GlasgowCeltic
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I'd rather be Martinelli than Greenwood over the next 18 months or so (or however long Ronaldos contact has left)
They are not different levels, Greenwood is the more natural finisher, but Martinelli probably pips him all round, his dribbling, tenacity and work rate is better.It was Greenwood when this thread was started and it’s still Greenwood now. Different levels.
He's miles ahead in current ability because he's been managed well, simple as. Their level of talent though is quite comparable. Greenwood needs a manager to trust and play him as he needs to be ala Guardiola has with Foden and his talent will shine.I have a hard time seeing that. They're basically the same age and Foden is miles above Greenwood at the moment. Of course, Pep helped him improve but there's a long way to go for Greenwood to claim this status.
That’s true but why is Martinelli so far away from that level? Did you see his performance against City, him and Saka singlehandedly destroyed their opposition full backs and gave the impetus for probably the best oppositiom performances against City this season, there was one particular moment where Martinelli picked up the ball from about 40-50 yards and literally ripped through the city team by himself, I would find it hard to argue that Greenwood is a level above him.He's miles ahead in current ability because he's been managed well, simple as. Their level of talent though is quite comparable. Greenwood needs a manager to trust and play him as he needs to be ala Guardiola has with Foden and his talent will shine.
I don't think he's far away from the level. I'd put him at the level below Greenwood and Foden. They have that special something where they're a young player but they instantly have an attribute that is at a world class level - Greenwoods finishing ability / Fodens composure.That’s true but why is Martinelli so far away from that level? Did you see his performance against City, him and Saka singlehandedly destroyed their opposition full backs and gave the impetus for probably the best oppositiom performances against City this season, there was one particular moment where Martinelli picked up the ball from about 40-50 yards and literally ripped through the city team by himself, I would find it hard to argue that Greenwood is a level above him.
Martinelli was coming back from a long term injury, and it was quite clear when he came back he was still weak from it. He didn't have the pace, and everytime he got tackled he looked like he could get injured. So Arteta took him out the side, and I imagine worked in training on this.Greenwood has been consistently playing and scoring while Martinelli was rotting in bench. Suddenly he has one good month and he is again better than Greenwood.
I think this is a fair assessment.I don't think anyone can argue at all with Greenwood's talent. His ball striking and finishing are brilliant.
My main concern with him, is his pathway / opportunity.
When you look at Martinelli now, a massive pathway has opened up for him now at Arsenal on the left wing spot, which is his favoured position, and he now has the opportunity with Aubameyang leaving to make that position his own.
Will Greenwood have that opportunity to do so likewise in his favoured position? Or will he become that hybrid player like Rashford, who seems like he's not really a left winger nor a striker? That's my main concern with him.
Absolutely.I'd rather be Martinelli than Greenwood over the next 18 months or so (or however long Ronaldos contact has left)
Mismanaged but that could quickly change with a good new manager in charge with a long term vision. Rashford and Greenwood deserve more time and will get it. Martial is a lost cause.Absolutely.
Reading this thread infuriates me, because it shows how fecking poorly we've managed Greenwood. We might not get an academy graduate as talented for another 20 years. We're so bad at developing talent in the modern era, Rashford, Martial and now Greenwood have all stagnated while playing for us.
Erm?.. ok?I hope Arteta stays for a very long time.
It's rarely that simple, of course talent is important but it'll also depend on his ability to absorb what he's taught even with a good manager. He's over 20 now, at one point he'll need to show consistency on the pitch, the promise of a bright future will mean less and less as he ages. Lets hope he evolves like Foden and not like Dele Alli, Walcott etc.He's miles ahead in current ability because he's been managed well, simple as. Their level of talent though is quite comparable. Greenwood needs a manager to trust and play him as he needs to be ala Guardiola has with Foden and his talent will shine.
Greenwood literally just turned 20!It's rarely that simple, of course talent is important but it'll also depend on his ability to absorb what he's taught even with a good manager. He's over 20 now, at one point he'll need to show consistency on the pitch, the promise of a bright future will mean less and less as he ages. Lets hope he evolves like Foden and not like Dele Alli, Walcott etc.
That makes him over 20 doesn't it? He's still very young don't get me wrong but he reaches the age when promises of talent will have to translate on the pitch. I've been reading everywhere on the caf that he's a future superstar, a gem etc. but he isn't a starter in a pretty average united team when Foden starts in one of the strongest team in the world (and i'm not even comparing him to what Haaland or Mbappé achieved at his age). Rashford was also a guaranteed superstar for a lot of people here and we can't really say that's how it's going.Greenwood literally just turned 20!
I dunno, recently turning 20 is outrageously young imo. What he has already done is a fantastic achievement for his age. 34 goals and 12 assists are great numbers.That makes him over 20 doesn't it? He's still very young don't get me wrong but he reaches the age when promises of talent will have to translate on the pitch. I've been reading everywhere on the caf that he's a future superstar, a gem etc. but he isn't a starter in a pretty average united team when Foden starts in one of the strongest team in the world (and i'm not even comparing him to what Haaland or Mbappé achieved at his age). Rashford was also a guaranteed superstar for a lot of people here and we can't really say that's how it's going.
That is really good, but Rashford had similar stats at 20, it's not a guarantee of anything.I dunno, recently turning 20 is outrageously young imo. What he has already done is a fantastic achievement for his age. 34 goals and 12 assists are great numbers.
Line from Michael Owen book.That is really good, but Rashford had similar stats at 20, it's not a guarantee of anything.
Different types of player. Rashford was never a finisher.That is really good, but Rashford had similar stats at 20, it's not a guarantee of anything.
Their PL stats are pretty close considering Foden is the better player + plays for a much better side.I have a hard time seeing that. They're basically the same age and Foden is miles above Greenwood at the moment. Of course, Pep helped him improve but there's a long way to go for Greenwood to claim this status.
Foden is vastly (that's an understastement) superior on the ball though. He regularly plays in the midfield.Their PL stats are pretty close considering Foden is the better player + plays for a much better side.
Foden: 81 apps; 20 goals; 11 assists
Greenwood: 80 apps: 21 goals; 4 assists
This is a ridiculous post, how many players have it all together at the age of 20 ? There's interviews with footballers / past legends (great insight from Glenn Hoddle) of the game speaking about their process of peaking which naturally occurs in later stages of their careers, where through experience they begin to understand the game of football which helps them evolve in their influence.That makes him over 20 doesn't it? He's still very young don't get me wrong but he reaches the age when promises of talent will have to translate on the pitch. I've been reading everywhere on the caf that he's a future superstar, a gem etc. but he isn't a starter in a pretty average united team when Foden starts in one of the strongest team in the world (and i'm not even comparing him to what Haaland or Mbappé achieved at his age). Rashford was also a guaranteed superstar for a lot of people here and we can't really say that's how it's going.
It’s probably the biggest overstatement I’ve ever read. I think you’ve just assumed he’s better on the ball because he’s a midfielder. Foden might be better on the ball but there’s little between them.Foden is vastly (that's an understastement) superior on the ball though. He regularly plays in the midfield.
Honestly some of the nonsense in these types of threads. I'm very cautious concerning rating Greenwood as often many United players are over-hyped.Foden is a starter and Greenwood isn’t a starter.
**checks notes**
Yep, Greenwood has played more. Ok.
You're totally missing he point. Players obviously don't peak a 20, but saying Foden and Greenwood have the same level of talent when one is a starter in a top4 european team and the other in the rotation at united is, as of right now, wishful thinking. Greenwood shows talent for sure but there's absolutely no guarantee he'll be an elite player when Foden isn't far from being one. Maybe he will under the right manager, maybe he won't.This is a ridiculous post, how many players have it all together at the age of 20 ? There's interviews with footballers / past legends (great insight from Glenn Hoddle) of the game speaking about their process of peaking which naturally occurs in later stages of their careers, where through experience they begin to understand the game of football which helps them evolve in their influence.
You can't be serious. Foden is a far more versatile player, his passing and composure is way better than Greenwood's while having comparable stats. Greenwood is a better finisher and also faster but that's pretty much it.It’s probably the biggest overstatement I’ve ever read. I think you’ve just assumed he’s better on the ball because he’s a midfielder. Foden might be better on the ball but there’s little between them.
Vastly. He predominantly plays as a left winger.Foden is vastly (that's an understastement) superior on the ball though. He regularly plays in the midfield.
Greenwood’s long passing is miles better than Foden’s. He’s also a better crosser when he does actually decide to cross it. Foden’s got better balance, is a better short passer and a better dribbler. Have you ever actually watched them play? I’m starting to suspect you haven’t, at least not enough to speak with such baseless confidence about it.You're totally missing he point. Players obviously don't peak a 20, but saying Foden and Greenwood have the same level of talent when one is a starter in a top4 european team and the other in the rotation at united is, as of right now, wishful thinking. Greenwood shows talent for sure but there's absolutely no guarantee he'll be an elite player when Foden isn't far from being one. Maybe he will under the right manager, maybe he won't.
You can't be serious. Foden is a far more versatile player, his passing and composure is way better than Greenwood's while having comparable stats. Greenwood is a better finisher and also faster but that's pretty much it.
This is nonsense Foden is not an out and out starter for City his total output of games confirms this ? He is not as instrumental to City as you are describing him. Phil is doing well playing within the peripheral of a strong City team. Peripheral and focal point are two different things. He cannot be considered elite as you have described him until he's the latter.You're totally missing he point. Players obviously don't peak a 20, but saying Foden and Greenwood have the same level of talent when one is a starter in a top4 european team and the other in the rotation at united is, as of right now, wishful thinking. Greenwood shows talent for sure but there's absolutely no guarantee he'll be an elite player when Foden isn't far from being one. Maybe he will under the right manager, maybe he won't.
You can't be serious. Foden is a far more versatile player, his passing and composure is way better than Greenwood's while having comparable stats. Greenwood is a better finisher and also faster but that's pretty much it.
Good postI don't think anyone can argue at all with Greenwood's talent. His ball striking and finishing are brilliant.
My main concern with him, is his pathway / opportunity.
When you look at Martinelli now, a massive pathway has opened up for him now at Arsenal on the left wing spot, which is his favoured position, and he now has the opportunity with Aubameyang leaving to make that position his own.
Will Greenwood have that opportunity to do so likewise in his favoured position? Or will he become that hybrid player like Rashford, who seems like he's not really a left winger nor a striker? That's my main concern with him.
Yeah but we rejected him for Greenwood, who's still very good and going through a bad run of form.Martinelli wins December PL Player of the Month. I still can't believe Man Utd rejected him.
It is extremely hard to say no to the pay cheque in Man Utd until you are 26 and 27 like Martial and Lingaard. Greenwood get lots of playing time in Man Utd for the past 2 years so he won't go anywhere.Greenwood will not reach his potential here. He's a Man United boy and I am sure he wants to succeed here and win all trophies.
If he and his entourage are wise, he'll opt for a move though. This club is a complete mess in developing players, and are miles away from winning titles.
Martinelli is currently playing a lot better football, but the comparison is unfair. Arsenal play much better football than United currently.