Barca understands one thing that we havent figured our for years, even in Sir Alex last seasons: a competent midfield. From there, you build your squad around it.
How do Barcelona rebuild?
- Thread starter Bojan11
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
It's Fergie's legacy to not give a shit about good central midfield at United.
United has been left behind in regards to midfielders for more than a decade now.
The Barcelona rebuild shows what you can do when your leadership, for them Laporta, comes in with a clear idea of:
Having leadership that knows exactly where its taking the club, and what that should look like, is vital to a successful rebuild. Hence, why at United we have p'd away the last 10 years doing sweet F.A. Whereas nobody would be shocked if Barcelona wins La Liga next season.
- What type of football team you want to be
- What type of coach is good at implementing that type of football
- What type of player best suits that type of football
Having leadership that knows exactly where its taking the club, and what that should look like, is vital to a successful rebuild. Hence, why at United we have p'd away the last 10 years doing sweet F.A. Whereas nobody would be shocked if Barcelona wins La Liga next season.
Let's wait until Barca mount a serious title challenge and reach the final stages of the champions league before saying they've rebuilt
I've seen United have too many false dawns to declare other clubs an overnight success.
I've seen United have too many false dawns to declare other clubs an overnight success.
Funny how quick they'll sell out on their principles when they need a bit of extra cash.
They'll jump on the dodgy crypto bandwagon with the rest of Europe's elite soon enough.
Even under our Ole new manager bounce we never went to the Emptyhad or Anfield and doled out four nil beatings.
Of course they will. This is the team that won its first European Cup by assembling a 'dream team' and was buying the biggest names in the game in the 1990s. For all the storytelling Romario, Stoichkov and Hagi were not born in Catalonia. However, that's one of the things you have to admire about Barcelona. When it has an idea, whatever it is, it puts in place the things it needs to make the most of it. United seem only able to do that off the pitch and, even now, I'd argue other teams are becoming much more innovative than we are. There are plenty of teams that have better digital content than we do these days. Plus, our commercial revenue growth has levelled off over the past few years.
Funny how quick they'll sell out on their principles when they need a bit of extra cash.
They'll jump on the dodgy crypto bandwagon with the rest of Europe's elite soon enough.
We hardly ever did under Fergie. I can barely remember us scoring more than 2 at Anfield after 2000.
To follow up on my post with some trivia. We last scored four goals at Anfield in 1969.
https://www.11v11.com/matches/liverpool-v-manchester-united-13-december-1969-80497/
You are not wrong, too early to call it a rebirth yet, but there is a difference to our false dawns here. Barca plays some good football, something we very rarely did, even during our better phases it always felt like we had our fair share of luck and individual skill, doesn't mean that this will last though.
The difference with this Barcelona side is that they seem to follow a very clear idea of play.
This not only shows that Xavi has some qualities as a manager (in that he seems to be able to get his ideas across), but also makes scouting new players a whole lot easier.
Good team football is something that is far more sustainable than luck or individual skills. Luck will run out and individuals may run out of form.
But a team collectively doing well? That's much harder to fade away.
The difference between United and Barça is that we have a competent leadership and a deeply ingrained football DNA.
We're not winning games thanks to our individualities, we're having an extremely good run of form thanks to a well drilled system which enhance the inherent strength of our players while giding their weaknesses.
For now, the only way to go is up.
To be fair, despite Barca being broken, financially crippled and a complete mess that needed rebuilding from the ground up….they still look million miles away from where we are right now. We still need to pay for cement and bricks to start our rebuild.
It’s quite depressing. We simply refuse to address the midfield.
The generally have the same midfield they did under Koeman, no?
If anything it's in attack where they've upgrade between Xavi and pre-Xavi. They've added Ferran Torres, Adama Traore, Aubemyang and Ousmane Dembele's returned from injury.
Our midfield definitely does need improving, but for me the one biggest constant that we've had during SAF's years vs the post SAF years is just how bad our attack has been. Even now, almost 10 years on, which of our attackers would get into other top sides? Maybe Sancho once he improves a bit, but that's it. The rest of our wide forwards at the start of the season were converted strikers (Rashford, Martial, Greenwood). Look back at 07/08.. Nani, Ronaldo, Tevez, Rooney.. even SAF's last season - Nani, RVP, Valencia, Rooney. We can upgrade the midfield all we want (and we should, especially at DM) but we can't win or challenge for anything until we sign better attackers, imo. Ousmane Dembele's available and he'd be where I'd start funnily enough.
Laporta has more footballing knowledge in his left toe than our board, CEO and technical directors combined.
There is also the possibility, United is serving as a template for how not to be reckless as a club and the best way to rebuild. We are like the bad child every parents teaches their children not to be.
Oh yes Bartomeu deserves to be judged at the Hague for what he has done to Barça.
Romario didn't win the European Cup with Barcelona, neither did Hagi.
You are mistaking them with Ronald Koeman and Michael Laudrup.
My general point was that Barcelona is a club that commits to an idea, whatever that idea may be and they don't let their 'mes que un club' narrative be a barrier to that. They might sell themselves like their Athletic Bilbao but the reality has always been different.
I'm aware that they won the European Cup cos Koeman smashed one in at Wembley. However, they were still carrying the 'dream team' nickname for years after. Really until Milan did them in the 1994 European Cup final. Even after that and they had a little bit of a downturn they still managed to pick up players like Ronaldo and then Rivaldo and nobody really saw this as contracting their Catalan symbolism. That's why I said they were buying the biggest names in the game throughout the 1990s. I wasn't limiting it to one specific side.
They have some wonderful talents. However, I m not sure this will be enough to challenge for CL. Yes, they won against Real, but that was a real without their best player, a Real which against PSG was completely outplayed for 150 minutes and went through like we did against PSG in 2019.
They are in much better position than us though for sure, assuming they have fixed their debt situation.
They are in much better position than us though for sure, assuming they have fixed their debt situation.
Yeah, I'm aware that La Masia 'cliche' it's a bit overrated
They did buy world class like Laudrup,Stoichkov, Koeman, etc in the 90s and complemented the team with some catalonian/spanish players, but the main stars were the foreigners.
Spain did have very good players in the 90s, Guardiola himself was a grear player, of course not Xavi or Iniesta level but very good, same for Luis Enrique.
I still subscribe to the idea that Bartomeu was a Real Madrid agent sent to destroy Barca. Or I would if I hadn't experienced Woody in action, coming to think of it, does he by any chance have any ties to the Scousers?
The answer is Xavi Hernandez.
interested to see if Pique and Busquets have enough left in the tank for a third big run at the major trophies
Woody is big mates with Gary Linekar if that counts
Having a strong academy with a defined style of play helps a lot (when you have the money to sustain it) in teaching young kids how you want to play and it makes extremely easier to join the 1st team, even if it is a top club.
It is not a romantic idea (you can sell it this way if you want), but it is actually effective.
You can hear a lot about Barça academy players... "he is not that good because he would be useless in an ultradefensive set up". ok... and the question is... who cares? why should barça be worried about their young kids not being able to play in a style the team itself is not going to practice? and from the player itself... why should i be worried about playing in all the styles of the world? there is always room for players like that in many teams so it is not a deal breaker for a career.
I still think it is going to take a few years to be a consistent candidate for Champions League. We might give a fight to any team of the world one day but I see ourselves far far away from Bayern/City/Liverpool... we still need some pieces and our juveniles to be only young haha. and of course, that they keep improving as they have in the last 1-2 years.
Yesterday's win (and the overall performance since the winter market) can be very important in summer to sign what we need. Some interesting players might see us again like a good team with good prospects and a lot of potential, rather than the trash can we've been the last few years.
- Fan ownership
- Importance of young academy
- "Positive" style of play
The day Barça is owned by a random billionaire, the day the academy stops being an important asset of the club... that day Barça will be a different team. Period.
Who cares about the naming of the stadium? specially when all the genocides of the world are buying clubs to whitening their dictatorship. How do you compete with them? there are irrenouncible principles, like not selling the club to the 1st dictator that knocks your door. But the name of the stadium? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
Btw, it was already reported that the biggest bid was from some crypto platforms/coins. Barça chose Spotify. I don't think this is better or worse.
And I don't understand what you have against crypto anyway. Why is it so bad to you? can you elaborate?
It is not a romantic idea (you can sell it this way if you want), but it is actually effective.
You can hear a lot about Barça academy players... "he is not that good because he would be useless in an ultradefensive set up". ok... and the question is... who cares? why should barça be worried about their young kids not being able to play in a style the team itself is not going to practice? and from the player itself... why should i be worried about playing in all the styles of the world? there is always room for players like that in many teams so it is not a deal breaker for a career.
I still think it is going to take a few years to be a consistent candidate for Champions League. We might give a fight to any team of the world one day but I see ourselves far far away from Bayern/City/Liverpool... we still need some pieces and our juveniles to be only young haha. and of course, that they keep improving as they have in the last 1-2 years.
Yesterday's win (and the overall performance since the winter market) can be very important in summer to sign what we need. Some interesting players might see us again like a good team with good prospects and a lot of potential, rather than the trash can we've been the last few years.
What principles?
Funny how quick they'll sell out on their principles when they need a bit of extra cash.
They'll jump on the dodgy crypto bandwagon with the rest of Europe's elite soon enough.
- Fan ownership
- Importance of young academy
- "Positive" style of play
The day Barça is owned by a random billionaire, the day the academy stops being an important asset of the club... that day Barça will be a different team. Period.
Who cares about the naming of the stadium? specially when all the genocides of the world are buying clubs to whitening their dictatorship. How do you compete with them? there are irrenouncible principles, like not selling the club to the 1st dictator that knocks your door. But the name of the stadium? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
Btw, it was already reported that the biggest bid was from some crypto platforms/coins. Barça chose Spotify. I don't think this is better or worse.
And I don't understand what you have against crypto anyway. Why is it so bad to you? can you elaborate?
Desperate times calls for desperate measures. I don't see any problem for selling the naming right of the stadium to bring in more money to reduce the debt. It is survival time. It is not like Barcelona is selling the club to oil country. You sell anything you can to keep you afloat. There is no priniciple if the club goes bankrupt.