Has Cesc Fabregas fullfilled his potential ?

[billybee99]

Generally it seems that Fabregas isn't held in the same level of respect/joy by fans like Xavi and Iniesta are, but at his best he was possibly better.

Xavi and Iniesta are basically considered legends of spanish footballl and of the game overall, while Fabregas seems a tier below...

Is this a serious post? I'm mean Jesus...he was no where near Xavi or Iniesta hence the reason he spent half of his career on the bench watching them for Barcelona and Spain. He wasn't even as good as Modric. Very good player but embarrassing defensively and one of the slowest players I've seen - he was literally a pylon in his Chelsea days although he was still a sublime passer.

 

[Cascarino]

Is this a serious post? I'm mean Jesus...he was no where near Xavi or Iniesta hence the reason he spent half of his career on the bench watching them for Barcelona and Spain. He wasn't even as good as Modric. Very good player but embarrassing defensively and one of the slowest players I've seen - he was literally a pylon in his Chelsea days although he was still a sublime passer.

He was a fair bit quicker during his Arsenal days. He would never be one of the fastest but he was much more mobile and it never really stood out as a big problem. I remember him slipping through from kick off against Spurs to score, albeit that was more down to the terrible defending than anything. As you said in his Chelsea days the lack of mobility did stand out, though the passing was superb.

 

[GlasgowCeltic]

his best football as the actual midfield controller people thought he was meant to become might’ve been the CL Final run as a 17 year old, with the Real Madrid away game possibly the best performance of his career. Be it because of his extreme levels of creativity or poor engine virtually every manager he played under eventually used him further forward, a superb player regardless

 

[tenpoless]

I stopped for a minute trying to remember where was He after Barca. Totally forgot about Chelsea.

 

[2mufc0]

Move to Barca was the wrong one, he needed to be the main midfielder not second fiddle to Xavi and Busquets, wasn't the same player after that.

 

[Robertd0803]

Probably stayed too long at Arsenal, possibly too long at Barca.

Unreal player though, and one I wish had played for us. Was gutted when he ended up going to Chelsea and they walked the league.

Is he recognised as the first proper "false 9"? I remember the disgust in the pub that Spain were so good they didnt need to name an actual striker for the final vs Italy.

 

[FootballHQ]

He was always going to go back to Barca, they wanted him around the time they got Pique back which was 2008. He tried to stay at Arsenal long enough to win something significant as thanks to Wenger for giving him his debut but eventually he was hitting mid 20s there and with Guardiola at Barca it was time.

Pretty sure he played false 9 for club and country a few times over those years.

He was a very good midfielder. Not as good as Xavi or Iniesta (although would've been interesting to see his development if he'd stayed at Barca instead of leaving for Arsenal) but still miles better than say an Arteta who was a solid central midfielder but was never capped by Spain and was good for teams in 4th-6th range in premier league.

It's close between him and Xabi Alonso actually in terms of their career progression.

 

[Pow]

Fabregas to costa was one of the reasons we won 2 titles in 3 years. A chance making machine.

 

[Ish]

World class player. Definitely fulfilled his potential - albeit at times he looked like he’d be a Balon d’Or winner. Definitely a tier below below Xavi/Iniesta though. I don’t think many, if any, would agree that he was their level.

 

[Alejandro Angel]

Wished Moyes had enough to convince him to sign for United. Fantastic player

Really glad that he never came to United, his dive and urging of a red card denied Darren Fletcher a chance to play in a champions league final. His Pizza throwing histrionics show his personal character, I was so happy that Moyes wasn't able to convince him.

 

[Luke1995]

Is this a serious post? I'm mean Jesus...he was no where near Xavi or Iniesta hence the reason he spent half of his career on the bench watching them for Barcelona and Spain. He wasn't even as good as Modric. Very good player but embarrassing defensively and one of the slowest players I've seen - he was literally a pylon in his Chelsea days although he was still a sublime passer.

Does he need to have defensive duties ? Ozil is another one who does better when free'd from that.

 

[Luke1995]

@Cascarino Very good insight into his career, thank you! Enjoyed reading.

I may ask, what can he achieve now with Monaco ? Hasn't turned 33 yet! Is there still a player good enough to have something of a european impact ? (Europa League, going far at CL, and so on)

 

[footballistic orgasm]

Pep coaching Barca really did a lot to elevate Xavi and Iniesta's status in football history and took them to their full potential.
Cesc was viewed as having a higher potential than both (especially Iniesta) in 2008, he was the one in the starting line up for Spain in Euro 2008 not Iniesta (who ended up getting into the starting 11) and Cesc Also ended up being in the team of the competition also.

A poster said he spent a lot of time watching Xavi and Iniesta from the bench for both Barca and Spain, that isn't true though. He played a lot, either changing positions constantly or either making Iniesta be played out of position.
He has the highest number of assists for the Spanish national team for any Spanish player ever if i'm not mistaken.

I think he's had a great career, very few players have won as many titles as he has, while playing an integral part to achieving those titles (for the most part). Was unfortunate to have not won the champions league though.

 

[Cascarino]

Pep coaching Barca really did a lot to elevate Xavi and Iniesta's status in football history and took them to their full potential.
Cesc was viewed as having a higher potential than both (especially Iniesta) in 2008, he was the one in the starting line up for Spain in Euro 2008 not Iniesta (who ended up getting into the starting 11) and Cesc Also ended up being in the team of the competition also.

A poster said he spent a lot of time watching Xavi and Iniesta from the bench for both Barca and Spain, that isn't true though. He played a lot, either changing positions constantly or either making Iniesta be played out of position.
He has the highest number of assists for the Spanish national team for any Spanish player ever if i'm not mistaken.

I think he's had a great career, very few players have won as many titles as he has, while playing an integral part to achieving those titles (for the most part). Was unfortunate to have not won the champions league though.

Iniesta started every game at the tournament. I think he was carrying an injury but in the end it didn't affect his appearances. Fabregas was more often a substitute but played well and did start the final. He did get into the team of the tournament (along with Xavi and Iniesta), but they selected a squad of 23.

@Cascarino Very good insight into his career, thank you! Enjoyed reading.

I may ask, what can he achieve now with Monaco ? Hasn't turned 33 yet! Is there still a player good enough to have something of a european impact ? (Europa League, going far at CL, and so on)

I don't know enough about Monaco and how he fits in with them, but it'd be great to see him do well there.

 

[tjb]

Sure. An incredible career. Won more or less the lot, hugely respected in the game, a multi-millionaire and played for Barca, Arsenal, Chelsea and Monaco.

There's only a handful of players who had better careers.

I think he could have been more. Forget the trophies, it's a team game. Fabregas made two bad decisions in his career. At the point he left Barcelona, you could make the case for him being a top 3 midfielder in the game. I don't think Modric two years ago was doing anything Fabregas could not have done. His first mistake was for staying at Arsenal for too long. Constantly finishing 4th while United and Chelsea were dominating both domestically and in Europe put him on the back burner of people's thoughts despite his excellence at the time. Everyone remembers the fantastic season's Drogba and Rooney had in 2010, Fabregas was just as good that year. And it's a real shame that's forgotten. The second bad move he made was forcing his way to a Barcelona team who didn't need him. There were better options at the time, and that was the worst option he could take given the reputation of Xavi and Iniesta at the time. His performances were judged directly against those players and given their status and the usual barcelona arrogance, rather than being accepted and idolized in another team, he was subjected to having to prove himself to fans who already had favourites. Those were his prime years. His season at Chelsea showed what he could have given if he had not made that move. Even if he had decided to stick with Arsenal, he would have been considered a true legend of that club.

 

[Amir]

Really glad that he never came to United, his dive and urging of a red card denied Darren Fletcher a chance to play in a champions league final. His Pizza throwing histrionics show his personal character, I was so happy that Moyes wasn't able to convince him.

It's a good thing we never had players who dived or did silly things on or off the pitch.

 

[Adisa]

People confuse the age a talent emerges with the extent of that talent.
He has had a fantastic career. You can't objectively say he should have achieved more.
He never struck me as a tiki-taka/juego de prosicion player.

 

[Stacks]

798 matches, 137 goals for club and country.

Has won...

Arsenal

• FA Cup: 2004–05[193]
• FA Community Shield: 2004[194]
• Football League Cup runner-up: 2006–07[37]
• UEFA Champions League runner-up: 2005–06[195]

Barcelona

• La Liga: 2012–13[196]
• Copa del Rey: 2011–12[citation needed]
• Supercopa de España: 2011, 2013[citation needed]
• UEFA Super Cup: 2011[197]
• FIFA Club World Cup: 2011[citation needed]

Chelsea

• Premier League: 2014–15, 2016–17[198]
• FA Cup: 2017–18;[199] runner-up: 2016–17[200]
• Football League Cup: 2014–15[201]

Spain

• FIFA World Cup: 2010[202]
• UEFA European Championship: 2008, 2012[citation needed]

Individual

• FIFA U-17 World Championship Golden Ball: 2003[citation needed]
• FIFA U-17 World Championship Golden Shoe: 2003[citation needed]
• UEFA European Under-17 Football Championship Golden Player: 2004[citation needed]
• Bravo Award: 2006[citation needed]
• Golden Boy: 2006[citation needed]
• UEFA Team of the Year: 2006, 2008[citation needed]
• Premier League Player of the Month: January 2007, September 2007[198]
• Arsenal Player of the Season: 2006–07, 2007–08
• PFA Young Player of the Year: 2007–08[citation needed]
• PFA Team of the Year: 2007–08 Premier League,[203] 2009–10 Premier League[204]
• ESM Team of the Year: 2007–08, 2009–10, 2014–15[205]
• UEFA European Championship Team of the Tournament: 2008, 2012[citation needed]
• FIFA FIFPro World XI 5th team: 2014[206]

Orders

• Prince of Asturias Awards: 2010[citation needed]
• Gold Medal of the Royal Order of Sporting Merit: 2011[207]

Had to do something similar when some geezer suggested Neymar hasn't fulfilled his potential

Generally it seems that Fabregas isn't held in the same level of respect/joy by fans like Xavi and Iniesta are, but at his best he was possibly better.

Xavi and Iniesta are basically considered legends of spanish footballl and of the game overall, while Fabregas seems a tier below...

Nope and yeah

 

[tjb]

Move to Barca was the wrong one, he needed to be the main midfielder not second fiddle to Xavi and Busquets, wasn't the same player after that.

They made him play as a false 9 at times. If he wasn't so focused on going to Barcelona so much, Madrid would actually have been a great fit for him, as well as Bayern. I'm assuming that Arsenal would not have allowed him to come to us ( we would also have been a good fit and were actively looking for Scholes' replacement).

 

[duffer]

I think he could have been more. Forget the trophies, it's a team game. Fabregas made two bad decisions in his career. At the point he left Barcelona, you could make the case for him being a top 3 midfielder in the game. I don't think Modric two years ago was doing anything Fabregas could not have done. His first mistake was for staying at Arsenal for too long. Constantly finishing 4th while United and Chelsea were dominating both domestically and in Europe put him on the back burner of people's thoughts despite his excellence at the time. Everyone remembers the fantastic season's Drogba and Rooney had in 2010, Fabregas was just as good that year. And it's a real shame that's forgotten. The second bad move he made was forcing his way to a Barcelona team who didn't need him. There were better options at the time, and that was the worst option he could take given the reputation of Xavi and Iniesta at the time. His performances were judged directly against those players and given their status and the usual barcelona arrogance, rather than being accepted and idolized in another team, he was subjected to having to prove himself to fans who already had favourites. Those were his prime years. His season at Chelsea showed what he could have given if he had not made that move. Even if he had decided to stick with Arsenal, he would have been considered a true legend of that club.

Becoming the Spanish Matt Le Tissier* was probably a big fear, not an incentive to stay. He's a kid from Barca, you can't blame him for taking a chance to go home, especially when they were the best team in the world. Where else could he have realistically gone?

*club legend with nothing to show for it apart from a local pub named in your honour.

 

[laughtersassassin]

If you look at what he achieved with his team's he did. If you look at how he performed on the pitch from his move back to Braca on I wouldn't say so.

Cecsc broke through so young hand was so so good. Then at Barca he was always a tier below xavi and iniesta while potential wise he looked like he could have been as good or better at one stage.

In that way I don't think he fulfilled it, but that isn't really that bad. His potential was that he could have been one of Spain's greatest players and it turned out he just ended up being a very very good player with a lot of achievements. No shame in that.


Could compare to Rooney almost. Rooney was obviously top drawer but his potential at the age of 18-22 in my book was higher than what he achieved. Atleast on a yearly basis. Again no shame in it cause he was still ridiculously good.

 

[Bebestation]

I find the Rooney comparison completely unfair on Rooney. Rooney was left top scorer with united and England the teams he played in during that time and achieved all that he could with the career path of being loyal to United, a club that should have won much more CL titles during its strongest era and Rooney ended up declining in the same path as the club and the players around him like going from players like Ronaldo's & Tevez to Ashley young, Chicarito and Valencia. We arguably nearly went close to two decades relying on the class of 92 without having the guts to move on from it any earlier (a useful giggs playing in midfield but at a near 40) and Rooney was one of the only players to really stick through that.

A little bump came back when RVP came but a little too late and everyone including Rooney were useful but were on a decline and not in any sort of prime for the next chapter either.

Fabregas for me started off very young being too loyal to a club that had good players but couldn't always remain competitive, and ended up moving to a club where players had maintained a near perfected system for so long and that when Fabregas arrived he was simply not as good as the players around him playing that system. By the time he came to Chelsea I felt he had lost that spark after either a) not playing regularly enough as a starter or b) not playing in the PL like he did before in comparison to playing or training like a rusty Barcelona player or more likely just a combination of both and he was on a downward projection from there where you could see that spark in his eyes for football had gone due to his unfortunate career choices where he spent time on the bench a bit more than he should have. I remember him picking up some injuries at Barcelona as well.

For me Rooney's footballing spark was there in his eyes even if it wasnt always there in his lungs or the players around him for the last couple of years.

I think hes done well to grab a lot of trophies and was essential in the final passing to iniesta in the world cup. However as someone that never rated him higher than xavi, iniesta, xabi Alonso, Busquets - i think he has had a career trajectory he deserves and could have had a bit better due to intelligence rather than footballing ability.

 

[duffer]

Rooney was left top scorer with all the teams he played in

Well that's just not true at all.

 

[Bebestation]

Well that's just not true at all.

That's true. I should edit.

 

[thepolice123]

He was a tremendous talent. Its very rare you get a midfielder like him who can control the play in deeper areas and still maintain a high level of productivity. Probably the closest player to Platini in recent times.

I think he lost the "Barca DNA" and got it coached out of him during his time at England. When he went to Barca they wanted him to be Xavi's successor, but in truth, they were nothing alike. He was a more vertical and dynamic player, probably too vertical for Barca's football.

Would have been the perfect replacement for Scholes.

 

[adexkola]

People confuse the age a talent emerges with the extent of that talent.
He has had a fantastic career. You can't objectively say he should have achieved more.
He never struck me as a tiki-taka/juego de prosicion player.

Wasn't any space for that in the PL of his day. To his credit he played the perfect game at Arsenal.

I do recall rumblings about him being too direct and unsophisticated. I know I'll die wondering about where that twitter thread went

 

[amolbhatia50k]

I find the Rooney comparison completely unfair on Rooney. Rooney was left top scorer with united and England the teams he played in during that time and achieved all that he could with the career path of being loyal to United, a club that should have won much more CL titles during its strongest era and Rooney ended up declining in the same path as the club and the players around him like going from players like Ronaldo's & Tevez to Ashley young, Chicarito and Valencia. We arguably nearly went close to two decades relying on the class of 92 without having the guts to move on from it any earlier (a useful giggs playing in midfield but at a near 40) and Rooney was one of the only players to really stick through that.

A little bump came back when RVP came but a little too late and everyone including Rooney were useful but were on a decline and not in any sort of prime for the next chapter either.

Fabregas for me started off very young being too loyal to a club that had good players but couldn't always remain competitive, and ended up moving to a club where players had maintained a near perfected system for so long and that when Fabregas arrived he was simply not as good as the players around him playing that system. By the time he came to Chelsea I felt he had lost that spark after either a) not playing regularly enough as a starter or b) not playing in the PL like he did before in comparison to playing or training like a rusty Barcelona player or more likely just a combination of both and he was on a downward projection from there where you could see that spark in his eyes for football had gone due to his unfortunate career choices where he spent time on the bench a bit more than he should have. I remember him picking up some injuries at Barcelona as well.

For me Rooney's footballing spark was there in his eyes even if it wasnt always there in his lungs or the players around him for the last couple of years.

I think hes done well to grab a lot of trophies and was essential in the final passing to iniesta in the world cup. However as someone that never rated him higher than xavi, iniesta, xabi Alonso, Busquets - i think he has had a career trajectory he deserves and could have had a bit better due to intelligence rather than footballing ability.

I think people are using Rooney to apply the age/development curve logic. Fabregas was clearly not as good as Rooney.

At the end of the day, Fabregas developed quicker than his peers and hence was playing at an incredible level for his age. But it isn't all about how early you develop but the standard you achieve. And while his standard was great, there were others who were comfortably better. People mistake that for Fabregas not fulfilling his potential. He did. It's just that the potential wasn't as good as you thought it was.

 

[SambaBoy]

Was a lot more dynamic at Arsenal, which combined with his creativity put him as one of the best young midfielders in the world with the chance to progress which never really happened at Barcelona. Similar to Coutinho, a very talented player who went there and couldn't really nail down a position or the players infront of him were better. Came back to Chelsea, and had lost all the mobility that was present at Arsenal but was still an exceptional passer and was one of the best players in the first 6 months, constantly churning up key moments but then seemed to regress and was just a good player afterwards.

 

[MyOnlySolskjaer]

Good to see him doing well, was a great player to watch in his Arsenal days.

 

[TwoSheds]

No. First Wenger then Barca Gerrarded him. He was a top CM but only a decent no.10.

 

[kouroux]

That 45mins vs PSG, was his best performances I've watched in years. Sadly it's not something he's capable anymore of reproducing. For those mins though, he was amazing. Just needed a goal for it to be perfect and it wasn't for lack of chances

 

[MyOnlySolskjaer]

That 45mins vs PSG, was his best performances I've watched in years. Sadly it's not something he's capable anymore of reproducing. For those mins though, he was amazing. Just needed a goal for it to be perfect and it wasn't for lack of chances

Scored the winning penalty.

 

[Raees]

I don’t think he underachieved on a trophy front or even on a performance front (if we are talking about his career for Spain). As he was never going to be a better player than Xavi or Iniesta and they would always have been given primary roles in the National set up over him.

However I do think he should have left behind a greater legacy in terms of personal recognition - I think he could have been better or on a par with Scholes if he had never gone to Barcelona and wasted his prime.

He was never quite the same player after that move, affected his confidence and he didn’t move around the pitch in the same way but he could still be very effective and proved himself as the creator in chief under Jose.

Rooney is a good comparison - both ultimately leave behind a feeling of dissatisfaction even though statistically and trophy cabinet wise they did well.

 

[Lay]

Good to see him doing well, was a great player to watch in his Arsenal days.

Heard he's been shit in general though

 

[harms]

Nope. He began slowing down in his development even at Arsenal (personally I felt that the move to the number 10 was a bad choice for his development and it was more about Wenger trying to cover glaring holes in his team) and the move to Barca didn't work at all. He has performed quite decently there – I actually liked their partnership with Messi where Cesc played as a false 9/10, but it certainly didn't make the best use of his best qualities. At Chelsea he has performed very well as a deep-lying playmaker and almost broke an assist record, but he was hardly one of the best players in the league, let alone in the world at that point – and that was his potential.

He should've been what De Bruyne is now or Pirlo was earlier. His passing from deeper positions was out of his world, his shooting was great, and overall he was a very complete midfielder. Weirdly enough, a transfer to Real Madrid probably would've worked out better for him. He had a great career, but he could've achieved all-time greatness, he had all the tools to do so.

 

[duffer]

I wonder what his career would've looked like without those 8 years at Arsenal where he only won one FA cup.

 

[Donaldo]

It all went downhill once he got transplants.

 

[GifLord]

This was peak Fabregas

 

[JSArsenal]

I wonder what his career would've looked like without those 8 years at Arsenal where he only won one FA cup.

Far, far worse, Fabregas like all those other ungrateful urchins owe their entire careers to Wenger and his coaching.

I can't believe Fabregas was 24 when he left and basically ended up spending his prime years at Chelsea of all clubs. When everyone knows he had other options.

If he had stayed, Arsenal might have won the league.

It's strange, he ended up playing deeper for Chelsea at the end but I don't think he was good enough to play there earlier on in his career. Cesc had some fatal flaws in his game that Wenger covered up, were brutally exposed at Barcelona and then Chelsea tried to mitigate them as well. Given the player he actually was, he's fulfilled his potential. Arsenal didn't hold him back from anything.

 

[Andre Kagawa]

No I don't think he did. But that says more about how ridicilously talented he was rather than anything else. Unique player, really. Did he have any serious injuries?