you want to risk more of the opprobrium you faced in those early years. It wasn’t pretty, was it? But, can anyone say those people got it wrong?
Brilliant. Honest and heartfelt and right on the money. Everyone should read this.
 

Red Dreams

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I prefer the positivity of Ole but was Jose incorrect to moan? No. Ed brought in jose to win the league. He wins the League cup, Europa league in his first season. Finish 2nd in his second season. Jose was brought in to win the league asap, so he needed those kind of players. Ed after giving a new contract decided not to fully back him. That was on Ed and the Glazer's.
You misunderstood.

Mourinho was right to complain. I was just saying Ole is not like him.

The Fault for this mess is entirely Woodward and the board.
Though Ole is not blameless for some poor tactics. Newcastle being one.
 

Red Dreams

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If we take a step back and think back to the scenario ..."What if the club is to be sold?"
Then the gutting of the squad makes sense. Cost cutting exercise.
It was obvious to everyone our defence needed to be rebuilt. So they started there. But the miscalculation was to think a threadbare midfield and strikeforce would see us safe enough till next season.
The panic set in when we were 2 points off the relegation zone.
Then all this talk about strengthening in Jan which is laughable because it cannot be done. No one will gut their own squad to sell.

It was a massive miscalculation by Woodward.
 

AneRu

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they just look at money spent.

Not what has happened to the squad which has been gutted.
Do you think Ole wanted to start the season with this squad?

He has not .complained like Mourinho. That is the difference
I get what you are saying but the issue here is that did Ole know how much we had to spend, did he make signings that he made knowing that we were going to sell our only proven striker and not replaced the other guaranteed starting midfielder whilst the keeping the likes of Matic, Mata and Rojo around? The I ask is because I think it was incredibly naive to spend more than half of his budget paying a world record fee for a defender who isn't really a 'best in class' type of player. I am sure searching in the German, French, Portuguese and Italian leagues would have unearthed a cheaper alternative who is similarly effective. Spending 40m on Milenkovic, for example, would have left us with money for a midfielder.

I like Maguire and AWB but I think both have certain limitations that prevent them being true value for money and if that was Ole's decision to spend our budget on them and leave the midfield and attack light then he can not blame anyone but himself.
 

Red Dreams

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I get what you are saying but the issue here is that did Ole know how much we had to spend, did he make signings that he made knowing that we were going to sell our only proven striker and not replaced the other guaranteed starting midfielder whilst the keeping the likes of Matic, Mata and Rojo around? The I ask is because I think it was incredibly naive to spend more than half of his budget paying a world record fee for a defender who isn't really a 'best in class' type of player. I am sure searching in the German, French, Portuguese and Italian leagues would have unearthed a cheaper alternative who is similarly effective. Spending 40m on Milenkovic, for example, would have left us with money for a midfielder.

I like Maguire and AWB but I think both have certain limitations that prevent them being true value for money and if that was Ole's decision to spend our budget on them and leave the midfield and attack light then he can not blame anyone but himself.
Let me digress a little.
The 3 signings by Ole are all very good.
I am not one to moan about what a player cost. That is the board's business.
Maguire is close to his peak. He is a very good player. No Rio who was the best I think in recent times. But I am happy with him.
James will become a solid winger. Lots of progress ahead for him.
AWB. Now here is a player who will some day be one of the best players we have got. He can some day be a solid midfielder. I would like to see him there.
Immense talent. Very few players can tackle like him.

The midfield was gutted by Woodward. We started with wantaway Pogba, McT a very good squad player,Fred the lost boy and slow motion Matic.
Matic tbf is an intelligent player. But he was done last season even. Fred. I'm lost for words. Don't lets kid ourselves about the Norwich display. They were terrible.
McT is the one player who has been consistent. He is still not the finished article.
And Pogba. Ok he is injured. But he has no heart in this place.
We therefore have to rebuild the entire midfield.
I mean Garner is a kid.
The running around for Longstaff, Madison and others After we let Ander and Fellani leave was simply stupid. That was entirely Woodward's doing.

It was right to sell Lukaku. If you remember we were still trying to get Dyabla right till the end.

Most of us could see what would happen with a couple of injuries.
And here we are.
 

predator

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I want the glazers to leave the club for good for a few reasons -
They will always view the club as an asset and between them all, they dont know anything about football.

They never publicly say anything about the clubs form, its expectations or where they expect the club to be.

However I cant complain about the money they have spent, mainly since SAF left. We signed big names who were on obscene wages and never delivered, we've broke the world transfer record, accumulated the highest wage bill in world football and generally have been ripped off in terms of sales.

It's laughable really how a lot of united fans fail to acknowledge just how much we have spent in the past decade compared to other so call big clubs.
 

red thru&thru

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I want the glazers to leave the club for good for a few reasons -
They will always view the club as an asset and between them all, they dont know anything about football.

They never publicly say anything about the clubs form, its expectations or where they expect the club to be.

However I cant complain about the money they have spent, mainly since SAF left. We signed big names who were on obscene wages and never delivered, we've broke the world transfer record, accumulated the highest wage bill in world football and generally have been ripped off in terms of sales.

It's laughable really how a lot of united fans fail to acknowledge just how much we have spent in the past decade compared to other so call big clubs.
And there in lies the problem, the incompetence. We don't even need to spend ridiculous amounts, we just need to invest wisely. However, the person tasked with this, Ed, isn't doing the job.
 

Cee90

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What annoys me about all of the Glazer out campaign stuff is how it goes very quiet when we are winning.

We should want them out regardless.
 

Bestietom

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I get what you are saying but the issue here is that did Ole know how much we had to spend, did he make signings that he made knowing that we were going to sell our only proven striker and not replaced the other guaranteed starting midfielder whilst the keeping the likes of Matic, Mata and Rojo around? The I ask is because I think it was incredibly naive to spend more than half of his budget paying a world record fee for a defender who isn't really a 'best in class' type of player. I am sure searching in the German, French, Portuguese and Italian leagues would have unearthed a cheaper alternative who is similarly effective. Spending 40m on Milenkovic, for example, would have left us with money for a midfielder.

I like Maguire and AWB but I think both have certain limitations that prevent them being true value for money and if that was Ole's decision to spend our budget on them and leave the midfield and attack light then he can not blame anyone but himself.
Ole wanted a lot more than what he got mate. He was promised replacements for Herrera and Lukaku but never got them. 100 million won't change a club that needs a complete rebuild, in one window.
 

red thru&thru

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What annoys me about all of the Glazer out campaign stuff is how it goes very quiet when we are winning.

We should want them out regardless.
This. There is no long term gain under the Glazer's and how any sensible fans think this will be the case is beyond me?!
 

Alabaster Codify7

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What annoys me about all of the Glazer out campaign stuff is how it goes very quiet when we are winning.

We should want them out regardless.

I think that's perhaps the main reason why it never really takes off or gets the recognition or air-time it deserves. Most neutral fans and media outlets just view it as United fans unhappy with losing on the field, as a result of things dying down when things improve slightly on the pitch.

If it was sustained, I think it'd start getting more traction.
 

Valar Morghulis

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What annoys me about all of the Glazer out campaign stuff is how it goes very quiet when we are winning.

We should want them out regardless.
Great win tonight however this thread still needs to be on the first page. Get fecked Ed, Glazers out! :angel:
 

Adnan

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I was honoured to attend an occasion at friend Faisal Abu Saq for owners and management of Manchester United. And tried to confirm the sale of the club to PIF Saudi. But they're conservative on the news.
 
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NinjaZombie

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What annoys me about all of the Glazer out campaign stuff is how it goes very quiet when we are winning.

We should want them out regardless.
That's why this thread should be bumped after every game.

feck off Ed.
 

FujiVice

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I was honoured to attend an occasion at friend Faisal Abu Saq for owners and management. And tried to confirm the sale of the club to PIF Saudi. But they're conservative on the news.
This is so obviously going to happen eventually. Looking at the expansion into Western pop culture that the Saudis have been on recently, they're going to buy a football club. And Manchester United is the one with the most clout globally.
 

Adnan

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This is so obviously going to happen eventually. Looking at the expansion into Western pop culture that the Saudis have been on recently, they're going to buy a football club. And Manchester United is the one with the most clout globally.
Our last two summer windows were quite telling with how the finances were being squeezed. The Saudi's would be the ideal party to sell to as far as the Glazers are concerned IMO.
 

AneRu

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How long will this be the case under Glazer's and Ed?!
This is the problem, ain't it? I get that they need to bring in the money and that enables us to have funds to attract and retain players but to me the focus is just wrong and there certainly doesn't appear to be any hunger for football success at the top of the club because all they seem to think about are potential revenue streams from the fan base. Beyond Ole who is plotting our way back to the top, who is doing the groundwork on the signings we need in January?
 

Adisa

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Our last two summer windows were quite telling with how the finances were being squeezed. The Saudi's would be the ideal party to sell to as far as the Glazers are concerned IMO.
This is a misconception imo. We don't have nearly as much money as fans think we have. Just look at our operating margin.
 

red thru&thru

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This is the problem, ain't it? I get that they need to bring in the money and that enables us to have funds to attract and retain players but to me the focus is just wrong and there certainly doesn't appear to be any hunger for football success at the top of the club because all they seem to think about are potential revenue streams from the fan base. Beyond Ole who is plotting our way back to the top, who is doing the groundwork on the signings we need in January?
Agree. Any new potential new owners need to start with Edwin, Rangnick and Mitchell. They can take it from there. The owners can then start to think about investing into OT and Carrington.
 

AneRu

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Agree. Any new potential new owners need to start with Edwin, Rangnick and Mitchell. They can take it from there. The owners can then start to think about investing into OT and Carrington.
I don't know if they will ever sell the club but they just need to simply do the right thing. I don't think fans are demanding £400m net spend per window but them just accepting that things have gone wrong and need to be corrected.

For starters we could bring Ragnick and start working towards a coherent vision from the academy going up to the first team. The money we spend could be spent better and we should be on the lookout for the best talent available from both the playing and the coachin/scouting/management side. If we start doing the right things then results will follow.

Arnold sounds excited by the impact of technology obviously with the view towards live streaming and making money off that but at the moment Liverpool, Barcelona and City look poised to capitalize on that because they have the momentum on the pitch. Selling Manchester United as a brand wouldn't be difficult with a competitive team on the pitch.