If Mourinho's authority and ideology were given more backing, would we be challenging?

[Wumminator]

Are you having a laugh? 75m worth of signings? You have Wolves coming in into the Pl and spending 100m+ and Everton doing that every other summer. And last time I checked Jose was not negotiating contracts with players, instead we have a bellend in charge who brags about how rich we are, and players and clubs are constantly ripping us open. Jose did not force Woodward to spend 52m on Fred. Just like he vetoed buying a CB he could have gone for another player or no player at all. Instead he paid 52m for Fred.

So the answer for Woodwood was to turn down more of Jose’s signings. Woodwood was dealt a shit hand spending dross that Jose needed. Sanchez, Fred, Dalot were signed in the last 6 months of Jose’s stay and will end up costing the club around 150 million between the three of them.

Imagine if Woodwood had vetoed Fred. There would be an uproar. Instead he trusted Jose, signed him and he is shit. Perisic, Boetang and Maguire would have been the exact same. Jose kept signing expensive shit that didn’t work out. The answer is not to let him sign more.

 

[edgar allan]

Giving it to Ole without any structure in place - DoF etc will create even bigger one

Its interesting how a DOF seems to be magic solution to all our ills?

 

[Reddy Rederson]

What do you mean stop it? The man has wasted literally almost half a billion quid and sent us challenging for midtable. He was backed more than any other United manager and took us backwards. It’s horrendous.

Your logic is horrendous. Jose might give a list of names, but it’s on woody what price is paid and what wages. Why on earth you’re trying to pin that stupid shit on Jose I don’t know, but it’s weird. We all know that it’s woody that makes the deals.

Seriously, you’re wumming too hard.

 

[roonster09]

Klopp was backed last summer despite not winning anything. We finished 2nd gave the manager a new contract mid season and then decided he’s not the guy to move forward.

Yeah I’m sure Liverpool spent less in the time they were both here but they have a much better management than us on every level.

So from money spent to management. Liverpool backed him as they saw clear progress. All ManUtd saw under Jose is shit football and toxic atmosphere. He spent as much as Klopp and both teams are miles apart.

 

[haram]

Wages were nothing to do with him? Signing Sanchez, Bailly, Fred and Matic was not on him?

He doesn’t hand out the contracts. If for example he wants Perisic and Woodward says no, but then says he can get Sanchez signed, how is that Jose’s fault? In terms of getting players like Rojo out the club and reducing the wage bill, is that Jose’s job as well?

The recruitment and contracts were a problem before Jose. Wake up.

What do you mean stop it? The man has wasted literally almost half a billion quid and sent us challenging for midtable. He was backed more than any other United manager and took us backwards. It’s horrendous.

He took us to 2nd and then was not backed.

 

[Wumminator]

He doesn’t hand out the contracts. If for example he wants Perisic and Woodward says no, but then says he can get Sanchez signed, how is that Jose’s fault? In terms of getting players like Rojo out the club and reducing the wage bill, is that Jose’s job as well?

The recruitment and contracts were a problem before Jose. Wake up.



He took us to 2nd and then was not backed.

Answer these four questions for me.

1) out of the roughly 500 million Jose spent, how much was value for money?

2) during Jose’s tenure, which club spent more than Mourinho?

3) where were we when Jose came in? Where were we when he left?

4) did Jose get backed enough when he spent 500 mil and increased the wage bill by 80 million or did he need more money?

 

[Wumminator]

Your logic is horrendous. Jose might give a list of names, but it’s on woody what price is paid and what wages. Why on earth you’re trying to pin that stupid shit on Jose I don’t know, but it’s weird. We all know that it’s woody that makes the deals.

Seriously, you’re wumming too hard.

Jose gives Woodwood a list of names. You wanted Woodwood to not sign those players but also want Woodwood to back Jose more?

Is he Shcrodinger’s Woodwood? Simultaneously needing to say no to Jose and his signings but also needing to back Jose no matter what?

 

[Kostov]

So the answer for Woodwood was to turn down more of Jose’s signings. Woodwood was dealt a shit hand spending dross that Jose needed. Sanchez, Fred, Dalot were signed in the last 6 months of Jose’s stay and will end up costing the club around 150 million between the three of them.

Imagine if Woodwood had vetoed Fred. There would be an uproar. Instead he trusted Jose, signed him and he is shit. Perisic, Boetang and Maguire would have been the exact same. Jose kept signing expensive shit that didn’t work out. The answer is not to let him sign more.

The answer for Woodward is to employ someone who has a clue regarding footballing matters, not playing football manager. Woodard or whoever is negotiating transfers for us is responsible for overpaying consistently for basically everyone. He's bragging about how rich we are and as a result he overpays for everyone. And no managers has a perfect record with signings, that's why we needed a better structure.

Mourinho didn't give Sanchez that monster contract Woodward did. The club is bleeding money not because of Mourinho but because of an incompetent twat who has no clue what he is doing. In reality we don't really who decides on signing and that is also a fault of Woodward, since we have been appalling on the market since he's come in.

 

[Ish]

I see a van Gaal thread, I see a couple of Jose threads. It hurts me that no one has thought to create a recent Moyes one

 

[haram]

Answer these four questions for me.

1) out of the roughly 500 million Jose spent, how much was value for money?

2) during Jose’s tenure, which club spent more than Mourinho?

3) where were we when Jose came in? Where were we when he left?

4) did Jose get backed enough when he spent 500 mil and increased the wage bill by 80 million or did he need more money?

Ask yourself what the squad was like when Jose arrived. We finished 2nd and then the manager was not backed. Now everything he said is being shown as true.

When your striker is Rooney you have to go and spend to replace him. Pep walks in with Aguero. When you midfielders are Schweinsteiger and Schneiderlin you have to spend to replace them. Pep walks in with de Bruyne already there.

Our best players when Jose walked in was de Gea, Rashford and Martial. What a fecking joke.

Liverpool finished behind us. They invested in van Dijk, Keita, Fabinho, Allison, Shaqiri.

 

[Kostov]

So from money spent to management. Liverpool backed him as they saw clear progress. All ManUtd saw under Jose is shit football and toxic atmosphere. He spent as much as Klopp and both teams are miles apart.

They backed him because they saw clear progress and it was evident for everyone. The morons in charge at United backed him in February and then changed their mind in the summer. We were in front of Liverpool in the table in May and beat them at Old Trafford in April, how he did it is another matter altogether.

 

[Reddy Rederson]

Jose gives Woodwood a list of names. You wanted Woodwood to not sign those players but also want Woodwood to back Jose more?

Is he Shcrodinger’s Woodwood? Simultaneously needing to say no to Jose and his signings but also needing to back Jose no matter what?

And so the tedium continues . I didn’t say that woody should say no, I didn’t bring it up, you did when taking about the wages and costs of players. Woody should have gotten better deals instead of just paying whatever the feck. He did it before Jose got here, and he’ll do it again.

If you want to say Jose was wrong for wanting them, fair enough, hindsight is a wonderful thing. But if you want to talk about the spending that finger points to another problem at united. Mr Ed Woodward.

 

[Wumminator]

Ask yourself what the squad was like when Jose arrived. We finished 2nd and then the manager was not backed. Now everything he said is being shown as true.

When your striker is Rooney you have to go and spend to replace him. Pep walks in with Aguero. When you midfielders are Schweinsteiger and Schneiderlin you have to spend to replace them. Pep walks in with de Bruyne already there.

Our best players when Jose walked in was de Gea, Rashford and Martial. What a fecking joke.

Liverpool finished behind us. They invested in van Dijk, Keita, Fabinho, Allison, Shaqiri.

Answer the questions FFS.

All the rest is just deflection. Liverpool has recently sold their best player for massive money. Their best signing over the last two years was discarded by Jose for not being good enough.

I argued for years Jose would be shit at United. He comes in, is incredibly shit and I still argue about it.

 

[haram]

Answer the questions FFS.

All the rest is just deflection. Liverpool has recently sold their best player for massive money. Their best signing over the last two years was discarded by Jose for not being good enough.

I argued for years Jose would be shit at United. He comes in, is incredibly shit and I still argue about it.

We finished 2nd. I gave context. The team above us were ahead of us even before Jose arrived. They had better players and continued to buy players. We finished 2nd and then the manager was not backed.

Big portion of our cash being used on 2 players because we had to. We were far behind.

 

[Bobski]

I don't think there is anything irrational about disliking Mourinho the person. He is a hateful cnut after all.

As a manger no-one forced him to bring in guys like Matic and Lukaku with obvious weaknesses on huge money, beg Fellaini to stay. Did we look a well coached team at any point in his time here, a team with a solid idea of how it wanted to play? What fecking ideology? Spend the most money?

At least allow Ole a transfer window to fix some of the problems that Mourinho contributed to.

 

[haram]

I don't think there is anything irrational about disliking Mourinho the person. He is a hateful cnut after all.

As a manger no-one forced him to bring in guys like Matic and Lukaku with obvious weaknesses on huge money, beg Fellaini to stay. Did we look a well coached team at any point in his time here, a team with a solid idea of how it wanted to play? What fecking ideology? Spend the most money?

At least allow Ole a transfer window to fix some of the problems that Mourinho contributed to.

Those two were signed and we went from 6th to 2nd. After that the manager was not allowed to build upon that.

 

[Johan07]

They backed him because they saw clear progress and it was evident for everyone. The morons in charge at United backed him in February and then changed their mind in the summer. We were in front of Liverpool in the table in May and beat them at Old Trafford in April, how he did it is another matter altogether.

This is incorrect IMO. What happened was that Mourinho signed up Sanchez 4 months early and with that insane contract practically spent his summers increase of the clubs wage budget. He is on record saying that there would be no more offensive signings that summer when he still was salivating over Sanchez.
Then Sanchez turned out to be crap and he went crying to the board for more wage space when they just had permitted him to raise our wage bill to be larger than Citys in February. So they told him to sell to buy which is completely logical and not any sign of "non-backing".

 

[El Jefe]

It's worth noting that when he first went to inter he bought 'his' signings and they were terrible. Mancini and Quaresma were huge flops, while Muntari was just alright. The following season, the Director of Football identified Jose's needs and produced an absolute blinder of a transfer window bringing in Eto'o, Milito, Motta, Sneijder, Lucio and Pandev. It was basically these signings that won them the treble.

So those saying if Jose continued signing his players we'd have made bad deals are probably right but they ignore that if a highly capable DoF brought in players for Jose he would achieve far more. Jose is not a scout and such his suggestions are likely to be lazy i.e. Maguire, Willian, Bale. A DoF would have been able to bring in proper Jose players and I'm absolutely convinced he'd be very successful if he had that structure here.

Jose is not a team builder but give him the players and personalities suited to his style and he is still one of the best managers around. It's no different to Pep really.

 

[haram]

This is incorrect IMO. What happened was that Mourinho signed up Sanchez 4 months early and with that insane contract practically spent his summers increase in the clubs wage budget. He is on record saying that there would be no more offensive signings that summer when he still was salivating over Sanchez.
Then Sanchez turned out to be crap and he went crying to the board for more wage space when they just had permitted him to raise our wage bill to be larger than Citys in February. So they told him to sell to buy which is completely logical and not any sign of "non-backing".

1. He does not sell the players. He does not hand out the contracts which prevents some of these players leaving

2. Alexis was signed after the board turned down players Jose wanted to sign. Why would Jose Mourinho turn down signing Alexis? The wage offered to Alexis is down to the board.

 

[Wumminator]

Those two were signed and we went from 6th to 2nd. After that the manager was not allowed to build upon that.

Mourinho spent more money than any other manager than Pep when he was here. Across his whole tenure. He took us backwards.

Matic for example. He might have helped us get second. But look at him now and his legs look done and he’s reaching the age where a decline is inevitable. Now Jose could have identified someone younger but he didn’t.

Jose has more money than anyone. He spent more money badly than anyone. Arguing that he needed more is mental.

 

[Wumminator]

The only way you could argue that Jose needed more money is if you can look at his signings and say “wow they were working out well”. They weren’t. They were all shit. Pretty much to a player they were all shit.

 

[Bobski]

Those two were signed and we went from 6th to 2nd. After that the manager was not allowed to build upon that.

Second but the fanbase had already turned on him because it was fairly obvious that he was building nothing sustainable, that finishing second was no sign of any lasting improvement on the pitch. Chelsea finish 3rd this season, do they see that a sign of progress or just a placing of circumstances. Liverpool were concentrating on the CL, Chelsea and Arsenal were terrible and Spurs were Spurs. 2nd ws no great acheivement if you actually watched how the team played.

That team already needed to be ripped apart by the end of that season, so his vision had to be questioned.

 

[haram]

Mourinho spent more money than any other manager than Pep when he was here. Across his whole tenure. He took us backwards.

Matic for example. He might have helped us get second. But look at him now and his legs look done and he’s reaching the age where a decline is inevitable. Now Jose could have identified someone younger but he didn’t.

Jose has more money than anyone. He spent more money badly than anyone. Arguing that he needed more is mental.

Again, you’re ignoring all context. I’m not going to keep repeating myself.

 

[Wumminator]

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/premier-league/fuenfjahresvergleich/wettbewerb/GB1

Look at this FFS.

Klopp made a profit in his first two transfer windows. In the one he was “significantly backed” he’d just got to the CL Final and spent less than Jose had the precious two years.

Look at that table and try and argue that Jose wasn’t backed. The current season also includes 12 million pounds worth of sales that weren’t Jose.

 

[Johan07]

1. He does not sell the players. He does not hand out the contracts which prevents some of these players leaving

2. Alexis was signed after the board turned down players Jose wanted to sign. Why would Jose Mourinho turn down signing Alexis? The wage offered to Alexis is down to the board.

What a naive post. If you think that Mourinho was not very much involved in the Sanchez-transfer as well as understanding perfectably well what effects that would have on the coming summers transfer market then I dont know what to say. Its United, the managers make the decisions on which players to buy or sell. The board sets the wage bill that they need to keep within. Its actually not that complicated. If Mourinho did not get players due to the board it was due to that he was fecking up our wage bill or trying to buy older players that would lose value so that even the transfer fee would have to be written off as a cost = practically salary as well. Not that the board or Woodward had any sympathies about what players he wanted.

 

[haram]

Second but the fanbase had already turned on him because it was fairly obvious that he was building nothing sustainable, that finishing second was no sign of any lasting improvement on the pitch. Chelsea finish 3rd this season, do they see that a sign of progress or just a placing of circumstances. Liverpool were concentrating on the CL, Chelsea and Arsenal were terrible and Spurs were Spurs. 2nd ws no great acheivement if you actually watched how the team played.

Cop out. Liverpool were behind us the entire season. The excuse that they were concentrating on the CL is a crap one. The fanbase turned on him because they thought the team could be playing better football and that his tactics were holding the team back. Again proven to be false.

A team that consists of Young and Valencia as fullbacks, has no width, no delivery, has no players able to build play properly (apart from maybe Lindelof) is not a finished one. So to stop backing a manager after he finishes 2nd is stupid.

 

[Wumminator]

Again, you’re ignoring all context. I’m not going to keep repeating myself.

Context? Jose took over a club with the worlds best goalkeeper, a youngster who had just been voted the worlds most exciting teenager, a defender who is currently in the CL semis, Rashford - England’s greatest young talent, Luke Shaw the worlds most expensive teenager, he had Pogba arrive in a world record transfer and had the option of smashing our wage structure. And he flopped. His signings were terrible. Almost to a person his signings were terrible and the players he identified as improving us this year have all had shit years as well. He didn’t improve any player, managed to go out in the CL to Sevilla and had us close to the bottom half. Our current players such as Sanchez are on massively inflated wages, he left us with an aging squad and didn’t win a decent trophy under him. Wank manager. Wank signings. Wank time at united.

 

[haram]

What a naive post. If you think that Mourinho was not very much involved in the Sanchez-transfer as well as understanding perfectably well what effects that would have on the coming summers transfer market then I dont know what to say. Its United, the managers make the decisions on which players to buy or sell. The board sets the wage bill that they need to keep within. Its actually not that complicated. If Mourinho did not get players due to the board it was due to that he was fecking up our wage bill or trying to buy older players that would lose value so that even the transfer fee would have to be written off as a cost = practically salary as well. Not that the board or Woodward had any sympathies about what players he wanted.

The board did not agree to signing his other wide targets. They said they could sign Alexis and he agreed to it, because why wouldn’t he? In terms of player contracts in general, it is not Jose’s fault someone like Martial is offered 250k is it?

 

[Wumminator]

Cop out. Liverpool were behind us the entire season. The excuse that they were concentrating on the CL is a crap one. The fanbase turned on him because they thought the team could be playing better football and that his tactics were holding the team back. Again proven to be false.

A team that consists of Young and Valencia as fullbacks, has no width, no delivery, has no players able to build play properly (apart from maybe Lindelof) is not a finished one. So to stop backing a manager after he finishes 2nd is stupid.

He had three years to get us full backs, to get us width or to sign players to build play.

He thought Fred, Dalot, Bailly, Mikhitaryan, Sanchez, Matic and Lindelof were the answer.

 

[roonster09]

The board did not agree to signing his other wide targets. They said they could sign Alexis and he agreed to it, because why wouldn’t he? In terms of player contracts in general, it is not Jose’s fault someone like Martial is offered 250k is it?

Were you present in the meeting?

 

[haram]

Context? Jose took over a club with the worlds best goalkeeper, a youngster who had just been voted the worlds most exciting teenager, a defender who is currently in the CL semis, Rashford - England’s greatest young talent, Luke Shaw the worlds most expensive teenager, he had Pogba arrive in a world record transfer and had the option of smashing our wage structure. And he flopped. His signings were terrible. Almost to a person his signings were terrible and the players he identified as improving us this year have all had shit years as well. He didn’t improve any player, managed to go out in the CL to Sevilla and had us close to the bottom half. Our current players such as Sanchez are on massively inflated wages, he left us with an aging squad and didn’t win a decent trophy under him. Wank manager. Wank signings. Wank time at united.

The best players were Rashford, de Gea and Martial. Only now can people appreciate how weak of a team that was because he is gone and we can see Rashford and Martial for what they really are. Yes very good, he signed Pogba. Meanwhile Pep walked into a team with de Bruyne already in it. So if you want to talk transfer fees and numbers, that’s where the difference is. That’s the context.

 

[haram]

Were you present in the meeting?

Don’t play dumb.

 

[Wumminator]

The best players were Rashford, de Gea and Martial. Only now can people appreciate how weak of a team that was because he is gone and we can see Rashford and Martial for what they really are. Yes very good, he signed Pogba. Meanwhile Pep walked into a team with de Bruyne already in it. So if you want to talk transfer fees and numbers, that’s where the difference is. That’s the context.

Using a team having are Bruyne in it as an example of a team that should dominate while simultaneously defending Jose. A brave stance.

There weren’t many better youngsters in the world at the time Jose signed. If they stagnated or lacked progression... that’s on him.

 

[haram]

He had three years to get us full backs, to get us width or to sign players to build play.

He thought Fred, Dalot, Bailly, Mikhitaryan, Sanchez, Matic and Lindelof were the answer.

After finishing 2nd he was not backed. He was denied the chance to add width and players that coukd build play from the back. You are not being honest.

 

[UncleBob]

No.

 

[roonster09]

Don’t play dumb.

Don't act like an ignorant. Signing player doesn't depend only on one party. I have already posted Perisic's interview where he clearly said he had ManUtd offer and he rejected it. Lukcy man knew what he was doing.

 

[haram]

Using a team having are Bruyne in it as an example of a team that should dominate while simultaneously defending Jose. A brave stance.

There weren’t many better youngsters in the world at the time Jose signed. If they stagnated or lacked progression... that’s on him.

Also Aguero. Also Silva. Also Fernandino. Also Sterling. Don’t act stupid.

 

[Wumminator]

Don’t play dumb.

You make it sound like Jose was offered Sanchez. “He was offered Sanchez”. No. He went out and requested him and the board signed him. Jose got what he wanted and it fecked us over. Royally.

 

[roonster09]

Using a team having are Bruyne in it as an example of a team that should dominate while simultaneously defending Jose. A brave stance.

There weren’t many better youngsters in the world at the time Jose signed. If they stagnated or lacked progression... that’s on him.

Brilliant Spot

 

[haram]

Don't act like an ignorant. Signing player doesn't depend only on one party. I have already posted Perisic's interview where he clearly said he had ManUtd offer and he rejected it. Lukcy man knew what he was doing.

Ignorant is acting like the board backed Jose after finishing 2nd.