Greenwood and Foden kicked out of England squad for bringing girls into hotel room

Hoof The Ball

Full Member
Joined
Jan 16, 2008
Messages
6,586
Location
San Antonio, Texas.
You can be a superstar teenager and have your head screwed on straight and be professional. It's possible. You wouldn't catch a mature-as-shit Mbappe doing anything like that in his teens. It's ok being level-headed on the field, but off the field if you want to be the very best you can't rely on your talent. I know folks will play this down, but Mason needs to get into his mind that his off-field choices will have footballing repercussions eventually.
 

Tom Cato

Full Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2019
Messages
2,487
So overdramatic.

Being a public figure means being in the public eye.


When Rooney was caught up in the prostitution scandal - was he at fault for cheating or the media at fault for reporting on it?

In Sterling's case it was a bit different since there was actual fabrication being published, but what aside from publishing Greenwood's OWN SOCIAL MEDIA posts has the papers done?
No you're wrong.

Being a known person does not, and should not remove your right to privacy. Was it in the publics interest to know that Wayne Rooney had an affair? What purpose does it serve to protect anyone?

You're missing my point, and somehow manage to speak out for sensational garbage news all in one, just because you happen to know who the people being reported on are.

Being famous shoul not remove your right to have a personal life. If you actually believe that then we really have nothing to talk about.
 

snowkarl

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Dec 12, 2018
Messages
236
No you're wrong.

Being a known person does not, and should not remove your right to privacy. Was it in the publics interest to know that Wayne Rooney had an affair? What purpose does it serve to protect anyone?

You're missing my point, and somehow manage to speak out for sensational garbage news all in one, just because you happen to know who the people being reported on are.

Being famous shoul not remove your right to have a personal life. If you actually believe that then we really have nothing to talk about.
So the media should not be allowed to report on things posted on social media if the people involved don't like it?

They didn't hide in the bushes outside of his home.

He posted one video himself, the other one his mate posted.

Making excuses for him and letting this continue will only serve to hurt Greenwood. He needs to stop acting like an irresponsible child - he is a MUTD employee making millions. Be a role model ffs.
 

Withnail

Full Member
Joined
Jan 5, 2019
Messages
4,196
Location
The Arena of the Unwell
So the media should not be allowed to report on things posted on social media if the people involved don't like it?

They didn't hide in the bushes outside of his home.

He posted one video himself, the other one his mate posted.

Making excuses for him and letting this continue will only serve to hurt Greenwood. He needs to stop acting like an irresponsible child - he is a MUTD employee making millions. Be a role model ffs.
Regardless of the fact that Greenwood's behaviour hasn't been exemplary and that he needs to cop on a bit, I don't think this story is in the national interest and needs reporting.

What value is there in reporting it?
 

snowkarl

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Dec 12, 2018
Messages
236
Regardless of the fact that Greenwood's behaviour hasn't been exemplary and that he needs to cop on a bit, I don't think this story is in the national interest and needs reporting.

What value is there in reporting it?
The value is not measured in subjective terms that you make up on a whim but in pubic interest measures by sales and clicks.

Similar reasons as to why Mason is getting paid millions to kick the ball about. People want to see him do it and pay insane figures.
 

Withnail

Full Member
Joined
Jan 5, 2019
Messages
4,196
Location
The Arena of the Unwell
The value is not measured in subjective terms that you make up on a whim but in pubic interest measures by sales and clicks.

Similar reasons as to why Mason is getting paid millions to kick the ball about. People want to see him do it and pay insane figures.
No that is not true at all and it's nothing to do with my whims.

There are supposed to be standards in regards to what is printable and people have the right to privacy. They shouldn't be allowed just print whatever information they like about someone just because it generates clicks.

The following is from the National Journalist Unions code of ethics for UK and Irish Journalism and something I think all media outlets should adhere to:

Does nothing to intrude into anybody’s private life, grief or distress unless justified by overriding consideration of the public interest.
 

hmchan

Full Member
Joined
Nov 20, 2017
Messages
855
Location
Hong Kong
A simple rebuttal to this endless "but all 18 year olds do dumb things!" is that none of our other players have been caught doing multiple idiotic things in a matter of weeks and not ALL footballers sneak in girls during a pandemic on their first England call up, not ALL footballers take drugs, not ALL footballers put out videos with underage girls talking about wanting daddy's dick, not ALL footballers get noise complaints over house parties during quarantine...

This endless excuse making is just the height of hypocrisy. The only reason people do it is because they are psychologically unable to consider that one of our best prospects doesn't have the right mentality. Many feel if they accept this, inwardly or outwardly, he is bound to be branded a Ravel or something.

Fact of the matter is that Mason shouldn't have been doing any of these things, let alone filmed doing it, and it is a worrying sign. If he doesn't get his shit together, his career will suffer.
Living on the other side of the world and reading this thread, I've really thought for one second that all teenagers in the west do the same.
 

Tom Cato

Full Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2019
Messages
2,487
So the media should not be allowed to report on things posted on social media if the people involved don't like it?

They didn't hide in the bushes outside of his home.

He posted one video himself, the other one his mate posted.

Making excuses for him and letting this continue will only serve to hurt Greenwood. He needs to stop acting like an irresponsible child - he is a MUTD employee making millions. Be a role model ffs.
I'll refer to the ethics guidemap I posted a link to. But especially the section about being especially considerate when it comes to children and young people in general. Greenwood is 18. Is a mass media coverage nationwide airing a stupid mistake validated because someone posted it on social media? Of course it isn't.

And again. What business is it of your's or mine?

I don't understand why you actually defend the tabloid press here, can you elaborate on that why you think sensationalistic dirty laundry is something you should get to read and enjoy?
 

snowkarl

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Dec 12, 2018
Messages
236
No that is not true at all and it's nothing to do with my whims.

There are supposed to be standards in regards to what is printable and people have the right to privacy. They shouldn't be allowed just print whatever information they like about someone just because it generates clicks.

The following is from the National Journalist Unions code of ethics for UK and Irish Journalism and something I think all media outlets should adhere to:

Does nothing to intrude into anybody’s private life, grief or distress unless justified by overriding consideration of the public interest.
But that is entirely subjective and arbitrary.

Mason and his friends put it up on social media themselves. They publicized it themselves - not some undercover reporter. Blame them.

Stop shifting the blame.
 

Rolaholic

Full Member
Joined
Aug 1, 2016
Messages
3,058
Living on the other side of the world and reading this thread, I've really thought for one second that all teenagers in the west do the same.
A lot of them do



Not many have to deal with a sensationalist media out to bury them or dig into all their past transgressions any chance they get though
 

Withnail

Full Member
Joined
Jan 5, 2019
Messages
4,196
Location
The Arena of the Unwell
But that is entirely subjective and arbitrary.

Mason and his friends put it up on social media themselves. They publicized it themselves - not some undercover reporter. Blame them.

Stop shifting the blame.
These are journalistic standards going back nearly 100 years. It's obviously judged on a case by case basis but the individual's right to privacy should come first.

I'm not shifting the blame if you go back and read the first post of mine you responded to.

It's possible to believe that both Greenwood and tabloid press are out of order.

not ALL footballers put out videos with underage girls talking about wanting daddy's dick, not ALL footballers get noise complaints over house parties during quarantine...
Also where are you getting the information the girl in the video is underage? It was his ex who is older than him wasn't it?
 

Dante

Bang Average but can post Blindfolded for 15 secs
Joined
Oct 22, 2010
Messages
19,151
Location
My wit's end
Supports
saves.outer.elite
I don't even think he did much wrong. The issue is that he got recorded doing it by somebody who effectively betrayed him for self-publicity.

Besides, it's not like he was stupid enough to do any of it in public. He was in a private setting with somebody he believed he could trust. If he'd fecked the girl and huffed the gas away from her phone, nobody would have been any the wiser.

But whilst it's not ideal, none of it is illegal either. It only just happened to break the rules of the England camp - and for that he got duly punished. It's certainly not worth the moral panic being stoked by a handful of Mary Whitehouses on this thread.

Incidentally, loads of kids his age are doing the same thing. But because they don't face the same media scrutiny, the rest of the public are oblivious to how normal it all is.

Flout a couple of workplace rules, inhale some legal gas, screw another consenting adult... it's living the dream.
 

SuperiorXI

Full Member
Joined
Jan 8, 2012
Messages
6,103
Location
Manchester, England
No hes not. Nothing about him from watching him play and on tbe pitch shouts knob to me.
Don't see other players with this kind of attention, majority get their heads down especially in such good positions. Some of the stuff he has posted online he's looked a prat. Luckly it's something that can change with maturity.
 

We need an rvn

Full Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2015
Messages
2,716
Location
somewhere in the sussex downs
You can be a superstar teenager and have your head screwed on straight and be professional. It's possible. You wouldn't catch a mature-as-shit Mbappe doing anything like that in his teens. It's ok being level-headed on the field, but off the field if you want to be the very best you can't rely on your talent. I know folks will play this down, but Mason needs to get into his mind that his off-field choices will have footballing repercussions eventually.
Spot on.

If Mason had done this 1 or 2 years ago there would be uproar as he'll be the next Ravel.

He needs to look at who he's hanging out with, what his priorities are now before they get out of hand...like you said, I don't hear Mbappe / Felix (Athletico M) getting up to shite like this at 18.

He can very quickly become the next RM or the next Mbappe
 

zizou81

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Jul 19, 2016
Messages
26
Spot on.

If Mason had done this 1 or 2 years ago there would be uproar as he'll be the next Ravel.

He needs to look at who he's hanging out with, what his priorities are now before they get out of hand...like you said, I don't hear Mbappe / Felix (Athletico M) getting up to shite like this at 18.

He can very quickly become the next RM or the next Mbappe
They just dont get caught. Trust me, theyre up to no good from time to time...
 

snowkarl

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Dec 12, 2018
Messages
236
These are journalistic standards going back nearly 100 years. It's obviously judged on a case by case basis but the individual's right to privacy should come first.

I'm not shifting the blame if you go back and read the first post of mine you responded to.

It's possible to believe that both Greenwood and tabloid press are out of order.



Also where are you getting the information the girl in the video is underage? It was his ex who is older than him wasn't it?
Whatever.

Mason did a LOT of stupid things in just one summer in his debut season. That is a very bad sign.

The media didn't create this by reporting on what he did. He did it himself by doing what he did.

Stop the excuses. Shape up or get out.

It's 2020 - the top teams no longer accept this type of behavior and if we want to get back we need to hold our players to professional standards.
 

Withnail

Full Member
Joined
Jan 5, 2019
Messages
4,196
Location
The Arena of the Unwell
Whatever.

Mason did a LOT of stupid things in just one summer in his debut season. That is a very bad sign.

The media didn't create this by reporting on what he did. He did it himself by doing what he did.

Stop the excuses. Shape up or get out.

It's 2020 - the top teams no longer accept this type of behavior and if we want to get back we need to hold our players to professional standards.
Well none of that invalidates anything I've said :lol:
 

NotThatSoph

Full Member
Joined
Sep 12, 2019
Messages
387
The point is how benign this is. Adding the phrasing "happy crack" does nothing for the article outside of attempting to put an emphasis on how

I'm honestly a little bit surprise that the media hasn't learned a thing from the Caroline Flack suicie that was directly contributed to the relentless media character assasination (I'm not a medical doctor so I won't pretend to know what else she was struggling with).

In Norway we have a strict set of ethics rules for the press that protects against sensationalistic publication and witchunting that all publications, radio and TV have to adhere by.

Here's a link to that that will translate to English with google for anyone curious: https://presse.no/pfu/etiske-regler/vaer-varsom-plakaten/

For example one section:

4.7. Be careful with the use of name and picture and other clear identifying marks on persons mentioned in connection with reprehensible or criminal offenses. Take special care when discussing cases at an early stage of investigation, in cases involving young offenders, and where identifying coverage can lead to an unreasonable burden on third parties. Identification must be based on a justified need for information. It may, for example, be justified to identify by imminent danger of abuse against defenseless persons, by serious and repeated criminal acts, when the identity or role of the person in question has clear relevance to the circumstances mentioned, or where identification prevents innocents from being exposed to unjustified suspicion.

4.14. Those who are exposed to strong accusations shall, as far as possible, have access to adress the factual accusations. Debate, criticism and news dissemination must not be hindered by the parties' unwillingness to express themselves or participate in the debate.


We generally don't name and shame in the Norwegian media unless it has a specific reason that contributes to public safety. But if someone does something stupid the media will cover with, for example: "Norwegian football star accused of embezzling funds" which happened last year. The man was not idenitified before he himself came out in public to admit his wrongdoing.

The whole naming and shaming and repeating articles in the UK, and honestly worldwide press for coverage and incidents that generally do not concern the broad public, is abhorrent and nothing more than voyeuristic fetishism that offers nothing but satisfy the publics need to KNOW what other people are doing.

Essentially, Mason Greenwood huffing laughing gas is not my business, not your business, and certainly not the publics business. Because it makes it's round on social media it certainly does not make it the medias business to go on a free for all and help spread the news nation wide.

Unfortunately the right to privacy only seem to extend as far as when it doesn't involve oneself.
This PFU section is not at all relevant, Greenwood is not a crime suspect or anything like that and he is a public figure. This would be a story in Norway as well.

- Some reality people having a get-together to watch Ex on the Beach

- One of them parties again

- Herman Flesvig and some friends take a trip to his cabin
 

Feed Me

I'm hungry
Joined
Apr 8, 2004
Messages
27,467
Location
Midlands, UK
This will be good for Mason in the long run. Generally speaking, he’s always someone who has been spoken about as being a sensible enough lad, so he’ll be grand. It’s always challenging when you’re a teenager but in the public eye. 18 year olds do stupid things. The club should obviously remind him of his responsibilities but there really is nothing to see here.
 

432JuanMata

Full Member
Joined
Aug 12, 2014
Messages
1,063
Location
Dublin
I agree with both sides in since he is young we all were he will make mistake or do what a teenager does but he needs to be careful he is a professional footballer because you expect him to act professionally, otherwise they would be classed as top footballers. In the 90’s players smoked/drank a lot but these days it’s not acceptable but he is probably paid more than any player in the 90’s and the club/national side will expect certain standards it’s the way it is.

I will not get upset like certain posters in here but I hope this isn’t the start of more negative things and more a one off as he has immense talent and should be working to maximise it.
 

macheda14

Full Member
Joined
May 22, 2009
Messages
2,188
Location
Manchester
How about general teenagers (not footballers)?
Many many teenagers do it or at least have tried it. You can’t walk 100 metres in London currently without seeing the empty canisters that contain laughing gas.

Literally last night I was woken up to 4 young guys sitting in a car outside the 24 shop across the street from me all having laughing gas and blaring music.
 

RedRonaldo

Full Member
Joined
Aug 17, 2003
Messages
11,319
A simple rebuttal to this endless "but all 18 year olds do dumb things!" is that none of our other players have been caught doing multiple idiotic things in a matter of weeks and not ALL footballers sneak in girls during a pandemic on their first England call up, not ALL footballers take drugs, not ALL footballers put out videos with underage girls talking about wanting daddy's dick, not ALL footballers get noise complaints over house parties during quarantine...

This endless excuse making is just the height of hypocrisy. The only reason people do it is because they are psychologically unable to consider that one of our best prospects doesn't have the right mentality. Many feel if they accept this, inwardly or outwardly, he is bound to be branded a Ravel or something.

Fact of the matter is that Mason shouldn't have been doing any of these things, let alone filmed doing it, and it is a worrying sign. If he doesn't get his shit together, his career will suffer.
Greenwood is only a 18 year old teenager trying to cope with fame.
Back when I was 18 year old teenage, I did a lot of stupid things too, it’s not really good to judge a person at that age. He is just a curious young boy having fun.
Remember young Giggs was once a party boy, young Ronaldo once invite some chicks and his mate to his house to have some “fun“, and young De Gea used to steal dognuts!
 
Last edited:

hmchan

Full Member
Joined
Nov 20, 2017
Messages
855
Location
Hong Kong
Many many teenagers do it or at least have tried it. You can’t walk 100 metres in London currently without seeing the empty canisters that contain laughing gas.

Literally last night I was woken up to 4 young guys sitting in a car outside the 24 shop across the street from me all having laughing gas and blaring music.
Wow that's an eye-opener for me.
 

glazed

Full Member
Joined
Sep 30, 2012
Messages
3,084
Southgate is a pr#ck. Dragging an 18 year old on his stupid friendly trip when he obviously needed a break. Then making him do media duty. And then sending him home with zero media protection.

The national team can fek off.