Holland - Euro 2021 discussion

Terranova

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Is Timber any wood?
No really, every time someone screams "Timber!" he feels the need to fall to the ground.
 

Cheimoon

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Koeman out, De Boer in pretty much killed any hopes of serious challenge.
Think so too. Koeman had them overachieving, I don't see De Boer managing that. Looks like a very poor choice to me - even if I don't know who would have been better. (Van den Brom? More pragmatic like Koeman, I think, but it would've been a risky choice.)
 

diarm

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As I said in the OP, we need Berghuis. He might be average, but he's the only creative player in the entire team.
This lad just took the worst corner I've ever seen, and I've seen Phil Jones take corners.
 

AjaxCunian

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Depay is one of the best forwards in world football, simple as. Sure he can be a frustrating player, but I stand by that.
 

lefty_jakobz

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Scottish keeper cost them a victory tonight. Depay is still a great player, I expect him to have a good tournament and show why Barca are wanting to sign him.
 

KirkDuyt

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This lad just took the worst corner I've ever seen, and I've seen Phil Jones take corners.
Yeah fair enough :lol:
 

Baxter

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Scottish keeper cost them a victory tonight. Depay is still a great player, I expect him to have a good tournament and show why Barca are wanting to sign him.
The referee seeing that ‘foul’ on Depay might want to take credit.
 

RedDevilRoshi

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Scottish keeper cost them a victory tonight. Depay is still a great player, I expect him to have a good tournament and show why Barca are wanting to sign him.
How on earth did Gordon cost Scotland a victory tonight?

It was never a free kick in a million years for the equaliser in the 1st place. Referee was blowing every two mins Depay was theoretically throwing himself to the ground
 

lefty_jakobz

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How on earth did Gordon cost Scotland a victory tonight?

It was never a free kick in a million years for the equaliser in the 1st place. Referee was blowing every two mins Depay was theoretically throwing himself to the ground
I know but he stands and watches the ball for the freekick and should have done much better for the first one. Shame Allan MacGregor didnt come out of retirement for this tourney far and away a better keeper than Marshal or Gordon.
 

RedDevilRoshi

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I know but he stands and watches the ball for the freekick and should have done much better for the first one. Shame Allan MacGregor didnt come out of retirement for this tourney far and away a better keeper than Marshal or Gordon.
First goal, no one had picked up Depay who was in acres of space to take that strike. Could have taken 3-4 touches if he wanted to. Don’t know where the CB or DM was that was picking him up.

The free kick was a phenomenal strike by Depay. Couldn’t have hit it any sweeter than that. Even if Gordon dived, I doubt he would have stopped it or if he did, there was a Dutch player right next to him ready to tap it in.

I’m not Gordon’s biggest fan either and agree with you that I would have preferred Alan McGregor too in goals as he is better than both Marshall & Gordon.
 

RedDevilRoshi

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Wait, Gordon is still keeping goal for the Scots? He must be about 40 now
Yeah, he’s 2nd choice to Marshall who never traveled with the squad for tonight’s game after 6/7 players stayed behind at the training camp following John Fleck’s positive Covid case. Been playing in the 2nd tier with Hearts.
 

bosnian_red

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Shame Koeman left before having a go in the euros, you have a good squad that could've made an upset but with De Boer, unlikely to do anything.
 

KirkDuyt

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De Ligt was terrible tonight. He looks a worse player than he was at Ajax. He moves like a freighter.
 

PoTMS

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Is Depay any good or do Holland just make him look good? He seems to be their best player every game.
 

KirkDuyt

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Is Depay any good or do Holland just make him look good? He seems to be their best player every game.
I think Depay is very good. Definitely not world class, but he's a great attacking player.
 

KirkDuyt

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Christ Frank de Boer is such a monumental fecking numpty. I can honestly say that I would make a better coach than him. I'm at least more eloquent than saying uuuhhhhhhhhhhh I uhhhhj, duhhhh,

What a twat.
 

Monkers

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I think Depay is very good. Definitely not world class, but he's a great attacking player.
Stupid mistakes and decisions keep him from being world class, like today lost the ball with stupid tricks. Yes it's friendly but if you fail 3 times don't try a 4the.
 

lefty_jakobz

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First goal, no one had picked up Depay who was in acres of space to take that strike. Could have taken 3-4 touches if he wanted to. Don’t know where the CB or DM was that was picking him up.

The free kick was a phenomenal strike by Depay. Couldn’t have hit it any sweeter than that. Even if Gordon dived, I doubt he would have stopped it or if he did, there was a Dutch player right next to him ready to tap it in.

I’m not Gordon’s biggest fan either and agree with you that I would have preferred Alan McGregor too in goals as he is better than both Marshall & Gordon.
He was a brilliant keeper a few years ago but hes too many blunders in him now.
 

Luke1995

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Frenkie de Jong and Van De Beek do know each other well from their years at Ajax and Wijnaldum is a great player to have in your midfield

So, if these three get on well on the pitch, Holland should have a good chance to at least reach the semifinals. They are very good.

Of course you never know what's gonna happen in a game, but on paper, they should be able to get out of that group fairly easily.
 

Trequarista10

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Does Koopmeiners not get a look in for the Dutch at all? Only has one cap according to wiki. I have an irrational admiration for him based on a couple YouTube compilations and signing him on FM. I guess Blind and De Jong occupy similar roles?
 

Cheimoon

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Does Koopmeiners not get a look in for the Dutch at all? Only has one cap according to wiki. I have an irrational admiration for him based on a couple YouTube compilations and signing him on FM. I guess Blind and De Jong occupy similar roles?
He's close but not close enough. He was in the preselection of 34 (do other countries do that? Always found this very weird...), but didn't make it into the final squad of 26. There are quite a few similar decent midfielders; not sure why he didn't make it specifically (e.g. instead of Van de Beek).
 

Cheimoon

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Do they do polls on coaches? I wonder where support for De Boer is polling now - and not because of this one match...
 

KirkDuyt

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I almost feel bad for Frank de Boer. He is one of the most clueless football managers I can remember. Sure, everyone can have poor results, but these last 2 weeks he's handled basically everything the wrong way. He started by talking about how he called the guys that didn't make the cut personally only for two of them to come out and say that they either learned it from a text message and the other one from the announcement in the media. Then there's the Cillessen cock up, which is honestly a headscratcher since you can still switch keepers until well into the tournament apparently. Now there's the sudden change to 5-3-2, which after utterly failing against a Scotland that was missing 3/4 , still seems to have worked out rather well according to Frank.

Mourinho was right about him. If our -21's make the Euros final tonight I think we should reward them, by sending them to the real thing instead of the pile of crap I saw yesterday. Well except Steven Berghuis, we always bring him.
 

VanDeBank

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Our best players are probably De Ligt, De Jong, Depay and Steven Berghuis.
No Botman?
Nope, not good enough.
Bringing the Ajax/Feyenoord biases to the NT is so cute :lol:

(Berghuis = Feyenoord captain, Botman = Young Lille CB sold by Ajax for peanuts)

I'm not as overly pessimistic as some of the Dutchfolk here. De Boer did a lot of stuff he would never do in a real game, like subbing his 2 class midfielders (Wijnaldum & De Jong) 30 minutes in to rest them or playing De Ligt on the left to hand Timber his debut. He might shit the bed like so many do on their debut and now it's out of the way. Blind and Ake are both left footed and the lead up to the first goal was a terrible ball by De Ligt with his left foot.

I was a bit dissapointed by Wijndal, there was one AZ game this season where he also struggled in a 5-3-2. The problem with Van Aanholt is that he can't cross to save his life. I thought Weghorst and De Jong did fine considering they got very little service.

My guess is if De Boer pulls it out again it will be against a very strong side where we sit back and play on the counter, with Malen up top.

Memphis Malen
De Jong Wijnaldum ?
Van Aanholt Blind De Vrij De Ligt Dumfries
?

It's not hard to swap back to a 4-3-3, take off a CB, add Berghuis and voila.

Krul and De Roon have been underwhelming every time I've seen them play now. I think De Boer should cut his losses and play Stekelenburg and Gravenberch instead.

The Dutch will smash groups (with their patented 4-3-3), get a lot of hype and either win penalties against an awful side or get crushed by Portugal/Italy in the first knockout game.
 

KirkDuyt

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Bringing the Ajax/Feyenoord biases to the NT is so cute :lol:

(Berghuis = Feyenoord captain, Botman = Young Lille CB sold by Ajax for peanuts)

I'm not as overly pessimistic as some of the Dutchfolk here. De Boer did a lot of stuff he would never do in a real game, like subbing his 2 class midfielders (Wijnaldum & De Jong) 30 minutes in to rest them or playing De Ligt on the left to hand Timber his debut. He might shit the bed like so many do on their debut and now it's out of the way. Blind and Ake are both left footed and the lead up to the first goal was a terrible ball by De Ligt with his left foot.

I was a bit dissapointed by Wijndal, there was one AZ game this season where he also struggled in a 5-3-2. The problem with Van Aanholt is that he can't cross to save his life. I thought Weghorst and De Jong did fine considering they got very little service.

My guess is if De Boer pulls it out again it will be against a very strong side where we sit back and play on the counter, with Malen up top.

Memphis Malen
De Jong Wijnaldum ?
Van Aanholt Blind De Vrij De Ligt Dumfries
?

It's not hard to swap back to a 4-3-3, take off a CB, add Berghuis and voila.

Krul and De Roon have been underwhelming every time I've seen them play now. I think De Boer should cut his losses and play Stekelenburg and Gravenberch instead.

The Dutch will smash groups (with their patented 4-3-3), get a lot of hype and either win penalties against an awful side or get crushed by Portugal/Italy in the first knockout game.
How dare you, Berghuis is the greatest player to ever grace Dutch football. And he's such a great sportsman too! Honestly though, it's my running gag to be a Berghuis fan, I just really like the guy even though he's obviously a bit cack.

I agree with the rest of your analyses actually and I'm always optimistic for a tournament. We were crap in 2014 as well and look how that turned out for Spain.

He declined, didn't want to go without Robben.
I finally get this joke, took me a bit under a day. :lol:
 

Terranova

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Bringing the Ajax/Feyenoord biases to the NT is so cute :lol:

(Berghuis = Feyenoord captain, Botman = Young Lille CB sold by Ajax for peanuts)

I'm not as overly pessimistic as some of the Dutchfolk here. De Boer did a lot of stuff he would never do in a real game, like subbing his 2 class midfielders (Wijnaldum & De Jong) 30 minutes in to rest them or playing De Ligt on the left to hand Timber his debut. He might shit the bed like so many do on their debut and now it's out of the way. Blind and Ake are both left footed and the lead up to the first goal was a terrible ball by De Ligt with his left foot.

I was a bit dissapointed by Wijndal, there was one AZ game this season where he also struggled in a 5-3-2. The problem with Van Aanholt is that he can't cross to save his life. I thought Weghorst and De Jong did fine considering they got very little service.

My guess is if De Boer pulls it out again it will be against a very strong side where we sit back and play on the counter, with Malen up top.

Memphis Malen
De Jong Wijnaldum ?
Van Aanholt Blind De Vrij De Ligt Dumfries
?

It's not hard to swap back to a 4-3-3, take off a CB, add Berghuis and voila.

Krul and De Roon have been underwhelming every time I've seen them play now. I think De Boer should cut his losses and play Stekelenburg and Gravenberch instead.

The Dutch will smash groups (with their patented 4-3-3), get a lot of hype and either win penalties against an awful side or get crushed by Portugal/Italy in the first knockout game.
How is saying that Botman isn't good enough an Ajax bias, it's more like that i should've wanted him in the NT if my post was biased towards Ajax?

Besides he wasn't sold for peanuts. 9ish million Euros including add-ons for a player that never played a minute for Ajax and wasn't going to be good enough anytime soon, that's a huge transfer sum for the Eredivisie and a player of his status.

Botman isn't better than Van Dijk/De Ligt/De Vrij/Blind/Aké and Timber did what Botman couldn't, get a starting XI spot at Ajax, while being more than a year younger. So unless there are going to be a lot of injuries, he's not going to play much for the Dutch NT the coming years.
 

KirkDuyt

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How is saying that Botman isn't good enough an Ajax bias, it's more like that i should've wanted him in the NT if my post was biased towards Ajax?

Besides he wasn't sold for peanuts. 9ish million Euros including add-ons for a player that never played a minute for Ajax and wasn't going to be good enough anytime soon, that's a huge transfer sum for the Eredivisie and a player of his status.

Botman isn't better than Van Dijk/De Ligt/De Vrij/Blind/Aké and Timber did what Botman couldn't, get a starting XI spot at Ajax, while being more than a year younger. So unless there are going to be a lot of injuries, he's not going to play much for the Dutch NT the coming years.
Yeah I don't see the Botman hype, though truth be told I watched him exactly twice this season, when he was eliminated in the EL by Ajax. Same goes for Mitchell Bakker, I have no idea how he is getting minutes at PSG. He makes Malacia look like Roberto Carlos.
 

Terranova

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Yeah I don't see the Botman hype, though truth be told I watched him exactly twice this season, when he was eliminated in the EL by Ajax. Same goes for Mitchell Bakker, I have no idea how he is getting minutes at PSG. He makes Malacia look like Roberto Carlos.
Must be a Dutch thing i guess, likewise i'm always suprised when people name Schuurs as a big talent. Not our type of defender i guess.

Not that Botman is a bad defender, but the Dutch NT is stacked with world class central defenders. De Vrij only gets playing time because both Van Dijk and Blind are injured(and that horrible 5-3-2 expirement). So Botman isn't going to get much playing time at the NT any time soon. Neither are Aké and Timber in CB and they are ahead of Botman.
 

Cheimoon

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Must be a Dutch thing i guess, likewise i'm always suprised when people name Schuurs as a big talent. Not our type of defender i guess.

Not that Botman is a bad defender, but the Dutch NT is stacked with world class central defenders. De Vrij only gets playing time because both Van Dijk and Blind are injured(and that horrible 5-3-2 expirement). So Botman isn't going to get much playing time at the NT any time soon. Neither are Aké and Timber in CB and they are ahead of Botman.
Surely De Vrij is ahead of Blind in the picking order for the 'real' CB positions though? I mean in a 4-x-x system; in a 5-x-x-x, there is usually one CB with a less traditional CB focus, for which I suppose people like Blind or maybe also De Roon are great. (Depending on how De Boer is implementing it. I didn't see the match, but I hope he didn't play 5 at the back and also play a DM among the 3 midfielders in front of them...)
 

Terranova

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Surely De Vrij is ahead of Blind in the picking order for the 'real' CB positions though? I mean in a 4-x-x system; in a 5-x-x-x, there is usually one CB with a less traditional CB focus, for which I suppose people like Blind or maybe also De Roon are great. (Depending on how De Boer is implementing it. I didn't see the match, but I hope he didn't play 5 at the back and also play a DM among the 3 midfielders in front of them...)
No, Dutch coaches mostly go for a lefty and a righty. Unless it's the Van Dijk/De Ligt combo. So Blind is playing more often than De Vrij
 

KirkDuyt

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Surely De Vrij is ahead of Blind in the picking order for the 'real' CB positions though? I mean in a 4-x-x system; in a 5-x-x-x, there is usually one CB with a less traditional CB focus, for which I suppose people like Blind or maybe also De Roon are great. (Depending on how De Boer is implementing it. I didn't see the match, but I hope he didn't play 5 at the back and also play a DM among the 3 midfielders in front of them...)
Not sure to be honest. De Ligt and De Vrij dont make a stellar partnership and De Vrij and interlands havent been a happy marriage since 2014. Also as @Terranova mentioned Blind usually gets the nod for the LCV spot.
 

dutchred

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Must be a Dutch thing i guess, likewise i'm always suprised when people name Schuurs as a big talent. Not our type of defender i guess.

Not that Botman is a bad defender, but the Dutch NT is stacked with world class central defenders. De Vrij only gets playing time because both Van Dijk and Blind are injured(and that horrible 5-3-2 expirement). So Botman isn't going to get much playing time at the NT any time soon. Neither are Aké and Timber in CB and they are ahead of Botman.
Timber was our best player last night and I think he is a better right back than Dumfries