Gaming Hollow Knight - GOAT Metroidvania

Ainu

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I do remember going through a different section and eventually falling into it.

My question was phrased wrong. I meant that now that I've completed this section early, will it feck up anything later on?

An example, some NPC gave me a delicate flower, I didn't know what that is. I died a little while later and I've fecked up that mission. If I did it later, I probably would have been strong enough to complete that mission...

Off topic, based on where I am in the game, is there a way to easily get geo? I really can't get over losing all them dollar dollar bills and really want to get more charm notches.

I'm currently getting through the levels and bosses on 3 notches and the factory setting amount of life...
Don't worry, you haven't messed up anything. The delicate flower quest can be attempted as many times as you want. You can try it again right now or come back much later when you've got more upgrades and charms. This game is designed to play in whatever order you like. The only true limits are areas that require specific abilities to access, the rest depends on your skill and determination. There is probably an optimal route, but I certainly didn't find it, as I was all over the place in my playthrough. It doesn't matter in the end though.

I don't think I've ever specifically grinded for geo, except at the end to get the unbreakable charms. I did the Trial of the Conquerer over and over for that, but that's pretty much endgame. I don't know where you've been already. The Great Husk Sentries (large guard type enemies) in east City of Tears (near King's Station) give a good deal of geo, but they're tough bastards and deal double damage. If you haven't been there yet or don't want to fight them, I believe the Moss Knights in Greenpath also give decent geo.

You're not going to get thousands of geo fast like this, but every time you get a couple of hundred there's probably something you can spend it on. Don't try to save up too much to spend at once, just go spend whatever you can when you can.
 

Dirty Schwein

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Don't worry, you haven't messed up anything. The delicate flower quest can be attempted as many times as you want. You can try it again right now or come back much later when you've got more upgrades and charms. This game is designed to play in whatever order you like. The only true limits are areas that require specific abilities to access, the rest depends on your skill and determination. There is probably an optimal route, but I certainly didn't find it, as I was all over the place in my playthrough. It doesn't matter in the end though.

I don't think I've ever specifically grinded for geo, except at the end to get the unbreakable charms. I did the Trial of the Conquerer over and over for that, but that's pretty much endgame. I don't know where you've been already. The Great Husk Sentries (large guard type enemies) in east City of Tears (near King's Station) give a good deal of geo, but they're tough bastards and deal double damage. If you haven't been there yet or don't want to fight them, I believe the Moss Knights in Greenpath also give decent geo.

You're not going to get thousands of geo fast like this, but every time you get a couple of hundred there's probably something you can spend it on. Don't try to save up too much to spend at once, just go spend whatever you can when you can.
Thanks sensei! I have fecked up by going to fight broken vessel early though. A lot of the earlier areas are now infected so it's much tougher :lol:
 

Ainu

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Ah yes, I avoided the Infected Crossroads for a while when that happened. Those Furious Vengeflies are a handful.
 

Dirty Schwein

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Had a frustrating one earlier. I was going through Queens Garden and killed one of the bosses. I roamed around looking to kill more mofos and realized this black goo was stopping me getting through a certain area. As I've explored everything else there, this is the only unexplored route... I assume I have to upgrade my cloak to get through this?

Secondly, where can I get the black version of vengeful spirit?

Finally, I found a bank... It's it safe to deposit geo in there? The old lady stunk of con artist to me :lol:
 

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Shade Soul (Vengeful Spirit upgrade) is in City of Tears just below the room where you fight Soul Master.

Shade Cloak, that'll get you through the black barriers, is in the Abyss, below Ancient Basin. You'll need the King's Brand from Kingdom's edge first though.

Sure why not bank with the nice old lady, what could possibly go wrong...

I did all the speed runs and am now on my Steel Soul run, not too tough yet.
 

Dirty Schwein

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Shade Soul (Vengeful Spirit upgrade) is in City of Tears just below the room where you fight Soul Master.

Shade Cloak, that'll get you through the black barriers, is in the Abyss, below Ancient Basin. You'll need the King's Brand from Kingdom's edge first though.

Sure why not bank with the nice old lady, what could possibly go wrong...

I did all the speed runs and am now on my Steel Soul run, not too tough yet.
Thanks mate. I better trek back to City Of Tears soon then!
 

afrocentricity

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Yeah that bank is a godsend!
feck me I'm so annoyed at this game now!

I finally got a respectable amount of geo by trading in a bunch of collectables for about 8k. Then on the way to the shop I accidentally died. I was heading back to my Shadow and was nervous, palms sweaty, vomit on my sweater, mom's spaghetti... Then I died again and lost all my monies :(
I didn't lose as much as you, but truthfully it doesn't matter that much, you'll get loads more. That first time does hurt though :lol:
 

Dirty Schwein

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Yeah that bank is a godsend!

I didn't lose as much as you, but truthfully it doesn't matter that much, you'll get loads more. That first time does hurt though :lol:
It's fine I've moved on but now I know how my dad felt when he went bankrupt many years ago :lol:

I think I'm close to ending the campaign now and I'm really enjoying the game (despite being awful at it).

It took me so many attempts to kill Hornet the second time round.

The one boss that I just couldn't kill (and gave up trying) is the Lost Kin. Just too difficult. Strange considering I slapped up Broken Vessel in one go with limited charms.

Once the black egg things opens, I may go around finishing as many side missions as I can before taking on final boss as I'm the kind of player that is unlikely to pick up the games once the campaign is finished.
 

Ainu

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It's fine I've moved on but now I know how my dad felt when he went bankrupt many years ago :lol:

I think I'm close to ending the campaign now and I'm really enjoying the game (despite being awful at it).

It took me so many attempts to kill Hornet the second time round.

The one boss that I just couldn't kill (and gave up trying) is the Lost Kin. Just too difficult. Strange considering I slapped up Broken Vessel in one go with limited charms.

Once the black egg things opens, I may go around finishing as many side missions as I can before taking on final boss as I'm the kind of player that is unlikely to pick up the games once the campaign is finished.
The hardest thing about Lost Kin for me was the blobs he was constantly summoning. If you have the Defender's Crest charm, it's a life saver here.
 

Dirty Schwein

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The hardest thing about Lost Kin for me was the blobs he was constantly summoning. If you have the Defender's Crest charm, it's a life saver here.
Yeah they are annoying. I do have that charm and been using it but still can't kill him. I'll come back to him once I fully upgraded my nail. Then I'll shove it in his arse.
 

Dirty Schwein

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The hardest thing about Lost Kin for me was the blobs he was constantly summoning. If you have the Defender's Crest charm, it's a life saver here.
You told me about a combination of charms that gives you infinite attempts at platforming sections... I can't seem to find the post... Can you tell me again please sensei?
 

Ainu

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You told me about a combination of charms that gives you infinite attempts at platforming sections... I can't seem to find the post... Can you tell me again please sensei?
Hiveblood, Grubsong and Deep Focus. Deep Focus is not essential but it gives you more margin for error. The idea is that Grubsong generates enough soul from failed attempts to heal the masks that you don't regenerate with Hiveblood. Deep Focus helps but if it's too much of a bother to acquire, you could try without it.
 

Dirty Schwein

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Hiveblood, Grubsong and Deep Focus. Deep Focus is not essential but it gives you more margin for error. The idea is that Grubsong generates enough soul from failed attempts to heal the masks that you don't regenerate with Hiveblood. Deep Focus helps but if it's too much of a bother to acquire, you could try without it.
I have deep focus and grubsong. I guess I'll need to find the hiveblood. Thanks mate.
 

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Just got Zote Radiant. I did the Speedrun and Steel Soul modes which aren't really that taxing if you stick to a route and be careful. All I need now is to complete Hallownest Pantheon get a few more Radiant trophies and then I'm ready for Silksong.
 

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The hardest thing about Lost Kin for me was the blobs he was constantly summoning. If you have the Defender's Crest charm, it's a life saver here.
Ok so I got that ability to dash through enemies and went to battle this fool again. Beat him in one go. Then I stood over his body and spat at him whilst shouting "BREXIT MEANS BREXIT!"

Now I will look to for the hive charm.

I initially wanted to just beat the campaign but now I've fallen in love with the game and am doing all the side missions to prolong it... Plus, I'm scared to attempt either the white palace or the temple of the black egg...
 

Dirty Schwein

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Thank feck I destroyed the Hive Knight in two attempts. The journey to him was so long, I didn't want to repeat that over and over.

I finished trial of the warrior in one attempt and trial of the conqueror in two attempts (first attempt I forgot to equip Mark of Pride).

How much is the difficulty turned up in trial of the fool?

Also there is a Zote boss now in Dirtmouth. I beat a couple of times but he doesn't give any rewards? What's the point of him?

I also came across a black thing with white face like the bad guy from Spirited Away. It was just in the corner somewhere (I think Deepest) then it vanished. What the hell was that? Creeped the hell out of me :lol:
 

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Trial of the Fool is quite a bit harder than the other two, especially the section without floors. I had to play it over and over until I knew pretty much every spawn point and could Great Slash the most annoying enemies the moment they appear. Nailmaster's Glory is your friend here. Also, knowing which enemies to keep alive for easy dream nailing and healing opportunities can help. And no, Zote doesn't give you any real rewards.

@dumbo You're hardcore. Good luck with Pantheon of Hallownest. I've found that the pantheons aren't really my thing, so I'm moving on from the game. I'll probably pick up Silksong as soon as it is out.
 

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@Moby we're the only two left m get back on it. Let's finish this thing!
:lol: Bro I respect you on having the patience to stick with it and get it done. I gave up long back after having a look on YouTube on what's in store even if I am able to get past the bosses I was last playing and I've just not got the patience for it. It might get easier with charms nail upgrades and stuff but my gripe with this game is not just difficult bosses but the scarcity of benches and also fast travel only from stations which fecks me up. It's just added chore everytime you have to repeat a boss fight you have to traverse the same shit route like a moron. It honestly feels worse than my day job at that point especially in cases where platforming can be pretty tough as well.

Overall as much as I absolutely admire the design and concept the who experience is pretty much designed for super dedicated gamers. I moved on to playing Persona 5 a while back which takes a lifetime to complete so not sure if I'll ever get back to this. I still enjoy watching speed runs on YouTube and just thinking how mental some of those guys are working on this for like months just to reduce a few seconds on their personal bests. I'm nowhere near that level. :lol:
 

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I'd still say you don't have to be super dedicated or anything to just complete the game. Trial of the Fool, Path of Pain and Godhome content are the only things that require serious dedication and they are all optional. The main game does ask more from the player than most games do, but nothing too bad. Of course, the most important thing is that you actually enjoy it.
 

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I'd still say you don't have to be super dedicated or anything to just complete the game. Trial of the Fool, Path of Pain and Godhome content are the only things that require serious dedication and they are all optional. The main game does ask more from the player than most games do, but nothing too bad. Of course, the most important thing is that you actually enjoy it.
The last part is the main thing of course. And I no doubt enjoyed it, but I think this has been mentioned previously as well that they could have made it slightly less exhausting by avoiding a few things, like not having the stag station as a separate point for fast travel and just allow fast travel from any bench to any bench. It's not like benches are everywhere anyway but that would just make it less frustrating for casual gamers like myself and it would be easier to enjoy to actual good stuff in the game.

But honestly, I think you are underestimating the skill required in this, it's not 'super easy' and certainly requires a certain amount of it at one point, at least from what I've seen. More in terms of platforming actually as compared to boss battles. You end up finding tricks to get past most courses without actually needing some crazy reflexes or anything but finding those ways for every course and every enemy itself is a painstaking process and requires you to be really invested in the game. As I said before my patience is just far far lower than what is needed for this, and I respect everyone who has managed to get all of it done, it is surely not an easy feat for most people.
 

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:lol: Bro I respect you on having the patience to stick with it and get it done. I gave up long back after having a look on YouTube on what's in store even if I am able to get past the bosses I was last playing and I've just not got the patience for it. It might get easier with charms nail upgrades and stuff but my gripe with this game is not just difficult bosses but the scarcity of benches and also fast travel only from stations which fecks me up. It's just added chore everytime you have to repeat a boss fight you have to traverse the same shit route like a moron. It honestly feels worse than my day job at that point especially in cases where platforming can be pretty tough as well.

Overall as much as I absolutely admire the design and concept the who experience is pretty much designed for super dedicated gamers. I moved on to playing Persona 5 a while back which takes a lifetime to complete so not sure if I'll ever get back to this. I still enjoy watching speed runs on YouTube and just thinking how mental some of those guys are working on this for like months just to reduce a few seconds on their personal bests. I'm nowhere near that level. :lol:
To be fair it gets a hell of a lot easier (and more enjoyable) as you upgrade your abilities. As you open up more of the map, there are a lot more travel stags as well. Don't worry brother, I'll complete this for the both of us!

I'm not gonna get the crazy percentage some people here got but I'll do my best.

I'm scared of going into white palace...
 

Ainu

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The last part is the main thing of course. And I no doubt enjoyed it, but I think this has been mentioned previously as well that they could have made it slightly less exhausting by avoiding a few things, like not having the stag station as a separate point for fast travel and just allow fast travel from any bench to any bench. It's not like benches are everywhere anyway but that would just make it less frustrating for casual gamers like myself and it would be easier to enjoy to actual good stuff in the game.

But honestly, I think you are underestimating the skill required in this, it's not 'super easy' and certainly requires a certain amount of it at one point, at least from what I've seen. More in terms of platforming actually as compared to boss battles. You end up finding tricks to get past most courses without actually needing some crazy reflexes or anything but finding those ways for every course and every enemy itself is a painstaking process and requires you to be really invested in the game. As I said before my patience is just far far lower than what is needed for this, and I respect everyone who has managed to get all of it done, it is surely not an easy feat for most people.
It's certainly not super easy. Like I said, compared to the average game, it's on the harder end of the spectrum. But there's a significant gap in difficulty between just finishing the game and its harder challenges. A normal playthrough is in Dark Souls territory, though as with all of those games, YMMV.

I know I was frustrated at several points (evidence in this thread) but a little bit of frustration during a playthrough is okay for me. As long as it's manageable. Difficulty is a funny thing, no one would have to ask me to, e.g. play through a game like Uncharted on the highest difficulty, because I'd throw my controller out of the window in frustration. But I'm always up for the type of challenge found in a game like this.
 

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It's certainly not super easy. Like I said, compared to the average game, it's on the harder end of the spectrum. But there's a significant gap in difficulty between just finishing the game and its harder challenges. A normal playthrough is in Dark Souls territory, though as with all of those games, YMMV.

I know I was frustrated at several points (evidence in this thread) but a little bit of frustration during a playthrough is okay for me. As long as it's manageable. Difficulty is a funny thing, no one would have to ask me to, e.g. play through a game like Uncharted on the highest difficulty, because I'd throw my controller out of the window in frustration. But I'm always up for the type of challenge found in a game like this.
What bosses did you find the most difficult? I want to see if I beat them... I'm really scared to fight Hollow Knight. If this game is like most in the sense that the final boss is the hardest, I'm fecked :lol:
 

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What bosses did you find the most difficult? I want to see if I beat them... I'm really scared to fight Hollow Knight. If this game is like most in the sense that the final boss is the hardest, I'm fecked :lol:
I think my hatred for Zote is well documented in this thread. :lol: Although that was only really from level 4 Zote onwards. It's hard to say which I found the most difficult, some of them were very tricky at the time but once you figure them out, you'll get them pretty much every time without much difficulty. Zote is a boss that doesn't follow that pattern, which is why I hate him so much. Watcher Knights and Traitor Lord were pretty hard for me. Edit: also, for some reason I really don't like the Oblobbles. I just don't handle randomness well.

I would say the normal final boss is not hard at all. There is an optional boss you can fight afterwards which is pretty damn hard though. Let's just say by the time you'll beat that extra boss, the original final boss will have become a joke. The hardest bosses are found in the pantheons, or at the end of another DLC pack depending on your choice.
 

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Just realised that concept of earning souls/points which you can then utilise either towards attacks or health records which is in ghosts of Tsushima was one I first saw in Hollow Knight. Was the latter the first to use this or has it been around before?
 

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feck me just came across the watcher Knights... I don't think I can kill these guys. So hard.
 

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feck me just came across the watcher Knights... I don't think I can kill these guys. So hard.
Urgh each time I see "watcher knights" mentioned, painful memories jump in my mind. +20 tries for 1 or 2 hours before I got them.
 

Dirty Schwein

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Urgh each time I see "watcher knights" mentioned, painful memories jump in my mind. +20 tries for 1 or 2 hours before I got them.
Actually done it quite quickly in the end. Basically I equipped quick focus and done it quite easily. Hornet 2 or Lost Kin remain the hardest bosses so far for me... Probably the former as I was under-equipped when facing Kin.
 

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Actually done it quite quickly in the end. Basically I equipped quick focus and done it quite easily. Hornet 2 or Lost Kin remain the hardest bosses so far for me... Probably the former as I was under-equipped when facing Kin.
I found bosses in Hollow Knight to be mostly "trial and error till you memorize all attacks perfectly" kind of bosses. The Watcher Knights difficulty for me came from the fact I struggled to maintain perfect concentration facing 2 at the same time for 3 fights in a row. I started out well then it became way too much for my reflexes to keep concentrating after defeating 3 or so of them. Took really, really long time to manage to put on such a perfect fight, even though I had ton of health.

Lost Kin dream fight was the second hardest for me. Also the same problem, I thought during fighting and dying to him that his attacks aren't really that hard to dodge, but it's the point of having full concentration and not losing it for one second or you're dead. This is the formula of "trial and error" boss fights at the end of the day.
 

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I found bosses in Hollow Knight to be mostly "trial and error till you memorize all attacks perfectly" kind of bosses. The Watcher Knights difficulty for me came from the fact I struggled to maintain perfect concentration facing 2 at the same time for 3 fights in a row. I started out well then it became way too much for my reflexes to keep concentrating after defeating 3 or so of them. Took really, really long time to manage to put on such a perfect fight, even though I had ton of health.

Lost Kin dream fight was the second hardest for me. Also the same problem, I thought during fighting and dying to him that his attacks aren't really that hard to dodge, but it's the point of having full concentration and not losing it for one second or you're dead. This is the formula of "trial and error" boss fights at the end of the day.
How did you fare with Hornet 2? I found that the hardest by a mile. Must have tried 20+ times before I finally snapped her. "Ighalo!"
 

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feck me just came across the watcher Knights... I don't think I can kill these guys. So hard.
Urgh each time I see "watcher knights" mentioned, painful memories jump in my mind. +20 tries for 1 or 2 hours before I got them.
Did you two realise you can kill one of them before even starting the fight?

I didn't until I beat them which was annoying.
 

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Right before you enter the boss arena there is a hidden area above where you can cut a chandelier which drops on to one of the knights below.
That would have helped :lol:

Needless to say, I've faced worse bosses.
 

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Watcher Knight is about as tough as it gets when first encountering them. That you have to face multiple enemies with unpredictable patterns and wide hit-boxes makes it tough regardless of the charms and upgrades, it's quite overwhelming. Funnily enough once you learn their pattern of behaviour, you can very simply corral them and they become one of the easiest, most predictable bosses. They are great
by the time you meet them in the Pantheon because you can use them to restore health and farm soul for the harder bosses to come.

It might be the best games I've ever played in terms of difficulty progression, maybe with Super Mario Bros 3.

It's pretty easy for a long time before gradually ramping up the difficulty, allowing the player to complete the game at a good level of challenge. From there it gives you the player the ability to tailor the level of challenge to their own desire, all the way up to an eye-watering level of difficulty. All bindings Hallownest Pantheon is possibly the hardest dev-designed difficulty I've seen in a game, it certainly feels like it would be harder than completing something like Battletoads.
 

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The secret to Hornet which I stumbled upon quite by accident after almost always dying to her in the Pantheons, is that you simply have to counter her own attacks. Unlike other bosses who mostly attack you first and then stop to allow you a clear window to take multiple strikes, Hornet will relentless move. Which means you barely have to move yourself. Just watch her and when she executes an attack either evade or pogo her head depending on the attack. She can be done hitlessly quite easily if you are being patient.