Idiotic Sales Post Fergie

[OleBoiii]

I don't think really think we've made any idiotic sales.

Hernandez and Kagawa both wanted to leave. The former wanted more playtime and the latter practically begged to leave after the terrible Moyes season. There was no point keeping them around. Nani and RVP had both clearly started their decline, so I had no problem seeing them leave. Rafael was injury prone and never really managed to recreate the magic from Fergie's last season, so selling him was fine as well.

Zaha and Evans were poor decisions in hindsight, but felt right at the time. And it's not like any of them have turned into top players anyways, so yeah...

Selling Blind was definitely a mistake, though.

 

[Kostur]

Glad we're sold Depay, he's an absolute clown, need less of those in the squad. Don't care much about Zaha.

 

[ghaliboy]

Moyes clearing out the caching staff was idiotic, but that is on the higher up structure at the club. There is no reason why that should have been allowed to happen.

 

[AaronRedDevil]

Moyes clearing out the caching staff was idiotic, but that is on the higher up structure at the club. There is no reason why that should have been allowed to happen.

Getting rid of a premier league and champions league winning staff...for Phil Neville...god I hate Moyes. Single handily destroyed man Utd. Even couldn't play Zaha who was a talented player. It baffles me.

 

[jem]

The only revisionism and make believe was people lying to themselves that he was somehow amazing at the start when he was nowhere near. Sure he got hooked at half twice in the first 10 matches of the season. He had a decent 5 games or so where he was still easily worse than all of Blind, Smalling, and Shaw.

His form definitely fell off a cliff - no idea if that happened within his first ten games - but go back and check his performance thread from 2015-16, and people were raving at the beginning.

 

[Snuffkin]

It's difficult for clubs to buy our cast offs. Nothing riles supporters if teams more than getting ripped of buy us. It's bad enough having us beat them week in week out and steal their best players. That's why we have to sell cheap.

 

[Crashoutcassius]

Evans was a good player. Like many of our centre backs down the last few years he was unfashionable, a bit like smalling.

 

[Antisocial]

I have sympathy for the Evans decision - at the time we had three centre-backs at roughly the same age who were meant to take-over from Rio and Vidic but they just couldn’t stay fit; there was even a thread in this forum about Smalling Jones and Evans being injured at the same time, it was such a constant occurrence.

One of them had to go, we couldn’t keep three such injury-prone defenders on the club’s payroll. Smalling was the least injured of the three; Jones was the youngest and had shown so much potential, plus had put in some decent DM performances (remember Sir Alex didn’t buy a single central-midfielder for the last six years of his reign, so we needed options there), and Evans was the oldest of the three and had been poor for a while.

Of the three, it made sense to sell Evans, but of course time has confirmed that was a mistake.

It should’ve been Jones.

 

[tenpoless]

The three of them were beyond shit at the end. Evra seemed to decide he didn’t need to bother defending anymore. Not to mention he personally requested to leave as well. And Ferdinand and Vidic practically immediately retiring after having the most forgettable spells ever sums how done they were.

If it wasn't for Moyes They would have stayed. They might be old and were in decline but their experience was still very valuable, considering how bad the state of the club was Post Fergie.

 

[POF]

Chicharito thought of himself as better than back up, while in fact he was never good enough to be a main starter in a top team especially at modern age when strikers are tasked with more than just scoring goals.

I agree with this but it shows the quality of a manager like Ferguson in comparison to those who followed him. In Fergie's squads, he had 18+ players who all believed they were genuine first 11 players.

He had Van Persie, Rooney, Welbeck and Chicharito and kept them all happy (except Rooney but that's another story). Then he leaves and the complaints about lack of game time started. He was a man management genius.

I still remember Moyes' first 10 or so games. He had Ferdinand who was finished and Vidic approaching the end and 3 young promising centre backs chomping at the bit. He played Rio and Vidic for 90 minutes in every game to start the season. Both left the following summer. It was a mindblowing lack of forward planning.

 

[RedTiger]

The only sales from the OP I care about are Rafa, Nani and Blind.

 

[Ace of Spades]

Zaha is the only one that I feel we made a mistake with, he was young and coming from the championship. If we had to sell, we should have put a cheap buy back clause instead of a sell on clause. Our RW was non existent for years, and only this season we have an actual winger with pace in James who can play there.

I can't think of any other, may be Blind but no one else.

 

[RUCK4444]

Other than Nani and Blind it made sense to sell all the others.

Even though Nani was always incredibly inconsistent and almost every poster on the caf to a man wanted Blind gone.

I said at the time that whoever bought Blind at that price would get one of the bargains of that window, great and versatile little player.

 

[montpelier]

I suppose Evans looks like the worst but he had lost authority and confidence imo.

Memphis was a waste of space.

Rafael had defensive weaknesses.

I'm not being critical of the thread but the hindsight concerning what comes after doesn't help. Most of what has been done has been worse than what went before.

Let's pick on Daley Blind, I mean, obviously quite a decent player - for teams that aren't top level. But if you scout him, he's obviously too slow for LB, not strong enough, not big enough to play CB at Man Utd. He should never have got here in the first place. Intelligent and a nice passer though, putting him way ahead of many of his team mates. Idiotic sale, not by the difficulty of finding an upgrade though, surely?

So, I'd go Nani and then not much else. Or quite a lot if you just get an even less good replacement.

 

[Web of Bissaka]

None. Each sales are reasonable (ignoring prices).

Where're Keane and Lukaku in this thread.. Hindsight is 2...?

Not idotic but moreso could've use these two players better due to...

(a) potential (Zaha, since he wasn't given genuine chances compare to other similar new/young players, and the squad is getting older and deadwoody).

(b) flexibility/variability/usefulness (Blind, since there are plenty more players that should be gotten rid first before him, he is a good squad player).

 

[big rons sovereign]

Evans was absolute garbage. Even when fergie was still in charge he was bad. The 4-4 against everton he was at for fault at least 2 goals.
Stood around looking gormless.

 

[Bondi77]

I don't think really think we've made any idiotic sales.

Hernandez and Kagawa both wanted to leave. The former wanted more playtime and the latter practically begged to leave after the terrible Moyes season. There was no point keeping them around. Nani and RVP had both clearly started their decline, so I had no problem seeing them leave. Rafael was injury prone and never really managed to recreate the magic from Fergie's last season, so selling him was fine as well.

Zaha and Evans were poor decisions in hindsight, but felt right at the time. And it's not like any of them have turned into top players anyways, so yeah...

Selling Blind was definitely a mistake, though.

If Zaha is not a top player then why is his market value over 60mil,....Geez

 

[RkkMan]

I don`t care how good Evans has been since he left he was AWFUL for us in his last season and the season prior to that. Had one good season under Fergie playing next to Rio and slightly above average in other seasons. He was the oldest out of him, Smalling and Jones yet failed to properly kick on. Selling him was the right decision. Blind, Zaha and Rafael are the players we probably could have kept a little longer and to a lesser extent Nani who would have been a much better option than Lingard/Mata on the wings.

 

[wolvored]

Out of the ones that played for Fergie we did right selling them. For me Rafael was always a risky player. You could almost feel there was a bad foul and red card waiting to happen every time he played. Evans only played well when backed up by Ferdinand or Vidic. Hernandez was better as an impact sub. Nani was always hit and miss. In fact out of all the players pre Fergie only Blind was a mistake imo

 

[Black.Ghost]

Depay for me. I thought he was great, and when he turned it on he was superb to watch. He had a bit of strength and attitude about him that I really liked.

I was a fan of Chicharito and Januzaj as well and didn’t want either to go. Nani also in that group. Evans Rafael, Blind not fussed either way.

Players come and go and they always will. I think we just need to focus on some of the exciting players we have now rather than dwelling on the past.

Hindsight is a great thing, but every manager we had was the wrong choice. LVG and Jose didn’t fit Utd at all, although I’ll admit I was pro-Jose at the time. I really thought he might be less toxic at Utd. Moyes may have come good but I don’t think he’s the kind of manager who can excel at a team like Utd.

OGSis showing real promise I think, and I hope we give him a chance. Time will tell. Exciting times ahead.

 

[JPRouve]

I will never understand people mentioning Rafael, he has been below average in France. He was injury prone for us and not good since he left.

 

[OleBoiii]

If Zaha is not a top player then why is his market value over 60mil,....Geez

My idea of a top player is not a 27.5 year old attacking winger playing for Crystal Palace. If he was tearing the league apart it would be worth a discussion, but he only has 3 goals and 5 assists in over 2500 minutes played this season. Yes, it's more difficult to produce good numbers when you're playing for Crystal Palace, but if his value was so evident, then why hasn't he been picked up by a top team yet? Attacking wingers typically start their decline earlier than other players so he's really running out of time.

 

[eupheus]

His form definitely fell off a cliff - no idea if that happened within his first ten games - but go back and check his performance thread from 2015-16, and people were raving at the beginning.

I remember that spell. He had a couple good games and once we faced Arsenal, Sanchez tore him up so badly he got replaced at half time and it became clear he was never going to make it as a United player.

 

[Canagel]

Memphis

 

[hasanejaz88]

This is serious revisionism if people are saying selling Evans and Cleverley were poor decisions, they were wanted out by majority at the time.

Both have gone on to do well after United but you have to consider the different circumstances between playing for United and a midtable club. The mental side of the game is big and its not for everyone to be playing with the pressure that comes with playing for United.

I liked both, especially Cleverley who I felt wouldve been a good player is a quick passing game system, SAF used it for some time early in 2011/12 with Welbeck, Nani and Rooney but I think Cleverley got injured and we couldn't return to the same style later on.

Both though were under performing by the time they were sold and it felt like they wouldn't have what it takes to be at the highest level for United.

 

[jem]

I remember that spell. He had a couple good games and once we faced Arsenal, Sanchez tore him up so badly he got replaced at half time and it became clear he was never going to make it as a United player.

so one bad game was all it took for people to immediately know then and there that he wasn’t good enough?

 

[Lay]

Selling all of them bar Rafael and Blind was fine but what we replaced them with wasn't.

 

[VeevaVee]

Rafael in his last 2 years was getting injured more than half of the season. Starts well then gets injured fast and never manage to return well for the remainder of the season. Yes he was great in Fergie's last season but that's about it. Beside Valencia was actually great and well praised up till the end of 2016/2017 season.

Nani was past it by the time he left. He spent the remainder of his career in Portugal, hardly proved he was still good at top level.

Chicharito thought of himself as better than back up, while in fact he was never good enough to be a main starter in a top team especially at modern age when strikers are tasked with more than just scoring goals.

Blind simply never proved himself 100% in any position he played. Decent as a CB, but with many flaws appearing in many games, very slow as LB and a terrible midfielder whenever he played there.

Evans spent the majority of his last few seasons injured and I can bring his performance thread here in LVG's first season when the most was attacking him and had no problem with him leaving. Sure, he's the only of the lot who found form after leaving, but by that time it was the right call.

Simply the problem in most of these is the replacements were mostly pretty poor or non existent, hence people believed we lost them. The reality is all of them deserved to go by this time. We just didn't do well on the buying department.

IMO each and every player we sold post Fergie deserved to go. The problem was only we had many flops in buying players.

Like I say, none of them are or were world beaters, but they 100% would have still been useful and therefore improved us. Valencia was certainly not great by any measure other than being a consummate professional, apart from one season in a different position. Our right side was totally inept for years and is still only half there.

As with many positions, we were also even more knackered if we had an injury and have basically had no bench since we got rid of so many players like this. On top of this every single one of those mentioned had the right attitude, something so starkly missing from our team since. The players mentioned weren’t the dead wood.

 

[NewGlory]

Was watching this video and brings to attention, some of the shear dumb arse decision making at United regarding former players.

Off the top of my head:

Rafael
Evans
Nani
Hernandez (although admittedly he wanted more full time football)
Blind

All of them would be hitting 30 odd now, but should be the backbone of this United squad. Instead, they were replaced by inferior players and only now that we seemingly have a manager with an actual long term fecking plan, have their omissions been somewhat less glaring.

Some will look at their form after United, but while they were here, they certainly looked closer to world class than mediocre.

Selling of all of these players was the right move, considering their actual form in the year prior to the sale. Potential means nothing if it's not realized. The fact that they may have been replaced by worse players doesn't mean they should not have been sold, it just means our recruitment department was garbage.

 

[eupheus]

so one bad game was all it took for people to immediately know then and there that he wasn’t good enough?

At the start, people were comparing him to Gary Neville due to playing style but he struggled against Tadic when we played Southampton and then when Sanchez destroyed him in that Arsenal game, his confidence went too. Every game played thereon he showed he wasn't good enough and was a liability. One of the reasons why Valencia was preferred later on.

 

[M Bison]

Fletcher, we should never have sold him at the point in which we did, could have been a good option for us for another 2 seasons. Looked a very good player for West Brom for 2 years.

 

[ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg]

Fletcher, we should never have sold him at the point in which we did, could have been a good option for us for another 2 seasons. Looked a very good player for West Brom for 2 years.

I disagree with Fletcher. He needed some playing time without pressure to get Over his illness.

fantastic player, and great professional, I think that worked out well for everyone and he got a second half to his career - if he had stayed at Utd, there’s a good chance he would have just faded away as he wouldn’t have got the games he needed to get back up to speed.

 

[M Bison]

I disagree with Fletcher. He needed some playing time without pressure to get Over his illness.

fantastic player, and great professional, I think that worked out well for everyone and he got a second half to his career - if he had stayed at Utd, there’s a good chance he would have just faded away as he wouldn’t have got the games he needed to get back up to speed.

Good point and you may well be right with the point about his illness.

 

[Untd55]

I don't think any of them have done much to say that they were bad sales. All of them are perfectly acceptable.

Rafael - Injury prone (you have to remember his best season with us was pretty much the only time he didn't get injured)

Hernandez - People seem to forget that his form deteriorated quite quickly with us and his goal stats were on the decline. He had one very good season but I think people are overrating him now.

Kagawa - Was pretty useless, which seems to be a trend with players that have left Dortmund. Faded into nothingness

Nani - Perhaps too cheap, but then again people complain when we hold on to players too long. He was clearly on the decline, which is shown with the lack of interest outside of Turkey and Portugal.

Evans - Decent defender, but decent was not what we needed. Again, not a player to feel regret about selling.

Blind - Nowhere near as good as people are making him out to be. Since last season at Ajax, he has raised to be something he is not. He struggled here the whole time. He was bought as a midfielder and was pretty useless. He has no pace, so he cannot play as a wing-back.

Blind may have been alright as a squad player, but nothing more. Nothing to regret here.

Depay - Showed absolutely nothing here. Van Gaal (the person who signed him and rated him highly) gave up on him, so I don't know why people are blaming Mourinho for selling him.

Zaha - Possibly the only one that we could have got better money. Then again, even Ferguson didn't give him many chances.

 

[Nick7]

I was sad when Rafael was sold but he just wasn’t up to it at the time. He had succumbed to injury and isn’t doing very well since leaving.

Evans was a weird one. One game I wanted him gone, the next he was excellent. It wasn’t idiotic to sell him, he just was not consistent enough. With the benefit of hindsight, yeah he probably could have stayed and played a part. But really, when he was sold he had hit the end of the line at the club. I don’t think he’d be as impressive as he is today if he stayed with us.

 

[Gopher Brown]

Getting rid of a premier league and champions league winning staff...for Phil Neville...god I hate Moyes. Single handily destroyed man Utd. Even couldn't play Zaha who was a talented player. It baffles me.

Bad decision, but show me a manager who doesn't bring in his own staff

 

[AaronRedDevil]

Bad decision, but show me a manager who doesn't bring in his own staff

True. But those guys usually have some good credentials. Replacing them with Phil Neville and others who haven't won jack with everton is unbelievably dumb.

 

[RedDevil@84]

Chicharito. But probably not at the point when we sold him. Post Fergie, it was crazy to sideline him with stuff like modern day striker is not enough to be a goalscorer. He needs to do hundred things and blah blah.
And till date we have the same problem that we do not have a guy who guarantees goals.

 

[Gopher Brown]

True. But those guys usually have some good credentials. Replacing them with Phil Neville and others who haven't won jack with everton is unbelievably dumb.

What about Wee Jimmy Lumsden though?

As wikipedia cruelly notes, 'Lumsden was briefly linked with the vacant Southampton job in 2014 but insisted he was too busy with his allotment. '

 

[VictoriaRed]

What about Zaha?